The majority of Americans came to America in the last century and didn't kill Indians or enslave bl

reply to post by blueorder


I'm not seeking "victimhood." I do however expect accurate historical representation. I understand that you're quite happy with the history you were taught, and why not, it's like a white pride handjob between two covers. Me telling you that it isn't accurate isn't me claiming to be a victim. if anything, it's me telling you that you are.

reply to post by gdeed



Man, while I don't disagree that what you learn in grade school is rubbish, you're idea that the settlers, which by the way are what wound up being "Americans," didn't have anything to do with the deaths of Native Americans is ignorant at best. At least have something in your original post to back up your claim. You don't. Why? Support for your claim DOESN'T exist!!!
:shk:

[edit on 23-12-2009 by SpeakerofTruth]

Originally posted by Isanti_dacotah
Keep in mind being a "real" indian is different then being of indian decent. If you were a true indian you would know that you claim your father's lineage and you would know what to call yourself.

Im from the great Isanti Dacotah Oyate, you are but a mere Pretendian.

Oh, that hurt, Chief Wampum, that really hurt me...

Don't give me that real indian versus pretendian bullcrap... If you saw photos of my grandfather and father, you'd think they came right off the goddamned reservation. Put a war bonnet on my grandfather and he'd make Chief Dan George look like Molly McButter. That's how much Indian blood is in my family.

Originally posted by Isanti_dacotah
Keep in mind that you must add "Mexican" to the list of all the tribe's your claiming to be since the term is actually Spanish slang for the Mexica tribe which all of the country of Mexico was named after. Another slang term for this particular tribe is "Aztec".

If you read my post more closely, you'd see that I did list Mexican. Of course, when you talk about Mexican as in the fight for Texas Independence, you're not talking about a pure Indian tribe; rather, you're talking about several-generations-deep interbreeding between Central American Indians (Yaqui, Oaxaca Chontal, Toltec, Ixcateco, etc, etc, there are dozens) and the Caucasian Spanish. Mexico had centuries to develop a distinct culture, a blend of Indian and Spanish, with advanced military structure, government and even an aristocracy. The Mexicans were well able to fend for themselves and fight off the French and practically anyone else who crossed them.

Their mistake was inviting American settlers (The Old 300) to come on in and help settle the vast territory of Tejas. What Mexico got was a bunch of my people, who were just mean enough and tough enough to kick Mexico out of Texas. The territory was simply too vast for Mexico to govern and defend, and the Texan settlers were just too well-adapted to the rugged environment. The Mexicans took their silk underwear and vacated the premises.

Point is, the Mexicans were driven out of Texas NOT by the White Devil, but by settlers such as my people, who were full of Indian and Mexican and German and French and Scottish blood. These were the people who were born of the land and who rose up out of the land and stomped Santa Anna's ass and sent him packing.

I don't believe the White Devil alone could have done that. In fact, I think only a multi-cultural mix of Indian and White Devil and Mexican could have defeated the Mexicans of the early 19th Century. They were some bad boys.

— Doc Velocity







[edit on 12/23/2009 by Doc Velocity]

reply to post by TheWalkingFox

o.k. I'll type slow so you can understand what I'm saying.

what you are saying is that the books you have read are better than the books he or I have read.That your teachers were better.

I wasn't there
YOU weren't there
HE wasn't there

we all know what we were taught.
we all benefit from the suffering of our ancestors,regardless of color.
we all apparently evolved from that lucy chick in africa 12,000 yrs ago.

I don't know you but i'll bet you aren't living in the congo on a plantation,you are in a nice house crying on your computer because you don't have more stuff like the people you see on tv.

Well I'm white and I can carry everything I own at the SAME TIME except my sea kayak.
How is it I owe you a thing?

If these wise native americans were so in touch with nature why didn't they know it's first LAW.
ADAPT OR DIE!

Originally posted by Isanti_dacotah

European's and decendent's of European's (American's) DID kill indian's and bring black slave's as well as enslave native population's in all of the America's.

They did not!!! That's bull__t and is only meant to get into the pockets of Americans, who as a whole remain unaware of what the lawyers and politicians have up their sleaves.

