Christian couple lose their High Court battle to foster children because they are against homosexual

Originally posted by getreadyalready
reply to post by hawaii50th

 

You are correct, I didn't start having sex until high school, and my young attractions were quite innocent. My point was that even at age 3, 5, 7, etc, I still new the difference between wanting to "kiss" the girls, and just being a protector or masculine figure for weaker boys. I was able to take a masculine role in all situations, and also know the difference between an attraction between boys and girls, and a friendship between boys and boys.

Personally I think homosexuality is learned behavior, even if it does happen in the animal kingdom, I don't think it happens for sexual reasons. BUT, I have no problem with people being homosexual by choice. My best boss ever was homosexual, and I would love to still work for him. I have plenty of my own perversions, so I am certainly not one to judge other people for their ways. I just don't believe they were born that way. Then again, if someone says they knew at an early age like I did, I would just about have to take their word for it given my own experience.

I know what your saying I can relate. My best friend and he was also my best man at my wedding was gay. He past away at the young age of 42 from AIDS. It was a very sad day for his family and myself, his mother asked me if I thought that if he had known the out come of his life, would he have still chose to live as a gay person, I really didn't know how to answer her. He was abused as a child, so I know that had an impact of his adult life. I've know many guys and girls that had been abused as children and ended up attracted to the same sex.
Just because some has those tendencies, I would never reject them or hate them, they are some of the nicest people that I've known, but I don't condone the act, but at the same time who am I to judge.
What I don't like are the arrogant ones that have chips on their shoulders and feel that everyone should have to bend to their ways. A heterosexual doesn't go around demanding to be accepted, and why is that could it be because that is the natural way to function. Like I said before, it's the act that is not the norm, no matter how long this has been going on for, it's not in the natural order of life.
Children should not be exposed to this kind of sexuality as much as children should never be abused, and the abuser should pay for the wrongs that they do.

Originally posted by controldiction
reply to post by hawaii50th

 

It is a sign of Television, cartoons, comercials, music, advertisment, sports....etc etc etc.!
I work around children and well....I say wow! The things these little children know these days. And when asked, "where did you see or here that from"? Well, the answers are other kids or Television, cartoons, comercials, music, advertisment, sports....etc etc etc.!

I know that's a big part of the problem, and it's so pathetic what media has come to.

Originally posted by The Djin
reply to post by hawaii50th

 

I'm sick and tired of all the b.s. that goes on in this forum

Then don't come here go hang out at church, invisible men that live in the sky will always be taken to task on ATS welcome to 2011 dude bronze age supernatural beings are so passe' and infantile.

What, are you afraid of being exposed, your part of the problem, when someone speaks out against your perversion you strike back with what, nothing more than shut up, I can't stand hearing the truth?
Now that's the kind of arrogant attitude that I hate.
If the practice of homosexuality is ever totally accepted, than it will finally put the end to humanity even closer than we are today.
There is proof of a flood, there is proof of the city of Babylon, and there is proof of the twin cities of Sodom and Gomorrah. In fact where do the word sodomy come from.

Hello again my friend. I do not want to turn this into to big a debate. I just wanted to clarify your position.

Originally posted by hawaii50th
Just because some has those tendencies, I would never reject them or hate them, they are some of the nicest people that I've known, but I don't condone the act, but at the same time who am I to judge.

This right here is the truth. You had it in you and you let it out because you know it is true.

Then in the very next paragraph you issue forth a judgement, and a harsh bitter one at that.

Originally posted by hawaii50th
What I don't like are the arrogant ones that have chips on their shoulders and feel that everyone should have to bend to their ways. A heterosexual doesn't go around demanding to be accepted, and why is that could it be because that is the natural way to function. Like I said before, it's the act that is not the norm, no matter how long this has been going on for, it's not in the natural order of life.
Children should not be exposed to this kind of sexuality as much as children should never be abused, and the abuser should pay for the wrongs that they do.

