Population Control "A License to Breed"

Originally posted by Wethesheeple
reply to post by Avarus

 

LOL what your talking about is Eugenics. I don't think I need to say it but I will... Eugenics is not a good thing

Bingo. Though you forgot to mention that it's actually been put into practice before, both on the conservative side here in America and the extremist side in Germany. Neither result was positive.

Originally posted by Avarus
It's truly an open discussion. I'm just curious about what people would do to combat global overpopulation.

Global overpopulation isn't currently a problem, and likely won't be until the advent of "immortality" that extends not just the average lifespan - but the health and youthfulness (breeding age) of the patient well beyond it's current limits.

Our problems with population are not ones of numbers, but of infrastructure. It's not that the Earth cannot support us - but that our current societies may not be able to support us. To solve this, we should be working on improving our infrastructures - rather than sterilizing people or forcing them to get licenses.

Food? Solvable. The Haber Process, for example, is responsible for generating about 1/3rd of our total food production. We can minimize land usage and greenhouse expenditures as well using stem-cell and cloning technology to grow flesh and fruit alike in factories. They'll probably be used at first in processed mixtures until the flavor and texture synthesis is good enough to be sold on it's own. "Real" meat will still be around, of course, but in much lower demand. Plus, a starving man won't generally reject a T-bone steak because the flavor is "a little off". We have plenty enough food already, it's just not being distributed right due to economics, politics, spoilage, etc. All fixable.

Energy? Solvable. We're on the cusp of being able to draw our energy directly off the sun in a highly efficient manners and with complimentary power storage. If we could capture 1/10th of 1% of the energy which falls on the Earth in any given day, we could meet our total energy projections for the next 30 years.

Resources? Solvable. We're currently ignoring around 73% of the total resources on Earth's surface simply because they're a bit hard to get to being covered by oceans and all. Analysis of hydrothermal vents reveals they are capable of spewing commercial grade Copper, Iron, Zinc, Gold, etc. These have left large deposits on the sea floor over time. Not all of our resources are on land. Unfortunately, we're spending very little money on exploring and tapping these resources. NASA's budget in one year would fund NOAA's for over a thousand. America has better maps of Mars than 50% of it's own sovereign territory.

Land Use? Solvable. The entire population of the Earth right now could live in a city roughly the size of Texas which has an urban density about equal to that of Paris. We're still basically building huts spread across the savannas. There's still the oceans and subterranean territories to colonize.

Etc, etc.

Not to mention that if we can cross our consciousness over to cyberspace, there is practically unlimited room for expansion and almost no expenditure on resources.

Sure it will require a LOT of capital and research. It will be a HELLUVA lot easier just to sterilize people. But you know... this is all stuff we gotta do eventually anyhow.

Not to mention that population growth has diminished greatly over the past century in developed nations. The average American family size has been falling. 4, to 3, to 2.5, to 2.1 being the most recent. This is partially due to technology freeing up more time by minimizing work efforts and extending lifespans. People have time to pursue careers, personal dreams, ambitions, etc before having children. Japan's birthrate has fallen so dramatically that it's creating fear of a crisis wherein the youthful and working class generation will be too small to support their aging population. They're looking to robots for assistance. Further, the trend towards living in cities is limiting family size due to space vs. cost of rent conflicts.

In poorer, predominantly rural, nations and families, it makes sense to have have many children. That's more hands to help around the farm, or to get a job and support the family. Medical care is often substandard, and infant mortality rates are much higher. The more children you have, the more likely some will successfully survive into adulthood.

And this isn't even bringing up our old buddy War, which should never be espoused as population growth control - but does happen regardless and does affect population levels.

By the time our species faces a true threat due to population growth which cannot be solved by improved infrastructure, we'll be mining and colonizing the solar system.

reply to post by Avarus


I think a lot of this is already in place in some sections of society.

It's not mandatory or anything, but it allows for those who actually give a damn about something other than their own selfish agendas.

Some people like their litters, they pride themselves on their fertitily without considering the long term effects of over population...

Fortunately, they're few and far between.

And best of luck to those conscientious couples who can actually raise 5 plus kids! Wow! That's talent! Moms like that always have my respect.


