11 yr Old Tasered In School

reply to post by RFBurns


Maybe you missed this part?

"The school knows pretty well that my daughter is like a 5-year-old," explained the girl's mother, Sandra Garcia.

Garcia told Eyewitness News that her 11-year-old daughter has a learning disability and when she was approached by the deputy Thursday morning in class she was simply scared to death.

Originally posted by amazed
reply to post by RFBurns

 

Maybe you missed this part?

"The school knows pretty well that my daughter is like a 5-year-old," explained the girl's mother, Sandra Garcia.

Garcia told Eyewitness News that her 11-year-old daughter has a learning disability and when she was approached by the deputy Thursday morning in class she was simply scared to death.

Scared to death?? Oh BS. This kid tried to shove another student into traffic, this kid acted violent and shoved her desk around, this kid spat at the teacher, this kid punched a cop....and the parents want to use the excuse she was scared????


A learning disability....


Does that still excuse the act? Does that set aside the fact that this 11 yr old is 11 yrs old and big enough to be a HS football player and can do some severe injury to the other much smaller students? What about their safety? What about their right to be in a safe place to learn?

Everone seems to be trying to find someone else to blame for this kid's actions. That is more of the problem now than what this kid did and this so called learning disability.

A learning disability does not cause a kid to behave violently. That learning disability could just be that this 11 yr old has a hard time reading her grade level, or doing math, or understanding spoken english.

I dont buy it. Nor should anyone else. If these parents knew this kid would be a problem, then they had no buisness sending this kid to a public school intended for normal kids who do not have the mentality of a 5 yr old.

Again, however, I dont buy that excuse one bit. The parents are trying to point blame on something else so that they are not spotlighted as a potential source for lack of appropritate discipline.

I still support the response by the cop. Until there is definative medical proof with this claim of mental incapacity, I still think the cop did the right thing. Even if it can be proven without a doubt that this kid should be at a different school, that does not dismiss the act, nor does it give any reason to dismiss the lack of the parents responsibility to place this kid into the appropriate school facility.

I think the parents need to be investigated.




Cheers!!!!!

[edit on 30-1-2009 by RFBurns]

reply to post by amazed



Ahhhh...yes...the MOTHER says the girl has a learning disability. And the mother has NO REASON to lie huh? Who is confirming this diagnosis? Or is the mother a clinical psychologist? Or maybe when she isn't making excuses for her daughter, maybe then she is busy making excuses for the abusive boyfriend/husband?

Tis a mystery!

The girl at Moss Park Elementary punched the deputy in the nose so hard the deputy went to the hospital. While an 11-year-old shocked by a Taser sounds extreme to some parents, other parents told Eyewitness News the girl deserved it.

Eyewitness News talked to several parents Thursday who said that Thaliamar Jimenez has caused trouble before. Most of those parents are coming down firmly on the side of the deputy.

"My daughter told me, 'Mommy, you know I wouldn't hit nobody! If I hit her in the nose, it was by mistake. I didn't hit her intentionally. I didn't do that!'" Garcia said.

And the parents of the other students, they must be evil. I mean, their OWN child could be at risk too right? And yet they AGREE with the actions of the school officials and the deputy, which means maybe they realize the ACTIONS WERE WARRANTED!!! Or maybe they just hate children? Hmmm.

Yes the child told her mother that it was all a mistake! Pushing another child into the street, later spitting at teachers, and then punching a female cop so hard in the face that she needed to go to the hospital.

ALL an accident! Of course!

Oh please!

I do believe the MOTHER may be the one with the mentality of a 5 year old! Or maybe....nevermind...I won't say it.



[edit on 30-1-2009 by Sonya610]

reply to post by Sonya610

I do believe the MOTHER may be the one with the mentality of a 5 year old!

They do say the apple doesn't fall too far from the tree.

Nice call Sonya. Starred.

TheRedneck


[edit on 30-1-2009 by TheRedneck]

Sonja and Redneck, I feel that you guys are advocating child abuse. But I also advocate that you two have a right to your opinions. Hope it works well for you.

