Britain has 85 sharia courts: The astonishing spread of the Islamic justice behind closed doors

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posted on Jul, 17 2009 @ 06:54 AM
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Originally posted by symmetricAvenger
reply to post by Laurauk
 


and putting everyone in the same box is a joke.

More so when you do not understand the laws of the land....

We have Muslims in the army.... I am sorry but I know the LAW because i study it

do you?

and let me ask you a question... have you ever watch one parliamentary proceeding ?

Simple Question... I would like a response be for you slag me off



If you study law then you must have heard of lex naturalis [Nature Law] wich have exercised a profound influence on the development of English common law.. Do you think Sharia goes through the test and trials of lex naturalis? like positive law?
Another thing Burqa's in Afghanistan are a trend from the latest decades, in the 50's they didn't wore those things, women were quiet modern [non-fundamental]and lived peacefully back then

[edit on 17-7-2009 by Foppezao]




posted on Jul, 17 2009 @ 06:59 AM
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Originally posted by teapot

Originally posted by masonwatcher

Originally posted by teapot
reply to post by masonwatcher
 


And don't forget the birth of rock an roll and the advent or invention of the 'teenager'.

New markets to exploit!

It's all just wage slavery and utter subjugation of the masses.

However, the rights of the female in western society have, for whatever reason and by whomever, been fought for and won.

We have not been 'allowed' to have equality! What kind of patronising paternalistic tripe is that?

If the west becomes more and more 'islamisised', through the back door of silent invasion and use of sharia to deal with 'domestic' issues, all such rights will be eroded until they no longer exist and the west, male and female, will be the poorer for it.



you are not a feminist and you don't know what you are talking about. I, however, am a Muslim, a blackman, a feminist and proud. I bet you didn't know a man could a feminist though, did you?

Feminism is a human rights issue, not a gender specific movement.

Your comment about Islam is just stereotypical Islam baiting.

[edit on 123131p://pm3114 by masonwatcher]


Have I hit a nerve? Is that what prompted your personal attack upon me?

The fact remains, the west is seeing mass influx via immigration and increased birth rates of Moslems from all over the world.

Our hard won freedoms (humanist, gender has no real role in the eternal struggle for liberty from control by the self selected elites) are being used to further the demands of Islam, namely that Islam become the world dominant religion.

Are you a member of Nation of Islam? I was once advised by these that moslem men revere their women! And that this is why they (women) must 'cover up'! Is that why they not only have to have complete control of the female, but somehow, the female is responsible for male sexual desire and activity? Has islam not heard of testostorone?



What hit a nerve was that I thought you were making a serious discourse on the issue of woman's rights. I take it seriously because is more than just Western woman's concerns and involves the lives of women around the world.

Your animousity of Islam is such that there is no possibility of conversation. Muslim people are dying at the hands of Americans by the thousands for no other reasons than the resources under their feet and the interest of the pirate state israel. In the meantime creatures like you dissect the religion of these victims for your amusement and point scoring. You are in fact a soulless creature that goes through the motions of being concerned about women's rights when you are actually in favour of death.



posted on Jul, 17 2009 @ 07:02 AM
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Originally posted by masonwatcher
Muslim people are dying at the hands of Americans by the thousands for no other reasons than the resources under their feet and the interest of the pirate state israel.

Muslim people are dying at the hands of Muslims by the thousands for no other reasons then thuggery and that certain muslims don't worship allah the same way as other muslims.


List of Muslim Attacks

(not to mention all the other innocent people who are butchered by the fundamentalists in the 'religion of peace'. )

[edit on 7/17/2009 by FlyersFan]



posted on Jul, 17 2009 @ 07:05 AM
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reply to post by Foppezao
 


and this is not 50 years ago...

50 years ago we just about had the NHS?

The problem is that people wont accept that people Today are allowed to practice any faith under the LAW but the LAW also states they can not put FAITH be for the LAW but they are free to be accommodated it by it.

You see the con is this

Sharia courts, yes they are but the only thing the rule on is marriage, and its Voluntary...

If a woman is FORCED its ILLEGAL... No woman needs to be FORCED in to anything

this is not France.. were you are FORCED to take off something that is PIC "politicaly in correct" just because business are scared of being called "anti islamic or anti christian" and for some time it did get very silly...

But as was stated you can not ware a full head gear in public school in England, because its not right... for education reasons

but in some cases then why not? why stop someone waring it if that is the faith of the person in question? we do not stop hindus or jews or christans waring a thing they wish too

Do you know why? because of FEAR ommg we cant see them they are going to blow us UP!!!

ect... i just think this type of talk does not help people of all faiths get on and be happy with each other...

the world must try to get a long no matter what god you pray too..

and our laws are not perfect but we try.. and that is a good thing

blaming and pointing out flaws in each others faith is pointless.. why?

because people end up killing each other over it....

that is why we have the LAW to deal with ALL people regardless of faith..



posted on Jul, 17 2009 @ 07:07 AM
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reply to post by FlyersFan
 


This is very ture.. More Muslims have died at the hands of radicals than westoners aka christans.

