To all the people who want to ban guns.

reply to post by Hoskizaki


Common sense tells me that if I am that irrational in wanting to shoot someone because I am so angry, that is a hint that I need to calm down. It is the PEOPLE who shoot PEOPLE. They deserve the consequences afterwards. Depending on the situation.

I LOVE that word....rubbish...something about it..just rolls off the tongue...ruuubbbish...hehe

Lots of facts and they have their place.
We need to bring things back to basics. Its a necessary change needed in this country but it is a change in attitude.
A gun is a piece of metal for the most part. We shouldn't ban pieces of metal.
Some people need attention and will even kill to get it. Is this not obvious to everyone regarding pretty much every mass shooting outburst?
If you ban the gun, its gonna be another weapon. Laws will never change certain things about the ego and human beings.

reply to post by Honor93

she was INSIDE when shot, not outside ... she came from the outside, was given ample opportunity to retreat and was not fired upon until she was inside.

My apology I missed that, then yeah by all means cap her if you had to, at least ya didn't kill her. If you didn't get charged, then it sounds like you were well within your rights. Cops even in some self defense cases will try and charge you, and it can be a lot $$$ and BS to be done with it and not go to jail even though you're innocent.
Was she armed in the house?

Arguing with liberals over gun control is like wrestling a pig in the mud.

Sooner or later your going to realize he's only doing it because he likes it.

They love to argue whether they have the facts straight or their even in the right..... it doesn't matter

Originally posted by Hoskizaki
I'm not demeaning your desire to "defuse" the situation, I'm demeaning the way you did it. Fair enough if the law permits you to do that, but it doesn't mean you have to do it. My opinion is that it should be avoided at all costs, and personally I'd be willing to accept a small risk rather than have to shoot someone.
I gather from another post that she was quite a large woman? I bet she was a real fast mover. I also gathered that she was facing away from you when you shot her? so you essentially shot her in the back ( of the leg)?
But yeah, you're a real hero for not killing her dude...
I'm afraid you're bang wrong about me not having any experience. I've been threatened by a drunk man who was wielding a liquor bottle and I guarantee you there was no point at which I would've pulled a gun on him. He never got anywhere near me and when he got bored and continued on his way I followed him and had him arrested. I used to work in a bar too and it wasn't uncommon to receive threats from customers. Usually a bit of common sense and patience is all you need to deal with a drunk. Half the time they take themselves out and save you the hassle.
The only drunk that's ever put me in hospital is myself.

well, given the circumstances ... how would you have diffused the situation?
man-handling her = instant arrest w/criminal charges (edit: and losing the privilege of gun ownership)
hide inside = potential death as had been repeatedly threatened for the prior 24hrs
run away = not my style
talking = wasn't an option
what's left?

she was at least twice my size but then again, so is most everyone in the neighborhood, including the children. her speed? what does that have to do with anything?

yes, from behind, following many warnings ... last words before firing --> if you take one more step, i will fire.
as i saw her leg bend off the floor and take another step, i fired.
yeppers, she is not likely to forget her error ... bullet was expanding and didn't exit ... i imagine she'll need a cane or some other assistance for the remainder of her days.

Thanks for the hero comment, i don't agree but hey ... life is always better than death in my opinion.

Dude, my family owned a bar/golf course ... i've dealt with drunks (stupid drunks) all the days of my life. I have tended bar and once refused a regular only to have him and his guest crash and burn just hours later. Yet, i got written up cause he was the boss' friend and shouldn't have been 'cut off' ... or so i was told.

Alcohol is not an excuse. Alcohol is not a deterrent. Drunks can seldom be managed. And, in your case, you got lucky, that's all.
well, as for being hospitalized from the behavior of a drunk, i've been there at least 3 separate times and that was enough. still wear the scar on my lip and will never forget the 2 children it cost me. Thanks, but i'll keep my guns ... especially as the drunk population grows.

reply to post by Honor93

Sorry I didn't realize you were a woman, that changes things a lot, no offense ladies.
........

