Remains of more than 500 animals found at Philadelphia home

Originally posted by nixie_nox
reply to post by stanlee

 

Once again your attaching to another religion what you are trying to dispell about your own.

um no... thats just a fact

Each religion has its nutty followers. Wicca is no exception. In fact, Wicca is particularly vulnerable because it does not follow evil, is not christianity, and it can feel secular. Wa la. It offers the perfect sanctity.Nto to mention, since it is not an organized religion, you can make up the rules as you go along.

riiiight is that why the un organised religios followers of wicca all say god is a woman? whats the difference between christianity and wicca? feminism. The three phases of the moon etc, their trinity if you will, not secular, just a moronic way of saying "screw you pope... we believe this instead"

Just because you meet someone is obviously picked up a silver ravenwolf book at barnes and nobles and claims to be a high priestess isn't as wiccan or druidic as the satanist killing chickens.

not remotely seeing what that was supposed to mean

And these authors you mentioned are just as much of a joke in the wiccan community.

yet their sales are highest among all wiccan authors and look at that.... bought by wiccans too.. hmmmm thats odd

You claim to be open minded and intellectual. But an open minded person understand that it doesn't matter when a religion is created, as long as it is valid to the person.
That all religions have their pros and cons.

Who are you to judge?

yes yes and able.
yes, I am both open minded and intellectual. Religion is a menace no matter what you call it. it spawns beliefs. people die and kill over beliefs. THAT is the intellectual way of looking at it. As long as its valid to the person.... I wonder how the victims of charles manson's group feel about the validity of the mindless ranting of a spiritualist mad man that didnt believe in time.
WHo am I to judge? well as I said before, I am a satanist. I dont prance around this phoney holier than thou facade screaming peace to all. Frankly I could care less but when I am asked questions like how does it effect my life when entire economies fail because of a new religion called capitalism, and a few elitist right wing protestants screwing everything up because they want nothing but money, it effects us all. THese are the same people that fetter medical advances in science by barring federal funding to stem cell research, and they throw it all to big business which has failed. I dont claim to be peaceful. Hit me and I will hit you twice as hard. Screw turning the other cheek.

As for the druids, most of the druids I know perfectly understand the ups and downs of druidism.
I have heard heated debates about whether druidic sacrifices should still be performed. Keep the religious belief or comply with modern standards.

your point? this doesnt alter the fact that most of the modern druids have no idea how not peaceful they were. Sure they oversaw festivities and religious rites and things but when the time came for war, they were not all about peace and love and all that crap. they were the first in and the last out. they lead their followers to battle honourably. Would the 'druids' today do this? hell no. they would claim themselves conscientious objectors and say the earth is upset about this war... well there are probably 2 out of 1000 modern 'druids' that will fight as they used to

Wiccans do tend to have the repuation of being fairies and rainbows and are basically retro hippies.
But many do understand that there is good and bad energy, and people do good and bad things. And stuff just happens, and it all happens for a reason. Not all believe it is just because.

no.. mmany do NOT understand there are different energies they read this in books by the authors you scoffed along side me. The problem, had you looked again is just as I said.. THEY DO NOT BELIEVE ANYTHING IS JUST BECAUSE

But so what? How does this affect you? What does this matter to you so much that is unleashes all this spitefulness and hatred? It seems like you are doing to others what society has done to you for centuries or a millenia.

I didnt say I was spiteful or angry at all. I said I hate them. they are annoying and there hasnt been one to my knowledge that has shown me otherwise. I hate them because they are no different from other mainstream religions in that they try to force their ideology down the throats of those that disagree. they affect my life by trying to preach to me the ways, or word of the goddess.. and though these so called un organised religions are allegedly free.. they all say the same things but hold different names of this 'goddess'. next?
by the by, Im only 34.... I havent been persecuted for millenia... nor has satanism if thats what you are referring to. the belief itself is still relatively new. started originally with the proclamation of Oliver Cromwell becoming lord protector of england. The original satanist was a rebellion against cromwell saying that singing and dancing was satanic and barred from society.

