A look inside the mind of erad3 (most-likely Jared Loughner)

reply to post by vkey08


"There will be theories,
Deny ignorance."

Sounds poetic

Originally posted by laslidealist
reply to post by m0r1arty

 

I ask this question with all due respect
Yourself and a lot of people insist that there is a mental illness or something wrong with people mentally because of belief in aliens or they were abducted or seen ufo's etc., etc.
Keeping this in mind and using this as the formula for what is real and relevant and what is not then can you explain to me why 90% (maybe less) believe in an entity that can not be proven for the last 3,000 years or so yet it is widely acceptable to say it's ok to believe in this unproven entity and give your entire life and in some cases money to people who's only reply when it comes to the religious God is that you need to believe and have faith regardless that God's existence has never been proved and not even close to proving. In fact Thomas Aquinas spent his entire life proving the existence of God and guess what? He died a shattered man unfulfilled.
Can anyone please explain why the same logic is not used for the billions that believe and sacrifice their entire existence for? Why are they not mentally deranged, especially the pope and everyone else associated with a non proven belief? Why is it ok to say God exists and i seen him or jesus or mary but if you see an alien or a ufo you are absolutely nuts and everyone should laugh at you but i don't see too many laughing at the religions making billions on an otherwise alien belief system? Isn't God an alien then?
once again i am just trying to understand things and will take my bashing as a man

"For in truth all is myth, myth is all"

Hi friend,
If two people share a delusion, neither sees the other as crazy. Instead they view those who do not share their delusion as deluded.

If 5 billion people share a delusion, none of them see any of the others in their group as crazy (at least for having that particular delusion). That does not negate the fact that they are all delusional.

Although some delusions form within the individual, delusions are usually accepted (conformed to) by an individual in order to gain acceptance within a group of other individuals (be it a family, a religious group, or any other type of peer group ranging from, for a few examples, a school clique to a discussion forum to a political party). The act of conforming to an external delusion is not necessarily nor normally carried out consciously or rationally. Hence the issues for the person who has conformed when it comes to rationally discussing or pondering the subject of his/her delusion(s).

reply to post by AboveTopSecret.com


I haven't read the entire thread. Tying this at work. I was wondering if anyone thought like me that this shooter was infatuated with the Congress woman and in his mind she rejected him? She is an attractive woman and I think we will find he was obsessed with her.

Originally posted by rusethorcain
reply to post by AboveTopSecret.com

 

I haven't read the entire thread. Tying this at work. I was wondering if anyone thought like me that this shooter was infatuated with the Congress woman and in his mind she rejected him? She is an attractive woman and I think we will find he was obsessed with her.

edit on 14-1-2011 by rusethorcain because: (no reason given)

You know that could be the closest to the actual truth that there is, it's an angle that none of the news is looking at, and since the last real relationship with a girl he had (or so it's been reported) feel apart rather abruptly when he was in High School, it could very well be the basis for all that transpired. Something to keep an eye open for

Originally posted by rusethorcain
reply to post by AboveTopSecret.com

 

I haven't read the entire thread. Tying this at work. I was wondering if anyone thought like me that this shooter was infatuated with the Congress woman and in his mind she rejected him? She is an attractive woman and I think we will find he was obsessed with her.

And you know, he reportedly scribbled the words "Die Bi**h" on a apparently routine correspondense from her office thanking him for his attendance at one of her events. That's the kind of thing you say to a woman you feel has hurt you or rejected you. It doesn't sound like political ranting.

reply to post by AboveTopSecret.com


Read his opening statements in his posts and regardless of who ERAD3 is, this person rambles on in a way that would have most sane people questioning his sanity......

ugh he posted in one of my threads. It creeps me out quite honestly.

I still think that this kid was nothing but a troll.
j.l.l. or not.

His posts were completely ridiculous and made no sense whatsoever..
even to the other trolls im sure.

To me,
"erad3" sounded/typed/talked/posted.. like a 4chan troll.

No meaning to his ramblings,
no real belief in them (from himself)..
just confusing ramblings to kill time.

