Texas executes low-IQ convicted killer

reply to post by Kryties

What an utter disgrace.

So, you're upset that they executed a man who abducted, raped, and murdered an 11 year old girl, then was later declared "stupid" because of an IQ test???

Wow....IQ tests are easier than lie detector tests to beat.

Of course, you can never appear "smarter" only "dumber" but if i was on trial for murder, and was given an iQ test, i promise you i'd be answering everything as wrong as possible.

Originally posted by Conclusion
reply to post by Kryties

 

If your goal is to change the world view, then good luck to you.

Someone's got to try mate, if everyone just keeps saying things like "my voice means nothing" then we are handing power over to those which we strive to fight against.

My voice may be small, but I will bloody-well try to make it as loud as I can.

Originally posted by SuperSlovak
uh he killed an 11 year old girl. he got what he deserved.

As I said earlier, this would depend on whether his mental deficiencies alowed him to determine right from wrong and if he understood the ramifications of his acts.

I would guess that he could and so was punished according to the law, but without more information on what tests were done to determine his mental capabilities (and from the article I would assume probably not enough) I cannot say whether this was the right course of action to take.

reply to post by nik1halo


Then how do explain why people in areas of poverty and some cultures score lower. There is a lot of math on those tests too.

reply to post by Kryties


Then bravo for you. I do still think it is more cruel. I know I do have a problem with paying for someone to stay alive to receive, this so called treatment, so they might get better, when I have a hard enough time providing for the one's that I know and love. I am not saying it is wrong to do so, I am saying that I cannot afford to do so and also provide for someone who has not killed anyone. If I had to choose which one to support, it would be the latter.

Originally posted by Snarf
reply to post by Kryties

 

What an utter disgrace.

So, you're upset that they executed a man who abducted, raped, and murdered an 11 year old girl, then was later declared "stupid" because of an IQ test???

You know what I am sick of? Those that repeatedly try to play on emotions by continually reminding me of what the person did wrong. Let me get something straight: I BLOODY WELL KNOW WHAT HE DID WRONG AND I AGREE THAT IT WAS A BAD THING. Is that clear enough for you, or must I hire a plane and write it in the sky? It's not like I haven't said it a million times in this thread or anything........

The point is NOT that he did something wrong, or what it was. The point is that people are still being executed out of EMOTIONALLY BASED JUSTICE, which is wrong on every conceivable level.

reply to post by sickofitall2012


Can you provide a source for that fact please?

I think one explanation to this could be poorer nutrition in those areas, diminishing the potential for neural development in both the foetus and during childhood development.

I'm sure I heard this somewhere, but I'll try to find a source.

[edit to add] If Einstein were taken at birth and given no education, would he have been any less of a genius? He still would have had the capability of learning, so could still have reached his true potential.

It's interesting also to note that Einstein didn't actually do very well in school, especially Maths

[edit on 4-12-2009 by nik1halo]

[edit for spellnig]

[edit on 4-12-2009 by nik1halo]

Originally posted by nik1halo

Originally posted by SuperSlovak
uh he killed an 11 year old girl. he got what he deserved.

As I said earlier, this would depend on whether his mental deficiencies alowed him to determine right from wrong and if he understood the ramifications of his acts.

I would guess that he could and so was punished according to the law, but without more information on what tests were done to determine his mental capabilities (and from the article I would assume probably not enough) I cannot say whether this was the right course of action to take.

youd think differently if it was your girl he killed.

reply to post by Kryties
Bobby Woods was sentenced to death in 1998 for the sexual assault, abduction and murder of an 11-year-old girl the previous year.


Okey, I'll agree with you on one condition. (Maybe my "Redneck" side'll show) But show me where was the compassion for this poor little girl and her family? She didn't seem to get a tril before she was killed. What appeal do they file for her life? If this piece of waste as the story say had the capacity of a seven year old I say bull. The story it's self says he Sexually assaulted, abducted and murdered her that falls into someone knowing what their doing and trying to use the system to get out of it.



[edit on 4-12-2009 by Chance321]

Originally posted by Conclusion
reply to post by Kryties

 

I am not saying it is wrong to do so, I am saying that I cannot afford to do so and also provide for someone who has not killed anyone. If I had to choose which one to support, it would be the latter.

That would be true if ALL of your taxes went to paying for prisoners incarceration. The truth is that neither you, nor I, know what the hell our taxes are spent on. Our respective governments rave on about this and that being improved but in the end you are still driving on pot-holed roads, you are still getting crappy mobile reception, you are still getting shafted on medical benefits, you are still getting screwed in every conceivable way inclusive of prison-running taxes.

I would say that only a small fraction of your yearly tax actually ends up in the hands of the prison officials.

