Proof that Jesus existed.

reply to post by NonKonphormist


I hear you NPK. I think you've handled this thread well.

This really is an impossible argument. Name one other person from 2000 years ago which we have absolute proof of their existence.

Can't be done my friend. So people believe in stuff. Big Deal right?

Conspiracy theories are often similar. People believe 9/11 to be an inside job they just don't have any proof. They are more rabid in their beliefs than any Christian, Jew, Muslim, Hindu....ect.

So you're not convinced and that is totally understandable. I often debated many believers a few years back. I would call them out and use your proof debate often. It certainly stops them in their tracks.

But the funny thing is.....as one gets older.......................you know the rest.

Becker

reply to post by Monts


Hold one one second! You need to see what the True Jews have to say about Jesus.
Differences between Judaism and Christianty

Jews vary about what they think of Jesus as a man. Some respect him as an ethical teacher who accepted Jewish law, as someone who didn't even see himself as the messiah, who didn't want to start a new religion at all. Rather, Jesus is seen by these Jews as someone who challenged the religious authorities of his day for their practices. In this view, he meant to improve Judaism according to his own understanding--- not to break with it. Whatever the Jewish response is, one point is crucial. No one who is Jewish, no born Jew and no one who converts to Judaism, can believe in Jesus as the literal son of God or as the messiah. For the Jewish people, there is no God but God.

You need to study the differences between Judaism and Christianity. No two religions could be so different.
Messiah Truth
Jews for Judaism

reply to post by Ophiuchus 13

YA KNOW ITS HER YOU WOULD BOW DOWN TO INSTEAD OF THE PRINCE!!!!!!!!!!! GREATEST LOSS

You are so funny. believing in something that that is fake - not real - designed to brainwash and control through some garbage concept called faith. At least my wife is real & yeah was meant as a joke but again she is real. oh jeez you crack me up! Oh the grammar, the spelling!

reply to post by phatpackage


wack! WITH AN EPIC FAIL FOLLOWING, IM DONE... I AM HAPPY FOR ME AND MINE WHO LOVE CHRIST/ALLAH/BUDDAH/JEHOVA/MOSES ECT. NOW I BET YOU GO HOME AND GET THE TASTE SLAPPED OUT YOUR MOUTH FOR DRINKIN TO MUCH MILK lmao peace as stated you are to wack to communicate with, I GOT FAITH DO YOU?
NOW GOATS OR snacks as I say lol, carry on w/o me im going home to my = and relax with her for a bit you know and watch that milk SMH BOWS DOWN TO THE VA JA JA BEFOR THE PRINCE OF THIS ENTIRE UNIVERSE. LATER AND GOD BLESS ALL MEN AMEN .

reply to post by Ophiuchus 13

I GOT FAITH DO YOU?

yes I do but not in any of the lies & deception you have mentioned. You seriously need medical help. BTW what is this wack stuff. Nobody ever threatened physical violence to me here on ATS before. Even in the most intense arguing sorry meant debates? Still you are incredibly funny!

Sorry to tell you that your quest is doomed to faliure. We will never have 100% proof that Jesus existed, or that he was who he said he was. Recorded history of today would have been able to document it, but something tells me that, if Christianity is correct in it's beliefs, we are not supposed to have proof. It is a religon heavily based on the idea of "blind faith", and so proof would only serve to undermine it.

That being said, I do believe that Jesus was a real person who lived two thousand years ago. I believe that he was also a spiritual person (perhaps even a spiritual healer) who devoted his life to spreading love and joy to as many people as he could reach. How he would have healed people is up for debate...spirital healing usually has a heavy reliance on the beliefs of the person being healed. I think it acts as a placebo...the person is so convinced that it's going to work that their own brain does the healing. As for Jesus being the Son of God...or, for that matter, as far as Jesus claiming such a fact...

....well, we need to take the Bible with a grain of salt. Most mythology is rooted in truth, after all. The problem is that the New Testament was written what? 500 years after the death of Christ, or something along those lines? Compare it to the Telephone game that everybody must have played at least once in school. Except instead of a message or event being passed between a class of twenty, it is passed between the population of multiple nations. And, instead of the game being over in thirty seconds, it takes five centuries before someone writes it down. And over all those years, people have exaggerated the story, or induldged themselves by adding a snippit of their own. Everybody does this...it's human nature as far as I'm concerned.