Banning guns is NOT the solution. Anyone who suggest banning guns is only a deluded soul speading ill conceived logic. Even if guns were successfully ban, the root of the problem will still persists. And that is violence within a society.

I personallly would support a ban on guns and would encourage everyone to do so, PROVIDED it can solve the woe of our society - having to put up with violence with its manifestation in many and varied forms under various types of weaponary BY BOTH the authorities and the violent.

BUT UNFORTUNATELY IT DOES NOT.

Thus, as long as the authorities, or members of the public whom refuses to address and solve the more critical issue of VIOLENCE within our societies, to eradicate it, then I would support ownership of guns and encourage everyone else to do so, as is their inalienable human right to defense against tyranny in any form.

Originally posted by mtnshredder
reply to post by Honor93

 

Was she armed in the house?

at the time, i had no idea for sure. hindsight is that she was not carrying a weapon ... but that doesn't automatically mean she was less of a threat.
I didn't 'know' this person and i certainly wasn't taking any chances.

The case is currently with the SA and charges against her are being pursued.
the detectives indicate a clear case of 'self-defense'.
they reported it to the SA as self-defense and i have not yet been charged with anything. Since there is not yet a final disposition on the case, i would suppose the SA could press charges should they choose.
However, this many months later and the only charges filed are against her, i believe the situation is history.

Originally posted by capgirl
reply to post by Hoskizaki

 

Common sense tells me that if I am that irrational in wanting to shoot someone because I am so angry, that is a hint that I need to calm down. It is the PEOPLE who shoot PEOPLE. They deserve the consequences afterwards. Depending on the situation.

I LOVE that word....rubbish...something about it..just rolls off the tongue...ruuubbbish...hehe

Anger can override rationality sometimes though. Especially when people have been drinking. People do crazy things. Why, it was only last week I got trashed on orange liqueur and tried to climb into my own coat pocket. I was so angry with myself for not being able to do it that I hit myself full pelt in the face with a cheesecake that I'd been nibbling on. I then proceeded to squeeze all of my toothpaste down the sink so that when I woke up in the morning I'd have to walk all the way to the shops and back before I'd be able to get rid of that horrible fuzzy feeling off the back of my pearly whites. Really self destructive behaviour. Imagine if there'd been a gun lying around? What might I have done? What if there had been a gun AND a cat? I could've killed that cat, and when I'd realised what I'd done, turned the gun on myself.
I know it's the people that are responsible, I just think that maybe guns make it too easy.
Having said that I have just noticed that you're (supposed to be ) a girl, and as such I think you should be able to have as many guns has you want. Hell, I'll even buy you a gun myself. Not that it's relevant, but I work out three times a week, have loads of friends (including some girls) and I've never played World of Warcraft.
( Hopefully you'll have noticed from my use of words such as "rubbish", and my insistence on spelling words correctly i.e. - realised instead of realized, despite what the spellchecker is telling me -that I am an English fellow trying to exercise some of our famous quirky humour).
Seriously though, I am freaking HOT.

reply to post by Honor93

Well thats good for you, I'm sure they would have filed charges by now if they thought you were in the wrong. So.....I doubt she will be coming over for any BBQ's this summer huh.

Originally posted by mtnshredder
reply to post by Honor93

 

Sorry I didn't realize you were a woman, that changes things a lot, no offense ladies.
........

thank you for noticing but i gotta ask this truly stupid question ... what difference does that make?
male or female, we have no right (in the US) to aggressively attack/assault anyone
(cops can but we can't)

i'm still looking in my own heart for rationale some days ... like i mentioned earlier, i was seriously Against ALL guns just a few years ago. To have moved from that position was a big enough shock but to progress to this point (isn't anything i ever wanted to occur) is like a tidal wave of emotion on some days.

