Man cited during traffic stop fears his picture might end up online

Originally posted by Blaine91555

Originally posted by ..5..
If a traffif ticket is a contract to pay and yo don't want to sign can you use a fingrprint ? There is a convaluted arguement that if you sign you are signing on behalf of something called strawman.

Trying to get out of a traffic ticket is pretty low. An adult just pays it and moves on.

NOOOO!!! BECAUSE THEN BIG BROTHER WILL SPANK YOU!!!! WE LIVE IN A POLICE STATE!!! WAH!! WAH!! LOLOLO!!11!!

[/sarcasm]

Originally posted by pumpkinorange
Also, bear with me as I really tick you off when I tell you I pay your salary.

I just got that one today on a traffic stop. I pulled a guy over for running a stop sign and ALMOST hitting another car. But of course he didn't do it, I have no idea what I am talking about, and then he said it. "you know I pay your salary". When in reality I also pay part of my own salary...since I pay taxes too...lol. But yeah some cops get mad when people say it...I just smile and say thank you for the new truck...

As for the OP...Its to early to say whats what because the facial recognition gadgets are all having MANY issues and aren't very reliable yet. That and 98% of the agencies can't afford the damn things.

reply to post by pumpkinorange


Maybe you should read a little deeper into what I was saying instead of twisting what I was saying.

If you become a threat to others, or if you pull a weapon on an Officer of the Law (which is illegal... Really?? geeeeeze...) then an officer has to make a choice. If your not carrying a weapon i wont pull one either. But dont pull a gun on me and think that I will go on my merry way. If you are willing to pull a weapon on someone of authority, then you are more than likely going to pull a weapon on someone of less "importance" thus you are a threat to society. I dont get how unclear that is to you.

edit to add:

alright i see your point. I had to reread that a few times. (see how miscommunication causes problems? I think I'm 2.5/0 for that tonight)

They do not become ###holes because they know there Rights. I'm referring to a video I watched about a guy saying he knows his rights before he blows a cops head off.

and another video i watched in class today about what happened when a cop failed to take charge of a situation.
--->>> Watch this VIDEO

...cameras are everywhere, including the gazillion on the cell phones of citizens who can take your pic without your permission and without your knowledge and do pretty much whatever they wanna do with it... at least cops are held to a professional standard... the man in the article / video and his wife should never leave their home without a paper sack over their head - problem solved...

Originally posted by rjmelter
reply to post by Aziroth

 

Then maybe you should get off of ATS telling about how you would kill cops... and go file some reports to the Internal Affairs Division, if that doesnt work go to your State Investigative Service, and then next the FBI for corruption. You have more options.

And if that doesn't work try crashing a private plane into a building and see how that works out for you.

reply to post by Aziroth


Sounds like you have a local problem. You should still be sensible in what you post.

Too bad you were never here in the summer. That is why we live here. No better place on earth. Where else you going to fish for 14 hours and still have light to pack your rig?

Our local Police are well managed. I know a few and they are nice guys. The gangs makes them hard, but that is expected.

reply to post by pumpkinorange


I agree regarding the apprehension of illegals (which is a Federal responsibility, not local). But, what I meant was, if they fail to appear and are never apprehended, the local government loses revenue from fines.

reply to post by rjmelter


I am not saying your a merciless killer, I am not saying all cops have it out for people, much less for me. But cops are not above citizens, they are dully appointed officers in charge of assisting people in their safety. If a cop wants to cause me or my liberty harm, he is no longer in my opinion fit for duty and at that point in time I will defend myself. If a cop for no reason is going to violate my wishes by trying to forcibly take a picture of me ( I assume would take more than him saying "hey you stay still" for it to be considered "force") in my world that means a violation of privacy something that is constitutionally protected.

Force to me does not mean tickle my backside with a feather until I am giggled into submission, it means to do something that would cause irreparable bodily damage. And I have not been angry through all this, I am just an old intense man not trying to sound that way.

reply to post by WTFover

But, what I meant was, if they fail to appear and are never apprehended, the local government loses revenue from fines.

But I thought traffic tickets were all about safety.

Originally posted by SyphonX

Originally posted by Marked One
It's that kind of mentality that is going to lead you right into a police-sniper's cross-hairs.

