'I wouldn't be here if not for the NHS': Stephen Hawking defends UK's 'Orwellian' healthcare a

'I wouldn't be here if not for the NHS': Stephen Hawking defends UK's 'Orwellian' healthcare after attack by U.S. politicians

www.dailymail.co.uk

Professor Stephen Hawking has spoken out in defence of the NHS after high-level U.S. politicians have branded the National Health Service 'evil' and 'Orwellian'.
The British professor, who has suffered from Lou Gehrig's disease for 40 years, insisted that he 'would not be here' were it not for the NHS.

He spoke after an editorial in Investor's Business Daily, a national financial newspaper in the U.S. that also runs articles by columnists on the Left and the Right, launched a misinformed att

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I wasn't going to make this thread but I decided to because I don't know enough of how the UK works in this matter however I would like to know more and what other people's opinions are.

I've always like stephen hawking, his books were the first books i've ever purchased while in high school.

So he does hold some weight to me.

Please enlighten me dear ATS members!

www.dailymail.co.uk
(visit the link for the full news article)

I've lived in the UK for almost 5 years. The NHS is far from perfect, however if I am sick I go to the doctor despite my financial situation. When I have gone to the doctor I have been treated well, listened to and have been given top notch care.

I lived in the US for almost 30 years. I went to the doctor when I had insurance and could afford the co pay. I got treated when my HMO said it was ok, not my doctor. When I didn't have insurance, I didn't go to the doctor. As a result I had a condition which did not get treated, got worse and eventually caused quite a bit of problems. Then when I could afford insurance again, it wasn't covered as it was deemed to be "pre exsisitng".

That's my personal experience.

Do not get me started on nhs.

Enough said.

reply to post by ModernAcademia


I will try to enlighten you.

I am a fan of Healthcare Reform, but I don't like this particular bill (or any of the dozen versions of it, we don't even know for certain which one we are debating!), for the same reason I don't like the Flu Vaccine. It is rushed, it is overkill, and it is not properly vetted and debated. A well thought out Healthcare Reform plan is needed, but there is surely a simpler and more mutually beneficial way to do it. I really don't want it ran like the Post Office, DMV, IRS, FDA, or the Fed!

Additionally, I am also a Stephen Hawking fan, but I don't believe his opinions hold weight in every forum. His Science, Physics, and Astronomy is second to none, but I won't ask him how to tile my bathroom, or stitch a wound!

I see people ascribing opinions of our "Accepted Geniuses" to many unrelated topics. Stephen Hawkings opinion on Healthcare is no better than Rosie O'Donnells opinion on Astronomy, or Dr. Gupta's opinion on Fashion!

Hope that helps!

reply to post by getreadyalready

but I don't believe his opinions hold weight in every forum

The fact that he is the beneficiary of healthcare through the NHS would in my opinion lend weight to his input on healthcare through the NHS.

I really don't see what everyones problem is with this national healthcare. If you don't want it, go private. If you don't like the cheaper medication, then again, go private and get yourself the best. I've never had any problem with the NHS.

I used to work for the NHS in a London hospital. But that's not why I'm defending it.

Why is the NHS Orwellian?

What happens in the USA with a condition such as the one Stephen Hawking has ?

Does private insurance exclude such an illness ? Or limit treatment for a certain period or to a maximum financial total ?

I suppose one measure of the success of healthcare is in life expectancy. And the US isn't doing particularly well if you consider the stats, nation number 32 in the life expectancy charts the last time I checked, just behind Cuba. I think most if not all of those nations above the US have socialised healthcare, which must mean something ...

Originally posted by Merigold
reply to post by getreadyalready

 

but I don't believe his opinions hold weight in every forum

The fact that he is the beneficiary of healthcare through the NHS would in my opinion lend weight to his input on healthcare through the NHS.

There are many many beneficiaries of National Healthcare from Canada, France and others. Their opinions are varied. There are as many horror stories as there are success stories. This can be expected.

The name "Stephen Hawking" was not picked randomly. Many will ascribe a higher level of authority because of his work in other fields. This is what I was addressing. Sure, his personal experience is noteworthy, but no more so than Joe Blow that went through the same system!

Originally posted by System
I really don't see what everyones problem is with this national healthcare. If you don't want it, go private. If you don't like the cheaper medication, then again, go private and get yourself the best. I've never had any problem with the NHS.

I still have to pay for it. Regardless of whether or not I want it.

THAT is why it's horsesh**.

I wouldn't be alive if it wasn't for the NHS. The system is not perfect, but everyone I know who has been treated under the NHS, has been pleased with the service. we actually spend less per head than the US on health and have longer lives as a result.

