People hate guns in the uk because we live in such a safe culture we don't need guns thats why we are scared to death anyone has one

Oh dear lots of post sin this thread since I posted it late last night. Can't possibly respond to all. But I must at least begin by responding to this sort of comment that there is much of:

Originally posted by Fett Pinkus
This thread just goes to show how brainwashed americans really are

Before you start critizing us have a good look at your media

And nothing beats a solid dose of sport after watching your team win, good to get rid of the callories after a football game!

If you think about it, I'm not precisely criticizing Europeans, at least not hardly anymore than than "Americans". Read my words carefully, I called "Americans" fat and lazy, as well as hopelessly brainwashed. But you see there is much of a 'myth' here int eh US amongst many cricles that Europeans are much 'smarter' than the average Joe here. And it's pretty well known for some time that many Europeans look down on our 'fat' 'lazy' 'stupid' "Americans". But if you get down to it, in my view, in the sorts of areas that are of my concern, most Europeans aren't much different, and in many cases as I've mentioned far worse than the average Joe here.

What I'm trying to acomplish here is a deep down look into how we're ALL brainwashed.

From across the pond our masses are big and lazy, obsessed with 'football', while your masses over there might be more trim enough to point at our heavy people, yet are even more obsessed with sports enough to fight each other and consistently train your local authorities to put down riots.

SO yes I am underscoring some differences, yet the underlying issue here is that we're all brainwashed. It's interesting to note how so many EUropeans took a tribalist offense to the notion of me criticzing EUropeans, while overlooking how the premise of "americans" being brainwashed as a sort of inherent reality.

There is an underlying WAKE UP call in my OP, directed at everyone worldwide for that matter. Even if someone from 'the East' were to read all of this I'd hope they;d look past tribalism social group sheepledom and consider their own brainwashing after reading how even 'free' "Americans" and Europeans are also hopelessly brainwashed.

So if you cant handle reading ways that Europeans (as complex a term that is) are brainwashed similar to US, then this thread isn't for you. And if you really think I'm European bashing you should see some of the threads I've posted over the years where I had armadas of ticked Joe's shouting their 'YOU'RE ANTI-AMERICAN' madness. I'm a libertarian'esque iconoclast extremist and my criticism is universal wherever criticism necessary.

[edit on 13-11-2009 by IgnoranceIsntBlisss]

Originally posted by eyeswilldeceive
People hate guns in the uk because we live in such a safe culture we don't need guns thats why we are scared to death anyone has one

2 murder in the past 3 months in my uk town, certainly feels safe!

Not having guns changes nothing when the criminals just use knives instead.

[edit on 13-11-2009 by Xadaz]

Oh and big surprise Europeans and Americans are both susceptible to "brainwashing" or whatever you want to call it. We're the same people.

[edit on 13-11-2009 by Xadaz]

Originally posted by CRB86
I'm still thoroughly interested in finding out how football hooliganism fits into the thesis, though.

Here in the States people of my thinking criticize "Americans" daily. The people who fit all the stereotypes inherent in this thread.

And they are REAL. They're EVERYWHERE, EVERDAY.

And a key identifier of rather striking accuracy is the types who obsess over sports much like the rest of what's on TV. But sports go much further. You've got dripping tribalism amongst other notable concepts such as irrational bowing to authority figures.

But perhaps most concerning of all, in my view, would be squander. There are MILLIONS of people in 'the west' who know more about sports than they know about themselves. A major percentage of the society here not only obsesses over pro-"Football" but also college football which has something like 100 teams. They know the stats, the players, an elaborate historical timeline view of the sports, teams, players, stats and the rest of it. They watch Sportscenter instead of the news. I had these roomates once they'd sit late at night and watch SC once, and then again the replay of the same show showing the same clips.

But if you try to talk to them about much of ANYTHING that is actually important in the world you'll get laughed off the stage.

So sports is an important benchmark in measuring the brainwashing of any society. Therefore, the idea of having regular riots over such tribalistic irrelevent nonsense is striking to say the least. So when you factor in the concept of unwittingly serving as a tool to train the police to put down uprisings along with providing justification to have such overblown police forces I'd say this key point is a slam dunk.