And that kind of mentality is something that redneck, cowboy cops need to drop.

Ehhh...Most of the cops I know where I am from are of Hispanic descent so...I'm not too sure what you're trying to say.

Originally posted by SyphonX
You're probably not a cop.

No. Actually I'm not. But I am a security-officer working for a private security firm owned and operated by a local county Sheriff's deputy.

Bottom line here is; you don't wanna do the time? Don't commit the crime. Simple as that.

Because I seriously doubt talking tough about 'killing cops' is going to help you to outrun a police-sharpshooter's bullet.

I appologize that I took my end completely off topic.

I just found it insulting that someone would kill a cop over something stupid. It sounds like if there are dirty cops involved his anger is justified... but not the reasoning for killing.

I think the picture taking is a little awkward, but I bet it has some really good uses. I spoke to a sheriff's deputy the other day after class about how that a father and son were in jail together with the same name. THey were releasing the father that day, the son committed a murder and was being held until transferred to a prison. Someone was smart enough to look past his name and and check out the picture to make sure it was the right Mr. "John Doe". He was out of the cell, he was out of his handcuffs, he was being given his civillian clothes and 30 seconds from exiting the building and on his way to freedom (maybe to commit more murders). The use is probably very good for apprehending people more quickly, ID'ing and solving crimes as cameras are very good for use in recording encidenses(sp?) of crime etc..

So I think its a good idea... but i also feel that maybe they shouldn't use it until they have a justified reason for doing so or atleast come public with what they say they are going to use it for. Its not really a conspiracy... just new news.

reply to post by Marked One


I think the point Syphon is trying to make is it is not necessarily the police's duty to sharp shoot people who talk about protecting themselves. Were not talking about murder, just defense.

Originally posted by Aziroth
reply to post by Marked One

 

I think the point Syphon is trying to make is it is not necessarily the police's duty to sharp shoot people who talk about protecting themselves. Were not talking about murder, just defense.

It's 'whatever'...

Originally posted by jam321
reply to post by WTFover

 

But I thought traffic tickets were all about safety.

Sure you did! I was, constantly, in trouble for not writing enough tickets. Once, I didn't receive my annual "merit" raise because of it. I always figured that, while others were racking up the citation numbers and getting the "attaboys", my time was better spent in the neighborhoods and around the businesses, trying to protect people's property. Unfortunately, the City Managers didn't see it that way, and the stuff rolls down hill, you know?

I have mixed feelings about this, but one thing that has to be clear is how that data (pictures) can be used as well as where and how long it will be stored. AT least the TSA makes the claim (unlikely) that they will delete our scanned images soon after they have been taken, to sell us the idea that they won't be using them for purposes that go beyond the scope of their security check.

How many people are really scamming police out of ticket revenue by masquerading as somebody else? The idea that there is enough warrant or revenue absconders to justify such an expense is BS. Let's not forget the expense of the management and storage of this data.

Allowing police agencies to build a potential database of photos or videos of us for simple traffic stops or infractions certainly seems beyond the scope of identification for the intent of public safety or simple revenue from fines. Perhaps a megalomaniacs wet dream to have and control the images of his little world. Yes, multiple images and movies of everyone living in his district just in case he needs to target them for not paying their tickets or he can sell their movies in the next reality TV America's most Wanted equivalent.

Last time I checked, most police agencies in my state can pull up my photo on their laptop computers before even pulling me over - unless I'm driving a vehicle not registered to me, but once I give them my name or license they can pull my picture up. The idea that they need more photos is nonsense and a waste of money & resources.

The only valid use I can see is taking a shot of someone with no physical ID & no ID available after searching the DMV other available databases. Then a photo could be taken for the purposes of follow up if the decision is made not to arrest or if they had a facial recognition database they could put it through that, otherwise it's off to the pokey to let the system ID em.

We allow a photo to be taken while applying for an Drivers License, passport or ID for the purposes of proof of who we are. The idea that a LEO is going to improve that photo on the side of the highway as claimed in the video, is utter nonsense. Either he can identify you from the photo or not. If the photo is that bad they can make you return to the DMV for a new one or they can shorten the time between renewals if it's that much of a problem.

