The True Hebrew Israelites

reply to post by buds84


No, seriously. Do you even know the history of the Seminole? And can you tell me why Black Americans are from the tribe of Judah, while Hatians are of the tribe of Levi, while Dominicans are the tribe of Simeon?

Black Americans and Hatians are both from the same damn place, coastal west Africa (with some contributions from central and Saharan Africa). Hatians and Dominicans share the island of Hispanola. Why are they supposedly three different tribes? Given the practice of slavery, where families were split apart and sold in both hemisoheres, with men being put out to "stud" how can they even be so neatly divided?

And that's without even considering the fact that the Seminole were in large part escaped slaves, adding a fourth "tribe" to this jittery, ahistorical nonsense.

Oh what do we have here?

Some more incredible proof?

This is an amazing book:

Who is Esau Edom?

www.scribd.com...

I found a map in here that shows exactly what I was talking about.
You guys should go read that book.

Check this out.




see, before you get confused at the end of Jacob line, Israelites were the first to rule those areas listed, Scots, Irish ect, it is proven Hebrew Israelites were there first before Esau took over, hence the need for the "Renaissance".

[edit on 3-11-2009 by buds84]

Oh so NOW your list includes the tribe of DAN?

So, what are you changing your mind again? What, re-writing history to suit your silly unsupported theories, again ?!!!

What ever happend to your precious Manasseh? I don't see HIM on your most recent chart...

What's the matter, Buds, can't you make up your mind what the 12 tribes were?

Oh, I forgot, they're all back in the Yucatan where you claim they came from !! (Or was it Peru, I forget)

Maybe you just need to take a simple basic paleoHebrew course !!

Originally posted by Sigismundus
Oh so NOW your list includes the tribe of DAN?

Read first page, bottom post, www.abovetopsecret.com...

I included tribe of Dan because I forgot to put it in.

It's called a mistake, not rewriting history.

Still mad because Esau is going to die?

All you have done is rag on me and brought no proof yet, I have stomped you with tons of books and resources to prove my topic point.

Go back school I'm tired of schooling you.

Buds--

If you wanted to school me you'd first better learn to read paleoHebrew, Aramaic and Koine Greek;

Hitherto you have done nothing to address the several points I have discussed in my threads to you except post non-sequitur material via silly illiterate garbage on video links which are totally unsupported by serious modern scholarship.

Now, discuss the Song of Deborah in Judges Chapter 5 if you would please, and explain why her tribal amphyctionies are different from the messy list you posted from the King James Version of the so-called Book of Revelation chapter 7:4ff.

Now please. I'm waiting.

Originally posted by EMPIRE
reply to post by Lemon.Fresh

 

1. Yes he says it will be by his hand. Why don't you try reading the book of Isaiah as it clearly says HE will do it, not Zionists, Rothschilds, Balfour Declarations, etc.

Who are you to tell what God's hand is?

God can use the evil man just as He can use the righteous.

2. The proof is in history books and any version of the OT. Don't blame me because you adhere to cult like beliefs.

Really?

Show me where then.

All you have done thus far is give vague answers with no real substance to back it up.

Time to put up or shut up. The onus is on you, friend.

Originally posted by Lemon.Fresh

Who are you to tell what God's hand is?

I'm Empire, the person who read the many verses in the OT where YHWH/HA-SHEM said he would be the one to restore the people. Buddy, it's all in the OT. He said he was going to due it by his hand, not by the Balfour Declaration, Zionism, etc. Doing it by other methods, such as evil men, will most likely lead to those men attempting to take credit for it.

God can use the evil man just as He can use the righteous.

See above. Who are you to say the god of the Hebrews is going to use a wicked man to build or restore the nation? Again, there are many scriptures in the OT saying he would do it by his hand, so why don't YOU show me something in the OT that says he is going to do it by wicked men, by Zionism, by associating with Americans, by the British, etc? You can't because it NEVER says it, but due to your love and allegence to Zionism you'll leap over the cliff and assume it means God using outside forces as instruments or agents. LOL!

Really?Show me where then.

I already did, start with the book I told you to read. In regards to the Balfour Declaration and everything related to the establishment of the puppet nation, all you have to do is use this sites search engine or google. Better yet, read this document and you'll see other places were considered for the "promised land",(temporarily or permanent it doesn't matter) are listed.

www.socialistproject.ca...

