Concluding that 9/11 is a Government Conspiracy is Grotesque

Originally posted by Orion7911

Yet you STILL have yet to show any evidence to support your CLAIM that 9/11 conspiracy theories are foolish without merit and false.

Simple answer?

The REAL experts, those with the proof of their expertise in their c.v., think that your 9/11 CTs are stupid and without merit.

So believe in the CT all you like, but without the evidence that convinces these experts, you will never get your new investigation, since the courts will listen to their opinion over those ofjones, griffin, gage, etc.

Originally posted by Joey Canoli

Originally posted by billybob

merely your opinion. thousands of experts disagree with you.
there is evidence of controlled demolition.

1-Name these expets.

2- provide their c.v. that proves their expertise.

no.
you'll have them all killed.
haha.

but, really, it is not necessary. there are MILLIONS of people who believe it was a total inside job. certainly, the statistics will easily show that thousands of these people are expert in at least one field related to 911.

any of the more outspoken experts are demonised by your division's (fairly effective) propaganda tactics. some of these more outspoken 'truther' experts are probably plants setting up giant red herrings and strawmen. some are just excited researchers with tunnel vision. i would say most are honest seekers of truth and justice and the long dead 'american way'.

i know the truth. and so do millions. and, despite the brazen lie that the truth movement is dying, the truth movement is gaining new members everyday, and losing very few to your 'power of persuasion' salesmen techniques.
regardless of the inane official media storyline, the truth will always be the truth. the truth will always be fuzzy, but it is a lot clearer than the web of lies.

reply to post by smurfy


And she isnt the first, nor will she be the last, person who has died this way. Accidents DO happen. I do take note that the APFN post had a glaring falsehood or two as well.

Originally posted by billybob

Originally posted by Joey Canoli

Originally posted by billybob

merely your opinion. thousands of experts disagree with you.
there is evidence of controlled demolition.

1-Name these expets.

2- provide their c.v. that proves their expertise.

no.
you'll have them all killed.
haha.

but, really, it is not necessary. there are MILLIONS of people who believe it was a total inside job. certainly, the statistics will easily show that thousands of these people are expert in at least one field related to 911.

And so there it is. Assumption used as a driving point behind the 9/11 conspiracy theories. Not a single ounce of 'truth' behind the 'truthers'. Its all speculation based upon theories that contradict rational reasoning and facts.

Congrats. You just proved another observation.

Originally posted by billybob
I know the truth. and so do millions. and, despite the brazen lie that the truth movement is dying, the truth movement is gaining new members everyday, and losing very few to your 'power of persuasion' salesmen techniques.
regardless of the inane official media storyline, the truth will always be the truth. the truth will always be fuzzy, but it is a lot clearer than the web of lies.

I am afraid 'truth' left you along time ago.

[edit on 6-9-2009 by Pathos]

Originally posted by billybob

the statistics will easily show that thousands of these people are expert in at least one field related to 911.

It's quite telling that you are unable to name some of them.

What you need are specialists on your side. Guys from the CTBUH, for instance.

To give a comparison, you need a heart specialist to fix a heart valve, and the TM cites the opinions of general surgeons (SE's), cancer researchers (fired physicist Jones), plastic surgeons (gage), and others that have no medical degree at all (griffin, hufschmid,etc) as proof that the herat valve specialist is wrong about the procedure needed.

bsbray even brought up the USS MAine as an example ofhow specialists/real experts can be wrong. But this doesn't help your case at all. Cuz what happened when they were brought new evidence???? They changed their consensus. That's what real experts will do if you can bring them new evidence that is convincing.

This brings home the fact that the TM has zero compelling evidence.

reply to post by Joey Canoli


i didn't say i couldn't, lol at you. i just said it was unnecessary. but just 'cause i enjoy throwing egg on the face of people like you......

here's some links to people who not only are expert and "truther's", but bravely publish their names...

someone conveniently collected inks to the more famous published ones (the ones you are pretending to either not know about, or to have demonised with typical debunking holding your hands over your ears and stomping your feet going "LA LA LA LA LA, i can't hear you)....

patriotsquestion911.com...

that's almost 2000 right there, and that's only in america. the whole world is watching.

