Black people 'less intelligent' scientist claims

Ummm here in America we have a black president whom I consider exceptionally intelligent. And IMO is more eloquent than any other person I've come across, be it white Asian etc.

I'm Jewish btw so I'm smarter than all of you bahahaha jk


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Ummm here in America we have a black president whom I consider exceptionally intelligent. And IMO is more eloquent than any other person I've come across, be it white Asian etc.

I'm Jewish btw so I'm smarter than all of you bahahaha jk


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The difference between average black and average white IQ has been known since the beginning of IQ testing early in the 20th century. It has remained fairly constant at one standard deviation or around 15 points. It is not a result of test bias. Some early IQ tests contained questions that favored white middle class children's life experiences over black and other races but none do so today. The results remain the same no matter what type of IQ tests are given, even on tests that use no words. The best explanation is a genetic difference. We can accept that blacks may have larger packages and be better at most sports but try and present evidence there is also a genetic tendency towards lower IQ and the S really does HTF. If average black IQ really is 85 the implications are huge and far reaching. I learned of this discrepancy in an upper level psych course on Learning in the mid-1970s while earning my BS in Psychology. My professor was a good liberal but also a real scientist. When we as class asked him, "What does it mean?", he answered honestly, "I don't know".

Originally posted by thehumbleone
Ummm here in America we have a black president whom I consider exceptionally intelligent. And IMO is more eloquent than any other person I've come across, be it white Asian etc.

I'm Jewish btw so I'm smarter than all of you bahahaha jk

So your shining example of an intellectual black person is our president?

I have a laundry list of other people I would have chosen,,,,,,,, I also didn't know that belonging to a certain religion brings you into a discussion about racial differences, unless you want to admit to everyone you consider Jewish as a race......

Originally posted by hotpinkurinalmint
I would not go so far as to say one race of people is somehow genetically more intelligent than another, but common sense tells us that talents and achievement have not been equally distributed across the globe and across different ethnic groups. This can be due to genetics, but can also be due to culture or envirnomental factors. Here are some examples.

For one reason or another, Black people seem to dominate certain sports like Sprinting and Basketball. Sure there are some fast non-Black people or good basketball players that are not Black, but if you watch the Olympics or the NBA, sprinting and basketball are dominated by Black people. I cannot say whether this is due to genetics, environment, social conditions, culture, or a combination of these factors. Nevertheless, the phenomenon is clearly present.

For one reason or another, Asian American Students students outperform other students. Sure you can find an Asian student with poor test scores, and non-Asian students who have excellent test scores, but on average, Asian students get the best test scores. Again, this can be genetics, it can be culture, it can be envirnoment, or a mixture of all these factors. Nevertheless, Asian students do better than non-Asian students.

This is a nuclear topic. Number typically don't lie, but people do intentionally or not. Any study showing black people are less intelligent could have an underlining racist bias skewing the results, as in tests on topics not learned by the individuals. There have been many studies showing different levels of intelligence, but it all depends on how intelligence is being defined. From my own experience, I believe that all people have equal potential intellectually and all that's needed is focused training. Due to genetic and/or hormonal traits, apart from actual intelligence, mental focus is the challenge and not intelligence. Some black people, just like white people, may have heightened hormone driven urges directly affecting the person's list of priorities. If a man has a strong sex drive, education is not at the top of his list and neither are the lessons associated with education like self-control and rational thinking over emotionally driven actions which I think are needed to achieve higher learning and demonstrate higher intelligence. I emphasize the word demonstrate. This does not mean his mental capacity is any different than anyone else. On general, from my own observations where I live, black men naturally tend to be more physically fit without much exercise. I have a black friend, of many, who didn't work out one bit growing up and he was in amazing physical form compared to myself and I was in sports, so obviously there are differences biologically. Was my friend any less intelligent, definitely not! But his priorities were different than mine. He was very interested in girls starting from a young age, while I was less interested until a much later age. This aspect apart from actual intelligence skews intelligence studies as the tests don't reflect the person's ability to learn, if focused, which I think is a better estimate of intelligence.