All you have done thus far is give vague answers with no real substance to back it up.Time to put up or shut up. The onus is on you, friend.

You're digging yourself into a hole here, and if I decide to post all the information proving that the Hebrews are not Celts/British....LOL....I can't even finish typing the sentence because the claim that they are is that absurd.

In closing, be careful for what you wish for...

[edit on 4-11-2009 by EMPIRE]

[edit on 4-11-2009 by EMPIRE]

Aw, c'mon! I want to know how in the world it is the Seminole are a "lost tribe of Israel!" It's bound to be a heck of a story, how a tribe that didn't exist until the middle of the 19th century suddenly became a bunch of Jewish dudes in the Florida panhandle!

Or are you just peddling a bunch of black nationalist hullabaloo and hoping nobody notices? ...Rhetorical question?

reply to post by buds84


I cannot star and flag the OP.
The premise of the post is wrong.

The tribes of Judah and Benjamin have never been considered part of the "Lost Tribes of Israel" by any real historical or biblical scholar. The "Lost Tribes of Israel" are usually referred to as "the Ten (10) Lost Tribes of Israel" and are supposedly "lost" during the Babylonian and Assyrian captivities.

There is some debate amongst bible scholars as whether or not any of the tribes were really lost during the captivities. There is a reference in the New Testament (Luke 2:36) of a woman prophetess named Anna who is from the tribe of Asher. Determining where they went and where they ended up is even more hotly debated amongst the so-called professional scholars.

ATS user Selahobed wrote some good responses to your posts, and from my studies, she is more accurate. Scholars need to take into consideration the promises made to Abraham as well as other historical and archaeological evidence. If your tracing is indeed true (I don't believe it is), the promises to Abraham have not been fulfilled.

Naming the tribes of Israel is not an easy task either, as there are several listings and not all are exactly the same. (Genesis 35:23-26; Exodus 1:2-5;
Numbers 1:20-43; 1 Chronicles 2:2; Revelation 7:5-8). Every listing contains Simeon, Judah, Gad, Asher, Naphtali, Manasseh, Issachar, Zebulun, and Benjamin. As one example here, Dan is left out of the list in Revelations 7.

reply to post by dirkpotters


Ok I think you missed the point.

It's a "Conspiracy", so Scholars are not going to teach this in class.
This is similar to expecting "Scholars in NASA" to tell you about UFO's or historical "Scholars" to teach how the government planned 9/11 and what for.
If your expecting the government to come out and admit they have been doing everything they can to keep this a secret your crazy.


This is literally the biggest secret the elites are hiding.
Why? Because they know what happens at the end.

Tell me why do you need a Biblical Scholar to tell you something before you approve?
You can't read the evidence laid out and decide for for yourself?

Anyways you ignored the book I posted WRITTEN BY A BIBLICAL SCHOLAR that agrees with everything I said.
32 megs You can download it :
www.scribd.com...

I found this book after I made my topic post by the way, so theres your "Scholar" approval seeing as you needed help you decide.

Like I said they spent billions keeping this a secret, the elites are not going to teach their slaves that they are Israelites.
There plan was to make them forget.

Also you said they were"lost" during the Babylonian and Assyrian captivities.
Where in the Bible does it say that? thats totally wrong, are you sure you read a Bible or did someone read it for you?

The only people saying they are "lost" is the government.

[edit on 4-11-2009 by buds84]

Ok for the people that can't simply read the Bible and clearly see who the tribes are and are going around like it's some big mystery.
Basically for the mentally retarded.

This man will break down who the tribes are and where they are now according to the Bible and "Scholar" books.

Most people don't have an attention span for this, so this post will be mostly for Israelites that want to know more.

I don't know how anyone is going to try to debunk this so far 5 pages and no one has been able to pick a part and debunk any of this.

All people have done is ask questions and yell "lair!" instead of coming with something to dis credit this.
So far the best "de-bunk" thrown out is "Your not a Biblical Scholar" which is pretty weak.
















[edit on 4-11-2009 by buds84]

Buds

It's patently obvious you don't have a single clue as to what you are talking about...if you did you would give straight answers to straight questions being posed to you by certain thinking persons on this thread instead of posting nonsensical video links that are so full of unhistorical misrepresentations as to be almost comical (if it weren't for the fact that there are actually persons on this thread who believe every other word of it !)

