Good question about hell

reply to post by whatsyourname


God is totaly unconditional love, he has no punishment, there is no suffering , it does not exsist , only love.....

Originally posted by Yacov
ha ha
You will find out soon enough if you dont check out your Bible and ask Christ to cover your sin lovin butt - which is all anyone can do for Salvation.
Just one glimpse of Hell would paralyze you with fear-believe me. Mocking God can accelerate that.

Y

wow... i can just picture christ himself saying that...

Originally posted by whatsyourname
God is totaly unconditional love, he has no punishment, there is no suffering , it does not exsist , only love.....

please, show me one scripture that says god´s love is uncoditional....

Originally posted by miriam0566
please, show me one scripture that says god´s love is uncoditional....

Do you really need the bible to tell you something like this? Is true love not unconditional? To say otherwise is to say that the father is a bad parent. You punish your child to teach them a lesson, you do not punish them just to cause them pain and suffering.

Sad state when you actually need the bible to tell you something as such.

Matthew 7

11If ye then, being evil, know how to give good gifts unto your children, how much more shall your Father which is in heaven give good things to them that ask him?

Ive studied a little nad online about heaven and hell...i saw a documentary on history channel, about hell.. it kinda depends on you religion. Muslims i learned dont belive in jesus or hell. Catholics and protestants belive yuo go to a place of sulphur, brimestone and fire, and forever tormented. I think its christians, i might be wrong..belive thier is 7or 9 levels of hell...each level kinda like a pyramid..the greater the sin, the higher the level yuo are tortured by demons, for that/those sins.
Studying religion, i learned about demons. Human encoutners are rare, at least documetned ones. When a demon manisfests itself in yuor home, it moves things around, makes things walk, might even hit you, and ofen, have imps, medium level midget demons, that are the actual demons helper. Its goal, is to confuse you, and break yuo down emotionally, until your under its control..possessed. No one has really ever been able to ask a demon, what the other side is like, because demons are liars, that is what they do. They wouldnt tell yuo the truth for any reason. Its not thier nature at all, to tell truth.
So! For one to know what hell is really like, one must be or go thier.

God is totaly unconditional love, he has no punishment, there is no suffering , it does not exsist , only love.....

Thats providing yuo have at heart and soul, proved your love and faith to him...god does challenge that alot..when yuo loose someone yuo love, or something bad happens, what will yuo do? Curse his name, or embrace it... and that, will have proved unconditonal love, by embracing.

There is Good, and there is BAD. Evil is not paid with good. The devil takes satisfaction in others fears, screams, pain. Why would he pay you "good" for your evil?

There is no give and take, negotiation. The Devil will only take. You will suffer in a pit of fire, your screams will be his reward. You see his "like" is what you would not like....his pleasure is your PAIN.

Why else would your evil deeds make him happy. Think about it, what does the Devil take pleasure in? So do you really think he would give you a reward to your liking in the end? What satisfaction would that bring him?

You too will make him happy, suffering, screaming. Your agony will be his reward. One sided my friend.

You are but a pawn.

Excuse me, I have got a question here.

I don't want to debate anyone's statement about unconditional love and God, but couldn't it be possible that it's all just wishful thinking from any person who makes a claim to know the truth? I mean, who has seen God?

If someone told me, hey I have seen God, then I am in no position to say that it's a lie. I need to consider possibilities. So please, who has seen God and who knows for sure that his/her/its love is unconditional (or maybe only conditional).

Please, anyone speak up.

I just wanted to ask this question and this is most likely allowed to do that in a discussion forum, right? Couldn't it be all just wishful thinking?

Greetings

Originally posted by TheWriter
Excuse me, I have got a question here.

I don't want to debate anyone's statement about unconditional love and God, but couldn't it be possible that it's all just wishful thinking from any person who makes a claim to know the truth? I mean, who has seen God?

If someone told me, hey I have seen God, then I am in no position to say that it's a lie. I need to consider possibilities. So please, who has seen God and who knows for sure that his/her/its love is unconditional (or maybe only conditional).

Please, anyone speak up.

I just wanted to ask this question and this is most likely allowed to do that in a discussion forum, right? Couldn't it be all just wishful thinking?

