Why all the Britishphobia in the UK?

reply to post by stumason


You're living in some fanciful time warp of your own creation, draping yourself in all things English to define yourself as ATS's own staunch Englishman.

Pitiful. Absolutely pitiful.

Even if we accept what you say is true, which I don't, English people who celebrate Saint George's Day are white, are they not ? With ne'er a black face to be seen, I bet. If it's not inclusive, it's racist, simple as.

reply to post by Ulala


Ah, I see. Unable to refute my claims so you resort to a personal attack. Nice way to spoil what was an adult discussion. Well done.

So St Georges day is only white folk? How do you know this? I've been down the local on April 23rd and seen plenty of Black folk in there. The only groups I don't see too often down the pubs are Asian's, but I suppose religious reasons prevent them from going to a bar.

It's not the English peoples fault if people of other cultures don't celebrate it and it shouldn't be an issue. After all, it is Englands patron saint, not Pakistans or India's. I wouldn't ask them to celebrate my festivals anymore than I'd expect them not to want me to celebrate Ramadan or Diwali. Each to their own. There is no racism there, quite the opposite in fact!

What about St Andrews day? Or St Patricks? or St Davids? I suppose it's ok for the Welsh, Irish and Scots to celebrate their day (in exactly the same way we English do) but because the English do it, it must be racist. A prime example of the attitude I was complaining about.

EDIT: What makes your posts even more laughable is that Finland has the lowest rate of foreign citizens in the EU and even those are mostly White Russians and latvians!

How many blacks celebrate Finnish Independance day? Must be racist if you have none, following your logic.

[edit on 22/5/10 by stumason]

reply to post by Ulala


So St Georges day, Jack in the Green, Wassailing, and all the other traditions some of which go back 1,500 add years are racist as they relate to white English heritage??

edit spelling.. lol

[edit on 22/5/10 by thoughtsfull]

reply to post by stumason


I think the issue for most english people is that they just don't have the get up and go to implement a proper celebration. All I ever seem to hear is that 'we need a bank holiday'. Well, St Patrick's Day gets a massive turnout because the Irish have made it that way and the corporations, the media and other nationalities have jumped onboard for each of their various reasons.

If people had true conviction in promoting their so-called Englishness, then they would be out there and doing something to about it. If you want to fly a flag, fly it. It you want to wear a football shirt wear it. As long as your good behavior matches your enthusiasm for your cause, then you should have no problems, despite whatever the Daily Mail says.

reply to post by thoughtsfull


Apparently so....

But I bet he'd be more than happy to let Indians celebrate Diwali or Muslims celebrate Ramadan without any hint of racist claims.

Like I said, a prime example of trying to quash English culture as racist, while allowing other cultures to celebrate their heritage without restraint.

What is it about being English that requires people to try and supress it?

reply to post by Extreme Pilgrim


It seems to depends where you live. When I lived in Reading, St Georges day was very much a thing a few local pubs did and it was elft at that. This is because Reading is one the most diverse towns in the UK withover 200 different cultural groups.

But a mere 7 miles away in my new home of Wokingham, it's an entirely different thing. We have Spring festivals that have a long heritage going back centuries, we have special events on St Geroges day around town and all the businesses join in.

I have noticed that in the run up to the world cup, the corporate machine is working ovetrime to promote England, not least because we're the only home nation in the cup.

There is definately a resurgance of English pride, but in typical English fashion it will always be muted compared to our more "animated" cousins to the North and West

Originally posted by stumason
reply to post by thoughtsfull

 

Apparently so....

But I bet he'd be more than happy to let Indians celebrate Diwali or Muslims celebrate Ramadan without any hint of racist claims.

Like I said, a prime example of trying to quash English culture as racist, while allowing other cultures to celebrate their heritage without restraint.

What is it about being English that requires people to try and supress it?

Well, I really want to understand that one... it is one topic that has bugged me for a long time.. Not even the protectorate managed to stop those in Lewes celebrating such things, am sure no one else will be able to... but they try! why... it is strange..

The Bonfire council tried to get UNESCO protection for our cultural traditions (like those afforded other cultures) but our traditions get no protection, not even from UNESCO.

Originally posted by Extreme Pilgrim
reply to post by stumason

 

I think the issue for most english people is that they just don't have the get up and go to implement a proper celebration. All I ever seem to hear is that 'we need a bank holiday'. Well, St Patrick's Day gets a massive turnout because the Irish have made it that way and the corporations, the media and other nationalities have jumped onboard for each of their various reasons.