When dealing with the tribal amphyctionies of the Israelitish Tribelets, you CANNOT AVOID the patently obvious fact that there is not a SINGLE list of 12 tribes in which you can base anything like a coherent discussion.

As we've pointed out (and you and your idiotic links REFUSE to examine) the SONG OF DEBORAH mentions 12 tribes in the OLDEST HEBREW in the Bible, and YET...these tribelets do NOT match your list very closely.

What do you have to say of the ORIGINAL tribes of Meroz, or of Gilead or of Machir?

How do YOU explain the fact that Judah (Yehudah) and Shimeon (Simeon) and (Levi) are NOT mentioned in the SONG of DEBORAH in Judges chapter 5, which is, as we've stated before several times, the VERY EARLIEST KNOWN LIST of the 12 Tribes of benei Yisroel in the Bible...

If you or your jejune crowd of idiotic video posters do NOT know the answers to these issues, I suggest you go back to school, learn some PaleoHebrew, get deep into ANET (Pritchard's Ancient Near Eastern Texts) and LEARN SOME FACTS of the matter.

And soon, too...your idiocy is beginning to wear thin on the few scholars that are on this thread !

reply to post by buds84


Uhm. Hi. Howdy, there.

I'll happily admit not knowing an awful lot about you know, Uruguay or the like, but i'm very secure in my knowledge of Native Americans, particularly those of the southeast. I happen to be one of 'em, y'know.

I would still love to see how in the world you're figuring I'm from the tribe of Gad, while the Seminole are from the tribe of Reuben. I lack the patience to sit through seventy minutes of stuff to answer these questions when you can no doubt address them in something closer to five minutes.

Please, in your own words, convince me that not only am I a member of a lost israeli tribe, but also that my next-door neighbors (civilizationally speaking) are from a different tribe.

[edit on 4-11-2009 by TheWalkingFox]

Since some people seem to think a "Scholar"s approval is needed for conspiracy theories on a conspiracy forum, here is a Jewish Scholar explaining Khazar Jews.



The book "The Thirteenth Tribe".

The Jewish author and historian, Arthur
Koestler, also concludes that the majority of east European
Jews-and hence of world Jewry-is of Khazar and not of
Semitic origin. In the beginning of his book he states:

". . . the large majority of surviving Jews in the world is of
Eastern European-and thus perhaps mainly of
Khazar---origin. If so, this would mean that their ancestors
came not from the Jordan but from the Volga, not from
Canaan, but from the Caucasus; . . .and that genetically they
are more closely related to the Hun, Uigur and Magyar
tribes than to the seed of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob ''


This book can be found online:
Online ver: www.christusrex.org...
PDF e-Book : www.fantompowa.info...


This book also by Biblical Scholar:

Who is Esau-Edom?: The life, history, genealogy, prophecy, predestination and modern identity of the Biblical Esau:


Can be downloaded pdf e-Book here:
www.scribd.com...

If you are so called "white" I suggest you read this book to see where you came from down to the root.

Originally posted by TheWalkingFox
reply to post by buds84

 

I lack the patience to sit through seventy minutes of stuff to answer these questions when you can no doubt address them in something closer to five minutes.

Please, in your own words, convince me that not only am I a member of a lost israeli tribe, but also that my next-door neighbors (civilizationally speaking) are from a different tribe.

[edit on 4-11-2009 by TheWalkingFox]

If you can't sit and learn about where you came from for a few hours and need me to do it for you thats just sad.

Gen 49:19 Gad, a troop shall overcome him: but he shall overcome at the last.

Who defeated the Native Indians? The U.S Cavalry Troops.

Deu 33:20 And of Gad he said, Blessed be he that enlargeth Gad: he dwelleth as a lion, and teareth the arm with the crown of the head.

Deu 33:21 And he provided the first part for himself, because there, in a portion of the lawgiver, was he seated; and he came with the heads of the people, he executed the justice of the LORD, and his judgments with Israel.

This talks about the Lord blessing them with "enlargeth" = big country = north america when they were on the run.

"and teareth the arm with the crown of the head." = Blood brothers, Natives are known for this.

Gad dwells as a lion is relevant to the facial war paint markings, the Indians wore. As lions the hunted the herds of buffalo with swiftness of the roe deer. The crown upon is head symbolizes the feathered headdress worn by Chiefs.

1 Chronicles 5:18 :

The sons of Reuben, and the Gadites, and half the tribe of Manasseh, of valiant men, men able to bear buckler and sword, and to shoot with bow, and skilful in war, were four and forty thousand seven hundred and threescore, that went out to the war.

