WAR: English Words and Western Voices Heard on Nick Berg Beheading Video

[edit on 20-10-2004 by antipigopolist]

Originally posted by McGotti
Im somewhat confused on what your saying....I dont believe the american guards felt their lives were in danger..so why would they give disinformation about who gave them the orders to humiliate and the photograph themselves...
So if the CIA ordered the pictures and torture.....and got caught red handed...its possible they either did the berg killing themselves or ordered somebody to do it and they may have been caught again.

I didn't mean the 'guards'. I'm referring to inmates/detainees
Sanc'.

Antipigologist: this is very good work. Thank you. It sickened me to listen to it, as well, but I guess it's something we have to do.

At first, I listened to the "original" audio track and was unconvinced, but this certainly is more convincing. That, Nick Berg being in US custody immediately prior to his kidnapping and the apparent lack of blood. The only voice I can make out "Now are we gonna..." sounds very, very like an American speaking English.

[Edited on 22-5-2004 by Lampyridae]

Originally posted by sanctum
I didn't mean the 'guards'. I'm referring to inmates/detainees
Sanc'.

Ok then like I said in the first place...what is your point??? yes the inmates would lie...what the hell does that have to do with the berg video...please explain

I can definitely hear the voices far better in that track just posted.
Good work, antipigopolist. It's the first time I've been able to hear the second statement, though I still can't really make out what's being said there.

antipigopolist

Thanks for your work on this.

I'm officially impressed.

Now on to the next mystery...

Who is Antipigopolist?

But seriously good work Bud.

Those words actually make more sense to me listening again.

well thankfully somepeople are paying attention, I think a few of us, including myself have sent several emails with links to this thread to various media outlets asking them to check into it for themselves. it's a shame though the story probably isn't ever gonna make it into the mainstream news.

antipigopolist for contributing and verifying what some of us hear.

Originally posted by Valhall
antipigopolist

Thanks for your work on this.

Hello, I'm french, understand a # to how that blog works, but have to say I heard this : -How openly ba(tic), bad(tic)- sure- how we go..."
I hear olso words of americans at 4:56 -hem'in- and 4:58 -over-
I wrot this in french to many medias and hope someone would translate it bur I might do it, those are the resons it is a fals media :

Cher journaux,

Par soucis de v�rit� face � l'�vidence qui appara�t, j'ai collect� un maximum d'informations v�rifi�es ou officielles sur la d�capitation de Nick berg et vous r�adresse cette lettre dont le contenu �voque le sentiment devenu ignoble de ceux qui s'y sont int�ress�. Ce sont les internautes am�ricains qui ont d�couvert et d�voil� ceci gr�ce � leurs journaux et m�dias :

Qui s'est pos� la question de savoir pourquoi cet am�ricain, Nick Berg, volontaire pour aider � reconstruire l'Irak, �gorg� devant une cam�ra vid�o par des terroristes masqu�s, �tait officiellement en prison am�ricaine quelques jours avant sa mort, et, pour quelle raison obscure �tait-il devenu "prisonnier-terroriste" des am�ricains? Pourquoi a-t-il �tait rel�ch� par l'arm�e am�ricaine sans raison, ni proc�s, ni excuses, alors qu'elle le disaient disparu? Pourquoi les terroristes pr�sum�s ont-il bizarrement choisi internet pour la diffusion de son ex�cution qui ne permet pas de v�rifier les trucages? Pourquoi est-il assis sur une chaise dont le m�me model a �t� photographi� � la prison d'Abou Ghraib? Pourquoi le mur jaune, le sol et sa tenue de prisonnier ressemblent-t-ils �norm�ment � ceux de cette m�me prison? Pourquoi entent-on parl� am�ricain, selon les anglophones, � la fin de la vid�o, en fond sonore ("how weak was that?", "hoo!", "we gonna...")? Pourquoi les terroristes semblent-t-il grands, gros et blancs (mains) et n'aurait pas l'accent arabe? Pourquoi portent-ils des gilets pare-balles identiques � ceux de la CIA? Pourquoi un zoom interrompt-il la sc�ne o� il est projet� � terre, puis menac� par le couteau pos� fortement sur son coup et celui ou on d�couvre la barbarie? Pourquoi ne se d�bat-il pas en criant, quand on recale les images avec le son (car le son est d�cal� � l'origine de 10 secondes en avance)? Pourquoi des m�decins ont-ils affirm� que le sang d'une art�re jugulaire ne sort pas ainsi chez un ex�cut� vif? Pourquoi les sp�cialistes de CNN affirment-ils, � l'invers de la CIA, que ce n'est pas la voix de Zarkaoui comme le pr�tend �tre le terroriste qui ne boite pas non plus alors que Zarkaoui a une proth�se? Pourquoi est-ce que ce chef affirme �tre Zarkaoui et le dit sans g�ne devant toutes les polices, mais est masqu�, enti�rement? Pourquoi li-t-il sa lettre sans conviction, ni passion, ni col�re et leurs cris de croyants lanc�s vers dieu paraissent, pour beaucoup d'am�ricains, ceux de supporters de foot ball? Pourquoi depuis que le corps a �t� retrouv� on a pas pratiqu� d'autopsie, ni envoy� en Am�rique? Pourquoi personne en France ne s'est pos� la question d'un faux devant tant de dissonances connues? Beaucoup d'am�ricains ne croient d�j� plus � cette vid�o de l'�coeurement!

