Who "Owns" The Moon?

Originally posted by merka
Technically the US cannot claim the moon, last time I checked they (and most of the world) had signed and ratified the Outer Space Treaty, prohibiting anyone from claiming the moon.

Not true

Article II of the 1967 Outer Space Treaty (OST) states that,...and is one of the major reasons that the Moon Treaty has not been ratified by very many nations (including the United States). 13 US Congress, HR5382,

The Moon Treaty goes further than the OST in prohibiting any military bases on the Moon (Article 3). Article 4 states that: “The exploration and use of the Moon shall be the province of all mankind and shall be carried out for the benefit and in the interests of all countries, irrespective of their degree of economic or scientific development. Due regard shall be paid to the interests of present and future generations as well as to the need to promote higher standards of living and conditions of economic and social progress and development in accordance with the Charter of the United Nations.” This is interpreted by some to mean that technology and profits have to be shared by all nations and is one of the major reasons that the Moon Treaty has not been ratified by very many nations (including the United States). 13 US Congress, HR5382, Public Law 108–492—

www.gwu.edu...

Dr Resnick et al were granted the Mineral rights in the World Court at the Haque 35+ years ago and so far that has held. He owns 23 patents, several are top secret including a stealth 'coating' to make things invisible

The US Army SMDC has had a base on the farside of the Moon since 1962. The project was headed by Brig Gen Trudeau and run by von Braun

The US NAVAL SPACE COMMAND runs the protection fleet, but they make this notice on the front page of the Clementine data website (Yes Clementine was NAVY not NASA)

The Naval Research Laboratory is not affiliated in any way with any organization selling lunar property or acreage on the moon. NRL has no involvement, either officially or unofficially, in providing "after-sales service" for the purchase of lunar property from the Lunar Embassy, its franchisees, or any similar organizations. Disputes arising from the purchase of lunar property from such organizations must be resolved with the seller directly.

www.cmf.nrl.navy.mil...

This page has since moved... use the internet archive wayback machine. A LOT of military stuff was moved early 2008. (still not sure what triggered that )

So if you bought some Lunar property, the NAVY fleet won't be protecting 'private concerns'

As to the minerals...

An email from Joe...

Your comment on 'liquifying' minerals on the moon is 'right on time'. Our group, presently, is engaged in deep discussion as to modifying the minerals to be harvested, and liquifying (H3, for example) is/has been the subject of much heated discussion. Actually, I suggested (to our group) not so much 'liquifying' ...but 'changing the state' . If you look at some of my patents...you'll note that in these I teach 'change of state' (from liquid to a gas, for example) to accomplish some desired result: Entropy vs Enthalpy, for example. The discussions continue as of this writing, with all suggestions being considered by our group (and others) prior to making recommendations to those within and outside our group.

On the mining-thing. I can only state that in the broadest of senses mining operations have taken place on the lunar surface and are presently being conducted on Mars (and continue on the Moon). Although the use of terminology, 'mining' has been downplayed (by NASA) and there exists an 'internal memo' ,

Use of terminology, e.g., 'mining', could be considered (by some countries) to constitute a violation of the International Space Treaty. Thus, NASA is real-careful about use of terminology that could be considered a breach of 'Policy and Protocol'. I can give you this stuff as it's 'public information'. You have to look between the spaces/lines for more info and draw your own conclusions.

BTW just in case you missed it, President Obama has CANCELLED all NASA's plans to go back to the Moon and to make Lunar Colonies, despite the announcement of finding a billion gallons plus of water (something the DoD already released in a pres conference in 1996)

Obama says we should spend the money to go to an Asteroid instead... and maybe Mars in 25 years

So I guess the mining operations and moon bases are safe for another 25 years

And yes I do have 'stuff' to back all that up

I own the Moon. I purchased it at a car boot sale for 50 pence last Sunday. A real bargain.

an interesting question which should be answered is who owns the Earth?
Apparently the meek are going to inherit it, but were never told when.

I suppose once you've found out who owns the Earth, then you can find out who owns the neighbouring property

Originally posted by Daisy-Lola
an interesting question which should be answered is who owns the Earth?

The Bilderberg Club

Bush, Hillary and Obama are all members.

Queen Beatrix of the Netherlands is the head of that.



Netherlands is where the Hague is that gave the mineral rights to ROC and the Home of Royal Dutch Shell, the world's largest oil company that has their hands into Hydrogen distribution and is the money behind Fresh and Easy food stores

So yeah... who owns the Earth?

THEY do

reply to post by zorgon


hey zorgon
who ownes the builderburgers?
lol
your spot on again ssttaarr

xp

reply to post by zorgon



Relax, owning the world isn't that much fun..