Everyone born in America is in fact a "native American"are they not? And most of these native Americans had nothing to do with slavery or killing of other native Americans. MOST Americans are not related to ANY of the people that owned slaves or fought Indians hundreds of years ago. They came here eons after those things took place. So stop with the panhandling tactics.
Why is it that so many people of every race and creed regardless of adversity and prejudice have made good lives for themselves in America? Because they didn’t sit back crying in their beer and blaiming everyone for their woes, that’s why.

Originally posted by gdeed
They did not!!! That's bull__t and is only meant to get into the pockets of Americans, who as a whole remain unaware of what the lawyers and politicians have up their sleaves.

Then YOU have nobody to blame but yourself for those societal problem you are whining about on-line. What are YOU, personally, doing about it?

Is this it?

Originally posted by SpeakerofTruth
reply to post by gdeed

 

Man, while I don't disagree that what you learn in grade school is rubbish, you're idea that the settlers, which by the way are what wound up being "Americans," didn't have anything to do with the deaths of Native Americans is ignorant at best. At least have something in your original post to back up your claim. You don't. Why? Support for your claim DOESN'T exist!!!

:shk:

[edit on 23-12-2009 by SpeakerofTruth]

Very well said! I can leave this at that! Thank You! (starred you so good lol)

Never argue with an idiot, as others will not be able to tell the two of you apart! However, in this case, I think people may already know who the idiot in all of this is. The more the idiot speaks - the more apparent it becomes.

Originally posted by JohnnyCanuck

Originally posted by gdeed
They did not!!! That's bull__t and is only meant to get into the pockets of Americans, who as a whole remain unaware of what the lawyers and politicians have up their sleaves.

Then YOU have nobody to blame but yourself for those societal problem you are whining about on-line. What are YOU, personally, doing about it?

Is this it?

I'm going to do my best to not be a burden on society, another panhandler in the long line of people looking for handouts when they are perfectly able to take care of themselves. I have been wronged by many people throughout my life but I don't let that keep me down. That's my contribution. And btw, who appointed you overlord of guilt creation? Just curious.

[edit on 23-12-2009 by gdeed]

reply to post by JohnnyCanuck

Aside from the American History I took in university...(did you know that during the great emancipation, Lincoln only freed the slaves that were not under his control) we had slavery here too (banned in 1833), and we have a dismal history of dealing with the First Nations as well. We are close enough kin to the US that we understand the issues if we choose to, and far enough removed that some of them are revealed in that context.

Oh yea i know. I had to learn all of this when i took an AA history class for two semesters. I also know that Ab didn't think too fondly of those black slaves and he never "freed" them at all. Freedom only came to those states bordering southern states. Oh yea i've read enough quotes about what Ab thought of black slaves.

I think it pathetic that this country toots him around as some great emancipator when he wasn't. Every damn president before you danced around the issue, he just got stuck with it If the southern states didn't secede from the union i'm positive they wouldn't have been freed by him.

reply to post by Doc Velocity

Don't give me that real indian versus pretendian bullcrap... If you saw photos of my grandfather and father, you'd think they came right off the goddamned reservation. Put a war bonnet on my grandfather and he'd make Chief Dan George look like Molly McButter. That's how much Indian blood is in my family.

Well it just goes to show what matters. To the natives, bloodlines IS EVERYTHING. Even if your mixed, the natives might not even recognize you as native american, it don't matter who or what your grandparents are but your parents. If both are native american, then you are.

How do i know? I've had the advantage of talking with a Lumbee Native here in north carolina and they are a mixture of lumbee, european and african. They don't marry outside the tribe (trying to conserve bloodlines) and they take their heritage seriously.

And he broke it down. It's about bloodlines. Unless your a pureblood, don't put to much stock into "oh my so and so is native american".

quote]
Oh, that hurt, Chief Wampum, that really hurt me...