Alexis X.

A vous de faire passer le message, au moins entre vous, il est d'importance capital.
Toutes les th�ories convergent vers un faux grotesque de la CIA et du pentagone suite aux s�vices, pour faire passer le message que des s�vices ne sont rien face � une saign�e qu'on balance � la figure du monde pour le faire vomir et revomir � loisir en maudissant les irakiens et leurs mani�res anti-chr�tiennes (car le texte est suspect lui aussi, trop aiguis� pour �tre franc, trop d�monstratif de b�tises, mais pas passionn�). Nick Berg savait quelque chose qui lui a donn� le r�le vedette qu'il ne soup�onnait pas, alors qu'on lui demandait de participer � sa lib�ration. C'est bien sa t�te qui est pr�lev�e et exhib�e, mais sur son corps mort. Il a �t� film� de son plein gr�s devant des faux terroristes-GIs, � moins d'un montage, ce qui ne change rien. On ne voit le couteau le trancher pour la premi�re fois qu'apr�s le zoom o� il ne bouge que parce qu'on le secoue, �tant d�j� mort, mais criant! Les GIs �taient press�s, dans l'urgence et voulaient une victime exemplaire. Il y a encore quelques 40 personnes port�es disparues comme lui � Bagdad.
Il ne faut pas rester dupe ni silencieux et combien m�me je me trompe....... demandez � Stanley Kubrick et � ses coll�gues cin�astes morts. Un grand pas pour l'homme......... Cette vid�o est ignoble, impardonnable, la v�rit� serait donc bien pire.

Originally posted by Alchy


translation :

Who ask himself the question why, Nick, was in american�s jails a few days before he died and for wich dark reason did he become a terrorist-prisoner of Americans? Why was he slackened (got free) by the army without reason, process or exuz, as he was said lost? Why did the terrorists have strangely choose internet to show it, when it doesn�t alow to verify any faking?
Why is he set on a chair which same model was photographed at Abu-Ghraib prison?
Why do the yellow wall, the floor, his prisoner-clothes look all the same in Abu-Ghraib prison?
Why do we hear american�s spokes in back-sounds?
Why do the terrorists looks tall, fat, and white (hands), and would�nt have Arabic accent?
Why do a zoom cut the scene where he is projected on the floor, then menaced with a cut (4 or 5 frame only) posed on his neck (yes, only!), his hair pulled �zoom- and the barbarity begins?
Why doesn�t he struggle while yelling, once the sound is harmonised with the video (he moves a little because he is moved by the man in his back)?
Why do some doctors say blood doesn�t flow like that when a jugular is cut on a living man?
Why do CNN specialists of Zarkaoui say it is not his voice, not his prosthesis (no prosthesis) but CIA say so?
Why do the chef affirm he is Zarkaoui and tell it without problem in front of the polices of the world, but is completely masked?
Why do he read is letter with no real conviction, passion or anger and terrorists cries of belivers to god seem more like foot ball supporter�s cry?
Why do, since the body was find, nobody made autopsy?
Why is the body always in Irak?
Why do French don�t care about so strange things (we don�t want to die!!)?