Greetings

I have. But why should you believe me? Couldn't I just as easily say it if it wasn't true? You won't find god looking out there, he is within you. Shouldn't take any man's word for it, you should find out for yourself. You need to truly question your entire reality right down to what is actually you. Your eyes register light, turns it into an electrical signal, that signal travels to the back of the brain, to where it is converted into the picture you see. So how can you be your brain? Truly deep and personal questions.

But realize, just because it is unconditional love doesn't mean you are going to be spoiled, or that it's all roses. The parent who loves his child will punish the child when appropriate to teach a lesson. If you keep making the mistake, you keep getting punished. But just as a parent who loves you, as soon as you quit making those mistakes, all is forgiven. As all the parent wanted was for the child to not make the mistakes. So you still have to learn from your mistakes.

Originally posted by whatsyourname
reply to post by whatsyourname

 

God is totaly unconditional love, he has no punishment, there is no suffering , it does not exsist , only love.....

Nope that is not totally true, yes God WILL NOT punish you forever making you suffer forever in a place called hell, but there is a punishment for going against God.
It is Non-existence. God's love is awesome but it has limits based on God's other qualities of Justice and Wisdom. God loves all his creation but his love for his good creation and his perfect justice demands that he remove evil spirits and humans from existence.

Originally posted by badmedia
Do you really need the bible to tell you something like this? Is true love not unconditional? To say otherwise is to say that the father is a bad parent. You punish your child to teach them a lesson, you do not punish them just to cause them pain and suffering.

Sad state when you actually need the bible to tell you something as such.

Matthew 7

11If ye then, being evil, know how to give good gifts unto your children, how much more shall your Father which is in heaven give good things to them that ask him?

matthew 7:11 does not say that god's love is unconditional, it simply establishes that he is a good father

no im not in a sad state. if you presume to speak for god (by telling people what love is and is not), then back it up with scripture.

unconditional love is what keeps victims attached to their abusers. ever see a woman who takes her husband back even though it was the upteenth time she got beat? thats unconditional love.

it means that no matter how he feels about her and no matter how much he hurts her, she will always love him.

unconditional love is one way and by its very nature worthless. in no way can unconditional love be called "true love"

what type of mindless idiotic god would love you while you spit in his face? while you take advantage of his gifts and blessings but pay nothing of that love back to him. that has to be the simplest, most non insightful belief i have ever heard. that type of belief can only stem from a lack of understanding of just how evil man can be.

imagine, loving a woman (or man) who despises you. who constantly ridicules you in public, does everything to try to hurt you. how long before you've had enough?

likely you will say that god is different and that he is able to interact with us in ways we dont understand. he's infinitly more patient than us. true, but we are made in his image. we can understand god's emotions because we in a way think like him.

if can relate to him, then why would god tolerate and person who hates him?

Originally posted by TheWriterI don't want to debate anyone's statement about unconditional love and God, but couldn't it be possible that it's all just wishful thinking from any person who makes a claim to know the truth? I mean, who has seen God?

If someone told me, hey I have seen God, then I am in no position to say that it's a lie. I need to consider possibilities. So please, who has seen God and who knows for sure that his/her/its love is unconditional (or maybe only conditional).

the same way that through the movement of a tree, the wind is manifest. so through the bible can god be manifest.

its a big question and it really is impossible to answer with any sort of quality in a brief way.

maybe start a thread about it?

Originally posted by virraszto
reply to post by benrl

 

Don't get it at all. If god is so powerful and can do anything, why not just get rid of the devil or satan or whatever you want to call him. A quick snap of the fingers should do it.

[edit on 14-2-2009 by virraszto]

See, That would ruin all of the fun. Then, how could the mind screw of "if you're "bad" you're going to hell" be perpetuated? How could control over the religious believers be kept if there was no "evil" to be ever fearful of. Hookers, tarot cards, harmless house haints, halloween, vampire movies, alcohol and even the internets are all "evil" and most of us are destined for hell for indulging and partaking in these examples of the "devils" handiwork.

reply to post by Jim Scott

Hi. I shortened your questions to get to the essentials. The creator loses because of the free will of the individual. For example, Satan has a free will. Jesus said He lost Satan, but saved all the others "except the son of perdition" when He was praying in the garden at the last. The creator created everything, and gave us free will. He did not create our decisions, and He saves us from our mistakes in those decisions.

