Black people 'less intelligent' scientist claims

reply to post by Threegirls

Ok, just for you. Intelligence is not one of the more desirable human traits.

I disagree, as does your dependency on intelligence to continue to exist.

This means that some other traits are more desirable, as stated by others in previous posts.

More desirable TO WHOM, FOR WHAT?

Intelligence though useful for survival is not absolutely necessary. A baboon cannot learn mathematics but is perfectly able to survive.

This is true, but there are not 6.5 billion baboons on the planet, now are there?

The sheer weight of human population is sustained, day by day, on the continued operation of this VAST industrial society that is the product of intelligence.

If we became less intelligent than we are now, most of us would starve.... that includes you.

Our society is not run by the most clever people, it is run by people who are ruthless and lacking in other desirable qualities.

Yes, this is true, and considering the collapse of the Western Economies, what does that tell you about the necessities of intelligence?

What does that tell you about how people VOTE for representatives in governments, and the implications that people HATE those with intelligence, thus assuring that those who LACK intelligence ultimately CONTROL society?

I was not calling you a smart arse,

Quite right, you were heavily implying it though.

I said that those who 'believe' themselves to have 'superior' intelligence are shunned because nobody likes a smart arse.

Nope, this is false on two different levels.

1. People who ARE intelligent are shunned because of jealousy of the majority of the population, which you unconsciously admitted here:

I state that highly intelligent individuals do not necessarily have a survival advantage due to social exclusion.

Exclusion is what is DONE TO people, not what people do to themselves.

2. Your false belief (which springs from your ego) that people who believe themselves to be intelligent, are not actually intelligent.

And this is your attempt to justify your own Ego-Centric hatred of people who are smarter than you, by claiming that intelligent people are only PRETENDING to be intelligent to get attention, which ironically, is what YOU are doing.

If you put yourself into this category then you call yourself a smart arse.

I never put myself in the category of "Smart Arse", that was your implication, not mine.

In addition to this, your juxtaposition of "Being intelligent" and "Being a smart arse" is actually bordering on the pathetic.

You don't know how to argue, do you?

Although I see no evidence of you being a person who has a higher intellectual ability,

No, you DO see the evidence, you merely refuse to admit it because it might hurt your ego, and then you would have to admit that you were wrong....

Something that those with low intelligence, rarely, if ever, do.

this is by no means an insult,

Implying that I am a smart arse is actually, despite what you may believe that you believe; an insult.

as I do not believe such to be the most desirable human trait.

Desirable to WHOM, for WHAT?

We don't have intelligence because we desire it, we have intelligence because we *NEED* it.

Or are you attempting to move this conversation in a more sexual direction? (predictably)

I doubt that socially isolated super intelligent people will fare too well if society was to radically change in the near future. They will be even more dependent on the larger population.

Please explain your premise, and be specific... this is for posterity.

How would intelligent people be MORE dependant upon "The larger population" if society was to "Radically Change" in the near future.

In addition to this, please explain the exact nature of this "Radical Change" that you are hinting at in a completely vague and non-specific way, as if to claim knowledge of all possible futures.

Give examples.

I repeat myself to increase the chance that you will understand my comments as you have completely misunderstood what I have been trying to convey and twisting my words in an attempt to display a hatred which does not exist

You have not actually been trying to convey anything, actually, you are merely stating in as complex a way as you possibly can:

INTELLIGENCE IS BAD!!!!

There is nothing to understand.

I doubt that socially isolated super intelligent people will fare too well if society was to radically change in the near future. They will be even more dependent on the larger population.

reply to post by Threegirls


You are correct and it takes real interlect to acknowledge this.

I found this out at an early age where I was forced to dumb myself down in various social settings in order to survive them e.g. school, the army, marriage, university, the workplace and having the ability to pick and choose the battlefields I wished to fight on in order to determine my course in all of those spheres.

However on a personal level it comes at a cost, because you are constantly forced to limit your capabilities in order to fit in however with insight you can use it to your advantage.

Your limiting yourself, gaining and nurturing friendships, winning respect and loyalty, acceptance, allows you to eventually show yourself , not losing friends but garnering more respect from your social circle with people celebrating their friends intelect and making use of it for their benifit too, thus making you indespensable.

Patience therefore is the true test of intelligence, because impatience leads to rejection, isolation, exclusion and lower survivabilty.

I'm interested to know what a black scientist thinks about all of this?

All people are intelligent. The level of intelligence one has is the subject of debate. I have stated many times that to have more intelligence than most other people is not necessarily an advantage. It certainly does not make you happier, healthier or nicer to be around, so not an advantage.

I have stated that your posts do not display a higher level of intelligence but I have not inferred that you have less intelligence than others. I did not make any inference about you being a smart arse because I did not put yourself in that group. You did.