The theory is that it was made to make the world vomit and vomit again cursing iraqis for their anti-christianity (antichrist symbol). The text is suspect too, too sharpened to be free (frank), too demonstrative of insanity, but not passionate) Nick Berg knew something that gave him the first part he didn�t suspect, as he was asked to take part to that �show� to get free. It is his head witch is taken off and exhibited, but on his dead body. He was filmed on his own free in front the false-terrorists, if it�s not a montage, witch change nothing. We see the cut cutting him for the first time after the zoom 4:39 to 4:43. Look well, it�s the first real cutting of his throat, not before at all! At 4:43, he is in another position, dead, yelling, moving only because of the man behind him and his head is cut off. GIs needed an �exemplary�, �confident�, victim. There are still some 40 persons who have disappeared like him in Irak.

I�m going sleep, 5:05 in France! Bye.


[Edited on 5-22-2004 by Valhall]

Updated news information at www.atimes.com...

This could very well be explained because Mr. Berg being misled by people he trusted to believe that this would be a staged event. Expert opinion in this arena does not override common sense.

That's the first news I've seen that included info suggested on this site.

Sources for all my facts can be found at the bottom, they are labeled according to subject.

That having been said...

Many of you might remember that I started a thread on the day the video was released noting how "convenient" it was that the tape had come out, just as the Iraqi prisoner abuse scandal was in full swing. Not only did this take the abuse scandal off of headlines, but it swayed public opinion back against "those ****ing Iraqis".

Evidence

1) Most people replied by asserting that the execution occured as retribution to the abuse photos that had surfaced, but you have to ask yourself - do these terrorists, who are clearly capable of brainwashing people to the point where they are willing to kill and be killed for their beliefs, really have no concept of political tact? Here they are, the whole world screaming at the US for hypocrisy and injustice over these pictures, and they perform and publish this execution right in the heat of the scandal. In other words, these masters of brainwashing and spin and deception release a video of a despicable act just as the US, their sworn enemy, is being globally grilled. Does this make sense to you?

2) Second, I wonder what the standard issue chair is at Abu Ghraib prison?

**pix**
/2d4qg
/2keh8

*cough*

3) Is it not interesting that the wall colour at Abu Ghraib prison is identical to that of the video?

4) Is it not also interesting that Berg is wearing the same orange jumpsuit worn by prisoners at Abu Ghraib prison? Sure, you say, perhaps he was kidnapped directly from the prison (as stupid as this sounds, anyway) - but then can you please explain (7)?

5) Is it also not interesting that the timecodes in the video jump back and forth?

6) Is it also not interesting that Berg did not exhibit any of the convulsions that typically accompany decapitation? www.ahsc.arizona.edu... I am suggesting here that Berg was already dead when the decapitation occured (which accounts for 5). Before you go calling me crazy, please review the evidence; why did he not exhibit the convulsions that go hand in hand with decapitation (especially such an extended one)?

7) Is it not curious that the US denies contact with Berg, and yet his friends and family insist that he told them he was being held by the US? Huh? Why?

8) Another tape oddity - the men SPEAK RUSSIAN for several seconds. Not only that, but they speak Arabic with Russian accents. That's right, in the final seconds of the tape, one of the men speaks in Russian. Those here who understand russian (and have the stomach to view that final seconds of the video) can verify this. Those who speak Arabic will be able to verify that these men speak Arabic in Russian accents.

9) Finally (the physical evidence that will convince you in case you already aren't)...
You will notice, in watching the video, that 6 times, a gold ring flashes on the hand of the executioner. What is the problem? Islam completely and utterly forbids men to wear gold rings. This fanatical muslim, willing to kill in a gutwrenching manner, and be killed for his beliefs, is violating one of the clear prohibitions of his religion? Really? DOES THIS MAKE SENSE TO YOU?

edit:
Two more points:

10) Nick Berg understands Arabic, but sits calmy while statement is read, waiting to be killed. Hmm?

11) One of the executioners is wearing Air Jordans. WHAT?

edit 2:

12) The "terrorists" signed the video, yet they wear hoods and masks. Why?

13) The "terrorists" have lily white hands.

14) The video time is in US Military English. What the hell?

Conclusion
As many has suspected, but have not had the time to build a solid case for, the execution of Nick Berg was performed by coalition interests (most likely independent Russian mercenaries) in order to dwarf the abuse pictures and sway public opinion back against the Iraqis and in support of the war by taking advantage of the emotional reaction we all experience when hearing of such an despicable act. The poor production quality (all the "curiosities" I have pointed out) of this video can be attributed to the haste in which it was made after the order was given to distract the public from the abuse scandal, and is in line with my conclusion.