*edit to clarify, spelling


[edit on 2/3/09 by GENERAL EYES]

do i get a tax rebate if i dont want any?

lol!!!

now thats a gooood idea, have no kids and get a better pension.. well.. I am paying for your 2 kids in tax..

wuwhahaa!!

heres a better solution

let them breed but convince all of them to build spaceships and leave earth

there you go, get rid of them but yet dont kill them or force anything on them

everyone wins, they get to explore space and you get to live on a non crowded planet

Originally posted by asmeone2
I am also not opposed to the idea of courts ordering women who have been brought up on hard drug charges to use birth control.

Why is this? I mean, why do you think this is a good governmental intervention?

What if the charges are 15 years old and the woman has moved on? Which drugs are "hard" drugs?

To me, if we applied our efforts to bring forth abundance on this planet, as I describe in my book discussed here: www.abovetopsecret.com... , most of our problems would vanish.

Childless person here who does not like being stereotyped and who most definetly *does not* hate the world. But I too think that I shouldn't have to pay for schools or child tax decuctions (somone's gotta make up for what you don't pay in) or any of the other parental entitlement programs that I know I will never ever use. Thats not hating the world, thats called not liking getting ripped off so you can get a reward for breeding.
And I'm tired of listening to egotistical breeders who say that thier kid is going to take care of me or do so much for me, the world, etc. I call BS. First of all: who knows if, after all that tax money, your kids will actually grow up to be productive members of society, as apposed to say being in prison.
My hard work and my savings will take care of me.
Roads are ok, crap i wont use, not so much.

Originally posted by Aeons
I'm sick of listening to the people who are going to suck on the teat of my children's work later complain about how they have to pay for education and roads.

There is NO reason for the childless to take out their self-hatred on the rest of the world. None.

Originally posted by LostNemesis
I agree..... NO reason for people to be breeding so out of control in this day and age.
I mean seriously, are these breeders really thinking that humans are on the verge of extinction and can only be saved if they personally take it upon themselves to populate the world?

Simpy, anyone who cannot afford kids, should not have kids. NO welfare for the irresponsible breeders. NONE. We have encouraged breeding for long enough.

If people can afford kids, well that should be up to them how many they can seriously pay for and provide attention for.

Another thing. Public schools should now ONLY be paid for by those with kids that use said schools.

I am sick of paying for other peoples' offspring.

(Maybe sarcastic, maybe not..)
EDIT: Typos

[edit on 3-2-2009 by LostNemesis]

[edit on 3-2-2009 by FunSized]

This is the second similar type thread, and the idea is completely unnecessary. To begin with the biggest problem is that we aren't owned by the cabal. They don't tell their collective bosses anything. Oh I know how they have set things up, but I really feel upset by the lack of others understanding that they also need to be informing their employees of their status, on a continual basis, as I do when I write to them.

We're sovereign beings.

Birth and birth control is one of the major issues that has been used to enslave women and treat them like second class citizens, often living in poverty. Birth control pills only work for half of them, the others have to be taken off by their doctors, something they told me when I had to be.

Women aren't property to be controlled and penalized on every turn in their lives, or if they, heaven forbid, should have sex!!!

Yet that attitude is pervasive.

The massive patriarchal societies, and the lack of social programs and health care, and equality, and a standard of living in the third world, condiitons that have been forced to be set in place by the bloodlines and cabal of the first nations, is the reason they have 8 or more children.

Countries with high standards of living, social services, well cared for citizens who know they have rights and are the bosses of their systems, and with equality between men and women, have around 0 % growth. Canada, minus its immigrations, has less than 0 %.

This isn't a fascist control isssue. This is about social justice and women being treated as equal in a society. Then birth rates drop, except for the unlucky fertile ones who can't take the pill For those, coming up with safe and effective birth controls would be an idea. Women don't like having 8 children, have you ever thought of that! Work for equality and social justice.

Ahab, what is wrong with sterilizing the mentally retarded?
Do you think that they should be free to create more like themsleves?

Birth control via the pill for women is totally wrong. You ask them to poison themselves with chemicals.

Yes, snip the males.
Snip the females too.
Reverse or do invitro when the time is right.

Everyone should have to have a full history of heritable defects before being allowed to procreate.

Humans have over 4000 heritable diseases.
Is there anyone who would not want to eliminate them?

Avarus !! You know ...its not politicly correct especially in some EU countries....they also pay a lot ....for children...
The problem is its normally Muslim children!
Simply ; Your Licence- masonic in itself, as idea may atract to You some jihad peolples...
Thats not the way!
I mean interdiction...
Take away social help from islamists will be super, but...try to do it...
Anyway if not most of Christian countries will face sooner or later the same story like historic Christian Region- Kosovo...
Peace

Originally posted by mystiq
Women don't like having 8 children, have you ever thought of that! Work for equality and social justice.

www.cnn.com...

