Facing Foreclosure from the banks? Tell them to PRODUCE THE NOTE!!, page 1

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Topic started on 24-2-2009 @ 04:39 PM by BlackOps719

Being in the mortgage field of business I was intrigued when I first heard about this new stall tactic being used to avoid foreclosure. After researching through not only lending laws and court dockets but also by questioning contacts at major lenders that I work with, I am startled to learn that YES it does in fact work.

Make em "Produce The Note"

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When you sign the final note on a mortgage loan transaction, the final hard copy of the agreement, or "the note" is recorded and kept as evidence of said agreement. A binding contract between you and your mortgage company that you are closing through.

When facing foreclosure notice from any bank or lender you as a consumer are within your rights to demand that they produce a hard copy of the original signed note showing the original terms of the contract.

The bad part for bank and lenders is that 90+% of these loans are sold off into the secondary market within weeks of closing, sold to other companies who purchase the debt and service the loan. Many loans are sold multiple times and as such are often difficult to track. These lenders and banks have stacks upon stacks of foreclousres to deal with, and when asked to produce the original note showing what is owed...they simply can't find it.

Also to their disadvantage is the fact that many of the companies who originally wrote these loans are now defunct and no longer in business. In this case it requires sifting through thousands and thousands of old paper copy files that may or may not even exist.

By saying to the banking agent who is looking to foreclose on your home, "I will not leave until you produce the note"...many banks simply move on to an easier target and leave you alone. Even if they do try and actually track down the note it stalls the foreclosure process BY LAW and allows you months to find new work or living accomadations, at the very least it keeps you in your home and out of the cold for a while longer.

So if one of these crooks from the bank decides to take your home, tell them to produce that original note, and watch as they collapse in frustration. Give em hell!!!!

reply posted on 24-2-2009 @ 04:43 PM by elston

Excellent post. I will send this info to a friend. Thanks for the info.

reply posted on 24-2-2009 @ 04:48 PM by jerico65

I saw this story with the title, "Three words to stop foreclosure" and the only three I could think of were, "I gotta gun!"

reply posted on 24-2-2009 @ 04:52 PM by MajesticJax

I too am in the mortgage field. x-loan off., and now I do loan modifications. Yes, this does work sometimes, especially if your mortgage has been sold multiple times.

reply posted on 24-2-2009 @ 05:03 PM by BlackOps719

Originally posted by elston
Excellent post. I will send this info to a friend. Thanks for the info.

Please do that! If we could help just one person keep their home then it would be a great thing. Share this with anyone who may need it.

Time for American people to get uducated about our rights within the law as consumers and as citizens. Time to fight back and beat these scheisters at their own game

reply posted on 24-2-2009 @ 05:11 PM by ANNED

Many times when you got your load you made a agreement to abide by certain provisions of the loan.

I know years ago when I got a home loan I had a provision the I would make my payment on the 10th of the month.

After my loan got bundled and sold the new company tried to move the payment date repeatedly to the first day of the month.
I got payed on the first day of the month and some months i was unable to withdraw my payment till the second of the month.

The sole purpose of the loan buyer making the change was to get me to make late payments so they could charge me a fee for the late payment.

Every-time they tried this i keep making my payments by the contracted date the 10th of the month and threatened to take them to court for violation of contract.

The thing i found was one that most of the bundled loan buyers did not know the wording of my loan agreement.
Two when they found that i would win any case they would sell the loan to someone else without telling them. And they would try the same thing.

Getting loan with toxic provisions like mine can make your loan toxic to loan bundlers and hard for them to sell.

One of the best is people that want bimonthly payments where you pay 6 times a year.
These are almost imposable to bundle and sell without the seller lieing to the bundle buyer.

reply posted on 24-2-2009 @ 05:14 PM by theindependentjournal

This was covered by L.B. Bork and Randy Yarborough over 6 months ago on American News Net Radio show. I think the bottom line here works everywhere or nearly so in our lives...

If you knows the Rules of the Game and how the Game is played, you can play it for a long time and the government/corporations get mad mad mad...

You should see how I stop a bill collector with a I.R.S. Document....

This is Valid and good information and is accurate I know for a fact, as long as, the note has been sold many times and or the original company is no longer in business.

reply posted on 24-2-2009 @ 05:21 PM by j2000

Keep in mind, that other debts where you sign a contract are in the same boat. If they have sold it over and over. Make them Produce the Note.

Concidering that everytime, if it's a bad debt, they add on 30-40 percent for fees plus a constant supply of 30 percent interest.

reply posted on 24-2-2009 @ 05:22 PM by spinkyboo

This is great.
I love when we the common Joe can join in and play the game
in their favor for a change.

reply posted on 24-2-2009 @ 05:24 PM by Jnewell33

what happens if the company simply cannot produce the note. I understand this is unlikely but what if, you know. very interesting to say the least.

reply posted on 24-2-2009 @ 05:28 PM by SLAYER69

Well I for one am all for keeping your house if you can but ultimately if you cant pay for whatever reason it's time to go. But delaying as long as possible, go for it. Hopefully things will turn in the homeowners favor before the final axe false.

[edit on 24-2-2009 by SLAYER69]

reply posted on 24-2-2009 @ 05:28 PM by BlackOps719

reply to post by Jnewell33

Well Im not positive on this, but if a bank cant prove that you owe them any money then it would be awful difficult for them to take the house back.