Again, before you attack my conclusion, attack my evidence. No matter how crazy you think this sounds, examine the evidence objectively and please try to deny a single thing I have said. If you cannot deny my evidence, you logically cannot deny my conclusion. Make your replies free of subjective opinions and ad hominem attacks or I will not reply to them.


Sources:

Chair, wall, timecode, and :
/3cjha
/2pu22

Berg was in US custody:
/24xtq
(you'll have to copy & paste this one since genmay blocks cnn links as you know)

Gold rings forbidden by Islam:
/2s4bg
/226ns

Originally posted by Valhall
This could very well be explained because Mr. Berg being misled by people he trusted to believe that this would be a staged event. Expert opinion in this arena does not override common sense.

I dont anderstand what you mean. Do you agree (sorry i'm french and as a good french i don't speak or anderstand so well english) or not. Anyway, all this can be verified on the net and everything was written by journalists, exept the theory that stay a theory.

Other things :
The face of Nick is over contrasted, saturated. I first thought it was a montage (I've never belive in that movie) but i think only the color of his face was change, so that, his face looks pinky-orange and the skin of the terrorists, white-grey. The light on his face is not natural in order to show a difference between his skin and the bads one.
Someone should ask Staneley Kubrick about that movie. He'd say this is a big step for humanity! Do every one know he confessed, ten years ago, the movie of Amstrong walking on the moon was made on earth by him and dead friends in stupids accidents!!
Some people also claim that the terrorist wear bullet proof gillets of CIA members. I cant verified this by my own.
An other strange thing is that the CIA or Pentagone hasnt work on that video and dont comment it anymore and have stop to speak about even to know more about anything you want. It remains me the recent rocketting on palestinian manifastants that have definitly stop all manifestation in palestinia against the final solution practiced on palestinians for 60 years ago.

To finish, I hope my Nick-name (I'm very funny!) is well prononced, Alchy, it's not altshi or alshi, altcha�, alqa� (even not ida), but [alki]. Thank you.

I dont belive george is not in the secret. It is impossible. Even the french president in 1984 or 5 or 3, Mitterand, knew about the french secret agent that distroyed the Rainbow Warrior of Green peace, killind 2 persons. He knows and do with, it's a strategy of desinformation to war more and win the petrol iraqies have no more... Iraq was much more a democracy, a developed country under saddam. It wasnt a real democracy, but was it more than today, now that they are straving in their rusted and distroyed country.
I have to say that american people looks stupid in the mind of the world. Every one is against the method, make it know, but bush's administration # on it and make money. Realy, the world thinks america is mistaken by its gouvernment and dont anderstand how, because it is so huge and visible...

Good luck America!

hey im muslim and im pretty sure it does not say how wicked is that it says

"a-wudthu-billa"

not sure what the means, but i no awudthubillahimanash-shawtannirajim, means somethin about keeping the devil away.

but back tot pic, im ptretty sure it doesnt say how wicked is that

In reply to SD-JH543

With allies like that, who needs enemies?

That is another possibility thrown into the mix, all I can say is this whole thing is messed up.

[Edited on 23-5-2004 by Darkblade71]

Now this might have already been mentioned, I haven't been up to date on my reading. But I was listening to a radio station in Detroit and the talk radio show said that in the video a person is wearing a US military hat as well as a jacket with US insignia. Anyone could do the same, I understand that but just was just curious if anyone else noticed this or not. I haven't seen the video frame by frame but I am just reiterating what was said.

Originally posted by DangerProne
But I was listening to a radio station in Detroit and the talk radio show said that in the video a person is wearing a US military hat as well as a jacket with US insignia.

Towards the end of the video, a person enters on the Right hand side of the screen, , but as far as an Insignia, I have not seen any evidence of this.

Heres a pic:


[Edited on 24-5-2004 by TrickmastertricK]

NO! We need to be sure we don't participate in burgeoning urban legends. THERE IS NO EAR...THERE IS NO BALLCAP! If you view it frame by frame you will see that what is seen on the right hand side is:

1. the mystery guy's left sleeve
2. his elbow
3. his left pinky finger
4. an apparatus (camera?) with a metal bracket clearly seen in the top right hand corner of one frame.

But we really shouldn't keep promoting a false statement that could just work against finding out the truth of this video.

There is no ballcap.