Originally posted by SuperSlovak

Originally posted by nik1halo

Originally posted by SuperSlovak
uh he killed an 11 year old girl. he got what he deserved.

As I said earlier, this would depend on whether his mental deficiencies alowed him to determine right from wrong and if he understood the ramifications of his acts.

I would guess that he could and so was punished according to the law, but without more information on what tests were done to determine his mental capabilities (and from the article I would assume probably not enough) I cannot say whether this was the right course of action to take.

youd think differently if it was your girl he killed.

Possibly, but it's not, which is why I can take a logical and non emotional view at the situation. If he was not capable of knowing right from wrong, he was not legally culpable, but still a danger to society, so the correct course of action should be lifetime hospitalisation.

Originally posted by Chance321
reply to post by Kryties

 

Bobby Woods was sentenced to death in 1998 for the sexual assault, abduction and murder of an 11-year-old girl the previous year.


Okey, I'll agree with you on one condition. (Maybe my "Redneck" side'll show) But show me where was the compassion for this poor little girl and her family? What appeal do they file for her life? If this piece of waste as the story say had the capacity of a seven year old I say bull. The story it's self says he Sexually assaulted, abducted and murdered her that falls into someone knowing what their doing and trying to use the system to get out of it.

The family gets a crappy deal out of it any way you look at it. The ONLY thing that will change for the family is having emotional satisfaction from watching the perpetrator die. THAT IS IT. NOTHING ELSE. Yes, what these people do is wrong, but executing them serves NO OTHER PURPOSE than to satisfy emotional needs.

reply to post by Kryties
You know what I am sick of? Those that repeatedly try to play on emotions by continually reminding me of what the person did wrong. Let me get something straight: I BLOODY WELL KNOW WHAT HE DID WRONG AND I AGREE THAT IT WAS A BAD THING. Is that clear enough for you, or must I hire a plane and write it in the sky? It's not like I haven't said it a million times in this thread or anything........

The point is NOT that he did something wrong, or what it was. The point is that people are still being executed out of EMOTIONALLY BASED JUSTICE, which is wrong on every conceivable level.



Sorry, I'm still in Redneck mode. So this bag of waste kills an innocent little girl and to you it's just a "Bad Thing" but somehow in your mind it's even worse that this waste was executed? Wow.

reply to post by Chance321


Wrong again. I never said that it was as simple as a "bad thing". That's you trying to put words into my mouth to attempt to make me look bad. Sprung

What he did was wrong, he deserves punishment. I never said otherwise. But executing people is not the way to do it when all it acheives is EMOTIONAL satisfaction. Western Law does not mandate emotionally based justice, nor does Texas Law mandate executing people who are mentally incompetant. What Texas has done is emotionally execute a mentally incompetant man! A double-whammy if you ask me.......

reply to post by Kryties


My computer is experiencing a problem trying to link to external links. Could you post what is spent on each inmate each year and how many billions of dollars each year it costs tax payers?

Originally posted by Kryties

Texas executes low-IQ convicted killer

news.smh.com.au

A convicted killer has been executed in Texas, despite pleas from his lawyers he was too mentally impaired to qualify for capital punishment.

Bobby Woods was sentenced to death in 1998 for the sexual assault, abduction and murder of an 11-year-old girl the previous year.

Woods, 44, received lethal injection on Thursday about a half-hour after the US Supreme Court refused to halt his punishment, which was delayed briefly until the high court ruled in his case.

(visit the link for the full news article)

Sexual assault, abduction and murder of an 11-year-old girl... And we are supposed to feel sorry for the retard? Screw him. He went out easy compared to his victim.

He should have been tortured to death very slowley. Just because you are a retard doesn't mean he should get away with the horror of what he did.

That is the problem with you feel good liberals. No feelings for the murdered 11 year old. You would rather let the retard out so he could do it again...

reply to post by Kryties


Forgive me if this has already been asked, but if the victim had been your daughter would you still feel the same way about the perpetrator? Just curious.

reply to post by northof8


I would think that by using the term "retard" you are referring to all mentally impaired individuals. As such your views and opinions on the subject are hereby dismissed for lack of compassion for anyone who is different than you.

reply to post by Conclusion


www.deathpenaltyinfo.org...

Financial Facts About the Death Penalty

California
Report of the California Commission on the Fair Administration of Justice

“The additional cost of confining an inmate to death row, as compared to the maximum security prisons where those sentenced to life without possibility of parole ordinarily serve their sentences, is $90,000 per year per inmate. With California’s current death row population of 670, that accounts for $63.3 million annually.”

Using conservative rough projections, the Commission estimates the annual costs of the present (death penalty) system to be $137 million per year.

The cost of the present system with reforms recommended by the Commission to ensure a fair process would be $232.7 million per year.