Are black people bigger than white people?

However Chinese have the largest brain size, whites next, and blacks smallest.


I remember a picture of the four Beatles holding the fingers of Little Richards Huge Hand.
This photo isnt it. But look at the size of his head.

Reply to post by jheated5

If you haven't noticed by now many people who come from Jewish origins will still call themselves Jews even if they do not follow th Jewish religion. That's all I'm saying.

And the previous 2 millenniums have show that many societies around the world have considered Jewish people as being "different", hence the numerous expulsions the Jewish people have suffered throughout the ages.


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Ok, I'm seeing WAY too much ignorance in this thread... so I'm going to Deny it RIGHT NOW...



A. Intelligence is not knowledge, and knowledge is not intelligence.

Knowledge is the possession of sets of facts, and data that form a partial understanding of a topic.

Intelligence is the ability to preform problem solving, and comprehend knowledge in a wider context.


Therefore, having "Street Smarts" is not a form of intelligence, it is a form of knowledge and experience.

Similarly, Having the ability to manipulate people socially is not a form of intelligence either, it is knowledge and experience.

These two words, Intelligence and Knowledge are NOT interchangeable, as people in this thread would like to believe.

Knowledge:
1. Information and skills acquired through experience or education.
2. What is known in a particular field or in total; facts and information

Intelligence
1. The ability to acquire and apply knowledge and skills.
2. the ability to comprehend; to understand and profit from experience

The two words are NOT interchangeable, they have definite meanings, and are not synonyms.


B. Intelligence *IS* Genetic.

Your capacity for abstract understanding *IS* determined by your Genetics.

See Also; every animal that does not understand fire.

How many animals do you know of that posses the awareness, and comprehension abilities of humans?

What's that? None?

Okay then.

C. We TOTALLY know what intelligence is.

IT is not subjective, it is not "A Mystery", it is not "Hotly Debated" by anyone that actually has the capacity to understand what they are talking about.

Intelligence

D. There is NO SUCH THING as "Multiple Intelligences"

This "Conjecture" was put forward by a psychologist QUACK, and has been THOROUGHLY refuted by the scientific community.

en.wikipedia.org...

One major criticism of the theory is that it is ad hoc: that Gardner is not expanding the definition of the word "intelligence"; rather, he denies the existence of intelligence as traditionally understood and instead uses the word "intelligence" whenever other people have traditionally used words like "ability". This practice has been criticized by Robert J. Sternberg (1983, 1991), Eysenck (1994), and Scarr (1985)

Ultimately, it would certainly be desirable to have an algorithm for the selection of an intelligence, such that any trained researcher could determine whether a candidate's intelligence met the appropriate criteria. At present, however, it must be admitted that the selection (or rejection) of a candidate's intelligence is reminiscent more of an artistic judgment than of a scientific assessment. (Gardner, Frames of Mind: The Theory of Multiple Intelligences, 1985)

"To date there have been no published studies that offer evidence of the validity of the multiple intelligences. In 1994 Sternberg reported finding no empirical studies. In 2000 Allix reported finding no empirical validating studies, and at that time Gardner and Connell conceded that there was "little hard evidence for MI theory" (2000, p. 292). In 2004 Sternberg and Grigerenko stated that there were no validating studies for multiple intelligences, and in 2004 Gardner asserted that he would be "delighted were such evidence to accrue" (p. 214), and he admitted that "MI theory has few enthusiasts among psychometricians or others of a traditional psychological background" because they require "psychometric or experimental evidence that allows one to prove the existence of the several intelligences" (2004, p. 214)." (Waterhouse, 2006a, p. 208).

So all of your thoughts on "Social Intelligence", or "Body Kinaesthetic Intelligence" (I'm serious... kicking a ball is called a type of "Intelligence" by this moron) IS PLAIN WRONG.