So, I feel there is enough evidence to say that:
1) Jesus of Nazarath was a thrity-thrity five year old man who lived two thousand years ago
2) He was a spiritual man, who preached a message of peace and healed the sick
3) He was convicted of herasy, and nailed to the cross

Everything else about his life, as far as I'm concerned, is completely up for grabs. After so long the story would have become so unimaginably twisted and contorted that the truth will probably be lossed for eternity...or, at the very least, until God rains hellfire and brimstone down upon us blasphemous humans


GtkP

reply to post by Ophiuchus 13


Trying to wade through the murky depths of your post is both irritating and futile. Pushing caps lock does NOT make your post any more useful or even understandable. I think you're confused about it.

reply to post by of the Ether


if he was merely a great teacher, he would be a liar.
and someone who shouldn't be listened to or followed at all.

reply to post by Romantic_Rebel


I've seen you bring these links up several times now. The part that you quoted from off-site, isn't it saying that Jews believe Jesus the man existed? They just do not believe he was the Messiah? If you trust those sites, then do you trust that the Man Jesus existed?

Jesus was real its a fact that has been proven

Originally posted by williamAmerican
Jesus was real its a fact that has been proven

edit on 22-11-2010 by williamAmerican because: (no reason given)

Where has it been proven?. This is the whole point of the thread . If you have seen proof show it!

reply to post by FeedTic


Well like the source says. Jews views differ on Jesus. To me a slight chance of him existing. we just don't what he truly was like when he was alive. I wouldn't even say his name is Jesus. It's possible the Jesus today many have different views of was real yet was very different in the past. I have many relives alive today and in the past who would die for this person.

reply to post by phatpackage


what he Phat said
we would love to see this proof
ignore deniance
mithra existed before christ was just like christ and the christians say the devil created him to misdirect everyone sheeesh
mithra you can prove

Originally posted by WashingtonGrewHemp
After reading the first 20 responses, it's clear to me that nobody has any proof he actually existed. The myth of Jesus is the most damaging example of hero worship in the history of mankind. Worship a magical Jew on a cross who you think will come back to life periodically and see how far that gets you. Religion is all evil hero worship, causing social inequality and scapegoating. Ernest Becker wrote a book called "Escape From Evil" in which he details the infinite faults of religion. Read it, and never go to church again.

Wheres the Proof that Muhammad even existed?


Can you answer that?

reply to post by phatpackage


Exactly the point. He won't, though...because he CAN'T.

I'll translate:

"Here's my evidence for Christ's existence. I was told to believe in him a long time ago and I still do, so he must be real."

reply to post by NonKonphormist

After countless threads being hijacks by Christians, I have decide to start a thread asking for proof that Jesus actually existed.

Which jesus would that be then ?

Originally posted by williamAmerican
Jesus was real its a fact that has been proven

edit on 22-11-2010 by williamAmerican because: (no reason given)

There are people going round every sunday evening saying the very same, they sometimes add "it has been scientifically proven".

Needless to say people have grown up a little and the pews in their churches are still getting emptier .

reply to post by NonKonphormist


Do you believe Josephus(Titus Flavius Josephus) existed in history? He lived 37 – c.100 AD/CE. He can be considered pretty much contemporary. He wrote extensively about Jesus Christ the story which was not too much different from the story in the gospels. If you believe he(Josephus) actually lived in history, you can safely say Jesus existed in history also. Josephus was not one of his disciples so you can safely say he was objective on the issue.

I don't believe that Jesus was the messiah, or the flesh and blood son of God, but I have no problem believing that he existed - or, at least, that a man lived and died, and in doing so inspired a great number of people. He could have been a teacher or a mystic of some sort, who ran afoul of those in authority who made a martyr of him.

You could ask the same question of any figure from antiquity - who's to say that Alexander the Great existed? Where is the proof? Sparticus? See where I'm going with this?

I don't care if Muhammad existed. Islam is the same as Judaism and Christianity- evil hero-worship that causes structured inequality. Every one in academia agrees with me. Religion will go the way of the Dodo eventually when people get sick and tired of hearing about Middle East Peace, which is an utter impossibility. People kill each other because they believe in slightly different myths, all with the same origin. It's idiotic, and I'll have no part in it.