It goes like this - Bank - "Hey, you owe us $200,000"

Customer - "Prove it"

Bank - " Oh crap, we can't"

Customer - "See ya in court then"

reply posted on 24-2-2009 @ 05:35 PM by northof8

reply to post by BlackOps719

What a bunch of losers... I can't pay my mortgage so I will screw with the bank. This is why we are in this mess. Losers like this didn't deserve a mortgage in the first place.

People like this need to be taken out of their homes and flogged period.

You tell them to produce the note? I say how about you put just as much effort in fighting the bank as finding a job and produce a damn paycheck. Losers...

reply posted on 24-2-2009 @ 05:55 PM by BlackOps719

reply to post by northof8

That's your opinion and you are entitled to it

Unfortunately I know different. People were put into bad situations by a lot of unscrupulous lenders and business plans out there. Over 400 mortgage lenders have closed down since 07 and it hasnt been because they were writing good or beneficial loans.

Regardless of who is to blame or who was greedy or who made bad decisions, the bottom line is the borrowers and the financiers alike are all suffering as a result.

But I hate seeing American families being evicted from their homes at the rate of 9,000 new foreclosure filings per day.

If this can help anyone keep a roof over their families head long enough to ride it out so they can find work again or possibly be able to re-negotiate the terms of their loan then I am all for it.

Throwing American families out on the street isnt helping anybody.

[edit on 2/24/09 by BlackOps719]

reply posted on 24-2-2009 @ 06:02 PM by spinkyboo

Originally posted by northof8
reply to post by BlackOps719

What a bunch of losers... I can't pay my mortgage so I will screw with the bank. This is why we are in this mess. Losers like this didn't deserve a mortgage in the first place.

People like this need to be taken out of their homes and flogged period.

You tell them to produce the note? I say how about you put just as much effort in fighting the bank as finding a job and produce a damn paycheck. Losers...

I hope hardship that you didn't bargain for and have no way out of doesn't find you.
There are a lot more variables than you are looking at - and judgment can be a bitch.

Although I agree we should pay our debts -
This is a crisis originating from a filthy and corrupt system...
It's not just about people who don't want to work and pay their bills.

Have some compassion. It will aid you in the future.

[edit on 24-2-2009 by spinkyboo]

reply posted on 24-2-2009 @ 06:08 PM by TheWayISeeIt

reply to post by MajesticJax

Hey MajesticJax -

Please expound. It seems you may be able to shed some more light on what the traditional 'official' response is. Is the OP correct in guessing that it ends up in court? Is it an option for the bank/mortgage lender to take a case to court w/o the original doc? What if the paper can be produced, but is owned by a 4th, 5th, etc. party? Who is the Plaintiff in that instance?

This goes for anyone who works in, or understands, the legal procedures of debt collection, but esp. to the specifics of mortgages, per the OP.

I am going to S&F because I think that people should be made aware of whatever options are available to them in the ponzi scheme that is our financial system. It would be very beneficial to this thread to have some opinions that are informed by exoerience of being on the 'the other side' -- bank/fed/gov -- (if that does indeed happen I think we shoud all be beware of potential trolls shilling and scaring).

PS - I saw something about this in the MSM about a year-ago where a man in Ohio realized that the note to his home was cut-up and owned by 6+ entities and was then able to stop the foreclosure, I then never heard about it again.

PPS - I would not be at all surprised if we saw legislation coming to the fore that attempted to correct these 'problems'.

reply posted on 24-2-2009 @ 06:18 PM by BlackOps719

reply to post by TheWayISeeIt

I am a mortgage broker and have been in the industry for several years so I do have some insight into how lenders and banks may view this type of thing. But in answer to the question "what happens afterward"..I really can't say with 100% accuracy.

But as I see it the law is the law, and without being able to produce an original binding agreement i don't see how a lender would have much of a leg to stand on. The promisory note is the signed agreement which is binding, everything else in a final loan packet is secondary. Without it there would be many legal implications and obstacles to overcome for a bank to try and seize a property.

reply posted on 24-2-2009 @ 06:29 PM by whaaa

reply to post by BlackOps719

Thanks for that solid information. I know for a fact my note has been sold no less than 10 times. My place is almost paid off but you never know what might happen and it's good to have a plan B.

This thread itself could save someone from being homeless. Bless you BlackOps719, bless you!

Thanks

[edit on 24-2-2009 by whaaa]

reply posted on 24-2-2009 @ 06:52 PM by camain

keep in mind, that if they start the foreclosure process, you technically don't have to make a payment, additionally, if they can't provide the note, you don't have to make a payment until they do. Afterall, why would you make payments on a house, to a lender if that lender didn't have the original document that states how much, and on what bill cycle you are to pay?

If you were making 700 payments before the default, and you drug it out for 3 years, thats 21000 you can put down, when and if they find the loan doc. Additionally, keep in mind, you sitting there for so long could result in you owning it, you may want to consider looking in abandoment laws. If the original owner abandons a property(lender) and fails to maintain it(which in essense forces you to), you could then technically charge them for maintenance fees to the property, not sure how that would work, but sure would be funny to charge them $800 a month for maintence when you owed 700, and refuse to have them pay you, then sue for damages and actually win, remember, owernership could default to you, by court rule if they refused to maintain it, and you were forced to maintain it. I would check local law though.

cheers

camain

reply posted on 24-2-2009 @ 06:54 PM by loam

reply to post by northof8

Originally posted by northof8
People like this need to be taken out of their homes and flogged period.

Why punish only one side?

Both ends suffer from delusions of entitlement...

When wrong-doers attack one another, I'm not sure I ever pick a side to cheer.

Do any of you?