Whenever I had read (or go back to) any of his posts..
It always popped into my mind first "TROLL".

Honestly , I could never get through a whole post/thread of his,
and i read some incredibly ridiculous things.
It was that bad. lol

I don't know what this kids deal was..
But the whole thing is just retarded.

Like "being high on salvia"

thats BS, because you don't go out and "function" on salvia.
Youre lucky if you can get up.

It lasts a very short amount of time..
You dont "take it" and go on a long trip.
It lasts minutes.
thats it.

and "inspired by zeitgeist" ..
also BS..
as that film does nothing to inspire anyone to do anything like this little person did.

It simply exposes some truths.

His weak little mind just couldn't handle it.
So he snapped like a weak little twig.

But ,
clearly he was already "effed in the head".

My opinion on this whole incident (this thread) is that I think:

1. Had ATS Administration not said anything about the allegations, people would be saying that ATS had some reason to be guilty about their alleged links.
2. By disallowing discussion on the matter, well, I think many would agree that it stinks of something bad. ATS has proven once again that it is open to any discussion by allowing itself to come under public scrutiny due to the sheer amount of material on this site that now linked to Jared L. Loughner (In terms of threads about him rather than his own user content).
3. They allow this kind of discussion because it is an important current event, regardless of his alleged ties to the site or not.
4. Whatever happens, there is going to be upset about some aspect of how it was handled and I think they did what they could to ensure it was handled in a mature way.

Hobson's Choice

reply to post by SerialLurker

And there it is. Whatever our personal misgivings or doubts, the idea of making ATS the only place on the Internet where this subject could not be discussed really doesn't make a lick of sense.

We don't get to opt out of situations like this. We just have to do our best and live with the consequences.

Originally posted by kungfucious
reply to post by AboveTopSecret.com

 

I didn't see this mentioned elsewhere in this thread.

Someone called erad3 out on one of his threads (Empty NASA Shuttles) for being the same person as savvys84

savvys84 was apparently banned some time ago. I haven't had time to look into it yet, just throwing it out there.

Actually, I believe savvys84 is currently using a new account, but I won't say why purely because I could be wrong and don't want an innocent poster being shut down for it. I suspect he may have wanted to get away from the bad vibes on his previous account.

Originally posted by solequinox
Some various thoughts about his state of mind...

One article I read interviewed some of Jared's old friends who said he used to go up to people randomly and ask them some crazy question just to get a reaction out of them (he thrived on chaos and feeling intellectually superior.) Seems very similar to the question he asked Giffords and was upset because she didn't understand it. I think that he thought of himself as very smart and on a higher level of understanding than everyone else and when people didn't understand the way he tried to communicate his views (infinite time, infinite currency, life as a dream) he became upset, angry, and internally violent. This became very clear in a college setting where people are encouraged to voice their understanding and debate amongst their peers. He became upset at professors and classmate for violating his "freedom of speech" and "freedom of thought."

SPECULATION HERE: That's interesting... Maybe in the past he saw her as some kind of equal (a soulmate?), but after she became confused by his question, felt betrayed and maybe even embarrassed at having misjudged her... if he'd spent alot of time fantasizing about her being the one person who understood him, imagine the blow when he felt that it wasn't the case. Like Bicentennial Man when Andrew finds out that the other robot merely has a personality chip and not the unique, non-programmed personality or "soul" that he has.
Loughner may have wanted to get revenge on her for the shame or embarrassment he felt internally.

Originally posted by Ahmose


Like "being high on salvia"

thats BS, because you don't go out and "function" on salvia.
Youre lucky if you can get up.

It lasts a very short amount of time..
You dont "take it" and go on a long trip.
It lasts minutes.
thats it.

I cannot talk from personal experience,only what I`ve seen read and heard,but in reading your quote my first thought was....how do you know that with prelonged heavy usage of the drug (that he was said to have done) that it is BS that it could be one main contrubuting factor to his mental illness,I have heard/read some people have become schizophrenic through the use of pot,so if that doesn`t affect everyone to become schizophrenic some people it does.

