11 yr Old Tasered In School

Does not matter if she is female or male.

She is an adult in a position of responsibilty, and gaurdianship, who did not handle the situation right.

How did the child hit her?

And 11 is very much a child?

She must of been close to the child to be hit.

Fair enough wrong, then must have moved back some or the Child moved away to be able to use the Tazer. The policewoman lost her cool as much as the child.

Saying it is lack of control over the child is misguided to.

It may be case, as many point out lack of boundaries can create problem behaviour, maybe just maybe the child herself has had much physical abuse reigned down on her, and as is usually the case with abuser's and bullies, repeat the behaviour she learnt, that goes in cycles.

The CHILD was obviously in a psychological distress situation, or reacting to problems at home to go on such a rampage for soo long. I dont think from looking at this it was just her testing her boundaries. She has much emotional damage probably, and needs care and help not more of the same.

She is looking to regain some form of control and power in her life, as obviously feels she has no control on other areas, usually stemming from mistreatment at home.

Bullies are the most insecure people around usually.

The policelady also used force and violence like the Child did, to try and regain control and power herself.

As she wears a uniform and is a Cop it is ok?
Nope not in my book.

If it would have happened outside by the road when the Child tried to push the other child, well then I would totally support this.

Who cares how much damage was done to the classroom?

Better than further damaging the childs obviously weak mind.

This child will now even more distrust people in life who are in a position of authority and is probably thinking just like the abusers in her life, even the ones when you are screaming out for help and attention in the only way she knew how, further abuse her.

A life pattern has been set up IMHO, and will be difficult to reverse.

Call for back, talk her down, explain the situation she faced, she would have burnt out before the other cop arrived, and seeing two of them probably subjegated.

Too much violence against violence in this world, its why we have suicide bombers and wars you know, and abusers, both sexual and physical.

Kind Regards,

Elf.

I understand your concerns about lack of proper training...

But please remember, as enlighted as some of us are about these types of situations, there are still people out there who aren't exposed to classes/courses/sensitivity training in these lines of work.

Funding problems, and a sudden increase in the number of people with these sorts of conditions are catching the entire System off guard.

It's not an overnight fix, and I'm sure instances like this will only serve to fuel the fires for better funding of those nessecary classes in the future.

Oh gods, I certainly hope so.

I've seen some rather terrifying things in the health care system over the years. It absolutely breaks my heart to think some elements of this Society haven't reached the level of care and treatment I know is possible.

Not to mention some people in the field aren't really cut out for it, in my opinion.

*edit = my grammar nemesis)

[edit on 1/30/09 by GENERAL EYES]

I remember when cops used to wrestle people to the ground. These days they are getting more lazy.... they're already so fat that they can barely get out of their car, the 'taser' is taking what little exercise they get away from them. In the long run I think tasers will help kill more cops than actual criminals, with diseases like diabetes and heart problems as a result of being overweight.

Wow for once i actually think this kid needed a good tasing, i mean that is just out of control. What they should do now, honestly, is lock her up all Hannibal Lecter style for a while, while they determine what her freakin' problem is.

[edit on 30-1-2009 by elcapitano75]

reply to post by elcapitano75


I agree. And apparently the "poor childs" mental problems were NOT so severe that the tasering didn't work! It left her in a corner crying.

If she were totally deranged she would NOT have been sitting quietly and crying, she would have continued to try and fight/spit etc... She knew what she was doing, and she was doing it because she thought she could get away with it.

There's no reason to taser a 11 year old kid. Are cops "afraid" of confrontation? This was in a school, loads of staff why didn't they just tackle and restrain her. I'm shocked at so many people saying she deserves this. Let this happen to your kid and see how you'd feel. The kid is 11, we all know kids do stupid crazy things. She might need to be checked out and put on some medication, fair enough but tasered?

side note: I remember lurking on these forums afew years back and people where outraged about kids being arrested. It seems now kids being arrested is just a normal thing. I wonder how long before people start to accept kids being tasered.

Florida Police are required to taser someone who is physically resisting arrest, its part of thier police Use of Force Matrix. That means that the Officer has no choice when someone starts acting a certain way, and they can actually get into trouble for hurting someone trying to physically restrain them without following the Matrix. When someone is physically resisting, chemicals or taser are always deployed.

Florida State Use of Force Matrix

So if you don't want to get tased or pepper-sprayed, don't resist an officers lawful commands in this state.

reply to post by AllTiedTogether


Did anybody even listen to the video it was a female officer that responded to the call. From the sound of it this student punched her and was probably bigger than the officer .To prevent injury of the officer and other students sounds to me to be a reasonable response.

Serves her right.

Age is no reason to coodle around with ANYONE that is behaving like crap towards you.

If she is that unruly, the parents are probably agreeing too. Maybe they found it even worked.

Way back when I was in Junior High School one of the juvenile delinquents in my school pulled a knife on one of the gym teachers, pretty much in front of the whole group in PE.

