Originally posted by OhZone
reply to post by nixie_nox

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What drove climate change thousands of years past?

you need to be more specific, what global warming?

What is warming the other planets in the Solar System?

I will issue the usual standard response here. There is no proof the solar system is heating up. If people can't even agree things are heating up here, how do they decide temperatures are rising in places they don't even have a weather station for. Or even a thermometer.

Our trees are not dieing because of more CO2. They “eat” that stuff for a living.

Where are you getting this information from? Who said trees are dieing of CO2?
And there is more then one greenhouse gas to contend with. Why are people so focused on CO2?

It is the nefarious chemicals we are spraying everywhere that are killing them. (and us)

Thats possible. So those same chemicals can be hurting the atmosphere.

If the Gov. or anyone is taking the CO2 matter seriously why isn’t there a huge effort to plant more trees?

Its called arbor day.

I am a tree hugger. I weep for all the trees that die in the fires. It takes so long for them to grow.

That is very sweet. Some fires are meant to happen, others not. Can be a complicated subject.

I also love Rocks. Especially Red Granite Rocks. I have one that I brought from Wisconsin where I used to live, sitting on my table.

Ok, you lost me there. But I like red rocks too. Sedona is one of my favorite places.

The tax is not meant to help the climate in any way. It is a punishment levied on consumers who are adding to the wealth of the oil Barons. Looks kind of self-defeating from their point of view, but then I guess they must get a cut of that "tax" money. You know, government subsidy.

What taxes and how do they benefit oil companies? And if people would insist on stopping their rampant use of fossil fuels then the oil companies wouldn't be so rich.

Personally, I think it is just a gimmic to further destroy the American Middle Class.

That middle class can take the advantage and start new industries that would create a whole new class of imports and technology. It could work hugely in our benefit. As it is, because of our lack of progress, the chinese now have the upper hand on batteries for electric vehicles and are quickly advancing. When it should be us taking the lead on technology.

Another thing that could prove that “they” are totally serious would be to have a massive propaganda campaign to curtail population increase, since more humans will only add to the perceived problem which supposedly was corrected by using less fossil fuels by those already here. It should have been in place for at least 10 years. You see, they are not serious. They seem to like the blood bath and attendant miseries that wars bring better.

Or we could keep the population as it is and curtail our devastating use of any resource we can get our hands on. And stop being selfish.

The holes in the Ozone layer were caused from 2 things. One the aerial A-bomb “tests” done in the late 40’s and early 50’s; and two- Haarp burned and blew away a large section of the atmosphere in their “tests”. It looks to me like there is a concerted effort on the part of TPTB to destroy the Earth. And you wonder what happened to Mars?

Ok I am not touching that.

Is there any proof that Carbon reaches that high into the atmosphere?
It is heavy and sinks. You can’t check for yourself, so you must believe what “they” tell you. Lies, more lies. Can you think of the last time the governments or its agencies told you the truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth?

You keep saying "they" until you know who "they" are, how do you even come up with these conclusions? Guess what, carbon doesn't have to reach that high because the atmosphere really isn't even that thick.

Tossing garbage in the back yard? Yes, absolutely. I have a compost container. I put all decayable matter on or in the ground to decompose. We don’t burn, so cartons and most papers go to trash pick-up. Some newspapers and paper towels go into the compost.

ok.

1. There is not enough CO2 in the air to make any appreciable difference from the absorption/re-emission phenomena.
   
   
2. Global temperatures had been rising at that time with no definite indication of slowing. Now, a few years later, we are starting to see such an indication of a slowing/reversal trend.
   
   
3. The sea level had not yet been affected on anything approaching a significant level. Several years later, it still has not been affected on anything approaching a significant level.
   
   
4. The scientific community was split between those who believed the theories and those who did not. Today, the split has shifted, first toward believers, and now back toward deniers.
   
   
5. There were many instances where the data was questionable. Today, I have found several of those questionable areas of data collection to be more of an outright fraud.
   
   
6. Predictions were regularly exaggerated to extreme proportions.
   
   
7. Information was being presented in piecemeal form to the general population, regularly focusing on one particular fact (CO2 absorbs and re-emits heat) while ignoring other facts (at a rate of only 16% of the total heat available to it) which did not support the position being advanced.
   
   
8. As time went on, a great deal of money and effort was expended on destroying the integrity of the most vehement deniers, instead of trying to disprove their positions scientifically.

Lowering them to 150 (which are under natural levels) would stop plant growth.

The fact that WE are being ignored and trampled under the profit motivated industrialist system is only being blame on 'US' because 'they' ( those who's banks we just bailed out, AGAIN!) refuse to give up their control mechanism called capitalism.