Now imagine if homosexuals obtained the majority. Would you appreciate it if they ruled that you should not be around children, that you were unnatural?

Oh wait, that is the topic of the thread. Oh, you do not like that judgement?

Judge NOT, Lest ye be judged yourself, and by what measure ye mete, so will it be met against you.

With Love,

Your Brother

reply to post by hawaii50th


There are no sexual acts that a homosexual performs that a heterosexual person hasn't/doesn't. Period. And seeing that by population homosexuals are the minority, it means that more heterosexuals engage in sinful sexual acts than the entire gay community combined.

Originally posted by The Djin
reply to post by hawaii50th

 

Anybody claiming that a homo should be killed is an idiot. It's the act and practice that is not moral. You don't condemn the person you condemn the act. No one has a right to kill anyone.

Then perhaps you would be good enough to take it up with the distributors of bibles in order that they may edit this sort of filth out before the next edition goes into circulation and lands on the laps of children.

Show me what your claiming, where does it say to kill a homosexual? And lust is lust in all forms out of wedlock between only a man and a woman. That is the natural order of life, yes the two become one, man, and woman, they marry and procreate. The sexual bond between a man and a woman who are married to each other is the most beautiful union.

reply to post by minkey53


I'm sorry, but if you're really trying to say God never commanded anyone to murder then you are a liar...or you have no idea what your talking about. Here are just a few verses where murder is condoned...

"This is what the Lord of hosts has to say: 'I will punish what Amalek did to Israel when he barred his way as he was coming up from Egypt. Go, now, attack Amalek, and deal with him and all that he has under the ban. Do not spare him, but kill men and women, children and infants, oxen and sheep, camels and asses." (1 Samuel 15:2-3)

"Anyone arrogant enough to reject the verdict of the judge or of the priest who represents the LORD your God must be put to death. Such evil must be purged from Israel." (Deuteronomy 17:12)

"You should not let a sorceress live." (Exodus 22:17)

"If a man lies with a male as with a women, both of them shall be put to death for their abominable deed; they have forfeited their lives." (Leviticus 20:13)

"A man or a woman who acts as a medium or fortuneteller shall be put to death by stoning; they have no one but themselves to blame for their death." (Leviticus 20:27)

"Whoever strikes his father or mother shall be put to death." (Exodus 21:15)

"They entered into a covenant to seek the Lord, the God of their fathers, with all their heart and soul; and everyone who would not seek the Lord, the God of Israel, was to be put to death, whether small or great, whether man or woman." (2 Chronicles 15:12-13)

"I will make Mount Seir utterly desolate, killing off all who try to escape and any who return. I will fill your mountains with the dead. Your hills, your valleys, and your streams will be filled with people slaughtered by the sword. I will make you desolate forever. Your cities will never be rebuilt. Then you will know that I am the LORD." (Ezekiel 35:7-9)

"Make ready to slaughter his sons for the guilt of their fathers; Lest they rise and posses the earth, and fill the breadth of the world with tyrants." (Isaiah 14:21)

"If even then you remain hostile toward me and refuse to obey, I will inflict you with seven more disasters for your sins. I will release wild animals that will kill your children and destroy your cattle, so your numbers will dwindle and your roads will be deserted." (Leviticus 26:21-22 NLT)

Well, there are many many more. Also, in case anyone says "Oh so and so said that, not god.", well isn't the bible supposed to be the literal word of god handed down to the men who wrote it? Unless I'm mistaken it is. I'm not a christian but I support anyone's right to worship whatever they want, just please don't outright lie to people, especially if it can be so easily exposed...that's just laziness.

reply to post by hawaii50th



Just because there was a flood and it may have been included in biblical scripture, does not mean there is a god or that much more of what is included in so-called holy books is correct.

Religion is slowly being seen for what it is - not a wholesome, family oriented path, but a means to regulate the masses.

Should this regulation and control be included in raising a child? I hope not.