I live in the Netherlands, besides owning the world.. We do have to pay heavy taxes too

Edit: A friend of mine did buy some "moon" shares about 20 years ago, and they did rise enormously. That doesn't mean it is legitimid, it does mean there are people who believe in it.
No different from normal companies.. Unless you sell in time, you have expensive paper at the end ;-)

Originally posted by midicon
reply to post by Redevilfan09

 

There was a company set up some years ago, selling small packages of land on the moon.
It was more of a novelty gift idea, that became a mini fad.
It was tested out in court I think and wasn't deemed legal.
I have one of these packages, given to me as a christmas gift.
The company was called 'Big Cheese'

I own a plot on the moon I was given it ( a certificate and plot ref with coordinates) for my fortieth birthday last year.

By a United Nations decree all inhabitants and nations on Earth have an equal claim to the Moon as it belongs to everyone on Earth!

reply to post by tarifa37


It may be the same sort of thing.
I too have a certificate with map, co-ordinates etc,
As I said before, it really isn't a legal document, more quasi-legal.
My one is from about eight years ago.
The gift from a friend was purchased over the internet and given to me.
There was a follow up procedure, ie you had to register your claim,
For another small fee of course.
As I said it is more of a novelty/fun thing which has no intrinsic value.

THe company is called MoonEstates.

reply to post by stupid girl


Great Question - I considered this a few years ago and put this little article together with some info

LINK

I definitely wouldn't worry about mining water (H2O)
That would just be for the miners who mine Helium-3.
Helium-3 is why anyone would be interested doing anything on the moon.

You guy's are so wide of the mark!

Our very own HRH Queen Elizabeth II owns the moon, apparently she owns nearly everything else as well.

Oh to answer your question OP, the Moon belongs to the international community. More specifically the UN under its Outer Space Treaty. An addendum to the aforementioned treaty was added known as the Moon Treaty or Moon Agreement. Like I initially said, the corporate oligarchs will end up plundering and pillaging the Lunar resources for profit.

In theory, this is correct. The moon is kind of like Antarctica in this sense. However, as previously stated by some, this idea hasn't technically been ratified by the powers who have gone there (manned or unmanned), so it's still a bit in contention.

The moon is actually owned by an individual called Dennis Hope
He has sold HUNDREDS of thousands of acres of it too as gifts.

"Did you know that The Outer Space Treaty of 1967 forbids any government from claiming a planet like the Moon, but didn’t mention whether private individuals can claim some for themselves?

That is completely true…. so back in 1980, an American called Dennis Hope filed his claim to the Moon with the Russian and American governments… and neither superpowers have contested it since."

So he is the owner lol

Edit: If you cant own any planet then how comes we have borders and government profit from "their" resources? If i go to NY and start digging up the pavement i will be arrested....because its owned by someone. If i cross a border i have to abide by their laws...because its their land legally.

The moon treaty thing will soon be abolished once a govenrment such as th US want to claim off world lands.

Who "Owns" The Moon?

What a fantastic opportunity for me to advocate for libertarian property rights.

In a free society, property comes into ownership through the mechanism of homesteading. The first person to use a resource can claim ownership of that resource.

To simplify this, let us take the example of a spear. If I were to walk through the woods and pick up a stick, then apply my labor to that stick which turns it into a spear, I could be considered the owner of that spear. No other tribesman may take my spear or use my spear without my permission.

Prior to my application of labor, the stick was not owned by anyone since no one was using the land or the wood which I applied my labor to.

If I discard the spear and no longer use it, the spear once again has no owner and may be picked up and "owned" by another.

Since I have applied the value of my labor to the stick, the stick rises in accordance with the labor applied. I may now trade my spear (which is really the value of my labor) for something else of equal value, perhaps a few eggs.

This same principle of homesteading can be applied to land. Those who use the land first can claim ownership.

If land is being unused, it SHOULD be considered to have no owner (obviously this is not quite how property works today). If land is being unused, a person should be allowed to put that land to use and retain ownership of that land as long as it is being put to use. A person who comes into ownership of land through this mechanism of homesteading may then sell the land at market value to others who may wish to use the land for their own devices.

So to answer the question of who owns the moon, a libertarian would answer "no one" since no one is putting it to use.

Originally posted by PsykoOps
reply to post by Hefficide

 

Isn't there a company that claims that they have legally claimed moon? They sell lots to people on the net.

i was wondering about this the other day actually and had a quick look around .. found this website
www.moonestates.com...

it also says that you can buy land on mars and venus

anyone got any idea

Good question, but as no-one has actually been there yet anyway it really makes no difference. You don't believe Apollo 11 actually landed do you?

I've been reading lots of research papers on the Fe-0 iron on the moon. Guess this form of Iron isn't found on Earth and if you put a glob of it in a microwave along with your cup of coffee....the iron would liquify before your coffee got hot.

Now imagine you build a satellite or rover with a nuclear powersource shooting microwaves at the surface of the moon.....instant "glass" highway you would be making.

It is easier to construct/mine on the moon than Earth. This was a hot topic discussed in the 41st Annual Lunar and Planetary Science Conference earlier this year.

Didn't you hear?