Intelligence combined with other beneficial qualities is far more desirable (for humankind, by humankind) than simply intelligence even superior intelligence.

If you still do not understand my point, I will accept that you disagree with my point of view and are unable to understand it. I have tried to clarify my stance for you so if you do actually understand what I am saying, it's ok to simply disagree, rather than trying to make out that I mean something other than what I am actually stating.

reply to post by Threegirls

All people are intelligent.

To an extent, yes.... but this is like saying that all things on earth have temperature.... you are not actually saying anything.

The level of intelligence one has is the subject of debate.

This is actually false, as I have pointed out previously, Intelligence is actually a well understood trait, and only people who do not UNDERSTAND intelligence, claim what you are claiming.

So, for the *THIRD* time, here is the link that totally destroys your entire position.

Intelligence

I have stated many times that to have more intelligence than most other people is not necessarily an advantage.

It does when society depends upon intelligence to survive, which for some reason you don't think is a good thing, or necessary to fuel your "Fun" at all.

Pity that.

It certainly does not make you happier, healthier or nicer to be around, so not an advantage.

On the contrary, I am having LOADS of fun verbally dissecting your pretentiousness, and pretended intelligence.

Oh, by the way, you should get off the internet... it was made by people who were intelligent, so you can't use it to your advantage.

I have stated that your posts do not display a higher level of intelligence but I have not inferred that you have less intelligence than others. I did not make any inference about you being a smart arse because I did not put yourself in that group. You did.

You are implying three things with that statement:

A. That people who are intelligent are actually just pretending to be intelligent.

B. That I am not intelligent, and am merely pretending to be intelligent.

C. That I am a smart arse because of this.

I fail to see how even YOU could be unaware of your direct attack upon me, as I believe that you are doing this on purpose.

Honestly, it's the oldest trick in the book.

Only complete morons would continue to argue with me.

Intelligence combined with other beneficial qualities is far more desirable (for humankind, by humankind) than simply intelligence even superior intelligence.

So, are you implying that there are people out there whose ONLY quality is intelligence?

Really? is that even possible? (rhetorical question, no, it's not)

Your continued attempt to denigrate intelligence is quite puerile and transparent, I suggest that you save face and drop this little charade, as you are losing quite badly.

If you still do not understand my point,

You never had a point, other than "INTELLIGENCE IS BAD!" which is clearly wrong.

I will accept that you disagree with my point of view and are unable to understand it.

And I will accept that if you respond to me again, that you suffer from down syndrome.

I have tried to clarify my stance for you so if you do actually understand what I am saying,

No, you have tried subtle little tricks to attempt to persuade everyone in attendance that intelligence is a bad thing, and that people who see themselves AS intelligent are actually egotistical, self centered, and "Arses"

Your motivation here is EXTREMELY transparent... and your attempts to direct the conversation towards a "Dumb People are teh superiorZ!!! and Smart peoples are teh Stupidz!!!" is woefully inadequate.

it's ok to simply disagree, rather that trying to make out that I mean something other than what I am actually stating.

You should heed your own advice on that one.

>Implying that people who are smart, are actually not smart at all because it makes the dumb people feel bad.

Honestly... your rebuttals are getting sadder and sadder.

reply to post by ErtaiNaGia


Different levels of intelligence is the subject of this thread. I think we have established that levels of intelligence have for more to do with environment, experience, understanding and knowledge and less to do with colour.

Also a higher level of intelligence does not appear to be as beneficial for humanity as intelligence combined with other qualities of equal value


Crankypantsuk gave a great answer about the importance of not being isolated (particularly during difficult times)

I make no predictions about the future, to discuss any possible scenarios would be off topic.

What is intelligence, anyway? I know quite a few people who wouldn't make a 100 on an iq test, but can get any sort of bike running, build a house, a guitar, tune a piano or actually understand another human being and relate to them and their problems.

I don't think you can pin intelligence down so easily, its too subjective.

reply to post by Threegirls

Different levels of intelligence is the subject of this thread.

Somewhat, yes.

I think we have established that levels of intelligence have for more to do with environment, experience, understanding and knowledge

And thus, the penny drops.

You never read my link, and your ignorance of the subject matter becomes apparent.

You are not actually attempting to converse about the subject matter, you are trying to Steer opinion.

You are attempting to obfuscate the DEFINITION of intelligence, for some predefined agenda.

are you being paid to post on this board?

Also a higher level of intelligence does not appear to be as beneficial for humanity as intelligence combined with other qualities of equal value

There is nothing that has equal value to intelligence.

Period.

I make no predictions about the future, to discuss any possible scenarios would be off topic.

Then don't claim knowledge that you do not posses.

reply to post by SprocketUK

What is intelligence, anyway?