Originally posted by getreadyalready
reply to post by Annee

 

I have had this conversation with gay people, some friends, some strangers, some that will remain friends, and some that will remain strangers, LOL!

Obviously they disagreed with me, but I think I made some good points.

Sorry - - I don't think you made any good points at all.

I got divorced in Los Angeles right in the middle of the sexual revolution. Birth Right Orientation is just that. It has nothing to do with Fetishes.

And I saw Ron White live once - - - which sucked because he was so drunk you couldn't understand anything he said - - - and he bumped Fluffy who was scheduled and I had tickets for.

Originally posted by The Djin
reply to post by hawaii50th

 

And the evidence is there and has been proven,

Feel free to provide sources of this proof, yes I do have all day



not only that,

in American Native Indian, Mayan, Egyptian, Polynesian, and others they all have a story of a great flood.

Countless flood stories do indeed exist however there is no evidence of the entire planet being flooded.

However if if we grant you that it is true then apply your reasoning, that as other peoples stories confirm the reality of your biblical flood then this causes a problem for you.

Flood stories like Gilgamesh predate biblical stories and as you are aware these people had their own gods so by your own reasoning these gods are very real thus making you my friend an atheist by proxy.

The evidence is there, you just have to be willing to look rather than look the other way to justify a sick perverted and vile life style.

Dude no one on this planet need justify their lifestyle least of all to you, do you criticize the character jesus equally , because surely a homophobe such as your self could easily spot his rather gay attributes a mile off ?

Is there a bit of bugger in you dying to get out of the closet my friend ?

This is how you justify what you are by twisting it around and trying to insinuate that everybody else is like you. Than in your pathetic little mind it makes it okay for what you are. Sorry go try your sick little trickery on someone else who hopefully will see right through you for the transparent person that you are.
This is very typical, it's not something new, it's an old tactic of the perverse and perverted minds.

Well, this is my first time posting on ATS and I might as well jump in with both feet.

I would like to think the ruling in this foster case wasn't based entirely on the couples religious beliefs. There had to be something else there that the High Court didn't like about this couple.

I'll confess that I have a strong Christian background. I don't agree with the act of homosexuality, but I certainly don't hate homosexuals either. I'm not a big fan of the Christian religion being referred to as a religion of hatred by some members on the board. Quite contrary, the true Christian religion is a religion based on love and forgiveness. Too often, the Christians who are over the top get the lion's share of publicity, and we end up getting painted with that same brush. For the record, I have a niece and a nephew and both of them are gay. I love them both very much.

I do find it curious that psychiatrists believe they can rehabilitate a pedophile and release him back into society at the risk of defenseless children, but also speak to the belief that homosexuality is an inherited trait and cannot be changed. Of course, one is illegal and one isn't, but really they are both desires aren't they? Sure, some will argue that one is a desire based on power and control and one the other is a desire based on love and companionship. I believe that as an advanced species we can all decide whether or not we choose to act on our desires. We all have free will. Could somebody politely explain to me why we can rehabilitate one sexual desire but not another?

Back to the argument at hand. If I'm incorrect in my original assessment that there has to be more to this story than denial to foster a child based on a couples religious beliefs, could somebody also explain to me why this isn't some form of prejudice? What would happen if the high court said, "Sorry, we don't allow Muslims to be foster parents based on their beliefs."

Originally posted by IAMIAM
Hello again my friend. I do not want to turn this into to big a debate. I just wanted to clarify your position.

Originally posted by hawaii50th
Just because some has those tendencies, I would never reject them or hate them, they are some of the nicest people that I've known, but I don't condone the act, but at the same time who am I to judge.

This right here is the truth. You had it in you and you let it out because you know it is true.

Then in the very next paragraph you issue forth a judgement, and a harsh bitter one at that.

Originally posted by hawaii50th
What I don't like are the arrogant ones that have chips on their shoulders and feel that everyone should have to bend to their ways. A heterosexual doesn't go around demanding to be accepted, and why is that could it be because that is the natural way to function. Like I said before, it's the act that is not the norm, no matter how long this has been going on for, it's not in the natural order of life.
Children should not be exposed to this kind of sexuality as much as children should never be abused, and the abuser should pay for the wrongs that they do.