"control mechanism called capitalism" PLEASE use the correct term.

This transformation was the result of organized plans developed by a group of highly powerful – though unelected – financial and industrial executives who wanted to drastically change agricultural practices in the US to better serve their collective corporate financial agenda. This group, called the Committee for Economic Development, was officially established in 1942 as a sister organization to the Council on Foreign Relations. CED has influenced US domestic policies in much the same way that the CFR has influenced the nation's foreign policies.

Composed of chief executive officers and chairmen from the federal reserve, the banking industry, private equity firms, insurance companies, railroads, information technology firms, publishing companies, pharmaceutical companies, the oil and automotive industries, meat packing companies, retailers... Source

Originally posted by TheRedneck
reply to post by GenLo
You, on the other hand, talked to your friends and family, made conclusions based on information from listening to others, and came out with a conclusion that all Conspiracists and Christians are Global Warming deniers. I present it here that, based on the tone of your OP, your mind was already made up; the desire to verify was little more than a cover story to let you back out gracefully while you berated those who disagreed with you.

First of all I never stated any conclusions that "Conspiracists" and Christians are Global Warming deniers, you on the other hand keep insisting in your statements that I had typed my OP this way. Please quote me!

Originally posted by GenLo
I have always known that global warming was a real issue that we face in the wake of our global population and pollution but why the doubt? First time I was met with such doubt came from religious family members and friends. I heard things similar to the affect that, "All natural resources are renewable.", "The idea of global warming goes against God.", etc. Being a spiritual atheist I could only find these answers typical until in later 2005 early 2006 when I entered the realm of conspiracies I began to hear that this was just another conspiracy. For some reason its quite typical a response in the conspiracy network that global warming is just an engine for the NWO to use to power in tyrannical taxes on the global population. I do disagree still as I have yet to see any evidence that these levels of global warming, even influenced by the human element, is indeed a natural occurring event that is simply being blown out of proportion.

Originally posted by GenLo
However, I do believe that the conspiracy is half right and that the high elite are using it as an excuse to press there thumbs down on the common man.

Originally posted by GenLo
And as coincidence theorists or Christian why not change your ways anyway?

Excuses? I haven't even started with excuses yet! Hey let me ask you though, what were you doing at my age and younger? Muddin? Drinkin some beer? Haven a good ole time? Sorry that was inappropriate of me.

Its as if you would like to (or that you do) believe that I enjoy the idea of Global Warming just so I can have something to blab about, but I would rather believe that Global Warming were just a cooked up dish to serve the masses because then HEY, that's some stress off of my mind!

And what you think of my little trip to Japan as being nothing more than a youth hardy experience of self-indulgence

Other than that I am still open to the possibility of the whole thing being a hoax, its like what some of you xtians say about your relationship with your savior, better to keep it around as insurance in case your wrong because if you are, well then no harm done. However, being wrong about global warming could have some pretty dire consequences.

You got me to here feeling like while typing.

Originally posted by crimvelvet
We have not had capitalism in this country since the barter system was abandoned. What we have is Corporatocracy or Corpocracy and the bankers/corporations who are in control want to KILL Capitalism.

Capitalism typically refers to an economic and social system in which the means of production (also known as capital) are privately controlled; labor, goods and capital are traded in a market; profits are distributed to owners or invested in new technologies and industries; and wages are paid to labor.

en.wikipedia.org...

The last thing they want is fair competition (capitalism).

They want "socialism" controlled by the them so they can kill all other competition through over regulation so they can become extremely wealthy and we become state controlled serfs.

It is actually Neo-Feudalism under the guise of the "Politically Correct term" Socialism.

The HACCP and the Food Safety Con Job The Global warming Hoax and The Federal Reserve Rip off are a few of the scams cooked up by these men behind the curtain to force laws that put more wealth (from YOUR labor) into THIER pockets.

It happens every autumn: midtown Manhattan becomes the motorcade capital of the world. Each foreign leader in town has a convoy of vehicles. Some of them, like President Obama's motorcade, are 20-to-30 vehicles in length. It's so long - it seems that when the front of it reaches the U.N., the back end is still back at his hotel.

Exacerbating the annual exercise in diplomatic gridlock are police actions, blocking intersections and closing streets for security to facilitate motorcade movements. It renders countless other vehicles immobile while waiting for motorcades to pass, their engines idling but still blowing exhaust into the midtown air

Does it undermine the goal of the climate change summit and cause the pledges of environmental concern to ring hollow?

Asked about it, White House climate change negotiator Todd Sterns had a suggestion.

"I think the U.N. should make a pledge to electric vehicle motorcades within five years," he said.

Right. As soon as all U.N. diplomats pay their parking tickets.