This:
Intelligence

I know quite a few people who wouldn't make a 100 on an iq test, but can get any sort of bike running, build a house, a guitar, tune a piano or actually understand another human being and relate to them and their problems.

Knowledge is not intelligence.

They are not the same thing; knowing how to do something, and being able to figure something out quickly and efficiently are NOT the same thing.

I actually already explained this a few pages ago:
www.abovetopsecret.com...
There's the link.

I don't think you can pin intelligence down so easily, its too subjective.

Just because you are ignorant of what intelligence IS, does not mean that EVERYONE IN THE WORLD shares your ignorance.

Enlighten yourself, I have already provided the links.

Is this news?See the Atlanta educators cheating scandle for answer.I doubt most of those students could have passed even if given the answers!

reply to post by ErtaiNaGia


On my mobile, so can't download that doc. Care to summarize it?

reply to post by SprocketUK

On my mobile, so can't download that doc. Care to summarize it?

Uhg....

It's a multidisciplinary study on Intelligence (general intelligence) its definition, traits, heredity, etcetera.

It's too in depth for me to summarize here... just check it out when you get home, it's worth your time.

reply to post by ErtaiNaGia


Ok, will get back to you.

Originally posted by hotpinkurinalmint
I would not go so far as to say one race of people is somehow genetically more intelligent than another, but common sense tells us that talents and achievement have not been equally distributed across the globe and across different ethnic groups. This can be due to genetics, but can also be due to culture or envirnomental factors. Here are some examples.

Race differences in average IQ are largely genetic

A 60-page review of the scientific evidence, some based on state-of-the-art magnetic resonance imaging (MRI) of brain size, has concluded that race differences in average IQ are largely genetic.

Source

I don't know "News-Medical.net" very well, but I saw the article a couple of days ago and saw it pertinent to post it here. I truly believe Africa is doomed. Maybe not because of IQ, but because of the sheer lack of the belief that life is precious. Look at all the killing, the murder going on between them. It's not hard to see the future of Africa is bleak. Granted, I may be generalizing a bit, but still.

reply to post by hotpinkurinalmint

I would not go so far as to say one race of people is somehow genetically more intelligent than another, but common sense tells us that talents and achievement have not been equally distributed across the globe and across different ethnic groups.....

You beat me to it.

We only have to look at the adaption of regional populations of the same or similar animals. polar bears and grizzlies come to mind or the differences in desert vs northern horse breeds Yes I know man interfered but a Clydesdale or Shire is still going to have a really tough time in the middle east. You can even see the difference in intelligence between horses and ponies.

Again I have run into some really smart horses and really dumb ponies but ponies are generally smarter. The Donkey, who can crossbred with the horse and the Zebra who can cross breed with the donkey are other examples. Different adaptations and different levels of intelligence.

I read once that black africans have a 5% lower iq than the average western european. This is probably true but the fact is that iq is a result of social surroundings and upbringing, not genetics.


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reply to post by ErtaiNaGia


The study you linked talks largely about the effect of intelligence on behavior. It states that it is genetic and that environment only affects it in childhood and these effects dissipate with time.

Genetics vary from person to person even within racial, societal groups. There are people of greater or lesser intelligence in all groups. Whether environment affects genetics is not addressed, it should be for the contexts of social improvement based on intelligence.

your argument therefore is that intelligence is genetically determined and dictates your behavior. This means that those with less intelligence should be provided with the best possible environment to ensure that social standards are maintained. Your welcome (in advance)

My point is that those who do not have higher intelligence do not necessarily indulge in harmful behavior, they often have other qualities, which are not addressed (in the study) because they can not be measured (unlike a brain size and observable actions) which also moderate behavior largely nurtured by environment. The study although interesting does not have all of the answers to intelligence which is why intelligence is still studied.

reply to post by biggilo

iq is a result of social surroundings and upbringing, not genetics.

I'm terribly sorry, but your statement is actually WRONG.

please try again.

reply to post by ErtaiNaGia


I am going to put a spanner in the works.

The Scientist making the remarks worked in Cambridge MA, home of the foremost Marxist Scholars in the world....

He also said he looked at reports from employers of blacks. I am going to assume these were reports from the USA.

Here is the interesting bit.

A black friend mentioned a relative had been an American slave. He was adamant about passing on the "Secrets" about how to survive slavery.

One point was to teach your kids to HIDE their intelligence.

The Second and most telling point, was IF a child would not hide their intelligence KILL THEM because they are a danger to all.

If you look at slaves as a "Domesticated Animal" then you had the culling of the intelligent by both the masters AND their parents! You also had a culture evolve where "intelligence" was looked down on by American blacks that we still see today.

Reply to post by ErtaiNaGia

Well according to my aunt who has her own clinic on Harley Street and sees clients on behalf of The Priory Clinic it isn't. But i respect the fact you disagree with this.


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