Sound familiar? I hope so...

The Native Indians gave the Euro's a hard time at war.
If their fate wasn't already sealed by God they would have kicked ass.

Jdg 20:38 Now there was an appointed sign between the men of Israel and the liers in wait, that they should make a great flame with smoke rise up out of the city.

Smoke signals.

Exo 36:19 And he made a covering for the tent of rams' skins dyed red, and a covering of badgers' skins above that.
Exo 36:20 And he made boards for the tabernacle of #tim wood, standing up.

Should sound familiar.

Exo 35:27 And the rulers brought onyx stones, and stones to be set, for the ephod, and for the breastplate;

ephod = Buffalo.

-Mr.Columbus traveled with Hebrew interpreters, Why?

Theres a few more but I suggest you start doing your own research stop being lazy and don't say this isn't enough proof you asked for a 5 min explanation.


[edit on 4-11-2009 by buds84]

Originally posted by buds84

Originally posted by TheWalkingFox
reply to post by buds84

 

I lack the patience to sit through seventy minutes of stuff to answer these questions when you can no doubt address them in something closer to five minutes.

Please, in your own words, convince me that not only am I a member of a lost israeli tribe, but also that my next-door neighbors (civilizationally speaking) are from a different tribe.

[edit on 4-11-2009 by TheWalkingFox]

If you can't sit and learn about where you came from for a few hours and need me to do it for you thats just sad.

No, I need neither you or your silly videos to figure out where I came from. I just wanted to hear the answer to a particular question regarding your claims, without having to sit through 65 minutes of filler for it.

Gen 49:19 Gad, a troop shall overcome him: but he shall overcome at the last.

Who defeated the Native Indians? The U.S Cavalry Troops.

Which indians? The Lakota were defeated by the 7th Cavalry, but the Nez Perce were eventually defeated by a conscript militia. The Choctaw, Cherokee, and Chickassaw were overcome by politicians and lawyers, while the creek were defeated mostly by the Cherokee and Choctaw. The Alaskan natives were never defeated in battle, just subjugated by politics. The Apaches weren't defeated by US troops, but rather by internal struggles and the occasional assault from Mexican forces and US "indian hunters". The Natchez kicked Hernando de Soto's butt, and then went almost extinct from Cholera. The Nassagarett indians were killed off my the Plymoth colony, in part by poison!

Deu 33:20 And of Gad he said, Blessed be he that enlargeth Gad: he dwelleth as a lion, and teareth the arm with the crown of the head.

Deu 33:21 And he provided the first part for himself, because there, in a portion of the lawgiver, was he seated; and he came with the heads of the people, he executed the justice of the LORD, and his judgments with Israel.

This talks about the Lord blessing them with "enlargeth" = big country = north america when they were on the run.

Except again, which indians are you talking about? Most of us didn't run around that much - the Lakota fled up into Canada, the Nez perce went from California to Idaho and back, and of course, lots of tribes got shipepd to Oklahoma, but I don't really figure that counts.

Gad dwells as a lion is relevant to the facial war paint markings, the Indians wore. As lions the hunted the herds of buffalo with swiftness of the roe deer. The crown upon is head symbolizes the feathered headdress worn by Chiefs.

Y'know, I have an interest in African wildlife. I hope to visit someday. I've looked at plenty of pictures of lions, but I can't remember many lions having black foreheads, red chins and white cheeks. Or horizontal stripes across their face. Much less any handprints in ochre yellow along their chests. There's not much that's leonine about Native war paints. You might have better luck looking at the Masaai for this one.

Hell, bonus points - the masaai practice circumcision!

1 Chronicles 5:18 :

The sons of Reuben, and the Gadites, and half the tribe of Manasseh, of valiant men, men able to bear buckler and sword, and to shoot with bow, and skilful in war, were four and forty thousand seven hundred and threescore, that went out to the war.

Sound familiar? I hope so...

The Native Indians gave the Euro's are hard time at war.
If their fate wasn't already sealed by God they would have kicked ass.

So, judging from your OP, that would be, the native Americans, the Seminole, and half of the Cubans? Well, here's the trouble. Those Cubans? They were named the Carib. First cousins to the Arawak that lived on Hispanola. They sucked at war. Something awful. They didn't have bows and arrows (they used bamboo lances) no shields, and the first thing one of hteir chiefs did when he saw a sword was grab it by the blade.