[edit on 6-9-2009 by billybob]

reply to post by Pathos


HAHAHA! you guys are pathotic in your smear campaign. yes, i purposely mispelt the word. it amuses me.
how's phobos, BTW?

[edit on 6-9-2009 by billybob]

For those interested, I found this video which I never saw before, first you see the fast forward played official released pentagon footage, but after that you see some footage from a different point of view in where I see clearly some sort of flame like spot/point moving fast in the direction of the pentagon and right after that the explosion appeared.
You can also see cars riding, but that is not a car in my opinion.
Sorely not a Boeing 757.



I am curious in other opinions, so if you want, watch it and give your opinion about it.

Thanks in advance.

Then another video with very interesting footage of witnesses who tell their stories what they experienced at the scene.
Listen to what is said on CNN live about for instance the pentagon case at 0:37

Originally posted by dragonridr

Originally posted by billybob


like the explosions that are visible far below the collapse front. the "squibs".

Just this one statement tells me you know nothing of demolitions and are merely parroting back what you read on a 911 site. Lets get technical what explosives were used? It couldn't have been a squib how was it wired where was the detonator. How did they get it into the wall? Before you try to pretend you understand demolitions take the time to at least learn the basics. I have demolitions training and trust me thats not a blast caused by explosives.In a building with that design the holes would have made lines from the blast almost like a crack. Do you even have a clue how hard it is to fracture a steal beam with explosives!This is why demolition companies weaken a structure and aloow gravity to bend the beam.

[edit on 9/6/09 by dragonridr]

Have No Fear, the Captain is here...

So wait a sec... let me get this straight... Are you telling us its your belief that there are no demolition squibs and the collapses weren't CDs?

Isn't it Obvious?

You aren't related to pathos by any chance are you?




[edit on 6-9-2009 by CaptainObviousNIN11]

Originally posted by billybob
patriotsquestion911.com...

that's almost 2000 right there, and that's only in america. the whole world is watching.

[edit on 6-9-2009 by billybob]

I've been a doubter, but now that I've seen the name of such a staunch supporter of the U.S. Government as Hugo Chavez – President of Venezuela- on the list, well... now you've got my attention. I'm quite certain that the unbiased Mr. Chavez would never put his name on a document that undermined the U.S. unless he was convinced of a conspiracy. You can stop twisting my arm; it must be true!

reply to post by questioningall

But I have a question for the OP...

Okay, so Im not the OP but.....

Have you EVER looked Deeply into the evidence of 911?

Yes, I have.

Or are you just taking a stand "saying how dare anyone think - the U.S. govt. did 911'?

Nope.

Have you ever looked at building 7?

Yes I have, from multiple angles. I find it curious how many members of the Truth movement want to take certain statements from the FDNY (out of context I might add) and use them to support them on certain issues (bombs), but yet, they completely disregard the FDNY about WTC7. In addition, its also curious how people state that WTC7 "fell into its own footprint", when its collapse damaged surrounding buildings. Also, they gloss over the fact that the majority of the facade of the north side of WTC7 ended up draped over the top of the debris pile. This indicates that the south side of the building failed first and for lack of a wordy, lengthy explanation, pulled the north side down.

Have you ever listened to reports of bombs going off all around inside the WTC?

Yes, Ive read quite a few of the reports about explosions that sounded like bombs going off. I have also know that in large office building fires, there are almost always explosions for various reasons...severed gas lines, oxygen tanks in medical storage, any compressed liquid, etc... Explosions do NOT always mean bombs. In a couple notable examples, members of the FDNY whose accounts were taken out of context to make it seem they were talking about bombs, these firefighters are quite p*ssed that truthers are using their words that way.

Have you ever looked into the facts - the security dogs had been called off a few weeks before 9/11?