One of the most ludicrous posts I've read in some time. Let's start with Europe is made up of many countries, as is the America's. The European Union isn't one government, but has regulations about trade, immigration, human rights law etc...So are you saying this is a bad thing? Many nations working together to create a climate of co-operation and equality. Now I get you would like to imagine in your ignorance that a New World Order is behind this, but that is total rubbish. By all means project your paranoid nonsesne, it is your right to free speech after all.

Oh,and guns. Obviously the world is much worse off without instant access to a gun? How else could we shoot one another otherwise? Because that is a good thing? Seriously, if you are that paranoid about things then you need help. If your government is going to take you prisoner at the barrel of a gun then you might wanna think about moving to Europe.

Since your post didn't quite seem to know what the point it had to make was, then as for believing the media; read only ATS and you will not get a balanced view. Read only Fox news and you will not get a balanced view. I was going to say use sensible discretion but paranoia only knows extremes.

OK, as a British expat I had to read what this post was all about... you're basically saying that the US isn't all that bad when compared to Europe in certain areas like surveillance, infringement of rights, etc.

You have to keep in mind that the US is a much bigger and younger country than the UK. For the US govt to put a camera on every street block, it would cost them billions. If it were cheaper, I'm sure they'd have done it a long time ago. They instead resort to more technologically advanced, covert tactics.

In any case, in my experience, whenever I have to communicate with Americans, I find I have to dumb down my language and use basic words and phrases and even start changing my accent and vocab to suit the American one. And as for general knowledge... well, I think it's pretty self evident... 60 mins. did a show recently where they gave US school kids and European school kids the same test - and as expected, the US kids scored very badly. Lets not forget the American news media which is full of the word of the day "terrorist" and an over-hyped, Hollywood style reporting. I'm sure the average American must know more about the geography of Iraq than the USA.

It seems that people in the US are too attached to celeb gossip, American sports, food, violence, their flag, government and army, etc. If any nationality is "brainwashed" as your subject title suggests, it would certainly not be those in Europe.

Look, the reality is that there are faults on both sides. I think to just come out and say those guys over there are stupid, without any real intellectual understanding is pretty lame.

In the UK I read they even banned the carry of pocket knives

Yes that's true and if your found with one without a good enough reason you get 5 years in prison, crazy huh.

The americans are far more brainwashed than europeans . You may see these undesirable attributes being displayed , but that is more down to social factors . You will see certain sectors of the society displaying some of these tendencies , but randomly placed geographically . It is not like say , in the USA where you can cross counties , and states lines and you know that whomever you lay your eyes upon on your travels is almost certainly of the very same opinion as the fellow you saw a few hundred miles back in another state and the same of all of those in-between.

You can tell they are brainwashed. What other country comes out en masse , like the Americans , to propagate the lie of the day about some country or other . If it's france in the news , the americans are out in their hordes attacking france .. if it's China, Russia , they are there again doing the same , venezuela , same old story . What other nation does that ? Where else in the world can the population be mobilized in the masses for universal propagation of disinfo and threatening demeanor to a specific target nominated by the media in this way ? What other country is so motivated by propaganda that they so infest the internet with their governments driven lies and agenda as Americans do ? . Who else has the multitudes lined up to vomit their government doctrines and distortions like the americans can . No other nation comes anywhere near the same scale of propaganda driven activity that the americans display .


[edit on 13-11-2009 by Gun Totin Gerbil]

Now Children stop pointing fingers at each other.

We are all in the same aquarium. So instead of Divinding each other and continu hate from the past wich led no where. Why not try to forget the past and try to get along because if every one keeps acting like a child and let one post start deviding europeans from american then they are well controling all of you.

Dont you folks get it yet. Alone with youre people you will only seclude yourself and your mind and that will lead to war and more war and more hate.

Lets all act as citizens of earth and lets try to be civilized and help each other against all the control that we all suffer from and this for centuries.
Just look around you its right there ...

"United we stand, Divided we fall"

I want to believe I am not alone ...

[edit on 13-11-2009 by NIGHTRID3R]

Originally posted by logican
The European Union isn't one government, but has regulations about trade, immigration, human rights law etc...

