Video of girls dancing in lingerie causes internet row

Originally posted by Dark Ghost

But you were suggesting that the only thing wrong with this video is those who see it as kids being sexualised. Then you went on to associate denouncing the sexualisation of children with being a paedophile.

You can't see it as sexualized without having sexualized it in your head. It's not sexual by nature. They aren't on stage having sex. I don't dare imagine what people like you think when they see little girls dancing like that.

Protesting is a waste of time. Political Correctness is a waste of time. Have a look at the title of thread.

I'll just have to go with the evidence and say reason is a waste of your time as well.

Originally posted by Point of No Return
Would you say the same if these girls were doing a ballet recital?

No because the context is completely different. The same as girls that aspire to be sportswomen are using their bodies for different purposes.

It seems that the problem is the perceived sexual undertone in the girls' dance, wich is in the eye of the beholder.

That is one of the problems. When do we draw the line?

Originally posted by Dark Ghost

It seems that the problem is the perceived sexual undertone in the girls' dance, wich is in the eye of the beholder.

That is one of the problems. When do we draw the line?

Maybe you should stop seeing the girls as sexual objects instead of blaming it on them and their clothes?

Originally posted by RestingInPieces
You can't see it as sexualized without having sexualized it in your head. It's not sexual by nature. They aren't on stage having sex.

So I cannot see a thief without having tendencies to steal? You can't see a person being discriminated against unless you are discriminated against in your head?

I don't dare imagine what people like you think when they see little girls dancing like that.

Nice try. Again resorting to veiled insults in an attempt to get me fired up. You will have to do better than that. What goes through my mind is actually sympathy for the girls - where are their parents and why do they think behaving like that is cool?

I'll just have to go with the evidence and say reason is a waste of your time as well.

I have to agree: the only way to communicate with you seems to be through veiled insults. I will stop, thanks for the heads up.

reply to post by Dark Ghost

No because the context is completely different. The same as girls that aspire to be sportswomen are using their bodies for different purposes.

Why is the context different? In all cases the girls use their body for sports or dance.

The only difference is the perceived sexual nature of the dance and the clothing, or lack of clothing.

Young ballerinas wear a smaller adult ballerina outfit.

Young soccer playing girls wear smaller adult soccer clothing.

Young pop dancing girls wear smaller adult pop singer clothing.

I understand how people could have a problem with this, as the kids are kinda portrayed as adult women, and that they should stick to being kids, yet, I still don't see anything sexual about it.

I'm not at all saying that people who find this sexual, are pedophiles themselves, but the sex is in their perception, I don't see it.

reply to post by Dark Ghost

So I cannot see a thief without having tendencies to steal? You can't see a person being discriminated against unless you are discriminated against in your head?

How do you see a thief? Because you see him stealing.

How do you see someone being discriminated against? Because a racist action is taken against that person.

Did you see those girls perform any sexual activity?

If you did, it happened in your mind.

Originally posted by Point of No Return
Why is the context different? In all cases the girls use their body for sports or dance.

Would you perceive a professional female netballer as using her body in a way that is the same as a prostitute? How do you think their daughters would view their professions? Do you think there is a difference between a daughter admiring her mother for being a skilled athlete and admiring her for being good at sleeping with men?

The only difference is the perceived sexual nature of the dance and the clothing, or lack of clothing.

You are correct. If you really want to, you can imagine every idea as subjective, relative only to the entity having the experience. But this is why we have rules and laws. This is why we have standards and boundaries.

Young ballerinas wear a smaller adult ballerina outfit.

Young soccer playing girls wear smaller adult soccer clothing.

Young pop dancing girls wear smaller adult pop singer clothing.

Does wearing a smaller sized gun make it ok for a kid to carry one? What about a smaller bag of illicit drugs?

I understand how people could have a problem with this, as the kids are kinda portrayed as adult women, and that they should stick to being kids, yet, I still don't see anything sexual about it.

For me the important thing is not the way they are portrayed to grown adults, it is the example they set for other kids. Encouraging them to dress up, wear make-up, listen to the latest pop song just doesn't seem right. Kids deserve to be kids and should be free to act like kids. They shouldn't feel pressured to act like girls in the video just to fit in and feel cool.

I'm not at all saying that people who find this sexual, are pedophiles themselves, but the sex is in their perception, I don't see it.

It is a matter of perception and I respect your views on the matter. There is a difference between recognising and condemning something, and recognising and condoning something.

Idolizing some slut on TV is never a good thing... ever.

I'm sorry, but that was wrong, just wrong.

What was there to gain by dressing these young girls up like that? They could have demonstrated their dancing brilliance wearing far more.

I find it somewhat amusing that some people are on here defending it, and don't see a problem.

I wonder if any of those people have kids, or nieces?

Anyway, no long term harm here, as long as a society we see this and agree it's really poor form. The clothing store in the UK that produced bras for 8 year olds recently came out and admitted that it was a bad error.

Next time, the parents should ask THEIR parents what they think, if they haven't got the intelligence to know better (they're probably n their early to mid twenties anyway!!).

Like I said, learn a lesson and move on.