If people had true conviction in promoting their so-called Englishness, then they would be out there and doing something to about it. If you want to fly a flag, fly it. It you want to wear a football shirt wear it. As long as your good behavior matches your enthusiasm for your cause, then you should have no problems, despite whatever the Daily Mail says.

Ignoring the Englishness term... the local Bonfire council has tried to get UNESCO protection for our culture heritage, if your unaware, we have a bonfire season that covers 12 weeks and over 1,000 years of history, encapsulated within those traditions are remembrance services for those who have fallen in all wars...

The council now only 35 towns and villages, down from 50 a few years ago... the pressure financially from police, local gov has put an end to many societies in the last 10 years.. and to be honest this has been ongoing for 150 years..

So what is it about our traditions? why is it they get less protection than other cultural traditions? why is it they have to be subdued? it is for me an interesting question, one that has a lot of ramifications..

Originally posted by Ulala

Originally posted by SearchLightsInc
reply to post by Ulala

 

[quote[If they've arrived in the UK legally they've every right to apply for housing ... the key is the word "apply" ... you don't get points because you're black. You get points because you're homeless & half a hundred other reasons. If more council housing is required, then elect a government or council committed to doing so ... oops, you guys just voted Conservative ... so that's that one shafted. Maybe you could tell the darked skinned fellows to sleep in a tent in a park instead, might suit your culture better.

Well i am not talking about legally. I am talking about migrant family who have a house, which may not meet their needs and yet they are placed on the housing list ABOVE an english family (specificly white) who had their name on that list YEARS before any foreirner. Is that fair, considering both familys are in the same situation?
How it should be is how it was - First come first serve. But what the frack do i know? i'm just someone talking sense.

I don't know anybody who thinks "British "culture" is scum. And I don't even think you know what culture even is anyway. So you celebrate the Saint of your country, yeah ? And how does that celebration manifest itself ? Do you go to church, to worship ? Give thanks to your saint ? Write a poem or strum a guitar and sing some songs around a campfire ? Perhaps getting drunk in a pub on a Sunday lunchtime, walking down a "Paki street" with your St George flags and breaking a few windows ... isn't that more likely ?

Well these days we dont do much, would be nice to have a parade without some minorities moaning and ruining it for people. Its like having a birthday and inviting that one person who cant cheer the hell up. I think where you go wrong in your last quote (For some strange reason) is that you generalise all the english to be racist lol I was smiling when i read it because its just typical arrogance from someone who doesnt have a clue. You say i dont know culture and yet you generalise all the english are racist? Well, i guess thats freespeech and all.

Prerogative, that's prerogative. I'm not even British and can spell your own words better than you. That doesn't mean I'm better than you in any way shape or form, but I'd be well impressed if you could tell me the name of the President of Finland, for example, or the King of Norway, without resorting to google. See, me foreigner, me takey interest in da English t'ings. You, you English, you aint gotta clue.

Oh dear me, the spelling police XD you might aswell arrst me now because if you think i'm going to spell check this post for you, you are misguided. Your not british? then you probably speak more then one language? I really envy your lingustic ability, to the point it threatens me and i feel stupid when matched against you. Not bring british, you get sarcasm right? hope so. The president of findland? Cant say hes that important enough to make british news regulary, if even at all. and the kings of norway? I dont know any but if thats have you judge someones intelligence then obviously your an idiot. But thank you for taking the time to try and debunk my racist POV.
Hope you had a great day with the sun.

What do you define as "English culture" then anyway, this "culture" that dark skinned foreigners are subverting ... dazzle us with your special insight on English culture.

Read the OP, usualy helps.

Originally posted by Dermo
reply to post by Peruvianmonk

 

No offense here..

But EU immigration into the UK is too much?

Tell that to the Spanish with their Million Spare Brits lying around taking their jobs..

But of course thats different somehow..?

Im not one to complain about Immigration/Emigration because Irish history is rife with it **Ahem** But at least look at both ends of the stick..

Actually i agree. The spanish i'm sure would love to kick the english out and to be fair, they should. No problems there lol.

The problem with the British and the English is simple. We are a very old nation and somehow we have largely grown beyond the more forceful forms of patriotism as compared to our chums from across the pond. We have also given the world a massive cultural set of icons...

So what happens we turn our minds to other things. Understatement, tact and self-efacement are part of our national heritage.

