Gabrielle Giffords shooting reignites row over rightwing rhetoric in US

Originally posted by TexasChem
Instead of playing into the hands of the idealogical rapists that are attempting to control our thought processes through propoganda aimed at dividing our society with a "LEFT" and a "RIGHT". Why don't we all pause for a moment, gather our thoughts, write down our beliefs from both camps and then attempt an understanding of the purpose of these aforementioned idealogical rapists?

Meehhh. You can't fool me with your common sense approach. We need more braying hysteria. (sarcasm)

Actually I believe that the hysteria politics led to the shooter going nuts. Sadly I cannot see the masses breaking loose from the right /left paradigm even if they understood it in the first place!

Good idea

Originally posted by wasco2
Sharon Angle didn't call for anyone to be shot. What she did was fail to understand the partisan zeal and deceit of the mainstream media.

Here's another Angle quote.

“I can’t believe people are even asking that,” Angle said in the brief interview. “I’m very much a proponent of the Second Amendment and the Constitution. But what we have to focus on here is a movement, a movement that’s about retiring Harry Reid by voting him out of office.”

Then explain what she meant by "second amendment remedies" please.
I have asked this about 10 times now and have yet to get an answer.

To compare leftist rhetoric with right-wing dangerous talk and actions is nonsense.
There is no comparison.


Check the link below and see the many and various lunatics on the right and their violent language and actions. There is absolutely NO COMAPARISON TO THE RIGHT WING AND THE LEFT IN TERMS OF VIOLENCE SPEECH AND ACTIONS:

PLEASE READ BELOW!

www.csgv.org...

Originally posted by kinda kurious
Weak sauce reply / dismissal.

I present a relevant case towards scquelching incendiary political rehetoric, unfortunately you are simply mired in your own bias and too blind to see. Posts he allegedly made on this site cannot be used as the sole motivator of his actions.

To dismiss the notion that divise violent vitriol serves no positive purpose in a modern society is quite absurd.

I disagree. You chose statements you defined as allegorical and insisted they were to be taken literally.

Plus, you have not -nor anyone else- established any link whatsoever between political rhetoric and the shooter's actions. Additionally you fail to account for the hundreds of millions of people subjected to this rhetoric for scores of months who have not acted violently. This entire argument of political rhetoric being causative is a massive failure from the beginning.

Originally posted by Sinnthia

Originally posted by wasco2
Then explain what she meant by "second amendment remedies" please.
I have asked this about 10 times now and have yet to get an answer.

Yes, she was talking about armed insurrection but the quote in context doesn't look so sinister:

"I hope that's not where we're going, but, you know, if this Congress keeps going the way it is, people are really looking toward those Second Amendment remedies and saying my goodness what can we do to turn this country around?"

She's clearly not advocating it but putting it out there as on the minds of some people.

Always spliting into ...sides...makes us weak. if we don't stand together the gov is going to pass a new law from this making it a crime to say anything against a public office holder or hold up an angry sounding protest sign...they are just waiting to snatch our freedom, what is left and we split to sides and split our strenth.

Originally posted by Sinnthia
BTW, what did Hitler ever really do that was so bad?

:shk: :shk: :shk:

Originally posted by inforeal
To compare leftist rhetoric with right-wing dangerous talk and actions is nonsense.
There is no comparison.

If you had stopped there, you would have been correct. There is crap talk on both sides.
To claim that one side has more than the other ... that's absurd.
The progressive Climate of Hate

The DEMOCRATS put out a similar 'target' map. In this case, it was from an official democratic source and not just an independent person (Palin) doing their own thing .. the Democratic Leadership Committee ...

READ HERE AND GET EDUCATED

Got it? “Targeting strategy” for Democrats who hope to go behind “enemy lines” and score a bullseye by nailing the target. That comes from the the Democratic Leadership Committee website in 2004. (And let’s not forget the president of the United States, who recently urged Latinos to “punish our enemies” and said at a rally in Philadelphia “if they bring a knife to the fight we bring a gun.”)