If you are meeting anyone calling themselves a white witch. Most likely you are meeting a dungeons and dragons player who saw the movie The Craft and ran to the store to buy a book, and now calls themselves a high priest.
And they do do it for shock value. But many are just looking to belong somewhere. Many are looking to rebel against Christianity.

strange.. I said that same thing.... and you started this wonderful argument... once again proving my statement wiccans are hypocrites

But you also can't blame a group for being angry since there is still rampant persecution going on. And you are reminded multiple times a day that you will never be able to practise openly without repercussions.

what are you going on about here? I can and do.

Instead of standing in a corner scoffing and pointing fingers. You would know that true pagans(broad umbrella term) are a reclusive people, who often don't inform others who they are readily, follow the religions as they should be, and know the ups and downs. I have met people who followed Hellinisitic, Greek, Roman, Egyptian religions.

And those who truely understand these religions, know that being a "witch" isn't a title. It is a work of art. That is to be taken very seriously. IN fact, many, don't practise witchcraft, because of the ramifications. They leave it up to the experienced people. A good coven makes you train for years. Witchcraft is the art of manipulating energy with magic. Your a witch only during that time. It would be like telling everyone you meet your a knitter. You are a knitter when you make a sweater, but that isn't the whole of your religious identity.

but I thought witches were.. dungeons and dragons playing hippies or whatever.... hold on..
"If you are meeting anyone calling themselves a white witch. Most likely you are meeting a dungeons and dragons player who saw the movie The Craft and ran to the store to buy a book" (you said that)

and again... wiccans are hypocrites

Originally posted by SIEGE
reply to post by stanlee

 

So, . .you're in the bathroom . . with pics, . . . and ?

reading ...........through the looking glass... lol

Originally posted by mamabeth

Originally posted by Donny 4 million
reply to post by stanlee

 

I just have to respond to this post...
Since, satin is material used for making wedding and formal attire,what is
satinism?

I'm a floral designer and wedding planner and this sounds important

well thats easy. its the religion that states Satin is better than silk. THey didnt get the memo that silk is used to make carbon fibre.

reply to post by Moonsouljah


I suppose you'd rather they go to whole foods and stock up on organic farm-raised beef and fair trade arugula?

Ramen is cheap. Ramen is filling. And truthfully it's a lot healthier than other foods at similar prices. About the only thing better they could be buying are sacks of rice and lentils (A billion Indians can't be wrong) but those take more time to cook than ramen.

Focus on your own kids and all the High-fructose corn syrup and plastic-tainted meat you're packing into their gullets

Originally posted by fmcanarney
I run over a possum, coon or civet cat, on the road.
Squirrels, birds get hit by autos.
I shoot prarie dogs for target practice.
I hit a vulture the other day, killed him, dented my hood a little, and gives my car character.
I shoot crows for target practice.

so you are a poacher. and you support anti abortion movements.. sounds pretty right wing to me. Tell me. do you have a velvet painting of elvis in your living room?

Originally posted by Stormdancer777
well Nixie, and stanlee, your conversation is truly amazing,

I don't think we have an true knowledge of what pagans really practiced, it has been lost, I always thought of them as similar to shamans or wise women and midwives, who had knowledge of herbal remedies, and healing.

And as for persecution by the church, mostly it was persecuting its own people, the Christians, who they accused of witchcraft, weird.

as for modern satanism it is based on what?

I should have my son come and express how he feels, but he wont.



[edit on 033131p://bThursday2009 by Stormdancer777]

well , I didnt say anything about paganism..all these isms. blah. anyway, isnt a pagan just something that isnt christian? Its always been my understanding that satanism is... well honestly? enjoying yourself. endulging, and living. Sin is pretty much an obsolete factor.. always has been (in my eyes) Do unto others what they have done to you. that sort of thing. You want to hang out? cool thats fine. but you attack me, I will defend myself and attack you back. not turn the other cheek.

you want good herbal remedies? go to asia, or africa. those ancient practices are still going on there.

Originally posted by GovtFlu
Why are SPCA "enforcement officers" allowed to serve search warrants? they are employed by a private corporation and are not "sworn" peace officers... although while on duty probably enjoy some additional arrest powers since the City of Philadelphia contracted their animal control services to the PSPCA.