If he was that type of person to take drugs what is the effect of mixing different substances that he could have also done,and how do you know that drugs affect everyone equally?

His weak little mind just couldn't handle it.
So he snapped like a weak little twig.

But ,
clearly he was already "effed in the head".

So in your mind he was already brain dead and weak and yet mixing that with drugs is somehow BS as to be the cause of his actions? if your a Doctor or like to play one I can see you running out of patients.


People will have their theories Majic yep I know,but it still hurts my head and the same theories will be spouted the next time someone goes postal with a weapon etc as it always is that I`ve seen here on ATS over the years,"its MKULTRA and they want to take my gun or my drugs etc etc etc".

Hello. This horrific case has led me to finally sign up to ATS after some time as a respectful observer.

I think that this is a very interesting site and only held back before because I felt I had little to contribute.

I have been interested in this subject because I believe that there is method in JLL's madness. (At least in his world). And would like to get a glimpse of what he saw. (Without going mad myself)!

I have read most of what has been written here in the threads and have made some investigations on the www.

I think I have narrowed down most of the key elements at play in his mind.

As pointed out by someone on here there is a logic to his non logic which seems to be connected to Carroll's Paradox, (perhaps an inversion of it?).

He is interested in logic and philosophy, but he seems to have gotten his wires crossed somewhere. Here is a newly released video Jared made.

JLL's fixation with the creation of currencies, calendars, alphabets and number systems.

Again the interest in philosophy and he seems to have created some sort of belief system/construct which to him is undeniable. The repetition of certain themes and assertions point to some sort of a method or logic.

JLL asserts that the grammar is manipulated to control the people.

It seems he was fascinated with semantics, logic and mathematics. Maybe he looked at "formation rules" in language, but certainly there is a body of work out there on language manipulation.

I believe that he has created his own grammar and that this is the cause of communication breakdown between him and the outside world. eg reports of "incoherent questions" and people not being able to understand his stories etc.
I notice that he seems to avoid using tenses on verbs sometimes. Someone also pointed out something about the significance of exclamation marks. I'm sure that his writing structure was not just the result of drug taking and was likely following some "rules".

JLL's interest in lucid dreaming.

In a news interview with one of his ex girlfriends she says that his favourite film was "Waking Life". I had not seen it before but found a full version of it on the web and watched it. There is a lot of stuff in this movie which links to Jared and his behaviour.

I am not an expert on semantics, philosophy or mathematical theorems, but I hope that there are those who are well versed in these areas who might be able to point out things that have been missed.

Maybe we will find out what his personal paradigm was all about. Or maybe it's as simple as he just wanted to stop dreaming?

Originally posted by rusethorcain
reply to post by AboveTopSecret.com

 

I haven't read the entire thread. Tying this at work. I was wondering if anyone thought like me that this shooter was infatuated with the Congress woman and in his mind she rejected him? She is an attractive woman and I think we will find he was obsessed with her.

edit on 14-1-2011 by rusethorcain because: (no reason given)

I thought about it as well but I still believe there's more to him as per why he snapped. Especeially when the politicos jumped the news and used it to their advantage/disadvantage.

What erad3 is not Jared Loughner? After all, there are lots of people named Jared who could potentially be a few cents short of a dollar...just sayin

Regarding use of cannabis and the problem of schizophrenia:

Evidence seems to suggest that suffering of schizophrenia will lead many to self-medicate using cannabis, and even though the use of cannabis has skyrocketed, there is no increase in schizophrenia amongst the citizens.

Read this TIME article:

But here's the conundrum: while marijuana went from being a secret shared by a small community of hepcats and beatniks in the 1940s and '50s to a rite of passage for some 70% of youth by the turn of the century, rates of schizophrenia in the U.S. have remained flat, or possibly declined. For as long as it has been tracked, schizophrenia has been found to affect about 1% of the population.