E. Intelligence is not "Socially Derived"

One cannot become "More Intelligent" by studying hard, or having a good upbringing.

What CAN happen, is taking crappy IQ tests that were put together by people that do not understand the difference between knowledge and intelligence.

Most IQ tests nowadays use Raven's progressive matrices, that do not rely on any previous knowledge or social "Situation" because they are a "Match the picture" type tests.....

Here is an example:

[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/b6f18de09126.gif[/atsimg]

[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/eb77d80149e1.gif[/atsimg]

These *ARE* intelligence tests, because it tests how QUICKLY you can predict the next pattern.

There is no "Cultural" or "Knowledge" based skill-set here... there is nothing you can learn (with the exception of the ANSWERS TO THE TEST) that would help you preform better.

There is no "Environment" that you could be raised in that would assist you in ANY CAPACITY with these types of tests.

Because they TEST your INTELLIGENCE, which is HOW QUICKLY AND COMPLETELY YOU UNDERSTAND THINGS, AND SOLVE PROBLEMS.


There... now that you have all been ENLIGHTENED as to WHAT intelligence IS, and what it is NOT, I expect this thread to be slightly more Civil in it's discourse.

P.S. Do *NOT* reply to me if you did not read THIS

P.S.S. Do *NOT* argue with me about this either, because the previous link will explain to you, in DETAIL why I am right.

P.S.S.S. If you DO respond to me, arguing that intelligence is "More mysterious", or "Subjective", or "We don't know it" then I *WILL NOT RESPOND TO YOU* because you do not comprehend the subject matter.

There... I feel better now.

In summary: Intelligence; It's Real, It's Objective, It's Genetic, and this debate was over 15 years ago.

Welcome to two thousand and eleven.

Science doesn't lie. Couple that with my experiences, and yes, I am in agreement with the premise of this thread. However, IQ is such a small part of what makes up someones personality. People are judged on much more than IQ.

Sure being intelligent helps. But how well can you relay your knowledge to others? Just because you have a high IQ, doesn't mean you rate well analyticaly, with logic, common sense, good judgement, high morality, are personable, have qualities of empathy, courteousness, determination, objectivity in career/life, compassion, desire to help others, or even have a solid work ethic, and ability to co-exist well with others. Doesn't make you a better husband, wife, mother or father.

Some of the most depressing, boring, anti-social, unhappy people I know are the most intelligent. Doesn't affect how you rate as a human being. I will say it is interesting though, and if accepted by the public, and studied, could have very large implications.

reply to post by ErtaiNaGia


Why couldn't you practice visual IQ tests to learn how to speed up your recognition of shapes and patterns? This is utterly ridiculous

reply to post by addygrace

Why couldn't you practice visual IQ tests to learn how to speed up your recognition of shapes and patterns? This is utterly ridiculous

Because determining the next pattern in the series requires thinking.

And it is THINKING that is being tested, not "Shape Recognition"

try again.

reply to post by MysticPearl

Science doesn't lie. Couple that with my experiences, and yes, I am in agreement with the premise of this thread. However, IQ is such a small part of what makes up someones personality. People are judged on much more than IQ.

IT's so very nice to see someone attack a position that was never held.

This is known as a straw man argument.

You are essentially saying that those who agree with Intelligence as a THING, are saying that Intelligence is the ONLY thing of value in human existence.

And this is not the case.... nice job attacking phantom bogey men though....

Sure being intelligent helps.

Intelligence keeps you alive.

Can you say the same for all of the other qualifiers that you seem to stress as more important than intelligence?

The development of agriculture was one of them.... the recognition of the pattern of plant seed dispersion, and new plant growth.

This keeps you alive, you know.... as well as the industrial agriculture system, the transportation systems that bring the food to your local store.... the petrochemical refineries, the oil rigs, etcetera.

These all keep you alive.

The reason that we can even HAVE such a number of population that we do now is a fact that is owed EXCLUSIVELY to the fruits of the labours of intelligence.