I find it odd a city can contract out law enforcement duties to a private organization that can serve warrants..

"Philadelphia SPCA enforcement officers were first called to the home over the weekend to tend to two emaciated dogs. The organization said that after obtaining a search warrant"

an "organization" obtaining a warrant? just like that? ..so, all this organization needed to obtain a search warrant was a report of "two emaciated dogs"?? that is enough probable cause to pierce someones 4th amendment rights these days?.. I'd like to read the warrant they wrote up.

you can thank the patriot act for that

Originally posted by TheWalkingFox
reply to post by Moonsouljah

 

Focus on your own kids and all the High-fructose corn syrup and plastic-tainted meat you're packing into their gullets

...I... I love you man

Originally posted by RedGolem
Thanks to everyone who is posting

The common theam seemed to be why not get worked up over child abuse. The answer they way I might see it is, this is about brutal killing, ripping apart and placing on display an animal for no other purpose then what is being called a spiritual act. Which is legal if done humanely

The mad emcon is to illustrate I still don't like it.
If any thing like that were to happen to a human the arrest would be swift, and likely capital punishment, laws are not the same for the animals.
That can be weighed against charges of child abuse being filed against some one for spanking the kid on the butt.

I think it makes a difference when it is 1 child or 500 Animals.

I think there are two separate and distinct issues at play there that are being confused because of tossing them together in the same pot.

1.) 1st Amendment Right to practice Ritual Animal Sacrifice. Whether you acknowledge Santeria as a legitimate religion or as a form of Satanism is irrelevant. They are protected under the same rights that protect Christians, Atheists, or any other religion. Although the majority of people in the United States may find Ritual Animal Sacrifice to be distasteful and repugnant, it is currently (and should remain to be) a protected Constitutional Right. The moment we start dictating laws and making exceptions to the Separation of Church and State is the moment we fall down that slippery slope where that Wall of Separation which has been maintained these past couple hundred years falls down with us.

2.) Animal Cruelty and Abuse is morally and legally wrong no matter whether you are a card-carrying member of PETA or a card-carrying member of National Hunters Association. It might be a Constitutional Right to practice Ritual Animal Sacrifice in the United States, but that doesn't give you a right to mistreat, neglect, or abuse an animal prior to it's Religious Sacrifice (just as it isn't wrong to hunt and kill for sport...assuming you have a license...so long as you do not mistreat, neglect, or abuse the animal in the process). Although it may seem odd, considering the manner in which our Mass Food Production raises our Cattle, Poultry, Fish, and Pork in the United States (which certainly could be considered mistreatment and abusive), in most Municipalities and States, any other mistreatment or abuse of an animal is a criminal offense.

So, as far as I'm concerned, the Religious choice of those arrested is not an issue and shouldn't have even come up in the news. The penultimate reason they were raising the majority of those animals should not even have come up, being that it had to do with their Constitutionally protected Freedom of Religion. HOWEVER, they are guilty as sin for the manner in which they were keeping and raising those animals, which is something they are legally accountable for.

reply to post by SIEGE



phoney crocodile tears for animals and not a tear for humans.


So boo hoo for animals.

If you eat fish, foul or ham, beef, mutton you are just paying for someone else to kill your animals for you so you can eat them.

leather purse, belt, shoes? same thing.
eat eggs, killing a poor little chicken every time. lol
cake for desert, dead chicken in the form of an egg in there.
drink eggnog? same thing.

So to inject the womb with salt water which burns the skin off of the baby is cruel.
You have put salt on a cut you have on your body and knows how it feels.

Or how about dismemberment with forcepts, skull crushing, is cruel.

Yes crocidile tears for the animals.

reply to post by stanlee



Where I come from shooting crows and prarie dogs is legal.
Running over animals on road is sportingly unavoidable.
I try not to swerve into the ditch and follow them if they are smart enough to get off the road, then I really try to leave them for another day.