All the best, Kiwi

Originally posted by Point of No Return
How do you see a thief? Because you see him stealing.

After having seen somebody steal, I can advise others not to take part in behaviour that is considered theft. (Theft can also be in the eye of the beholder, but it seems MOST people are aware when it occurs).

How do you see someone being discriminated against? Because a racist action is taken against that person.

Racism isn't the only form of discrimination, but still if I can advise others not to take part in behaviour that is considered racist or discriminatory then I will. (Discriminating against somebody else can also be in the eye of the beholder. Most people understand when it occurs as well).

Did you see those girls perform any sexual activity?

If you did, it happened in your mind.

I saw 8 year-old girls dressing in clothes similar to those worn by adult women who get paid to have sex with men or paid to strip for them. I did not achieve any sexual gratification from watching them, I felt pity for them. Parents too stupid to realise how silly it was to let their kids take part in such events.

It seems my mind is NOT the only one that deemed the way they were dressed and the way they danced to be inappropriate.

[edit on 17/5/2010 by Dark Ghost]

reply to post by Dark Ghost

Would you perceive a professional female netballer as using her body in a way that is the same as a prostitute? How do you think their daughters would view their professions? Do you think there is a difference between a daughter admiring her mother for being a skilled athlete and admiring her for being good at sleeping with men?

Why did you make that comparison? Why do you keep bringing sex into the equation?

What does a prostitute have to do with it? The sex is all in your head.

You are correct. If you really want to, you can imagine every idea as subjective, relative only to the entity having the experience. But this is why we have rules and laws.

And since none were broken, how bad can it be?

Does wearing a smaller sized gun make it ok for a kid to carry one? What about a smaller bag of illicit drugs?

To go from clothing to guns and drugs is a giant leap don't you think?

Drugs are illegal in any case, and carrying guns is not allowed for children either.

Bad example.

For me the important thing is not the way they are portrayed to grown adults, it is the example they set for other kids. Encouraging them to dress up, wear make-up, listen to the latest pop song just doesn't seem right. Kids deserve to be kids and should be free to act like kids. They shouldn't feel pressured to act like girls in the video just to fit in and feel cool.

I respect that and I agree with that for the most.

However, we can't know, maybe those girls had the best day of their life and were not pressured at all, the video doesn't show this.

Kids should be kids, but I object to the notion that these kids were being sexualized. At least I don't see it.

I have to admit that when I see Beyonce's original video of the song, I am thinking about having sex with her, maybe it's because she is an adult woman, and not a young girl without any sex appeal whatsoever.

reply to post by kiwifoot

What was there to gain by dressing these young girls up like that? They could have demonstrated their dancing brilliance wearing far more.

This type of dance is kindoff hard with loose clothing and layers of it. Would a bathing suit been more appropriate?

It seems the only problem was the perceived lack of clothing, wich in turn gets associated with sex by most apperently.

reply to post by Dark Ghost

After having seen somebody steal, I can advise others not to take part in behaviour that is considered theft.

Jeah but you saw them steal. Did you see those girls have sex, or perform sex related actions?

Same goes for your other example.

reply to post by kiwifoot


Hi Kiwi, you are so right!

Let us stand by our children in this country, and not do what this post is about, and let us save all children on the planet.

Let our children be innocent, cared for and loved.

reply to post by Point of No Return


Not much point turning this into a Point of No Return vs. Dark Ghost thread. I have given my reasons, you have given yours. You seem to think the problems I have with the video stem from my own misperceptions, I disagree. We have different mindsets and different POVs on how we see the world. We will have to agree to disagree on this issue.

reply to post by Dark Ghost

Not much point turning this into a Point of No Return vs. Dark Ghost thread.

Don't let that stop you from posting, we are free to have an on-topic discussion in this thread.

We will have to agree to disagree on this issue.

Well I agree, that kids should remain kids, and that kids are being manipulated in todays world, and that sex is imposed on them.

However, I disagree that they are sexualized in the video, the lack of clothes and poppy dance style, doesn't make me assosciate them with sex.

I bet there were a few freaks out there, turned on by this display of parental stupidity.

Reminds me of Little Miss Michael Jackson sings "I'm Just A Little Girl" - Ending with Judges Jerking Off

I don't see a problem. I only see a problem with people who get turned on from little kids.
I look at them and the only thing i see is a nice dance show, they really know what they're doing, looks amazing and i bet they had lots of fun doing it.
I don't even concentrate on the clothes and why should i?

People overreacting to much these days. Besides it's not really more revealing than say a normal Ballet Outfit and that seems fine with everyone

Besides: Humans are born naked, what's the problem with skin?

[edit on 17-5-2010 by ShadowAngel85]

reply to post by acrux

I bet there were a few freaks out there, turned on by this display of parental stupidity.

I order to make that statement, you must know the inner workings of a freak's mind.

It's funny to me, people that are not turned on by this, all seem to think that this turns on pedophiles, freaks and perverts.

It takes one to know one I guess.

Originally posted by tellmemoreok

I dunno...I think those girls have a lot of talent...maybe a little young for those moves though..if we protest something I think we should protest This video.

SWEET BABY JESUS! I think I saw satchel. *wretch*