But how well can you relay your knowledge to others?

Well, I guess that all depends upon how Intelligent they are.

You may fancy yourself a brilliant socially skilled person... but how well can you explain the concept of arithmetic to a baboon?

Just because you have a high IQ, doesn't mean you rate well analyticaly, with logic

Actually, Yes it does.

Analytical and Logical thinking are the precise things that IQ tests... well.... TEST for.

common sense, good judgement, high morality, are personable, have qualities of empathy, courteousness, determination, objectivity in career/life, compassion, desire to help others, or even have a solid work ethic, and ability to co-exist well with others. Doesn't make you a better husband, wife, mother or father.

Of course not.... and what;'s more... noone ever claimed that this was the case.

You seem to not like intelligence, as you appear to be attacking it's very existence.

Why is that, I wonder?

That you would set up intelligence as some sort of Dues Ex Machina, that comprises the totality of human values and virtues, and then attack the absurdity of your own statement, as if to claim victory over people who never held such ludicrous claims as you yourself have set forth for them.

Some of the most depressing, boring, anti-social, unhappy people I know are the most intelligent.

Hey... you would be depressed too, if everyone around you constantly talked about things that you considered beneath your intellectual capacities.

Spend all of your time, from birth till now, conversing SOLELY with the mentally handicapped, hear them wax poetic about what the BEST shape is... whether it is a triangle or square, hear them define the Greatest colour in the world... Green, red, or purple.

Hear them put forth their arguments, ad nausium, that the REASON that green is the best colour, is because it is their favourite.

Do this your entire life, and THEN tell me who is depressed and anti-social.

The people with the BEST "Social Skills" are the ones who have the most intellectual peers.

The smarter you get, the less people you have to talk to.

Because people who are dumber than you BORE you, and they don't UNDERSTAND what YOU like to talk about.

I swear... the world must look like rainbows and unicorn farts, when you don't understand a single [snip] bit of it.

There is another scientist who claimed that (a local one from Quebec)

The Quebec College of Physicians has suspended and fined a psychiatrist and radio host who once told listeners blacks have low IQs.

Pierre Mailloux was suspended from his profession Friday as a psychiatrist for a period of two years and ordered to pay fines totalling $33,000 for racially charged statements that drew the ire of regulators.

Link

I think .. it is absurd to say such a thing
in every nationality .. some are very intelligent and others arent
but have other habilities to compensate
in my world .. EVERYONE is egual .. INTELLIGENT OR NOT

reply to post by ErtaiNaGia


Maybe people of lesser intelligence should celebrate the fact. You have demonstrated that that higher intelligence is certainly not one of the more desirable human qualities.

Enough intelligence is certainly helpful for survival but the superiority complex of those who over rate their own intelligence is tantamount to suicidal because people do not fair well in isolation and nobody likes a smart arse.

reply to post by Threegirls

You have demonstrated that that higher intelligence is certainly not one of the more desirable human qualities.

You must have missed the part where Intelligence keeps you alive.

Also, are you attacking intelligence, by attacking... *ME?*

Really?

So, because I don't subscribe to the ignorance that you seem to swim in as a matter of course... Suddenly, Intelligence is not desirable... right?

Why do you hate intelligence?

Or are you talking about the difficulties that intelligent people have, relating to the masses of mouth breathing idiots that comprise "Society"?

Yeah... being SMART is the bad thing... not that most people are Idiots... no, of COURSE not!

Let's all lobotomise ourselves so that we'll all be happy, and Dead.

Enough intelligence is certainly helpful for survival but the superiority complex of those who over rate their own intelligence is tantamount to suicidal because people do not fair well in isolation and nobody likes a smart arse.

I find your Anti-Intellectual-Elitism somewhat reminiscent of a superiority complex.

As if to say, that being Stupid is a desirable trait.

You make-a me laugh.

And "Over Rating" intelligence is not what is going on here.