I am against the politicisationof culture as seen by the town hall mafia. Multiculturism has become a complete cliche involving Steel bands and Somosas. Yet britain is obviously a multicultural country because it has many cultures.

I think it took the recent press-induced immigration hysteria to shock people into thinking Englishness is under threat. It clearly is not and just is not spoken about on a daily basis. We do not discuss our height on a daily basis do we?

99% of immigrants want to keep their heads down work and fit in..

[edit on 23-5-2010 by Tiger5]

Most british meet new people and make new fiends in the pubs/clubs poss due to weather especially in the cold months, the scotish and british both like the pub also irish,welsh .Other,s the new cultures, not the blacks they have a drink, the asian muslims they dont hang loose,or try to break the ice ,result the vibes stay up,The two cultures clash due to life style, maybe they should turn out for a drink even pop, become a member of the local clubs pool team or such local teams ,they are all whiteish around here , lots of polish been hear for years, also latvians they blended well ,round my local pubs the asian ,muslims,i never c in a pub only c them on the local market they do now own most corner shops,AND i here they send all profit money home,They do dress in same cloths year after year as though the money they earn dont belong to them?? also they own all the rented property and rent to single men who are down on there luck in tiny bed sits,I was in one once 15 years back,he had three storey building and lots of rooms even a bed in cellar no windows, horrid place,56 quid for room 12foot by 7 feet.
fly the flag i say ,but i miss the christmas decorations in hospital and town centers

I remember fights with the next town along also no racism there ,just your town had diff name.It was organized and takeing a weapon made you a puff,75 to 1980, we followed the bigens to watch,and get chased,they hardly fought it was singing,shouting ,chargeing at each others group just boys being boys ,Nothing to do back then only 3 channels on tv with 2 the bbc.












[edit on 5/22/2010 by dashar]

[edit on 5/22/2010 by dashar]

OP, this how your post and all the others like it sound to me...

"I hate all these coloured people coming into my country! Bla bla bla... with all their weird cultures and weird languages and weird religions that are making me feel uncomfortable because I'm actually racist and feel that, nowadays, I can't express freely just how racist I am like people in this country used to be able to do before it became all liberal and embracing and bla bla bla. Now I have to resort to making racist posts which are written in a politically correct way on ATS because if I wrote to my MP about this or spoke to most British people in general they would all call me racist bla bla bla and it's so unfair cry cry bla bla. Why can't my country be more white like it used to be bla bla bla.

There's a difference between being British and being English. People don't seem to understand that. A British person can be any colour skin or have any religion, they can be Chinese, Indian, Spanish. I'm British but I'm not English even though my parents were born in this country and their parents before them and my mother is as white as snow, but even she wouldn't call herself English. A hell of a lot of people in England have grandparents/ great grandparents and so on that came from other countries as well as those from europe. What threads like yours are actually complaining about is how anti English it is to have too many people in our country who aren't English.

If it makes you feel better stick an England flag on your car and go about your way, nobody else will really give a flying poopie what flag you put on your car but if it gives you a boner go right ahead.

reply to post by stumason


Took a bit of time to reply but this is a corker, besides I want to get bad and read the rest of this thread.

basically it hit on what you said.

My wife is Mexican. she has been living in the UK legally for the last 5 years. Tbhis last December, we decided to move back to Mexico,

Anyway. We are at Chicago Airport, about to check in for a Mexicana flight to Mexico.

Everyone is in the "Queue" but everyone as Mexicans do are jumping the queue to go to the desk to ask questions.

My wife turns to me and says Bloody Mexicans, Why can;t they just wait in line like everyone else until it's their turn!!!

I had to laugh!! Sorry love you're now about as English as they come!!!

reply to post by Ulala


Bullcrap.

is it our fault is dark skinned people do not choose to celebrate the day of the Patron Saint of England????

No!!

Is it racist if those people that do are white?? NO

Do i care if colored people celebrate it too. NO.

Do i wish more people would

YES

I feel ASHAMED that more English celebrate Paddy's day than Georges day!

reply to post by Mesdoline


Question:

if your parents, grandparents and great grandparents have lived in England, but do not call themselves English. And you do not, despite being born in England and 3 gens living in England, then what the hell are you??

if you were Jewish by descent in 1939 Germany after that many generation you could join the SS as a pure blood German!

Nothing on your politics just stating for the second time on this thread how ethnicity can be determined.

This is nothing about flags on cars or other such 4 year football paraphernalia.