No dude you've not got to the essentials, you stated the creator of all that there is and could possibly be, has lost something.

This is impossible, if the creator has created all that there is, was and ever will be, the all that there is. Then there is nowhere or nowhen for anything to be lost to.

If the creator of everything (including satan) is reduced in any way there must be somewhere or somewhen or someone for the loss to be, this if true would mean by proxy that the creator is not the creator of all that there is.

It is impossible to be omnipotent and omniscient and be unaware of an outcome.

reply to post by miriam0566


Do you have kids? I think that would answer the majority of your questions on what kind of god would forgive such things.

Originally posted by theresult
it just goes to show how stupid this heaven and hell crap is...

its got less logic than aliens coming to earth and landing on the whitehouse lawn...

I mean really cmon.. the devil and god are the same person... both used to controll your basic fear.. "death" and the "unknown"

Man has always wanted controll over other men.. why? becouse we are no different than a lion and his pride...

And aliens are very real... and if you think otherwise i think one needs to look up at the stars and understand ones place in the cosmos..

heaven and hell can kiss my a$$
Infinity owns them both

Yes. I believe Satan was nothing more than an ET that rebeled against the true ET's that created us by splicing our DNA from Neanderthal and coupling it with theirs. It does say in the bible that man was created in His (Their) image. It explains that gap between Neanderthal and Homonid, and the gap between Apes and Men. We didn't come from apes.

This is all just my theory and my strong opinion. I think it makes much more sense than any bible, Scientific theory, etc.

Anyway, it says in the bible that after Adam and Eve were CREATED, "He" (God) gave them the garden of Eden. Everything was perfect. They didn't know was evil was. That was apparently the intentions of the ET's (Anunnaki?) who created us (But playing God is still messed up in my opinion).

Now, from almost everything I have ever read about alien abductions and contacts, ET's communicate telepathically. IF this is the case, it opens up this possibility:

Satan, Lucifer was supposedly the one who rebelled against our creators (which were just living creatures like us, mind you), and manifested in the form of a "Serpent". He "Tempted" Eve to eat the fruit. A simple use of deciet to a Naive human being (She didn't know any better). The eating of the fruit was (perhaps) symbolic to our creators, they got pissed off and kicked Adam and Eve out of Eden - also banishing the serpent to the underground.

Is it possible that this could be in the right direction? I mean, people sometimes read the bible and don't see deep enough into it. I believe the basic basic meaning and truth was there, but just tampered with so much in the past 5,000 or so years. Words got changed, etc.

Well, from what I understand, Satan/Lucifer was the king of the dark side - if you will. He's died apparently and the other "Fallen Angels" are probably still down there, living underground.Also, about how I said all ET's are supposedly telepathic?

Maybe what's left of them are using their form of telepathy to influence peoples thoughts, minds, and maybe actions. Ever get a feeling to do something you know you shouldn't do, and you wonder "Where the hell did that come from?". I think that's it. It - to me is the most logical over everything else I have heard.

Sounds crazy at first, but just indulge me and give it thought.

As far as what created ET's?

Perhaps the force called "The Great Creation". An entity of pure energy that we are all part of. When we die, I think we go through incarnation (not RE-incarnation) cycles. I believe the meaning of life is just to spiritually evolve. Unfortunately, it's apparent that evil MUST exist for Good (The exact opposite) to exist as well. It's all about + and -.

So, from what I understand, since we are all creation anyway (This includes non living objects as well; EVERYTHING in the universe) we are basically our own god's (notice the lowercase).

I am in NO ways undermiming what some of us would interpret as God. God to me was always everything "Good" - the nemesis of evil. But in the bible, God is very unfair. Asks for sacrifices at first, says in the 10 commandments "Thou shalt not worship any other god's". And somewhere it also says to worship only him, for he is a JEALOUS GOD.

What's that telling you? "God" was just just as fallable as we were, just more advanced spiritually and (cont

[edit on 2/15/2009 by impaired]

perhaps technologically more advanced than we were.

That "devil" on your shoulder? Perhaps outside influence?