Right. And don't forget the currency. Here in the US we have the "Republican" and "Democratic" political parties which dominate the politcal system. In practice, the combination of the 2 comprises 'the government' via the House, Senate, etc. But in reality the true government, the one which supercedes these 2 factions amongst the 'branches' of 'government' is in fact the true government. Over here we call it the "Federal Reserve". It is the true government considering it openly dictates the operations of the economy and it openly claims to be above the 'government'.

"The Fed" is the de facto government. The bank alone is the de facto government.

Anyone informed and not irrationally biased to rationalize our system over here would have to admit the tyranny of this system. The irony is the EU is even more tyrannical, being virtually the same under the 'federation' pretext, while also having a private central bank, meanwhile having what we would call the 'government' as a sort of 'congress' full of unelected elitest politician scum.

So are you saying this is a bad thing? Many nations working together to create a climate of co-operation and equality.

We already have those sorts of things: NAFTA, GATT, WTO, and so on that have helped destroy our economy in the past couple decades, while handing over consortium type quazi monopolies to the major corporations. DO you really believe that the major international corporations and central bankers dont play the EU the same as they play the rest of the world?

Now I get you would like to imagine in your ignorance that a New World Order is behind this, but that is total rubbish.

That's funny, Gordon Brown is one notable EU'esque figure that has applied that term to it, er joining the EU. Start checking Google News regularly for that term and you'll see the major media from here and there quoting officials from both here and there. The funny thing is I can post an endless list of evidence of such, for days, yet I doubt theres any actual evidence there isn't such. HMMM...

Guns: True what we call 'Constitutionalists", or 'libertarians', etc, consider the liberty or freedom to possess a weapon as a key benchmark in considering how free you are. If the Big Daddy / Nanny / Brother government doesn't allow you to have a gun while it wields guns and gunships then guess how free you actually are.

read only ATS and you will not get a balanced view.

That's funny, reading this thread alone we're seeing several different arguments, perspectives, etc. Balance.

Are you sure you're not 'American'??

[edit on 13-11-2009 by IgnoranceIsntBlisss]

Originally posted by Venetian
OK, as a British expat I had to read what this post was all about... you're basically saying that the US isn't all that bad when compared to Europe in certain areas like surveillance, infringement of rights, etc.

If you'd read my response above... or stop thinking in tribalistic terms, you realize I'm not patting the US on the back. I'd probably leave if there was any real option. But in total it's no different anywhere else to my knowledge, plus 'we're' generally disliked across the world for the actions of the government that most everyone is stupid enough to worship.

READ HERE, MY FIRST SENTENCE:

Originally posted by IgnoranceIsntBlisss
I'm aghast daily at the level of brainwashing of the US public,

You EUropeans are disappoiting me. I had really hoped you wouldn't all respond the same way as a bunch of 'Americans' if I dare start a thread saying that 'America' is brainwashed.

[edit on 13-11-2009 by IgnoranceIsntBlisss]

Originally posted by Dermo

I live in Ireland and like most other EU countries, you can get guns for hunting.. just not for shooting people. Get that into your head!!!!!! WE CAN GET GUNS.. JUST NOT FOR SHOOTING PEOPLE LIKE YOU CAN

Yes as everyone here in America knows a hunting rifle will never shoot a human. Sort of like those in the EU who have never figured out how to kill a man with a hunting gun.

oh, I believe AMERICANS are far more brainwashed...
its mainly cuz of the reason that i believe TELEVISION is the greatest brainwashed or hypnotize device..and we all know america has a powerful media and HOLLYWOOD is there ... their hypothesis start with their childhood,..
A person can be surprise to see how so many people are controlled and majority of them donot even know they are..

You can buy a gun here in the UK and legally keep it for the purposes of hunting or recreational purposes. No one cares about the street cameras everywhere because - guess what - it's not a big deal. In the larger scheme of things there are bigger issues to worry about and since most cameras are operated for the purposes of private security and not by government, I'd argue it doesn't matter anyway.

This is just like the whole NHS thing all over again - illinformed people throwing opinions around when they know diddly squat.

Also , you find americans come in 'packets' , there is no gradual diversification in their mannerism or opinions . They all sit snugly within the packets . This is evidence of a form of a socio-environmental coercion that they are already compelled to abide by . Under such parameters , it is easier for an agency to forge the minds of already compromised and weakened of mind individuals already committed to a kind of group or national interest compliant mindset .