I am glad the resolve is what it is. I am glad to know i can, should i have to.
Shooting at paper targets isn't quite the same as a soft target (and no i don't hunt)
to be totally honest, i wasn't sure i could pull the trigger given the need to ... but, this situation eliminated that self doubt entirely.

Not that i ever care to repeat the experience, on some level i am thankful it occurred. To be reaffirmed of my own ability is a blessing. To be able to respond in such a controlled manner was a blessing. (remember, i had the pd engaged in conversation, with the phone in one hand, whilst moving to the firing point and hitting my target in one shot) ... now, i'm certainly not bragging but i am glad to have had this experience as i believe it will come in handy in the very near future.

I will always be bothered by the fact that i damaged someONE in such a manner, i have accepted this. However, it is not enough to ban guns.

The eradication of violence is possible, and not some pipe dream.

It begins at home. Children are great learners during the formative years, and many of their actions and reactions are based upon what they see, learn and experienced from adults around them. If violence is accepted within the families and neighbourhoods, it is highly likely that that the child will learn and believe violence is the only solution to resolve problems.

It begins in schools. Schools have a responsibility to educate a child, not just on the 3 r's, but to create a well rounded person. The child is at school for longer hours than at home, and would pick up much more habits from their peers. Schools bullies are a critical issue that must be resolve by the teachers upon recieving notice of such behaviours, to nip it in the bud, first by reporting it to their parents, and if it is still not resolve, then the school must invoke its rights and powers to handle the matter to ensure the child stops at such destructive behaviour.

As for adults, it is common enough that when face with stress, difficult situations, or alchoholic drinks, rage is a way to push up the adrenaline level to deal with such confusions, and that is to hit at others with anything - a stone, a glass, a chair, a table, a gun, etc , instead of calming down to rationalizing that situation from all angles to resolve a situation.

Some have cooler temperaments, some more quick to rage, and such were born during our formative childhood years. The solution is to have a wider social circle, to keep in touch with others, and share such feelings so that informed decisions on anger management can be found. Many would have experience it before, and anger that leads to violence had NEVER solve anything. Many will attest to it. It is a truth and a reality we all need to confront and embrace.

Leave the violence to the battlefield where it serves its purpose, where life and death is immenient, and not in our daily interaction with others within a civilise society. where civil discourse and debate can resolve many a difficult issue..

Originally posted by Hoskizaki
Having said that I have just noticed that you're (supposed to be ) a girl, and as such I think you should be able to have as many guns has you want. Hell, I'll even buy you a gun myself. Not that it's relevant, but I work out three times a week, have loads of friends (including some girls) and I've never played World of Warcraft.
( Hopefully you'll have noticed from my use of words such as "rubbish", and my insistence on spelling words correctly i.e. - realised instead of realized, despite what the spellchecker is telling me -that I am an English fellow trying to exercise some of our famous quirky humour).
Seriously though, I am freaking HOT.

not just a girl but a grandma too. (still too young to be 'senior' but i'm workin on it)
boy would we get along great ... i don't do WoW (although the kids keep trying to get us to) ... i also like and often use Rubbish (such a cool word) ... you'd have to accept the cats (all 18 of 'em) ... i could send you my 'wish' list if you're being serious --> presents always welcome and from what i'm told, i still have to carry my ID to buy smokes (some say HOT but that's subjective) ... i quit drinking 14+yrs ago and i do love my herbals. So, what ya think? 5'2 on a good day ... 93lbs ... brown hair ... hazel eyes ... still doing cartwheels and practice throwing my knives, regularly.
(i do hope you know i'm just teasing ... i am happily involved but thanks for the interest)

]



I apologize if this picture is way to big but I wanted EVERYONE to see it, well that and I don't know how to shrink it.

Most of the gun violence is committed by illegal owned firearms not registered ones. But comparing firearms to tobacco, alcohol, diet, microbial agents, and toxins firearms doesn't even come close. So why don't you start crying about regulating how people live?