Check the link for multiple official 'target maps' by the democrats .. complete with the same kind of gun rhetoric and the same kind of 'target' rhetoric.

reply to post by The Revenant


Right wing- left wing isn't it all the same in some regards? They are just labels given by society to put someone in a neat little stereotype. The shooter,Jared, was said to be left wing but honestly I feel he did not fit in with either.
Why does it matter if we are republican,democrat, independent.. they are only labels.
I don't consider myself republican or democrat. My beliefs are from both sides.
I am for freedom of speech, expression, against guns but also against abortion. I am for the poor and middle class but I am also for personal responsiblity. I am against war but for protecting our country if need be.
I would like to see someone try to label me.(LOL).
I see evil in both sides but mainly in the government and corperations. I am against the whole system over all but I don't believe in spreading hate. I know we all have our judgements but I try hard not to judge.

reply to post by wasco2


Sugar coat it however you like.

Originally posted by FlyersFan

Originally posted by Sinnthia
BTW, what did Hitler ever really do that was so bad?

:shk: :shk: :shk:

No answer then? Seriously. All the people screaming about how words never hurt anyone that are not trying to free Manson are not hypocrites how?

Given the dangerous mix of madness in the shooter's head as evidenced by the ramblings on various media it could be that rightwing may have tipped him over the edge. It may have been a single event. Does anyone really know what goes on in the mind of a lunatic?

We are therefore ALL speculating.

Originally posted by dreamseeker
Why does it matter if we are republican,democrat, independent.. they are only labels.

I understand why you say this, but you need to understand - in my view, you will ALWAYS have a label, the type of label depends on what beliefs you express. Have a look at one of threads in my signature for advice on this.

People always say "Don't label me, I don't fit into any of them". The problem with this is that it's just plain wrong. People will ALWAYS have a label - because it's a descriptive term. If you express beliefs that fit into a certain political descriptive category - you ARE one of them, whether you like it or not.

If I sad "Kill all the Jews", I would be a far-right fascist. If I said - "Equality for all, and a maximum wage limit", I'd be something akin to a severe Left-Wing socialist. The labels are there, and whether you like it or not, you will fit into one of the many that exist. By simply saying don't label me, you are looking for a way to say what you like, and not suffer the consequences. This at the heart of the OP topic.

The Revenant.

reply to post by The Revenant

Oh, yeah it's the right wing rhetoric that has to stop. We don't have left wing pundits running around crying for revolution completely unchecked. I used to live in Tucson, I used to shop at that Safeway, and my best friends parents almost went to see Giffords that day. What you people are doing is #ing despicable. I am so tired of people trying to spin this story for political reasons. I've also got information from a friend of Jared's that he didn't fit into any mainstream political line of thought, look at his posts for Christ's sake!

Everyone spewing partisan BS over this incident can # off. I am not kidding, you people make me sick

Originally posted by kallisti36
reply to post by The Revenant

 

Oh, yeah it's the right wing rhetoric that has to stop. We don't have left wing pundits running around crying for revolution completely unchecked. I used to live in Tucson, I used to shop at that Safeway, and my best friends parents almost went to see Giffords that day. What you people are doing is #ing despicable. I am so tired of people trying to spin this story for political reasons. I've also got information from a friend of Jared's that he didn't fit into any mainstream political line of thought, look at his posts for Christ's sake!

Everyone spewing partisan BS over this incident can # off. I am not kidding, you people make me sick

Thank you Kallisti!!! I completely agree! What the media, politicians, and pundits are doing is absolutely uncalled for, and I too am sick to my stomach over the rhetoric that has been thrown around in the past couple of days. These people in many ways are no better than Jared Loughner ...

I am ashamed of a society that, in the name of advancing their poltical agendas, would point the fingers of blame in a tragedy at anyone other than the one who acted. The fact of the matter is that to politicize this is to do a disservice to the memories of a 9 year old little girl, a federal judge, and all others who died or were seriously injured by this nutjob who had no affilation to anyone other than himself. This had nothing to do with right wingers and left wingers and the Tea Party. This had everything to do with a lone wing nut who I don't think had any idea what he believed, since much of it was so contradictory as to be incoherent ...