I suggest the best we can do until this is worked out, is actively take pictures & videos of any law enforcement officer you come in contact with. A recording of the contact from both perspectives. I imagine that some agencies will make up new laws making it illegal to video police.

[edit on 24-2-2010 by verylowfrequency]

Originally posted by Marked One
Bottom line here is; you don't wanna do the time? Don't commit the crime. Simple as that.

Because I seriously doubt talking tough about 'killing cops' is going to help you to outrun a police-sharpshooter's bullet.

Here's a little advice.

Maybe you ought to be careful with your words, and your actions. You're not above the law, and frankly, you're only a "security officer". Going around and trying to 'rabble-rouse' the wannabe "cop-killers", isn't going to do you any personal favors.

This is why most people have a problem with police, because too many cops or "security officers" seem to think they are the law themselves, and that it is their priority in life to either act tough, harass or openly threaten people, as in your case, with some idea that a police sharpshooter is out there ready to get me.

Let me tell you something, and I'm serious, heart-to-heart here. Everyone all super "pro-cop" in this thread keeps bringing up this Joe Stack crap as if it's some funny joke, some crazy guy that you can now use for your amusement against others. Not funny. I don't think you people realize where this country is right now, and how desperate people are. Take a good hard look at the people you serve with, because no one is immune to losing it right now. People are being pushed to the brink, and all the "online cops" on this site have made a mockery of it all, and like to 'humorously' imply that anyone upset with cops on this site is "a Joseph Stack".

Keep it up. No, really.. See what comes of it when you keep hiding behind your badge and laughing at this country you live in. Because if it gets worse, and I feel it will, those people who you serve with.. they're going to be gone, they won't want any part of it. A police sharpshooter isn't going to do squat against an angry mob, and neither is a crowd dispersal unit.

We're not done with the Joseph Stack's, or the murder-suicides. There is a lot more coming this way, without a doubt. And it only gets worse because people in authority abuse their privilege as 'overseers', and use their positions to mock and harass. Being a cop isn't just a job, it's a life. You don't just punch in and punch out. You act on a much higher standard than the average citizen, at all times, because you are supposed to set an example and institute a zone of respect where ever you go. A soldier is always a soldier, doesn't matter if he hasn't picked up a rifle in 30 years, it's just the way it is. Unpinning a badge doesn't remove what's expected of you, either.

[edit on 24-2-2010 by SyphonX]

Originally posted by SyphonX

Originally posted by Marked One
Bottom line here is; you don't wanna do the time? Don't commit the crime. Simple as that.

Because I seriously doubt talking tough about 'killing cops' is going to help you to outrun a police-sharpshooter's bullet.

Here's a little advice.

Maybe you ought to be careful with your words, and your actions. You're not above the law, and frankly, you're only a "security officer". Going around and trying to 'rabble-rouse' the wannabe "cop-killers", isn't going to do you any personal favors.

This is why most people have a problem with police, because too many cops or "security officers" seem to think they are the law themselves, and that it is their priority in life to either act tough, harass or openly threaten people, as in your case, with some idea that a police sharpshooter is out there ready to get me.

Let me tell you something, and I'm serious, heart-to-heart here. Everyone all super "pro-cop" in this thread keeps bringing up this Joe Stack crap as if it's some funny joke, some crazy guy that you can now use for your amusement against others. Not funny. I don't think you people realize where this country is right now, and how desperate people are. Take a good hard look at the people you serve with, because no one is immune to losing it right now. People are being pushed to the brink, and all the "online cops" on this site have made a mockery of it all, and like to 'humorously' imply that anyone upset with cops on this site is "a Joseph Stack".

Keep it up. No, really.. See what comes of it when you keep hiding behind your badge and laughing at this country you live in. Because if it gets worse, and I feel it will, those people who you serve with.. they're going to be gone, they won't want any part of it. A police sharpshooter isn't going to do squat against an angry mob, and neither is a crowd dispersal unit.