Full article: TIME article

Originally posted by SerialLurker

SPECULATION HERE: That's interesting... Maybe in the past he saw her as some kind of equal (a soulmate?), but after she became confused by his question, felt betrayed and maybe even embarrassed at having misjudged her... if he'd spent alot of time fantasizing about her being the one person who understood him, imagine the blow when he felt that it wasn't the case. Like Bicentennial Man when Andrew finds out that the other robot merely has a personality chip and not the unique, non-programmed personality or "soul" that he has.
Loughner may have wanted to get revenge on her for the shame or embarrassment he felt internally.

edit on 14-1-2011 by SerialLurker because: (no reason given)

I also considered this approach and think it is a valid theory, especially in light of the new photos that were released showing him wearing a G-string. He probably had some suppressed sexual emotions fueling his hatred.

I also suspect that he intended to commit suicide based on his actions/communcations shortly before the shooting. Murder suicides are most common in intimate relationships.


Re: Jared's interest in Philosophy, Zeitgeist, Waking Life, etc...

From an interview with his friend from high school it seems that Jared used to be into this type of stuff and discuss it with his friends but recently had completely cut himself off from it and his friends entirely and went "over the edge."

One of his longtime friends said they used to be into discussing philosophy and trying to figure out the world, railing against the government suppression of individual freedoms, etc.. but sometime in the past year Jared sent his friend a message saying that he didn't want to be friends anymore and to not get in touch with him. His friend was confused by this and felt Jared had receded into his own world of confusion and madness, not the world of philosophical search for meaning or coherent theories of currency and control.

Originally posted by BruceWayne
I am not an expert on semantics, philosophy or mathematical theorems, but I hope that there are those who are well versed in these areas who might be able to point out things that have been missed.

Maybe we will find out what his personal paradigm was all about. Or maybe it's as simple as he just wanted to stop dreaming?

Finding out what was going on in his mind will change nothing.

Obviously he wasn't dreaming when he pulled out his gun and began shooting people.

Mission accomplished?

Thanks to whomever posted this link to his youtube video rant:
Jared College Video

After listening to him speak, I'm afraid that he was much more coherent/sane and had a much more specific complaint about the current state of society than I believed at first glance or, frankly, would like to admit.

Postings on the internet can look crazy especially coming from someone with communication issues, but when you listen to someone speak and can see their body language you pick up much more in the way of context, implied meanings, etc...

Some experts claim that when someone speaks only 30% of their meaning is conveyed by their words and the rest of communication is nonverbal or emotional tone.

From looking at the video and piecing together some of Jared's other posts, it seems that he had very specific beliefs about an authoritarian/fascist government controlling social constructs such as perception of time/date, currency, and violence (police & war) while suppressing the civil liberties granted in the constitution.

He says that "its not the real date," which kind of reminds me of the Christian belief that the world is actually only 8,000 years old, but I think for him is different in that he believes their is some purpose in fooling everyone about what the real date is, as if trying to conceal something in our history, or about the nature of reality itself.

"Illegal transactions, illegal currency, and teachers being paid illegally" I think is fairly easy to interpret as many people in the world and especially on these boards can recognize many simple fallacies with our debt based "infinite"currency.

He says that our current wars/occupations in the middle east are "illegal," and rails against the police as enforcement of the whole "shomboozle."

He also discusses how tptb control society and minds through language or "grammar control."

He feels that the suppression of civil liberties in combination with other authoritarian measures is resulting in the "genocide" of these "illiterate" students, and he is "pissed off" at the guy that took away his "freedom of speech" with a B. Additionally he is personally hopeless and feels that he may end up "homeless" because of the illegal systems that are controlling society.

This particular tone of the video is a clue that he is becoming violent and careless. I think his dad somehow knew (intuitively and logically) what was going on or suspected it and that is why he chased him the morning of the shooting.

At one point in the video you can see his reflection in a glass door and read his body language, in addition to hearing him speak and listening to his tone. Insightful but disturbing.

He comes across as someone that feels hopeless with his personal situation and future and blames a mysterious governmental force for his woes and controlling society (and minds) and committing "genocide" on the students, therefore he feels justified in committing acts of violence on the government or governmental structure. He seemed much more coherent and sane than I imagined him to be.