Now imagine if homosexuals obtained the majority. Would you appreciate it if they ruled that you should not be around children, that you were unnatural?

Oh wait, that is the topic of the thread. Oh, you do not like that judgement?

Judge NOT, Lest ye be judged yourself, and by what measure ye mete, so will it be met against you.

With Love,

Your Brother

If that day was ever to come that homosexuals were the majority, we would not be having this discussion, because the lights would be out for all mankind.
And, I never said I am perfect, some times we get angry at the way people think, when they want to teach children about being homosexual, why can't we just let children be innocent and let them grow up to the age of understanding.

reply to post by Annee


I didn't like Ron White in person much either. His act is really his persona, it isn't much of a stretch, and he isn't that funny. I liked that little snippet though.

The "Birth Right Orientation" vs. "Learned Behavior/Fetish" is the crux of the argument here, so I don't understand your other points about your divorce and time in LA. I don't believe in Birth Right Orientation (edit...I guess I do believe in it, I just believe we are all born biologically hetero), and it seems you believe we can born oriented any number of ways, but I doubt that either of us can support our opinion beyond refute.

Since it seems impossible to entirely prove my point, let me ask you this. If a person is born with a certain sexual orientation, and there is nothing they can do about it, and it seems current political correctness says we should accept them the way they are.........then why do we lock up pedophiles? Most science supports the fact that they are hard-wired that way, they cannot be reformed, so they were born that way by no fault of their own, why don't we accept them as well? Before anyone tars and feathers me, I do not believe homosexuals are equivalent to pedophiles, but it goes to show the argument is invalid, because if one wants to argue that it is "natural" and "acceptable" because they are "born that way" and because "it happens in nature" then the same can be said for pedophiles.

Originally posted by hawaii50th
Show me what your claiming, where does it say to kill a homosexual? And lust is lust in all forms out of wedlock between only a man and a woman. That is the natural order of life, yes the two become one, man, and woman, they marry and procreate. The sexual bond between a man and a woman who are married to each other is the most beautiful union.

It doesn't say to judge them, yet here you are again judging. You believe your life style superior and therefore judge them. This is the exact behavior Christ spoke against in his first sermon on the Mount. Yet here we are dishonoring his legacy and saying screw you Christ! I am holier than thou and CAN Judge!!!

Though I bear record of myself, yet my record is true: for I know whence I came, and whither I go; but ye cannot tell whence I come, and whither I go. 15Ye judge after the flesh; I judge no man. 16And yet if I judge, my judgment is true: for I am not alone, but I and the Father that sent me. 17It is also written in your law, that the testimony of two men is true. 18I am one that bear witness of myself, and the Father that sent me beareth witness of me. 19Then said they unto him, Where is thy Father? Jesus answered, Ye neither know me, nor my Father: if ye had known me, ye should have known my Father also. 20These words spake Jesus in the treasury, as he taught in the temple: and no man laid hands on him; for his hour was not yet come.

It's as if people never took the time to get to know Christ and what he was saying.

With Love,

Your Brother

Originally posted by hawaii50th
If that day was ever to come that homosexuals were the majority, we would not be having this discussion, because the lights would be out for all mankind.
And, I never said I am perfect, some times we get angry at the way people think, when they want to teach children about being homosexual, why can't we just let children be innocent and let them grow up to the age of understanding.

I will tell you why we cannot just let children grow up innocent anymore. It is because sex IS innocent. It is your own judgement that shamed it. Then it went into the closet where men molested daughters behind closed doors, priests molest choir boys and rape nuns, men of the cloth and men protected by the veil of shame do heinous acts in that darkness.

I rejoice that my children are sexually educated at a young age, because they are comfortable enough with it that if someone gets out of line, they will tell! It will not be shoved in the closet of shame ever again.