We're not done with the Joseph Stack's, or the murder-suicides. There is a lot more coming this way, without a doubt. And it only gets worse because people in authority abuse their privilege as 'overseers', and use their positions to mock and harass. Being a cop isn't just a job, it's a life. You don't just punch in and punch out. You act on a much higher standard than the average citizen, at all times, because you are supposed to set an example and institute a zone of respect where ever you go. A soldier is always a soldier, doesn't matter if he hasn't picked up a rifle in 30 years, it's just the way it is. Unpinning a badge doesn't remove what's expected of you, either.

[edit on 24-2-2010 by SyphonX]

Dont advise what you dont understand, and get back on topic...

The world is in a chaotic situation due to the financial issues in the country. That does not give anyone the right however to run a muck. When the economy goes down... Police Employment goes up, for the reason of domestic disputes, rise in violence etc. There are good cops and there are bad cops.

Police works typically attracts Authoritarian minded folks, and yes they do power trip. BUT GUESS WHAT... the majority of those in jail think authoritarian(ly) also.

IF YOU can find someone who isnt Authoritarian (do not mistake for authoritative which makes for the perfect cop) then I suggest you ask them to be a cop and risk their lives for a rediculously small pay. You wonder why there are fat cops (The stress is high, the pay is too low, cops try to avoid hazardous duties because they know they arent protected well enough, the hours suck, more than likely they have marital issues because of law enforcement schedules). AND Because people such as yourself ASK TOO MUCH from an officer, PAY TO LITTLE, Underman, Underpower (lack of protective gear), and when they do one thing wrong... its EVERY SINGLE COPS FAULT.

No sir, its a job. The uniform is what YOU are condemning. Just because your city is corrupt is your own issue, file complaints follow the procedures and get out. but dont ****** and complain because it isnt done your way. You wouldnt last long in charge of a Police Task Force either.

I'm tired of people that think cops should grovel b4 them because another dirty cop messed up. Thats their problem... not mine, show a little respect and youll get a whole lot back. Dont spit on my uniform saying you hate cops, regardless of it the spit hit my uniform or not your disrespecting me, and what I stand for. Learn not to OVER ASSOCIATE.

The Police are looking for better ways to make their job more worth it and more secure such as this picture thing. If your not gonna pay to protect me so that I can protect thousands more.... I mean hell, when I walk around places I get more pictures taken just because im in the background of someone elses picture. Does that bother me? No. Why should it? Why should it bother you when a cop takes a picture and puts it on file. Id be happy to take a few pictures. Id take some funny ones and some serious ones. Whats going through some of yall's minds is parnoia about what technology can do with those pictures. Rightfully so, but until it is actually used (and I know plently of cops that dont know how to pull up a picture on a PC let alone modify it and edit it to incriminate you).

Look up... not down. Youll walk a better path thatway.

[edit on 24-2-2010 by rjmelter]

I read time and time again that some feel this technology can be used to prove your innocence...PEOPLE, WAKE UP!!!!! It's not our responsibility to prove our innocence, it's the ACCUSER'S RESPONSIBILITY TO PROVE GUILT, beyond a reasonable doubt...

I believe the invasive presence of cameras has gone too far. Privacy is a Constitutionally guaranteed right, not something the police or government grants you when it suits them. I agree with the many posters who state that there will be hell to pay when finally fed up with the government's "rationing" of rights. Rights are not to be used as bargaining chips or rewards for politically correct thought or behavior, or blind obedience to idiotic laws. And when (has hell frozenj over yet?) would this camera/recognition technology EVER be applied to CRIMMIGRANTS??? We can barely even patrol our borders, let alone make a pinhead sized dent in the flood of illegal entries (over 5,000 per DAY!!!) And if it is applied, anyone care to venture on the outcome???
It'll probably be the picture on a green card, MASSHEALTH card or some other privelege card we Americans don't qulaify for.

I wish inventors would think of the missuse of stuff before submittin patents
s+f

[edit on 2/24/2010 by dashar]

To me the bottom line is that we are in the information age which mutes both of the grievances. Yet I understand both sides. So far as the cop is concerned is he now has a new highway to monitor...the internet highway and pictures help him.

Yet the same is escalated on those who feel that government knows too much and that government has too much power as the information age allows both crooks and government to get at once very private information.

The truth is the internet has caused us all too be able to get to know each other a little better and that is very uncomfortable to some.