If you think Stephen Hawking receives the same level of care as the rest of the people in the UK under NHS, I have some beachfront property in Arizona I would like to sell you.

reply to post by Double Eights


The NHS was created in the late 1940's, it's paid for by taxes from our wages. It doesn't really hurt me to pay those taxes because I've never known any other system !

And you can't miss what you've never had.

If you balance out a socialised system against private insurance, employer insurance & public programmes such as Medicare ... wouldn't a socialised system for "Mr Average" come out less expensive ?

reply to post by Double Eights


You have to pay for a myriad of things with your taxes that you may or may not want, many of them completely criminal, overpriced and completely unjustified.

People, especially Americans from my experience, don't bring up these things but will still give out stink about the idea of free healthcare for everyone.. Simply because they feel others don't deserve it and don't want to pay for them.

Get over it.. It won't make a difference to your taxes, get your respective governments to stop blowing up countries or wasting that money on stupid investments and use THAT money for free healthcare to ensure all its citizens are happy and healthy.

IMO, the big "Anti healthcare" reform ideal is a remnant of cold war 'pro excessive capitalism, anti anything with the word social or commune in it" conditioning. Guess what.. the excessive capitalism thing doesn't work with healthcare.. Everyone taking their cut from development to hospital so in the end it costs 100x more than it should for you to get your tonsils checked by an overworked and overpaid, depressed, prescription drug addicted doctor.

BTW, if this system comes in, you can always go and get private healthcare if you want to fork out tens of thousands to get a cast on your arm.

Also, for the record, I don't fall into the category of people in my country who qualify for free healthcare so no point in calling me a commie.

Not surprising that the larger part of the scare tactics being used to typify the care as substandard are complete fabrications. I can't believe that Grassly had the temerity to make the statement characterizing the system as one that wouldn't care for the elderly. If you read the comments after the article it's remarkable how many are aghast at the number of people in the US that have no access to health care.

I think Stephen Hawkings illness gives him a great insight in to how the NHS works and should have the right to speak out if he feels he should.

In my opinon the NHS is one of the greatest institutions we British have created, its not perfect and it still needs some fixing, but to me this is what being a civilized society means, giving its people the resources of a healthcare system that should be for everyone, not just the rich.

What I find strange is the stance that some Americans have taken, they have a constitution granting them their freedoms of speech, their freedom to bare arms but not a freedom to healthcare, surely this should be on the forefront of your liberties and freedoms that you all talk about.

reply to post by System


It's in quotes because this is part and parcel of the anti-health care reform rhetoric coming from the republican leaders here in the US, not because it is in any way Orwellian.

Initially I used to think Mr Hawking was a smart dude. Until I read one of his books, than I realized he is little more than a mouthpiece for the mainstream science establishment.

His ideas about the Universe are outdated and archaic, so I am totally not surprised by his statements on this issue.

I also agree that he most likely got far better treatment than the average joe, I mean come on every doctor would be drooling and begging for his autograph.

No, I am sorry, hes no Carl Sagan or Michio Kaku. He never came off as being a brilliant guy to me, ever. Just an average physicist with too much time on his hands.

He is rarely open to new or different ideas, he is always so caught up in his own ideas that he does not even consider other points of view.

Ya as you can see, I would argue with the guy all night about most everything.

I see Carl Sagan or Michio Kaku as open minded scientists who are willing to consider many variables. And I see Stephen Hawking as a closed minded scientist who will only consider his own opinion and ignore anything that conflicts with it.

reply to post by Kurokage


When is the last time you think he used the system?

Maybe it saved his life 20 or 30 years ago. Has he used it in the las 10 or 15 years?

Doubtful. He has enough money to pay for any doctor in the world. His opinion on it is dated.

When I had my first tooth I fell off a highchair and put it through my tongue.

About 4 years ago I had an absyss in which the teeth were removed at hospital.

About 3 years ago I had ingrown tonails on both feet.

2 Years ago I wrecked my finger.

Last year I had my appendix out, barely before it burst.

About 8 years ago I had a stitch put into the back of my head.


Those were all NHS.

In private care (Which I ONLY can get because my dads work provides FREE private care.)

I have had a varicose (I think thats right?) vein sorted in my lower area.

I have had Supra Ventricular Tachychardia diagnosed and am having an operation to get it sorted in two weeks.

Now without my dads work funding that private healthcare, we would not have been able to afford it. And if it wasn't for the NHS neither would have ever been treated and I would have had to live with the issues they brought up. This is of course avoiding the hundreds of doctors visits I make, and will make in the near future. (Seriosuly even the doctors at hospital comment on the frequency of my visits) So I have no problem when I start paying the taxes, and personally if you don't like it, all you have to think is my money may have just saved the life of a newborn child. If you arn't okay paying them then, well I don't know what to say.

One of my next visits after my SVT is sorted is back problems....so another serious one...and I'm only 17