"Its just training and the right mental attitude. Two trained people can restrain even a Seal or the SAS types if you know what they are doing and are close enough to get contact at the same time, (lol with the sas types obviously without them knowing you are just about to or intend to ) 2 secs later they are on the ground, unable to move without causing themselves pain, not face down but sitting and just struggle till their muscles burn and throat is sore from screaming at the frustration of lack of mobility of any limbs, or head without causing themselves pain"

I agree with this statement. It does sound as though there was retaliation. An 11 yr old girl would not be difficult to restrain. I am 5ft 6 and fairly petite but have, with one other member of staff, trained in restraint bought really 'hefty heffers' to the ground with no harm done to them and in a way that is dignified. And for those who do not think this is possible, it is about isolating various muscles, which once on the floor can be done with fingertip pressure. Restraint, in my view is last resort- de-escalation, talk down, humour, a listening ear, enforcing boundaries-that is the start. Taser is too far for a child. We only get the police in at work if a patient is kicking off and is armed, because quite frankly a cushion as protection is not enough!

Originally posted by RFBurnsA learning disability does not cause a kid to behave violently. That learning disability could just be that this 11 yr old has a hard time reading her grade level, or doing math, or understanding spoken english.

Even if the kid has a learning disability, she is in the FOURTH GRADE. If she had the mentality of a 5 year old how is it she capable of passing the third grade and making it into fourth? Why isn't she in special ed classes?

reply to post by amazed

Sonja and Redneck, I feel that you guys are advocating child abuse.

I have been trying to decide how to respond to this. I believe there is no greater crime than to harm an innocent child, and no earthly punishment can pay for that crime. Ergo, there must be a special wing of Hell for child abusers.

You see, I consider tasers as a great tool that has been terribly misused. Many times I have joined in calling for criminal charges when someone was repeatedly tasered or tasered without being a threat. They are much less lethal than guns, which may have been their downfall. Since they are touted as non-lethal, they tend to be overused and abused too often. they can be lethal when used (especially repeatedly) on someone with health issues, and are extremely painful in any respect.

A child, especially a mentally-challenged one, must be protected and sheltered. Too often, they cannot be responsible for their own behavior. I have a cousin who is like that. He is in his 60s now, but has the mind of a 5 year old. We all know about him, and we all are protective of him. His parents, however, went to great lengths to make sure he knew how to act around others, and how to control his anger.

What we have here is abuse of a child, agreed. The question I have is who is responsible for the abuse. I do not see a single taser shot on a person of that size (age does not matter to electricity, but size does) in reasonable health as abuse when it was the most humane way to subdue her under the circumstances. A taser used on a healthy person of her size is not lethal, and in this case was not injurious, although I believe it was extremely painful. The needs of this girl were balanced, IMHO, by the needs of the officer, the teachers, and the other children to be safe from her attacks.

Nothing I have seen or read about this case tells me there was malicious intent by the officer in using the taser. Some have reported she showed restraint in attempting to calm the child diplomatically, even after receiving injury. Everything I have seen and read indicates the situation originated and escalated because of the girl's actions.

Still, I have questions: Why was a mentally-challenged girl allowed to be in a school environment with non-mentally-challenged children? Why was she in the fourth grade, when she obviously was incapable of performing at that level. Why was she allowed to stay in the school even after she had been the source of disciplinary problems in the past? Why was she bullying another student and so combative when challenged about it?

I'm sorry, but my assessment of the situation leads me to believe that the true culprit here was either the school or the parents, and most likely the parents. I feel for the poor girl, really, but I also understand the reality of social life. One cannot be allowed to simply go on a fighting spree without challenge and consequences. No one. Not even an 11 year old mentally-challenged girl. Public safety is just that: public. It's for everyone.

I worry about being seen as supporting child abuse. I do not. I do support reasonable force to calm a dangerous situation, based on that situation.

I really don't know what else to say. If someone can't understand this reasoning... well... I'm sorry...

TheRedneck

www.wftv.com...

The girl was tased twice, in the back.

Mom's explanation is that the person she pushed was a friend, and they were not trying to harm each other, just playing around and both were "pushing" the other. Mom also said that if they had called the assistant principal, her daughter would have calmly gone with her as they have a great relationship. (I agree the children should not have been pushing each other even in play)

Sounds like "on coming" traffic issue might be in question as well, because of where it took place, bus lane. Not real sure about this part yet. Mom plans on having the boy and his family in court with her to testify.

After the incident the two kids had breakfast together and then went to their classrooms.

Sounds like mom is still asking questions and trying to get information from the school as well and is not having her questions answered.