I don't really need to say much more. She wants to be considered the 'hero of baby making' or something like that... I can't find the exact quote.

reply to post by LostNemesis

Simpy, anyone who cannot afford kids, should not have kids. NO welfare for the irresponsible breeders. NONE. We have encouraged breeding for long enough. If people can afford kids, well that should be up to them how many they can seriously pay for and provide attention for.

My thoughts exactly people have 5 , 6 , 7 ,8 or more kids to sponge of the goverment they get a roof, heat and food and do they have to work for it i think not,.

reply to post by OhZone


no one should be denyed the chance of that special love thats brought from a child that would be un ethical and moral.

Originally posted by ravenshadow13
reply to post by asmeone2

 

Good idea about the drug charges.
Birth control pills are really inexpensive. My mom actually said that she thinks we should just put it in the water.

But then people will go drink bottled water and have 18 kids like those people on TLC.

I hope your mum was joking.
If not then you should have her go through a fluoride detox and if that don't help then it's the soft cell I'm afraid.

well if they still get pregnant maybe they will get fined/ticketed.jail time is 2 harsh for something that god has given us as a blessing...but what if the government give the child $100,000 for their education after high school education or something else if needed..Why should we pay for education anyways.I'm a high school student myself,i am in my twelve year.And wanting to become a male registered nurse with a bachelors is gonna be hard without help.I know i wondered off topic but i needed that off my chest..

flashor, part of the problem is that these young girls that want babies, is because they are looking for love.
No one should have a baby just so they will be loved.
That is being as psychologically unstable as one can get.

Tell me that you really approve of a hair-lipped woman having 3 hair-lipped children; and of course under you edict the 3 would go on to produce maybe 9 or more and those 9, 27 or more etc, etc.
After all, they are just looking for love.......
Bad reason for having children.
BTW there is such a case in this area.

Avarus = Moron

I have no idea why you were even allowed to post such a thread.

Human beings PROCREATE, it's built into us, there is no "criteria" for procreation.

Overpopulation is a myth, I'm surprised you haven't figured that out by now. The Earth can handle many more people than it currently holds, and in fact needs this many people to fulfill it's energy needs. The main reason so many people are starving is simple...corruption and mismanagement!

DUH!

Being a parent is a huge responsibility.

Many people are up to the challenge and have great families.

Others, are just not up to that particular challenge. It would be nice if we could discourage people who aren't going to do the job that they've chosen.

The question is how?

Perhaps you should only be able to claim all the income tax advantage associated with children as long as your children are turning out to be the kind of future citizens that we all need.

By that, I mean, that they are succeeding in school, they are succeeding in their social development and somehow rated as potential great future citizens.

If your precious child goes to juvenile hall, then no tax advantages for several years. If your child is a chronic truant.... no tax advantages. If your child is failing at school.... No tax advantages.

There has to be some way to recognize and reward good parenting and to penalize poor parenting.

reply to post by OhZone

So...ummm...Who is that hair lipped child offending? You? Are you advocating sparing that child it's life so that it won't offend you or are you trying to spare it from discrimination and from being picked on? From who, other people like you?

The thing is...is that YOU have NO SAY in WHO gets to live or who gets to die....and I'm VERY glad for that.

I can't believe I'm wasting my time even responding to such rubbish. Use your brain, and maybe throw in some conscience.

reply to post by Wildbob77


Wow...they just pop-up like wildflowers don't they! "Reward peoper parenting and penalize poor parenting".Hmm, now that is an interesting idea ON A WEBSITE THAT IS A MAJORITY OF PEOPLE THAT ARE FOR LESS GOVERNMENT INVOLVEMENT IN OUR LIVES THAN MORE. Hey, pssssst, lets bring back debtors prison too! Lets....ummm...BANISH BROWN EYED WOMEN AND RED GRENADINE.

Dear Sir:

Over population will be a problem in the not-so-distant future.
Eventually, steps will have to be taken to ensure our survival.
Whether that be through an immoral depopulation effort, or planned parenting.

Sooner or later though, we're going to need to slow the population's growth.

Whether or not you agree with the methods, or notion of the idea aren't important or relevant.
It's just a fact.