For a few weeks over the summer of 2001, the PAPD had had EXTRA security dogs onsite at the WTC. It is those dogs that were returned to their normal duties. The dogs normally assigned to the WTC complex were there that day. Google "Sirius" or David Lim.

Have you ever watched the videos carefully of the buildings coming down?

Yes. Ive also read the transcripts of the NYPD aerial units that were reporting buckling of the buildings and expressing the view that from what they were seeing the buildings were going to collapse. In addition, the phone calls from people trapped inside the towers to the police in which they describe floors that had already collapsed inside the building. Also, the gentleman that was on the phone when the collapse happened....no explosions, just the sounds of the floors collapsing.

Have you ever considered how Cheney had the military stand down - though they knew a plane was heading towards Washington?

Except for one glaring fact, the military NEVER stood down.

Have you ever looked at the evidence of the Pentegon bombing?

You mean the evidence that shows it was a Boeing 757, wearing the colors of American Airlines, that hit the Pentagon? Yes I have looked at it.

I have spent days/weeks/months looking into the evidence - because my first thought was like yours - when I first heard something about "9/11 being an inside job

Then you might want to examine the sources you have been using and how they have been edited. Because if you have truly looked at the evidence with an open mind...then you wouldnt be calling yourself a "truther"

reply to post by Kikanbo


You know what i find funny truthers cant even figure out which theory they like the best.There was no plane or there was a cruise missile fired no wait it was a military jet that fired missiles. Then theres always it was a remote controlled passenger jet or cgi or any other weird theory people can come up with whenever the facts disprove something.Don't worry when facts get in the way simply change the variables. The only thing i cant figure out is who's life is so pathetic they spend hundreds of hours pouring through a government report to find an error when i have never seen a government report that didn't have errors.All you prove is the government cant manage to get there act together wow real shocker there.

Originally posted by billybob

here's some links to people who not only are expert and "truther's", but bravely publish their names...

And where are their c.v.'s that indicate expert status on anything?

Nowhere in sight.

Where are the papers that will be used to convince members of CTBUH, ASCE, etc?

Nowhere in sight.

Why not, if they're experts?

reply to post by waypastvne


HAHA! you guys are cracking me up, today. out of a list of over two thousand names, you pick chavez to characterize the list.
LOL!
BTW, didn't chavez give free fuel oil to needy americans during the cold winter months, when america was simply ignoring the plights of these poor? wow. what an evil man.

reply to post by billybob


So, a question. On the page that came up when I clicked on your link, it says Col. Donn de Grand-Pre was added June 7th, 2009. I find this interesting since he died January 24, 2009.

looks like another job for Captain obvious

Originally posted by dragonridr
I have no doubt terrorists attacked the world trade center

of course good sir, thats pretty darn Obvious now aint it?

The real question is which terrorists do you think did it?

The Terrorists with boxcutters from caves on the other side of the world?

Or the Terrorists from a pentagram shaped building that control the most powerful nation and sophisticated military tech on earth thats funded by TRILLIONS of dollars,,, Who by the way had one of the biggest motives to create a false flag black op to facilitate an endless war for power, oil and the protection of Israel.

Now really, do you need the captain to point out how obvious the answer is?

Originally posted by dragonridr
i just wonder who was in the background pulling the strings?

isn't it obvious?

Originally posted by dragonridr
Id think its unlikely the CIA would knowingly support the attack,

its more than obvious you don't really know very much about the CIA or its history.

Originally posted by dragonridr
but i sometimes wonder if they had an operation blow up in there face and there actions had unintended consequences.

and isnt it obvious this operation was called 9/11?

oh by the way, do demolition trainees have grammar problems? Just curious because its kinda obvious they might.

Originally posted by Light soul

Pathos, Are you a disinformation agent or are you just another blind idiot?

Isn't it Obvious it might be alittle bit of both???

Originally posted by Light soul
Open up your eyes and your mind and go and do some research.

I think its obvious it hasn't, at all, whatsoever, nor ever will.