As adults, I feel it is our responsibility to protect children, I feel that many people dropped the ball on this. Personally, until we KNOW that tasers do not effect how the brain works (and their are still questions as to how tasers interact with cognitive functioning), we should not condone the use of them on children, as children still have a lot of brain development taking place.

www.azcentral.com...

Their is also a study in regards to the safety of Tasers, and how some of them put off more voltage than they are supposed to.

and another study

www.biologynews.net...

Then we have these...
www.stumbleupon.com...=Liberties/Rights&url=http%253A%252F%252Fwww.apa.org%252Fmonitor%252F2008%252F06%252Fstun-guns.html

New research finds that Tasers may impair people's cognitive functioning.

In a study of 62 police officers, researchers at Rosalind Franklin University of Medical Science in Chicago and the University of Illinois found that police officers who had been "tased" during training drills fared worse than a control group in attention, processing speed and memory. The results, though preliminary, suggest that law enforcement agencies should reconsider their use of Tasers in training exercises and that researchers need to further investigate the potential long-term effects, says study co-author Neil Pliskin, PhD, a University of Illinois psychology professor.

"It's a provocative finding because the kinds of difficulties that were observed ... are the same kinds of changes we see in people who have suffered electrical shocks from accidents involving domestic power sources," Pliskin says.

Peace

Originally posted by amazed
The girl was tased twice, in the back.

Mom's explanation is that the person she pushed was a friend, and they were not trying to harm each other, just playing around and both were "pushing" the other.

Yes mom says the girl is KNOWN to have the mentality of a five year old, yet she is still in the fourth grade.

Other parents have said they AGREE with the actions, and that this child has cause multiple problems before.

Can you quote anyone besides "Mom" regarding this childs history, intellectual abilities, and possible actions???

Update, girl gets probation, family has to pay $2000 in cost and the 11 year old child has to continue with counseling.

The family is filing charges against the school. Personally I hope they win. It is well known that a person can be subdued without using a taser on them, and police should be trained in how to do this.

www.clickorlando.com...

I hope they win, because we do NOT know what happens to a child's cognitive functions after being tased. We should not be using our children as guinea pigs in learning how tasers affect brain functioning.

Peace

reply to post by jam321



This is a tough one. I think what the problem is, and why she ended up being tasered, is because people (teachers especially) are afraid of physical contact with students. They are afraid of losing their jobs and having parents sue the school districts. It's a damn shame that people have to be so afraid to act in these situations.

If a student is physically attacking another student then it is the duty of the teachers to grab the aggressor and hold them back. Period.

Now, as for the tasing. Well, that technology has caused many deaths. It would have been pretty bad if this girl died from it. She didn't so that won't be considered. But tasing a young person that is in the midst of puberty probably has not been tested. Who knows what the heightened hormone levels would do when currents like that are introduced to the body.

Just saying that even though the cop seemed to have no choice (well, other than that of the physical kind), they need to think of these things.

Originally posted by Sonya610

Originally posted by MischeviousElfThis was a case of hitting back as such by the police/security, who lost his cool after being struck.

It was NOT a big burly MALE cop! It was a FEMALE officer who might have been quite a bit smaller than the 11 year old.

By this logic, a female firefighter should not be able to be employed because she is too frail to lift a large man. I have to call rubbish on this one. Believe it or not, police handled these situations LONG before there were tasers.

If the cop, be them male or female go into a situation where they may be assaulted by anyone and do not take the care to be aware that they may be assaulted, they should go back for more training. There are MANY small frail women serving in the military, police, firefighting units that are far more capable of defending themselves than many men I know.

By asserting that a woman police person is any less capable than a male police person to subdue a child, even a large child, without the use of a taser is simply not accurate and an affront to women everywhere. Unless this 11 year old had spent the previous 5 years immersed in physical training, there is simply no excuse for this abusive use of a taser.

..Ex

Update....

taseredwhileblack.blogspot.com...

Mark Lippman (attorney), said the girl is mentally disabled (with a lower-than-average IQ)

Since the incident the girl has not attended Moss Park and has experienced lasting trauma from the incident, he said, including not being able to sleep in her bedroom alone.

The teacher called Hudepohl, the schools resource officer.

Again I reiterate, until we know how tasers actually affect the brain, which we do not know yet, we should NEVER use tasers on children. I don't agree with using them at all on children, but I understand that some people do. I would say that it would be irresponsible of humanity to continue such abuses towards children.

Peace