Its a shame really


and you are also correct there is not one version of Islam




gave you a star



posted on Jul, 17 2009 @ 08:34 AM
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Originally posted by FlyersFan

Originally posted by masonwatcher
Muslim people are dying at the hands of Americans by the thousands for no other reasons than the resources under their feet and the interest of the pirate state israel.

Muslim people are dying at the hands of Muslims by the thousands for no other reasons then thuggery and that certain muslims don't worship allah the same way as other muslims.


List of Muslim Attacks

(not to mention all the other innocent people who are butchered by the fundamentalists in the 'religion of peace'. )

[edit on 7/17/2009 by FlyersFan]


Another falacious argument. Here is a statement for you; more westerners die at the hands of Westerners than die at the hands of extremists.


Western Wars en.wikipedia.org...



posted on Jul, 17 2009 @ 08:36 AM
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Originally posted by symmetricAvenger
reply to post by FlyersFan
 


This is very ture.. More Muslims have died at the hands of radicals than westoners aka christans.

Its a shame really


and you are also correct there is not one version of Islam




gave you a star


Don't let sophistry and illogical fallacies deceive you.



posted on Jul, 17 2009 @ 08:42 AM
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reply to post by symmetricAvenger
 


As I have previously responded to your commens at the beginning of this thread, I tiold you I had. Oh and show me where I have slagged you off. as you put it? I am not getting into this childish tittle tattle.

If you or any other member cannot handle someones opinions, without having to resort to calling somone racist, bigot, feminist or which ever some choose to use. Just shows the mentality of some members in this thread.



posted on Jul, 17 2009 @ 09:22 AM
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reply to post by symmetricAvenger
 


All need to listen to this member. Unlike most, they come from a place of reason and logic, not unsubstantiated beliefs, tangible only to what is portrayed in mass media.

As for this whole situation. Why do you care? Do you feel a sense of loss? A sense of loss over your heritage, control, say in what goes on in your country or how it is run? I tell you what. You dont have a say already.



posted on Jul, 17 2009 @ 12:14 PM
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reply to post by Toughiv
 


Logic and Reason


This statement by Cleric symmetricAvenger shows just what logic and reason he operates by.

www.abovetopsecret.com...


are they not laws that are above man? but yet man makes his own in order to try to understand his own being?


Laws above man, separate from the laws made by man. Religious beliefs claiming a status above the laws of man without logic or reason for those claims. It is the worst kind of faith that aims to put the claims made by the pharisees/clerics as being law without debate, without the consent of the people governed, and without the application of logic or reason.



posted on Jul, 17 2009 @ 12:40 PM
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reply to post by Laurauk
 


Im sorry but as I stated I did give you kudos on one of your posts? I have respected your point of view?



posted on Jul, 17 2009 @ 12:41 PM
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reply to post by poet1b
 


Yeah and i do not trust any bible
so my logic is not flawed is it?

Just because I say the tree is the same as you would i be wrong? both are life correct?



posted on Jul, 17 2009 @ 12:42 PM
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Originally posted by masonwatcher
Another falacious argument.

wrong. it's just the truth.

You sit there and whine about 'how many muslims were ALLEGEDLY killed at the hands of Americans. I gave proof that MANY MORE muslims have been killed by Muslims ... simply through muslim thuggery and because certain muslims don't think other muslims pray to allah correctly.

Facts. Cold hard facts.



posted on Jul, 17 2009 @ 12:43 PM
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Originally posted by symmetricAvenger
reply to post by SR
 


your my proof



lol

let me ask you this smart one.. what made you?

do you argue that you was not born? will you argue that you will die?

are they not laws that are above man? but yet man makes his own in order to try to understand his own being?

i find that crazy for a start

you all pray to the same thing

your very understanding of being created in the first place

stupid


does a tree ask why it is a tree? i think not..

that is the problem

we argue over being created when the fact is we was?

kind of a no brainier don't you think.



[edit on 7-7-2009 by symmetricAvenger]


Full statement



posted on Jul, 17 2009 @ 12:56 PM
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reply to post by symmetricAvenger
 


I am not attacking you or anything. Lets get that clear. I am just making a general comment on how fromthe start. This thread has went downhill. It is spiralling into one of the rudest and most digusting threads in ATS. I no longer want a part in it.

When there was civil debate yes it as fine. But now this thread needs to go to the gray area.

I have respect for your opinions system oks.



posted on Jul, 17 2009 @ 01:13 PM
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reply to post by symmetricAvenger
 


You continue to claim that these Sharia courts are voluntary, but unless there are processes put into place that guarantees these agreements are voluntary, these religious based courts should not be allowed to exist.

In the U.S. we have a separation of religion and state, which would make any attempts of a religious sect to start holing its own courts, under some abuse of arbitration laws, unconstitutional. If Brittan has laws establishing a separation of religion and state, then that should make these Sharia courts, trying to operate under the guise of arbitration, illegal.