Since we became sentient after the fruit incident, we now have to choose the right way or the wrong way. Whatever we do on a daily basic creates a cosmic (if you will) karma.

When we do bad by giving into "temptation", I really think that all hell is is just the mindset and consequences of upsetting that "balance". Hell on Earth? Heaven on Earth? You better believe it.

This is a little more fair (in a way - despite the fact that we've been manipulated by ET's for thousands of years). According to my theory (it's not just mine, I don't take credit here), there is no unfair judgement. No burning in hell for eternity just because you didnt believe the bible the way it is.

Obviously, and I know is sound so corny, the only way to fight this bad side would be to say NO to that "temptation" that makes us do wrong.
When we hurt someone or something (in whatever way), it creates a domino effect of negativity, which could manifest itself in many different ways.
As damn hard as it is, not just love one another (because we ARE in this together), but understand that when someone does something bad (I know it sounds nuts), it probably isn't their fault!

Remorse, I think, is just the good part of you saying "I can't believe I did this, Why did I do this?"

And like I said, when I say love one another, I mean it on a human level mostly. We all do bad things, there are some of us that realize it, some don't.
We are literally in this world together - basically stranded here with different religions, different languages; we HATE people and freak out because they cut us off in the car. "A###ole! I hope you die!"
Why do we do that??? Do we really want someone to die for something like that???!

Light up the darkness. From what I understand, this bad force - these "demons" feed off of our pain and sorrow and misery and anger. It is a sustenance for them.
"They" have a classificated-name, but I will not get into that one here. People who know their ET knowledge know who I am talking about.

I'm sorry to who I may have offended with this. Religion is ingrained into some of us since birth. Challenging that belief system is bound to stir up some anger.

In these tough times and even tougher times approaching, my wish is that we will stick together and not aggravate violence with violence. That will surely keep the domino's falling.

Why can't we start a domino effect of positive karma? We can, but the "influence" over us has a stronghold on alot of us, including myself.

At least I know my enemy (being that I for one believe this theory). At least I understand what NOT to give it. That makes it just that much easier for me to be a better person.
Is anyone on the same page as me? If not, no problem.
Just had to get this out...
Peace.

I chuckle at those who would deny all. That's really an intelligent approach.

I note that when the Christ, KNEW that he was about to go to his death, while carrying the sins of the world, that he found the prospect so terrifying that he was literally sweating blood (burst capillaries) from the stress he was feeling.

Of all people, I'd say He knew what it was all about.

His fear, was that for His time appointed, He was going to be separated from God the Father. That alone was his great fear.

Because God the Father cannot be in the presence of evil, Jesus the Son was compelled to be separate from the Father for the first time. And all that implies.

I recall a story of a man who was convicted of murder, and was going before the judge for judgement. Oddly, this very same convicted murderer as a child was saved from drowning by the judge as a young man.

He had saved his life, and now he was pronouncing the death sentence.

Choices.

Apparently after death, there's no "sleep." You pretty much go to your reward. We can read of Lazarus and the rich man, whose name we are not given. Kind of reminds me that those whose names are not in the Book of Life, go to hell.

The rich man dies after Lazarus, and raises his eyes in great torment, but has recognition, sees Lazarus, and asks Father Abraham if Lazarus can dip his finger in water and touch his tongue. He's reminded that a great gulf does divide them, and no one from one side can cross to the other.

When you are convicted, and found guilty of capital crimes, then sentencing is usually to come at a future date. You aren't turned loose until final sentencing. You are taken to prison and held until sentencing.

I'd say that's kind of like Hades. You got your comforting side of Hades, for those who are written in the Book of Life, and then you've got those who find themselves in great torment.

The final judgment is the final, official judgment.

At that point, you for all time, are separated from God. Darkness and no hope, misery and suffering.

Because not of God, but because of you. Your choices.

Imagine absolutely no hope.

Worse than death.

Lol could god make a rock so heavy, even he couldn't lift it?

not a good question

a great question

just adds a whole nothing aspect to the things that dont add up about religions

normally i am of the belief if it doesnt make sense, then it just isnt so


sounds like it just isnt so doesnt it?

great way to think outside the box op, great thread