Don't give me that real indian versus pretendian bullcrap... If you saw photos of my grandfather and father, you'd think they came right off the goddamned reservation. Put a war bonnet on my grandfather and he'd make Chief Dan George look like Molly McButter. That's how much Indian blood is in my family.
Nothing personal Doc! I wasnt trying to insult you as you have to be proud of something like being indian to get offended. It's as plain as day you take yourself and your ancestor's (You know the one's who looked like indian's) as a joke but that's fine. Once again you are truly an American and can claim to be so, but your just another brown person in America as being a real indian is living a spiritual life and striving to keep your future 7 generation's alive and kicking. Looking indian and being indian are 2 completely different thing's.


If you read my post more closely, you'd see that I did list Mexican. Of course, when you talk about Mexican as in the fight for Texas Independence, you're not talking about a pure Indian tribe; rather, you're talking about several-generations-deep interbreeding between Central American Indians (Yaqui, Oaxaca Chontal, Toltec, Ixcateco, etc, etc, there are dozens) and the Caucasian Spanish. Mexico had centuries to develop a distinct culture, a blend of Indian and Spanish, with advanced military structure, government and even an aristocracy. The Mexicans were well able to fend for themselves and fight off the French and practically anyone else who crossed them.

Their mistake was inviting American settlers (The Old 300) to come on in and help settle the vast territory of Tejas. What Mexico got was a bunch of my people, who were just mean enough and tough enough to kick Mexico out of Texas. The territory was simply too vast for Mexico to govern and defend, and the Texan settlers were just too well-adapted to the rugged environment. The Mexicans took their silk underwear and vacated the premises.

Point is, the Mexicans were driven out of Texas NOT by the White Devil, but by settlers such as my people, who were full of Indian and Mexican and German and French and Scottish blood. These were the people who were born of the land and who rose up out of the land and stomped Santa Anna's ass and sent him packing.

I don't believe the White Devil alone could have done that. In fact, I think only a multi-cultural mix of Indian and White Devil and Mexican could have defeated the Mexicans of the early 19th Century. They were some bad boys.

— Doc Velocity
I did read your post correctly, you put Mexican in with the European bloodline's that you claim and NOT bunched with all the tribe's you claim. I didnt expect a rant on Texas history though.

Blood quantum was invented by the European's to cause clashes and disunity between indian's (both with other tribe's and within tribe's)

Mexican's are just that Mexica's (Aztec) and it doesnt matter if your big toe is indian or your "full blood" as most Mexican's have more indian blood in them then most N.American tribal member's (who are also had many generation's of European influence but are still able to claim there indian culture and ancestory).

Being indian (which anyone can claim to be as everyone has a great great cherokee princess for a grandma) and living the indian way are completely different once again.

Im Dacotah and we never used Wampum for trading but thank's again for making a laughing stock of the culture you claim to be and take so lightly.

Also the OP is living in denile for some odd reason.


[edit on 12/23/2009 by Doc Velocity] [/quot

Originally posted by gdeed

Originally posted by Isanti_dacotah

European's and decendent's of European's (American's) DID kill indian's and bring black slave's as well as enslave native population's in all of the America's.

They did not!!! That's bull__t and is only meant to get into the pockets of Americans, who as a whole remain unaware of what the lawyers and politicians have up their sleaves.

Everyone born in America is in fact a "native American"are they not? And most of these native Americans had nothing to do with slavery or killing of other native Americans. MOST Americans are not related to ANY of the people that owned slaves or fought Indians hundreds of years ago. They came here eons after those things took place. So stop with the panhandling tactics.
Why is it that so many people of every race and creed regardless of adversity and prejudice have made good lives for themselves in America? Because they didn’t sit back crying in their beer and blaiming everyone for their woes, that’s why.

Seriously, your just a racist ranting about how you don't want to pay anything for the stolen land you live on and made your living on.

All indian's I known have never cried while drinking beer/being sober about how our land was stolen ETC The only indian's crying and wanting a check are Pretendian's living in the western world and way of life. Get your fact's straight and stop calling people BS'ers

Eon's must mean centurie's and decades in your deluded eye's and no one wants your pityfull possesion's or worthless paper money so stop trying to claim every indian want's a check or can't take care of themselves .