Schools have dress codes, and in fact all public places have dress codes.

You can bet that if some Christian sect started sending their girls to school dressed in Nuns habits, school dress codes would be quickly changed to eliminate the practice, as they should be.

As gang problems have become more and more of a problem in the U.S., laws have been written to restrict what people can wear to eliminate gangs from establishing themselves. When a religion starts to act like a gang, as we see with Islam, then laws should be written to restrict their dress to establish their territory.

You shouldn't be allowed to walk around naked, and you shouldn't be allowed to walk around covered from head to toe.

It is well documented how men succeed in controlling women, dominating every aspect of their lives through intimidation and fear. Forcing women to wear a burqa is just another way of keeping them locked away from the outside world.

In Islam we see an entire religion dedicated to the domination of women through intimidation, fear, and violence. Why should we allow such a religion to create its own courts in divorce when it is obvious that the only purpose of such courts is to put another wall between the women, who are trapped inside of this oppressive environment of extremist Islam, from the free world.

Control of their women is central to the plan is Islamic extremists to conquer the world. They force their women to become baby machines in a world that is already over populated, so that they can raise their numerous sons with their extremist beliefs. Then as they out breed the host countries, they take over those countries and impose their extremist religion.

These Islamic extremists aim to create isolated communities in the countries where they migrate, which increases their control over their women, like they were sheep. By pushing outsiders out of the areas where they establish themselves, they are able to hide their activities from everyone else, and by establishing their own courts, keep their women from even getting an opportunity to see what rights are available to them outside of the Muslim community.

These posters who continue to deny what is obvious to anyone who is paying attention are only here to serve their own purposed, which is to hide the truth.

This post on this thread paints the picture clearly.

www.abovetopsecret.com...


-Once a school begins to have a large amount of muslims rules start to change drasticly. ie, litle muslim boys terrorize litle girls for not wearing the robe. You have litle muslim boys calling adult woman prostitutes because where they come from the woman is inferior.


If that isn't gang style activity, what is? Either you wear my colors or I will terrorize you.

European nations would be foolish not to start creating laws to end this type of gang activity.



posted on Jul, 17 2009 @ 01:28 PM
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reply to post by symmetricAvenger
 



Just because I say the tree is the same as you would i be wrong? both are life correct?


What are you saying? You can't tell the difference between a man and a tree?

Everything is the same, and yet everything is different.

This statement here in your full quote is where you really step outside of logic, and show that you choose to allow your religious beliefs to control your thinking, instead of logic and reason.


we argue over being created when the fact is we was?

kind of a no brainier don't you think.


You buy into the belief that we were created, as opposed to evolving, when all evidence demonstrates evolution is the most likely reason we exist.

Your insistence that creationism is fact beyond dispute, a no brainer, demonstrates that you turned off your ability to evaluate things with logic and reason long ago. Or more accurately, you were never allowed to develop logic and reason, being indoctrinated into a religious belief system since you were a child.



posted on Jul, 17 2009 @ 01:52 PM
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reply to post by poet1b
 


so what about Mormons?

you can NOT have more than one wife in the UK... im sorry but this is not the united states of America.





posted on Jul, 17 2009 @ 01:58 PM
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reply to post by poet1b
 





What are you saying? You can't tell the difference between a man and a tree?


no? You said this was the basic of my logic and I stated that a tree is alive and so is a human?

every human is the same regardless of what god you wish to hold your hand

Im very happy being here... i care not for god? why should i?

If any faith removes the freedom of people under that law of were you are based on history and other factors then i would be more than happy to pack my bags and leave..

the one reason i would never live in the united states is the gun laws... any cracker can shoot me? no thanks..

would i like to live any place like Afghanistan? not a chance.. but they do not have a choice to escape.

The law in the UK does not make ANY "court" that uses faith LAW why?

because people would be getting stoned and getting heads chopped off just the same if people are evangelical christens would have not gay marrige and call them sinners

thal shall not judge ? i think people who put god in the name are

Hypercritical

no wonder the world is going to pots... nutty god lovers



posted on Jul, 17 2009 @ 02:04 PM
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reply to post by poet1b
 





You buy into the belief that we were created, as opposed to evolving, when all evidence demonstrates evolution is the most likely reason we exist.


No i think you lack the understanding of what i think.

let my show you why

to make something is creation as it did not exist be for this would also include evolution.

If i make a cup of coffee i created it
by my actions if the universe created man.. you was still created

people miss understand basic words like creation and auto aromatically think of GOD...

why is that? because most people are brainwashed twits like Scientology..

both are stupid...

and the reason i say that is because YOU DID NOT MAKE THE UNIVERSE IT MADE YOU i find it 1 arrogant and 2 pathetic to think you know half the things you think you know....

the world was flat... why? he was looking at his feet... so please do not tell me what I think or what I side with...





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