Unless you believe sincerely that no-one is more intelligent than anyone else... which is as ignorant a statement as there ever was.

Let me break this down for you.

Intelligent people have difficulty "Blending-In" with normal society, because normal society HATES people who are intelligent, because their EGO cannot allow them to accept the fact that there are people who are more intelligent than them, and that Intelligence is the most USEFUL trait for survival in the entire world.

So, your insults about intelligence, contrary to your intention to make smart people FEEL BAD about being smart, are actually a compliment, that you desire intelligence so much, and have such jealousy of the capacity, that you dare not even allow yourself to acknowledge this desire in yourself, and instead seek only to destroy those with the capacity that keeps you ALIVE.

So, yeah... congratulations on your deficiencies.

Spend all of your time, from birth till now, conversing SOLELY with the mentally handicapped, hear them wax poetic about what the BEST shape is... whether it is a triangle or square, hear them define the Greatest colour in the world... Green, red, or purple Hear them put forth their arguments, ad nausium, that the REASON that green is the best colour, is because it is their favourite Do this your entire life, and THEN tell me who is depressed and anti-social The people with the BEST "Social Skills" are the ones who have the most intellectual peers. The smarter you get, the less people you have to talk to. Because people who are dumber than you BORE you, and they don't UNDERSTAND what YOU like to talk about I swear... the world must look like rainbows and unicorn farts, when you don't understand a single snip] bit of it.

reply to post by ErtaiNaGia


THAT is the story of my life!

I have to dumb myself down, not be myself, just to interact with my family.

You get sick and tired of limiting yourself and your capabilities in order to not offend peoples sensabilities and make them feel dumb.

I remember having a conversation about science with my fiancee, a forensic psychologist, who started to cry because "i made her feel stupid."

Therefore you get stuck in a world that forces you to limit yourself, not being able to grow or expand because morons get upset if you do..

I do not do that anymore.

I am a human being too!

reply to post by ErtaiNaGia


I am neither attacking you nor intelligence. This is evident because your posts do not display intelligence, meaning you do not come across as having much intelligence. This was shown by your inability to understand what I wrote. Understanding is a determining factor in intelligence.

I state that highly intelligent individuals do not necessarily have a survival advantage due to social exclusion. Over rating ones own intelligence is very common in intelligent people, but does not signify higher level of intelligence, you are an example of this.

Again not an attack, simply stating the argument which you make apparent.

reply to post by Threegirls

I am neither attacking you nor intelligence. This is evident because your posts do not display intelligence, meaning you do not come across as having much intelligence. This was shown by your inability to understand what I wrote. Understanding is a determining factor in intelligence.

Your lack of comprehension of the very things that you wrote is still on display, if you would like me to reiterate the specific nature of your failure to comprehend WHAT you actually wrote:

What You Wrote:
Maybe people of lesser intelligence should celebrate the fact. You have demonstrated that that higher intelligence is certainly not one of the more desirable human qualities.

This is you attacking intelligence, by claiming that it is a detriment.

What you Wrote:
Enough intelligence is certainly helpful for survival but the superiority complex of those who over rate their own intelligence is tantamount to suicidal because people do not fair well in isolation and nobody likes a smart arse.

This is you attacking me, by stating that I am a smart arse.

So, that's the specific nature of your lack of comprehension of the very words that you committed to this board.

I state that highly intelligent individuals do not necessarily have a survival advantage due to social exclusion.

And yet your entire social SYSTEM relies upon the intelligence of those who can keep this system running, so that you have the free time to do such things as devote the majority of your time to talking about meaningless trivialities to other people of a like intelligence (word used loosely of course) as yourself.

Over rating ones own intelligence is very common in intelligent people,

Are you meaning to say that I believe that I am smarter than I actually am, because I am smart?

Or that thinking that I am smarter than you is a fallacy, because all people are equally intelligent?

What exactly do you mean by "Over Rating ones own intelligence"?