Animal sacrifice is legal, but cruelty to animals is not. I know prosecutors who have been able to prosecute animal sacrifice b/c the animals were treated cruelly. Animal cruelty laws vary, so it depends on how the statute reads.

There is a well-established link between cruelty to animals & violence towards people. Many serial killers get there start "practicing" on animals. Luckily, the judicial system is taking cruelty to animals more seriously than it once did.

I have been working with animals for as long as I have been old enough to work.This is my "calling" in life.I am appalled almost every day at the poor treatment of all of Gods creatures.I could write a book of what I have witnessed through the years! I see abuse of animals the same as child abuse in manny ways because animals and young children have no voice in the world.Alot of people do not know that a veternarian goes to school longer than an MD.,it is because the vet.has to rely on the symptoms the animal presents,but also the external obsevations people around the animal can relate.I see laws being passed every day that that are putting us as just chattel.We don't treat each other any better than the unsung creatures that share this planet with us.I respect all living things and I feel it is about time humanity "wakes-up" and use the brain we have!

I am a reader,advid info. sponge to say the least.I do not post much,don't care about fags and stars,but I had to respond to this.So I guess this is my "Hello",to my fellow ATS'ERS;best to all this new year ahead,think were gonna need it!

reply to post by andy1033


Remember the World Elites Themselves are Satanists so they of course allow this to happen

Bengal said that the U.S. Supreme Court has ruled that rituals of Santeria -- a religion similar to voodoo and originated in Cuba and Brazil -- are permitted under the Constitution. But he believes these animals may not have been sacrificed humanely.

SOURCE

Is there really a method of sacrafice that would be deemed .. humane? I like to hunt, but the meat fills my freezer and is eaten. Maybe some people do not view this as humane either.

The way I understood Church of the Lukumi Babalu Aye, Inc. v. City of Hialeah, 508 U.S. 520 (1993) was that the city couldn't outlaw animal sacrifice while allowing animal slaughter b/c it was targeted at a religion, which violates the First Amendment to the US Constitution. However, the city could outlaw animal slaughter/sacrifice in a religiously neutral way. The govt can regulate religious conduct, but not beliefs.

I actually think animals in factory farms suffer a lot more than animals who are sacrificed. In some religions, the animals are killed quickly & then eaten. Unfortunately, Satanists like to torture the animal first to release the hormones those sick f***s like. Anyway, animals in factory farms suffer their whole lives in terrible conditions, & then are killed pretty brutally (The Humane Slaughter Act is a joke, & doesn't apply to poultry animals, anyway).

[edit on 31-12-2009 by someotherguy]

Originally posted by smyleegrl
I've always wondered why people get more 'worked up' over animal abuse than child abuse. Not that we aren't outraged when child abuse happens, please understand. But we seem to react differently when the victims are animals.

I've thought about this, and come to the conclusion its because animals are innocent. In my experience, the animals I've had in my life have all been forgiving of my foilibles, loving, and just.....well...good. Which makes abuse of animals heinous in the extreme.

I agree with you, OP. Stuff like this really disturbs me. Thanks for bringing it to our attention.

S&F

Im pretty sure if it was 500 children, we hear a lot more rage...

Ok if sacrificing animals for religion is a first amendment right, I think I'm going to go and exercise my first amendment rights and kill a kindergarten full of children to appease the gods. First amendment rights, right???!!!

Seriously, if I can go and kill a bunch of helpless animals for religion why is it any different for children? They're both innocent and helpless.

[edit on 1-1-2010 by yayap3]

Originally posted by yayap3
Ok if sacrificing animals for religion is a first amendment right, I think I'm going to go and exercise my first amendment rights and kill a kindergarten full of children to appease the gods. First amendment rights, right???!!!

I don't think SCOTUS said people have a First Amendment right to sacrifice animals. I think it was more that the ordinance in the Santeria case failed the Lemon Test.

Under the Lemon Test, for a statute not to be a violation of the Establishment Clause, it must meet the following conditions: (1) it must have a secular legislative purpose, (2) its principle or primary effect must be one that neither advances nor inhibits religion, and (3) it must not foster an excessive entanglement with religion.

www.answers.com...