Black's however DO want a check and DO want some livestock so cry to them about how your innocent and don't want to pay them for the stolen land they slaved on to create your fruit of the loom's.

reply to post by Isanti_dacotah


funny to read such a racist rant

yes,the people that killed indians were probably white.
white farmers and ranchers,looking for a place to live.
for every murderer there were thousands of honorable families.

they went in to liberate the buffalo
with the natives hurting defenseless buffalo until they were liberated from the fascist regime that they were under.
the buffalo welcomed the settlers as heroes.
sorta an early PETA
mission accomplished!


And the OP is correct.see that word majority?
that means more than 50%
if they all had murdered a native there would have been NO survivors.


[edit on 23-12-2009 by the_grand_pooh-bah]

Not all the Indians fought settlers. A distiction was made between red Indians who fought white settlers and white indians who did not fight settlers. The white Indians frequently moved into the newly created settlements and blended in. They were given the same status as the settlers. Some of the white indians became educated becoming preachers and other pillars of the community. Many people whose families where here more than a hundred years have Indian ancestors.

[edit on 23-12-2009 by eradown]

Originally posted by Isanti_dacotah

Seriously, your just a racist ranting about how you don't want to pay anything for the stolen land you live on and made your living on.

The little land that I have I paid for by working my but off and helping build this great nation. I guess to some people that’s racist.

Black's however DO want a check and DO want some livestock so cry to them about how your innocent and don't want to pay them for the stolen land they slaved on to create your fruit of the loom's.

Speak for yourself, NO ONE slaved for me, I'm a working stiff!

See? The more he speaks - the less sense he makes!

I bet Mommy is so proud.

Lets all just leave this thread alone. I dare ya!

Leave him alone.

He will then get his cars and other toys and go play elsewhere!

Originally posted by gdeed

Originally posted by JohnnyCanuck

Originally posted by gdeed
They did not!!! That's bull__t and is only meant to get into the pockets of Americans, who as a whole remain unaware of what the lawyers and politicians have up their sleaves.

Then YOU have nobody to blame but yourself for those societal problem you are whining about on-line. What are YOU, personally, doing about it?
Is this it?

I'm going to do my best to not be a burden on society, another panhandler in the long line of people looking for handouts when they are perfectly able to take care of themselves. I have been wronged by many people throughout my life but I don't let that keep me down. That's my contribution.

That's just tickety-boo for you...but you have acknowledged that there are societal problems that can be directly traced back to slavery and colonialism. And with your 'contribution', none of that will change and you will keep dumping your tax dollars into a money pit. Seems to me that YOU are the one crying into your beer about how unfair it is.

And btw, who appointed you overlord of guilt creation? Just curious.

A thread was opened, an opinion was asked and I responded. Sorry to confuse you with a straight answer.

Originally posted by JohnnyCanuck
Sorry to confuse you with a straight answer.

I'm still waiting for that straight answer. Funny how so many so-called "experts" think they have answers but only have hate. Some people want to round up everyone for a firing squad, the good with the few bad apples, makes no difference to them. Must make them feel proud or something. Bottom line it’s all about money and picking people’s pockets.

Originally posted by gdeed

Originally posted by JohnnyCanuck
Sorry to confuse you with a straight answer.

I'm still waiting for that straight answer. Funny how so many so-called "experts" think they have answers but only have hate. Some people want to round up everyone for a firing squad, the good with the few bad apples, makes no difference to them. Must make them feel proud or something. Bottom line it’s all about money and picking people’s pockets.

Balderdash! Hate is writing off black and native inequities without considering the root causes...then whining about it what a hassle they are. I've given you my attempt at an answer...take the funds that are now being dumped into a broken safety net and apply them to good health, good education and good leadership...and do it without the pork. It may not be a perfect response, but it's a damn sight better than starting threads on websites so you can bitch about it.

Mind you, maybe that makes one person happy, so it isn't entirely useless an endeavour .

Originally posted by JohnnyCanuck
Balderdash! Hate is writing off black and native inequities without considering the root causes...

Granted there are people whose ancestors did evil on to others and they might have guilt feelings about such things, as it seems you do, and should have such feelings. But don't expect the blameless Americans to ease those guilt feelings for you or whoever. America has bent over backwards to help those who need or want help regardless of fault and whether they deserve such help or not. But some people keep whining the more that is done for them. It's a no win situation.