Originally posted by mtnshredder
reply to post by Honor93

 

Well thats good for you, I'm sure they would have filed charges by now if they thought you were in the wrong. So.....I doubt she will be coming over for any BBQ's this summer huh.

you don't know it but thanks a bunch for that chuckle
we gave the BBQ she dumped to the neighbor next to her (same building) ... nope, definitely no invites

Originally posted by JohnnyCanuck

Originally posted by Rocky Black
Look at any country where it is illegal to own or posses a pistol or shot gun. Find one and look up gun related murders. Hey why are they high gee I wonder how can that be.

Thats right taking away guns is the agenda of the socialists.To make us into sheeple so we cannot defend ourselves.
Oh you dont like that.
Here drink this coolaid it will make you feel all better.

You can crow about your guns in America...but compare the murder rates for Toronto and Detroit...about 10 times higher per capita in Detroit.

You may have a right to your firearms (and we have legal guns, too, though more controlled), but you'd better add your national psyche to the equation.

Wouldn't that rate have something to do with the decline of that cities ability to employ it's masses???

like i've learned 1st hand(but not nearly as extreme as murder) "you never know what you'r'e capable of until you're pushed there.."

Detroit is a shell of it's former self, and you know that as well. 700 more GM jobs just went near toronto as of November 2010, so that's another kicker for Detroits' gm toronto expansion

reply to post by SeekerofTruth101

can i call you to 'rationalize' with the drunk, next time?
i've tried that technique many times and usually end up laughing my arse off but that's about it.

i agree patience, acceptance and quality social interactions begin at home. However, in a history such as mine, once you've moved beyond the aggressive environment but those around you have not, do you succumb to their desire or your survival?

reply to post by Honor93

thank you for noticing but i gotta ask this truly stupid question ... what difference does that make?

No not stupid question, Most guys could take "most" woman down physicaly. You said she was much bigger than you and you were small, that makes a difference. One of the first things a defense attorney would want to do is establish what the threat level was. If you flipped the circumstance around and you were much bigger than her it could and would be factored in to the threat level by the prosecution. If it was a guy against her ,it would be even tougher in a court of law to prove that he acted in self defense and deadly force was necessary.

Just chop my arms off, and ripe out my soul and send me to china, Our country was founded bye those who died to earn with those very guns you want to take away.

Originally posted by Honor93
reply to post by SeekerofTruth101

 

can i call you to 'rationalize' with the drunk, next time?
i've tried that technique many times and usually end up laughing my arse off but that's about it.

i agree patience, acceptance and quality social interactions begin at home. However, in a history such as mine, once you've moved beyond the aggressive environment but those around you have not, do you succumb to their desire or your survival?

edit on 12-1-2011 by Honor93 because: typo

There can be no denial that yours and your loved ones survival comes first. If you cannot even protect yourself, then there is no need to talk further about protecting others.

But having said that, who is 'they' and 'us'? Aren't we all humans? The cold war is dead. Communism ended. No state had declared war on anyone. The only ones who are hell bent on waging wars are based on differences by radicals. But are the jews, muslims, christians, hindus, taoists, atheist, etc our enemies?

At the basic level, we are and will always be only one race - humans, with common aspirations in life, and it is such aspirations that will be the common ground we can all stand on without resorting to violence.

Those that do resort to such, are either provocative or believe that it is the only course, without using their given and gifted brains to come out with better solution that needs not make brother harm brother.

The recent flare up over the mosque to be build near zero point NY is a case to ponder. It could have triggered a lifetime of untold deaths, regrets and sufferings, but saner heads prevailed, and once again peace was achieved.

And why rationalise with drunks? You already logically knew the drunk is far too intoxicated to be of right mind for any reason or logic. Just simply walk away, and talk to him when he is more mentally stable when the effects of alchol is gone. Challenging or hitting drunks do not make one a hero. You are only actually bullying a temporary mentally challenged person, nothing to be proud of.