Unsurprisingly the Caribs were extinct within forty years. Disease and massacres took their toll. They didn't fight back - they comitted suicide very frequently though.

Moving north into the "Tribe of Gad".... Pretty much the same story, really. The Indians weren't very good soldiers. Any given indian could be a damn good fighter, but they had no concept of "military". War consisted of all the guys in one band rushing around, killing and whacking the guys from another band, then going home after an hour or two. A few days later that other band would do the same. it was tribal warfare, sort of like "Dude, i'm bored, let's all go pick a fight with the neighbors"

It wasn't until the late 1800's that the indians started getting hteir junk together and picked up some useful tactics from whitey. By then it was rather late. Though I do have a personal fantasy of what would have happened if Tecumseh, with his British military training, had actually succeeded in his endeavor to unite the tribes on the US' western frontier.

Jdg 20:38 Now there was an appointed sign between the men of Israel and the liers in wait, that they should make a great flame with smoke rise up out of the city.

Smoke signals.

Which were not used by the vast majority of natives, because htey didn't live in areas where the things would be useful.

Exo 36:19 And he made a covering for the tent of rams' skins dyed red, and a covering of badgers' skins above that.
Exo 36:20 And he made boards for the tabernacle of #tim wood, standing up.

Should sound familiar.

No, it doesn't. Rams? Tabernacles? #tim (acacia) wood?

Exo 35:27 And the rulers brought onyx stones, and stones to be set, for the ephod, and for the breastplate;

ephod = Buffalo.

an ephod is an article of clothing, man. It's like an apron / girdle thing. You can find images with a simple web search.

-Mr.Columbus traveled to Hebrew interpreters, Why?

Because he, like most Christians at the time, believed that the bible was a literal account, and that these people he'd met on the other side of the world must be lost Jews. it simply never crossed his mind that the people he met were there thousands and thousands of years before some penis-cutting desert-dwellers decided to give up a few extra gods and keep the crazy tree-hating, pillow-smiting one.

Theres a few more but I suggest you start doing your own research stop being lazy and don't say this isn't enough proof you asked for a 5 min explanation.

I've done lots of research. I'm deeply interested in my roots. I'm also deeply certain that you are either completely full of it, or have been horribly misled by others who are completely full of it.

Good day.

reply to post by TheWalkingFox


Yeah the ephod thing is wrong mistake on my part I was doing that off the top of my head.

But anyways you are so sad the way you degrade your own Indian culture, but whatever I already knew you wouldn't agree.

Were you looking for the Bible to tell you specific details?

Originally posted by TheWalkingFox

Y'know, I have an interest in African wildlife. I hope to visit someday. I've looked at plenty of pictures of lions, but I can't remember many lions having black foreheads, red chins and white cheeks. Or horizontal stripes across their face. Much less any handprints in ochre yellow along their chests. There's not much that's leonine about Native war paints. You might have better luck looking at the Masaai for this one.

Wow dude?
Yellow along their chests? horizontal stripes across their face? thats whiskers from a lion... oh man you are lost
Red chin? ever see a lion after he eats?
The feathered head dress gives the appearance of a lion furry head.
This was the Bible not National Geographic he wasn't going to give exact details but he did a pretty good job.
One of my best friends, an old timer Native here in Canada is one of the first people to tell me about the Israelites.

Anyways thats what happens when you get your information from the same people that took your land killed and enslaved you.

Christopher Columbus knew exactly who they were going after, but they won't tell you that in high school history books.

You won't make it.

[edit on 4-11-2009 by buds84]

Ok, this thread is one that is put here to incite outrage among people.

The TRUE Hebrew Israelites, are long dead and gone, there blood is mixed into many cultures thousands of years down the road.

Stop trying to proove something that is like a glass of soda, sitting in a bunch of melted ice cubes!

The world is a huge melting pot of everything.

Get over it already!

edit for boo boo

[edit on 4-11-2009 by Blanca Rose]

reply to post by EMPIRE


So you think that a big hand will come out of the sky?

reply to post by Lemon.Fresh


Possibly. I'd accept that moreso then him using Zionism and hatred to restore the people. I mean after all, he does have a history of leading the children of Israel doesn't he? Maybe he could lead them by a pillar of cloud during the day and a pillar of fire by night.