The same goes with homosexuals. They make a lot of noise now because people like you have made them ashamed of who they are with your twisted inferior judgements. Now they are rebelling against you and your kind oppressor! Never will they be shamed again.

Such is the nature of things. Judge and you will be judged.

With Love,

Your Brother

Originally posted by IAMIAM

Originally posted by hawaii50th
Show me what your claiming, where does it say to kill a homosexual? And lust is lust in all forms out of wedlock between only a man and a woman. That is the natural order of life, yes the two become one, man, and woman, they marry and procreate. The sexual bond between a man and a woman who are married to each other is the most beautiful union.

It doesn't say to judge them, yet here you are again judging. You believe your life style superior and therefore judge them. This is the exact behavior Christ spoke against in his first sermon on the Mount. Yet here we are dishonoring his legacy and saying screw you Christ! I am holier than thou and CAN Judge!!!

Though I bear record of myself, yet my record is true: for I know whence I came, and whither I go; but ye cannot tell whence I come, and whither I go. 15Ye judge after the flesh; I judge no man. 16And yet if I judge, my judgment is true: for I am not alone, but I and the Father that sent me. 17It is also written in your law, that the testimony of two men is true. 18I am one that bear witness of myself, and the Father that sent me beareth witness of me. 19Then said they unto him, Where is thy Father? Jesus answered, Ye neither know me, nor my Father: if ye had known me, ye should have known my Father also. 20These words spake Jesus in the treasury, as he taught in the temple: and no man laid hands on him; for his hour was not yet come.

It's as if people never took the time to get to know Christ and what he was saying.

With Love,

Your Brother

You really make me laugh, your credibility. Who are you to talk and point the finger on someone judging. Now your judging me for judging someone else. Your dead in the water. Your no different than anybody else, but you play this pious person, of wisdom. You really need to take a look in the mirror before you make judgments about others and before you start preaching. You also need to read all the post before even making one yourself.
Stop playing this pious role, it's old and lost steam already.

Peace Brother.

reply to post by theicc


That's the problem with the uneducated today. They put catholics and christians together and assume they're all the same. We don't pick and choose what rules to follow... But as for the whole gay thing, the court really has no right to rule the way they did. Its a far worse thing to let a gay couple to adopt any children at all! It sickens me. Gays shouldn't have been allowed to get married.

Originally posted by Christian Voice
reply to post by JonoEnglish

 

Just because homosexuality is a fact of life doesn't make it right.

The judgment in the case was about discrimination which is illegal. The larger question of homosexuality was really irrelevant.

reply to post by BrawleR



There is no difference. Glorifying child sexual molestation by adults is disgusting and it is much too prevelent today.

If a heterosexual performer built a show around making female children the object of sexual pleasure, I would not want that person taking care of foster kids either! How about you?

Originally posted by hawaii50th[
You really make me laugh, your credibility. Who are you to talk and point the finger on someone judging. Now your judging me for judging someone else. Your dead in the water. Your no different than anybody else, but you play this pious person, of wisdom. You really need to take a look in the mirror before you make judgements about others and before you start preaching. You also need to read all the post before even making one yourself.
Stop playing this pious role, it's old and lost steam already.

Peace Brother.

I judge no man, I am simply pointing out the cause and effect of your relationships. I am on no one side other than the truth. I call out everyone equally and only address their behavior to one another.

I judge all how I want to be judged. As worthy of being in the Kingdom of Heaven, but I know they will never enter if they do not quit judging one another.

I do not judge you my friend. I know what road you traveled to get where you are. I know how much faith you have in your way. It is your truth and you treasure it more than life itself.

But, the truth about God is, once you have stopped searching, you have settled for an Idol. He is too complex to ever know the fullness of. Do you really think one book could contain him?

Open your mind and your heart. The limits you set are your own.

With Love,

Your Brother

edit on 1-3-2011 by IAMIAM because: (no reason given)