Originally posted by Light soul
When 911 first happened, i was so angry and i thought that it had been done by Terrorists.

well yes, but you just didn't realize the terrorists were from within. It became obvious once the evidence snowballed and was examined closely.

Originally posted by Light soul
After 6 years of solid research i now have no doubt in my mind that 911 was an inside job that was carried out by the US Government.
911 WAS AN INSIDE JOB! Hopefully the truth will be revealed one day.

I'm sure its obvious to anyone who does solid research my friend.

Originally posted by PathosI am not sure if some of you get off on this debate. I do not understand how a person could blame a sitting US President for killing 2,000+ of his own citizens. I find it revolting, grotesque, and freakish.

I almost stopped reading the rest after I got to that part.

The thought that a "leader" of a country could do something like that is what scares you and makes you think there just can't possibly be any truth in what "truthers" say.

That's the whole point. Something soo messed up and crazy that it simply can't be true, when in reality it is.

There's no possible way a leader/president could do that to their own people? You know anything about history at all? You might want to refrain from calling people ignorant or saying there's something wrong with them.

Oh and you asked "What would they gain?"



You realize you can be considered a terrorist if a 9/11 DVD or other material is found in your home? Not just conspiracy related stuff, even tribute related material can be used to make you look like a terrorist.

Look at how the USA has turned to *crap* since 9-11 while TPTB have done nothing but gained power and ask that question again. Look at Afghanistan and Iraq and how much money TPTB have made off them.

Even Bush had said explosives were used by operatives to help bring the buildings down. And I don't want to hear anyone saying "oh that was just Bush and his bad use of English" or "Oh he was reading of a teleprompter and got it all wrong". BS. He clearly said that operatives used explosives to bring the buildings down.

Do I need to mention how often Rumsfeld has slipped up and said a missle hit the Pentagon and not a plane?

How about the firemen, police officers and other witnesses who heard all the explosions going off before the buildings even fell?

I could go on and on, but it's more than obvious you've never done an ounce of research into it at all. So why even bother? You just too scared to believe a government could actually do something like this to it's own people when history should tell you otherwise.



[edit on 6-9-2009 by nightmare_david]

[edit on 6-9-2009 by nightmare_david]

Originally posted by Silcone Synapse
Pathos,just as an insight into your character,could you describe to us how you would feel if you came to the conclusion the Government were involved in 911?

Would it be fair to say that it would shatter your belief in the government,and cause you much pain and stress?

The way you fail to adress the obvious flaws in the official story suggest to me that you are suffering from some kind of psychological denial of even the possibility of Government involvement.

Sort of like how abused children cut out memories of abuse,as it is just too horrible for thier young minds to comprehend.

The human brain has a way of shutting off that which it feels may destabilise its equilibrium-I think you may be suffering from such a predicament.

Once,just once will you tell us all:

How the pools of MOLTEN steel came to be at ground zero?

How did Al quaeda made NORAD stand down?

They are just 2 points of hundreds,which if you look at rationally should lead you to question the official story.
I bet you cannot adress these points with logic,as I believe part of your brain just could not cope with what it would find to be in total opposition with your much cherished official story"security blanket."


Some here think you are a paid up disinfo agent,working for TPTB.

I do not think that is the case,I just think you are unable to handle the thought of your benevolent Government killing its own people,which in fact it has been doing since at least the beginning of the 20th century.
You said you base your opinion on 300 years of American history-I suggest you re read the last 100years or so.

I feel sory for you,but I am also a little envious of someone who believes their government could never kill its own for political or commercial agenda.
I must be a nice world you think you are living in.

Obviously one of the best posts I've seen in this thread. I wish it were more obvious to pathos. But that may be the problem here. Pathos is in denial and can't believe something so obvious could ever be pulled off especially by his own government. Pathos is obviously living in a fantasy world where his ego and delusion are safe.

Originally posted by hisshadow
Even Dan Rather, notes, that the buildings fall with the same action as a controlled demolition

www.youtube.com...


It isn't that hard to notice.

pretty obvious isn't it?

I mean really!? the evidence for CD and many other areas is overwhelming.