I have news for you.

If you parent were born in England and there parents before them. And you were. Well that makes you ethically whatever

You might be black, white, green brown, yellow or pink. I don't care.

But after three generation of your family born in England, and YOu still say you are not English!!??

Well whatever the nationality of your descent go live there then.

it is high time that the English stood up like the Scot ans Welsh and said we too are a real nation again! NOT an ethnicity.

So you might be coloured so you might be white. NOONE really cares (At least I don't) but if you are born here you ARE ENGLISH

Learn YOUR hertiage. be proud of YOUR HOME. Know what it is to be ENGLISH.

I know. I don;t live there any more, But I feel it everyday. and you know what?

it hurts to be far from your home!

[edit on 22/505/1010 by JakiusFogg]

[edit on 22/505/1010 by JakiusFogg]

Originally posted by Mesdoline
OP, this how your post and all the others like it sound to me...

"I hate all these coloured people coming into my country! Bla bla bla... with all their weird cultures and weird languages and weird religions that are making me feel uncomfortable because I'm actually racist and feel that, nowadays, I can't express freely just how racist I am like people in this country used to be able to do before it became all liberal and embracing and bla bla bla. Now I have to resort to making racist posts which are written in a politically correct way on ATS because if I wrote to my MP about this or spoke to most British people in general they would all call me racist bla bla bla and it's so unfair cry cry bla bla. Why can't my country be more white like it used to be bla bla bla.

There's a difference between being British and being English. People don't seem to understand that. A British person can be any colour skin or have any religion, they can be Chinese, Indian, Spanish. I'm British but I'm not English even though my parents were born in this country and their parents before them and my mother is as white as snow, but even she wouldn't call herself English. A hell of a lot of people in England have grandparents/ great grandparents and so on that came from other countries as well as those from europe. What threads like yours are actually complaining about is how anti English it is to have too many people in our country who aren't English.

If it makes you feel better stick an England flag on your car and go about your way, nobody else will really give a flying poopie what flag you put on your car but if it gives you a boner go right ahead.

I dont understand where you got these ideas from, would you so me a favour and quote parts of my OP to back up your opinion? I dont remember saying anything about how i hate people of different creed - I remember saying how i dont like those that refuse to intergrate and wish to undermine the laws of Britain by trying to impliment their own. However, i'm really not in the mood to answer your argument because i have a sneaky suspicion you didnt read my OP...
Please quote.

reply to post by JakiusFogg


St Patrick's day seems to have has been around longer than St George's day. Dare I say that in the bad old days (1950's /60s )it was the immigrant Irish that felt the need to assert their culture in England. Besides St Patrick's day has become a day of fun for all without being specifically Irish.

the English need to realise that theirs is the dominant culture and Englishness is therefore a given. If I step back we are surrounded by Englishness and rightly so. I don't see why a few fundie moslems generate such an uproar. I do not bdelieve Englishness is so fragile. It has been around for centuaries.

Originally posted by Tiger5
reply to post by JakiusFogg

 

St Patrick's day seems to have has been around longer than St George's day. Dare I say that in the bad old days (1950's /60s )it was the immigrant Irish that felt the need to assert their culture in England. Besides St Patrick's day has become a day of fun for all without being specifically Irish.

No Blacks, No Dogs, No Irish. Those were the signs that greeted the 'foreign labour' that came the englands shore in the not-too-distant past. The Irish felt that they only found compassion and unity amongst their own kind, leading them to keep the spirit of their homeland in the not so welcoming adopted country in which they found themselves working. This has been replicated by many of the ethnic minorities in the UK.

Originally posted by Tiger5
the English need to realise that theirs is the dominant culture and Englishness is therefore a given. If I step back we are surrounded by Englishness and rightly so. I don't see why a few fundie moslems generate such an uproar. I do not bdelieve Englishness is so fragile. It has been around for centuaries.

The fundie moslems have an agenda that would wipe all forms of non Islamic culture off the face of the Earth.

I completely agree that Englishness is not fragile. Because of the proud history of civil disobedience against social and political injustice in this country, we now enjoy freedoms that far exceed civil freedoms in many other countries. Freedom of association and freedom of ideology have helped develop the general British and in particular English reputation for fairness and tolerance.

What I find amazing is that whenever I see references to British or English culture, there is always mention of drink feulled, mindless absurdity! Bring on the Morris Men! The Horticultural Society! Or how about some Cricket?