Because I think I am exactly as smart as I am.

but does not signify higher level of intelligence.

So, you are stating that me being smarter than you, is not an example of me being smarter than you?

Or are you stating that people who are intelligent commonly believe that they are intelligent, which means that they are not intelligent?

Clearly, you have a misconception of the meanings of the words that you pretend to understand.

Again not an attack, simply stating the argument which you make apparent.

And since you have yet to actually specify the exact nature of your meaning (which I surmise is merely an insult to my intelligence, or to me personally) would you be so kind as to spell out, in plain, layman's terms, EXACTLY what concept it is that you are attempting, and yet failing, to get across?

reply to post by ErtaiNaGia


Furthermore:

This is evident because your posts do not display intelligence,

meaning you do not come across as having much intelligence.

This is an example of reiteration, where you express the exact same opinion twice, in rapid sucession, because you apparently failed to understand that both phrasings carry the exact same meaning.

This is evidence of a lack of intelligence, and also the attempt to make oneself sound more intelligent than they actually are, by stretching out their meaning over more words and phrases than are strictly nessecary.

Thus, an indicator of low intelligence.

In addition to this:

Over rating ones own intelligence is very common in intelligent people

So, in one breath, you claim that they are not as intelligent as they believe themselves to be, and that this is a common occurrence in people who are more intelligent than average or normal.

This is an example of projection, in which YOUR lack of intelligence is placed on display as THE focal point and motivation for your posts in this thread.

You take an intelligence that is greater than yours as a direct threat, and so you seek to attack those who poses intelligence that is greater than yours by saying that they "Over rate their own intelligence", when in fact, the only over rating that is being done (to use your meaning for the term) is that of you, and your "Intelligence"

but does not signify higher level of intelligence.

And thus, we come full circle to the tragic truth of the matter.

You are AWARE that your false belief in your own heightened intelligence is incorrect, and you understand that your pretentiousness does not actually make you any smarter than you actually ARE, and so, unable to reconcile your ego with reality, you lash out at people who ARE smarter than you, because they posess that which you do not.

So, to calm your fragile sense of self worth, you rail against intelligence, by stating that it is unnecessary:

Maybe people of lesser intelligence should celebrate the fact.

By subconsciously AGREEING that people of lesser intelligence actually HATE people with intelligence greater than their own:

I state that highly intelligent individuals do not necessarily have a survival advantage due to social exclusion.

and by railing against ME, as some form of AVATAR for intelligence in general:

and nobody likes a smart arse.

I am neither attacking you nor intelligence. This is evident because your posts do not display intelligence, meaning you do not come across as having much intelligence.

So, as you can clearly see, your comprehension of the ideas and concepts that you are toying with in the form of these symbolic words are clearly beyond your mental faculties, and yet you continue to attempt to "Win" an argument that you don't have a hope of realizing that you already lost, due to incompetence.

I do hope that this will be the LAST of our correspondence in this fashion,

Thank you, and have a nice day.

reply to post by ErtaiNaGia


Ok, just for you. Intelligence is not one of the more desirable human traits. This means that some other traits are more desirable and more 'important', as stated by others in previous posts.

Intelligence though useful for survival is not absolutely necessary. A baboon cannot learn mathematics but is perfectly able to survive.

Our society is not run by the most clever people, it is run by people who are ruthless and lacking in other desirable qualities.

I was not calling you a smart arse, I said that those who 'believe' themselves to have 'superior' intelligence are shunned because nobody likes a smart arse. If you put yourself into this category then you call yourself a smart arse. Although I see no evidence of you being a person who has a higher intellectual ability, this is by no means an insult, as I do not believe such to be the most desirable human trait.

I doubt that socially isolated super intelligent people will fare too well if society was to radically change in the near future. They will be even more dependent on the larger population.

I repeat myself to increase the chance that you will understand my comments as you have completely misunderstood what I have been trying to convey and twisting my words in an attempt to display a hatred which does not exist