The cost of a system in which the number of death-eligible crimes was significantly narrowed would be $130 million per year.

The cost of a system which imposes a maximum penalty of lifetime incarceration instead of the death penalty would be $11.5 million per year.

Commission on the Fair Administration of Justice, June 30, 2008).
Maryland
New Study Reveals Maryland Pays $37 Million for One Execution

A new study released by the Urban Institute on March 6, 2008 forecasted that the lifetime expenses of capitally-prosecuted cases since 1978 will cost Maryland taxpayers $186 million. That translates into at least $37.2 million for each of the state’s five executions since the state reenacted the death penalty. The study estimates that the average cost to Maryland taxpayers for reaching a single death sentence is $3 million - $1.9 million more than the cost of a non-death penalty case. (This includes investigation, trial, appeals, and incarceration costs.) The study examined 162 capital cases that were prosecuted between 1978 and 1999 and found that those cases will cost $186 million more than what those cases would have cost had the death penalty not existed as a punishment. At every phase of a case, according to the study, capital murder cases cost more than non-capital murder cases.

Of the 162 capital cases, there werer 106 cases in which a death sentence was sought but not handed down in Maryland. Those cases cost the state an additional $71 million compared to the cost non-death penalty cases. Those costs were incurred simply to seek the death penalty where the ultimate outcome was a life or long-term prison sentence.

(“Death penalty costs Md. more than life term,” by Jennifer McMenamin, The Baltimore Sun, March 6, 2008). Read the entire study here.
Federal Costs

The average cost of defending a trial in a federal death case is $620,932, about 8 times that of a federal murder case in which the death penalty is not sought. A study found that those defendants whose representation was the least expensive, and thus who received the least amount of attorney and expert time, had an increased probability of receiving a death sentence. Defendants with less than $320,000 in terms of representation costs (the bottom 1/3 of federal capital trials) had a 44% chance of receiving a death sentence at trial. On the other hand, those defendants whose representation costs were higher than $320,000 (the remaining 2/3 of federal capital trials) had only a 19% chance of being sentenced to death. Thus, the study concluded that defendants with low representation costs were more than twice as likely to receive a death sentence. The complete report can be found here.

(Office of Defender Services of the Administrative Office of the U.S. Courts, "Update on Cost, Quality, and Availability of Defense Representation in Federal Death Penalty Cases," June 2008; prepared by Jon Gould and Lisa Greenman).
Washington
Report to Washington State Bar Association regarding cost

At the trial level, death penalty cases are estimated to generate roughly $470,000 in additional costs to the prosecution and defense over the cost of trying the same case as an aggravated murder without the death penalty and costs of $47,000 to $70,000 for court personnel. On direct appeal, the cost of appellate defense averages $100,000 more in death penalty cases, than in non-death penalty murder cases. Personal restraint petitions filed in death penalty cases on average cost an additional $137,000 in public defense costs.
(FINAL REPORT OF THE DEATH PENALTY SUBCOMMITTEE OF THE COMMITTEE ON PUBLIC DEFENSE, Washington State Bar Association, December 2006).
New Jersey
Death Penalty has Cost New Jersey Taxpayers $253 Million

A New Jersey Policy Perspectives report concluded that the state's death penalty has cost taxpayers $253 million since 1983, a figure that is over and above the costs that would have been incurred had the state utilized a sentence of life without parole instead of death. The study examined the costs of death penalty cases to prosecutor offices, public defender offices, courts, and correctional facilities. The report's authors said that the cost estimate is "very conservative" because other significant costs uniquely associated with the death penalty were not available. "From a strictly financial perspective, it is hard to reach a conclusion other than this: New Jersey taxpayers over the last 23 years have paid more than a quarter billion dollars on a capital punishment system that has executed no one," the report concluded. Since 1982, there have been 197 capital trials in New Jersey and 60 death sentences, of which 50 were reversed. There have been no executions, and 10 men are housed on the state's death row. Michael Murphy, former Morris County prosecutor, remarked: "If you were to ask me how $11 million a year could best protect the people of New Jersey, I would tell you by giving the law enforcement community more resources. I'm not interested in hypotheticals or abstractions, I want the tools for law enforcement to do their job, and $11 million can buy a lot of tools." (See Newsday, Nov. 21, 2005; also Press Release, New Jerseyans for Alternatives to the Death Penalty, Nov. 21, 2005). Read the Executive Summary. Read the full report. Read the NJADP Press Release.

Thats just a fraction of the information on that page, found with a simple Google search, all of which supports the fact that executing someone costs more than incarceration. Please feel free to go to the link and read further.

reply to post by gazerstar


Yes, I abhore the whole concept of the death penalty.