Absolutely sickening ...In spite of it all, I am praying for the peace and comfort all those and the friends and families of all those who were affected by this.

Funny how those on the FAR RIGHT will ONLY consider alternative concepts when they serve to move forward their own agenda.

A case in point is this thread.

New York union guilty of murder (depraved indifference),

One of the fife and drummers suggested holding the NY Sanitation Union responsible for the snow related deaths since the roads weren't plowed. Interesting how many rattlesnakers were in support of that concept.

reply to post by davidgrouchy


Well said, it's very disturbing the way some on the left seek to capitalize on this when the reality seems to be that Jared was one of them and the left has been 'targeting' people for years.

[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/1abea5269593.png[/atsimg]

reply to post by The Revenant


No, you aren't biased at all.

"If you hate ANYONE, keep it to your damn self." transitions into "gunned down simply because your ignorant, uneducated right wing trash-talking infected their unstable minds with more hate than one person can handle!!!" and "some extremist right-wing nutcase."

If your mind is personally so weak and unstable that you can't handle someone's speeches, then perhaps ATS and politics aren't meant for you. Do not take it out on the people who enjoy freedom of speech and who can handle it.

Originally posted by The Revenant

the right-wing hatemongering MUST STOP.

But you're OK with the left-wing hate mongering, right?

Just want to make sure I don't get on your crap roster, so I need to know which side of you to stand on.....

Originally posted by The Revenant

Originally posted by mydarkpassenger
One problem with trying tar Palin and the right with this brush: his friends described him as far leftwing, hardly Palin's targeted audience.

That's not what most news sources are saying - most are saying (including the source above) that he was a right-wing extremist - prone to rants about various issues from a noticeable right-wing bias.

How do you explain this?

The Revenant.

I will explain this:

You are a fool for listening to news sources. They are all slanted, trying to get their candidates into office for whatever reasons they have.

It is a shame that this lady being shot makes me want to ignore American politics altogether. it is all so stupid and petty. For real. I feel like i am getting dumber the more i pay attention to it.

reply to post by The Revenant


For the weak minded, yes...labels will always be there.

For the rest of us, we realize that boxes are where people are buried. We don't live in them.

wow most everyone here is playing right into the proverbial hand....

Think about this before anyone, i mean ANYONE, thinks about "left" or "right".

Outside the "never ending battle" issues like abortion or any other issue that never gets resolved and is always fought over, there is only one classification system. When bush was in power, if you were for the government in any way, you were right wing. If you were against the Government, you were left wing.

NOW, If you are for the government, you are left wing, if you are against it, you are right wing.

People, please, there are no official left or right areas. If they are, they are subject to change at the whim of the people in charge. If you are democrat, you are left, if you are republican, you are right.

Think about it, everybody who was not in favor of the government under bush were called lefty loonies by those in power. It reversed when obama became prez, with one difference. If you are against what the gov. does now, you are automatically a right wing nutjob. If you protest, you are a white-trash Tea-bagger, regardless of any obvious rebutting fact of the matter. If you are against the war under the bush admin, you were a left-wing idiot, and vice versa under obama.

People, quit with the left-right-conservative-liberal bullsh*t. Its a pseudo good vs evil battle that changes depending on the idea. All it does is give people a name to call eachother in political arguments.

Right now, all people can think about is "oh he was a righty, a righty i tell ya". NO!!!! He was just a psycho or a patsy, one of the 2. Nothing else.

This, like another poster said, is just a tool to attack our freedoms on the internet because this guy posted something online, like MILLIONS and BILLIONS do all the time. All this is going to do is be used as a tool to tighten the internet and speech.

If people can't see this for what it is, then i have pity on you, but not much. As long as people continue fighting with this little name-calling game that is the left-right slap-fight, we are just going to march forward into the unholy Idiocracy/1984/Brave New World hybrid future that TPTB are leading the world to.

All i ask is that people freaking take common sense into the equation, as Common Sense is really rare nowadays in society.