The gym teacher was an ex-marine. The kid with the knife lunge towards the teacher. The teacher responded with a couple of quick martial arts moves.

Results kid with a broken arm and a smashed nose. The rest of the kids applauded. (This kid was evil and got what he deserved). The police came and we never saw him again. The rumor was that he was sent up the river in addition to being expelled from not just the school but all the schools in the city.

Now days, the gym teacher would have been arrested for assault and the juvenile delinquent would have been back in school the next day while his/her parents filed the multimillion dollar lawsuit against the school district.
The conspiracy theorists would point out that the military was being used to take the rights away from school children and that pretty soon we'd all be in FEMA camps. The lefties would all be claiming it was racial discrimination because no white students got their arms broken. Jessie Jackson would be consulted by the National News Media about this crisis.

Boy, times have changed.






[edit on 30-1-2009 by Wildbob77]

As much as I am against the (mis)use of tasers...

Age is not the only consideration here; size also matters. This was a situation of a bully being out of control. Here's my breakdown of events:

She tried to push a classmate into traffic. I don't see that as attempted murder, because at age 11 she was probably not completely conscious of the consequences of her actions. A stiff reprimand or corporal punishment would be all that is needed at this juncture.

She then pushed her desk and spat at a teacher (authority figure). At this point, the child is out of control and must be calmed down. Authority must be maintained, and if there is any inappropriate action on the part of the authority, that can be sorted out later.

She assaulted a police officer. Now she has crossed the line from being a child in need of discipline to a criminal. In today's climate (thanks in no small part to a society that places emphasis on feel-good fake compassion / political correctness and none on maintaining order), the police officer had no idea if she was high on drugs (PCP users have been known to become extremely fierce during physical combat, with no apparent realization of pain), armed with a gun or knife, or deranged. The child's behavior had to be stopped immediately for the safety of others.

A policeman (or woman in this case) has to make split-second life or death decisions on a regular basis. She was assaulted by another human who was physically large and apparently mentally absent. Her action was no doubt one of reflex as much as forethought. True, she could have wrestled the child to the ground, but she no doubt had a gun in her side holster, loaded; could it have been taken fronm her in the struggle? She could have shot the girl, but that would have been far worse an outcome. Perhaps she could have chosen her words better when she confronted the girl; that, however is hindsight, much clearer than foresight. Therefore I see no problem with the use of the taser in this case. If the assault had not happened, or if the child had been a normal-sized 11 year old, or had the taser been used multiple times, I would be screaming police brutality as loud as anyone. But let's be honest: we expect the police to protect us from the dangerous elements in society. By expecting that, we have to allow them some measure of judgment and authority to make split-second sudden decisions that may involve harming another person in a confrontation. There will be times when that sudden decision turns out in hindsight to have been excessive; that is the price we pay for training men and women to be police. It is not an indictment in every case against the one making that decision.

I can agree with Elf that this girl is in desperate need of some psychological intervention, and that should occur now. I also agree with several posters that there is a problem with discipline at home, and perhaps that should be investigated. But in this instance, I will not fault the officer, nor the school, for their actions.

She danced, she paid the piper. Case closed.

TheRedneck

Security guards and cops are all over- zealous fascists, i dont ccare if they are using the excuse "just doing my job", its wrong to use a tazer or a gun without a direct need, had they handled the situation better, they would not have had a violent confrontation.

I think the kid is stressed about something in life, maybe dealing with rejection or responsibility. Either way i think in situations like this, tazers are over used.

[edit on 30-1-2009 by mastermind77]

[edit on 30-1-2009 by mastermind77]

Jeesh what is wrong with you people? This was an 11 year old CHILD!!!!!!!!!!!! Do you people NOT SEE how WRONG this is? I understand some of you really hate kids, and are probably getting off on this, but dang, 11 years old. What happened to people being aware of whatever was taking place in this child's life BEFORE something like this occurred?

We don't know, we don't know if the child she pushed had been bullying her or not, MAYBE she was at her last straw because of some bully that no one would stop and she just snapped. Maybe she has abusive parents. Maybe she has a mental disorder and needed help BEFORE some jerk decided to taser an 11 year old.

This is a symptom of a society gone awry. This is so sad, and the fact that their are people who say an 11 year old deserved tasering is proof of that. Breaks my heart, the little one needed HELP people.

I don't care how big she is physically, mentally she is 11. As the parent of an 11 year old, this is just plain horrid and sick that a society would condone such a thing.

Love, compassion and intelligence has left the house. (house being earth)

Originally posted by amazed
Jeesh what is wrong with you people? This was an 11 year old CHILD!!!!!!!!!!!! Do you people NOT SEE how WRONG this is?

That child could have hit puberty 2 years ago.

You think children are all harmless? Come on down to Atlanta where there are 12 and 13 year old gangbangers that will shoot you in the head fr $2. But don't worry, the fact you are shot by a CHILD makes it much easier to take.

Originally posted by amazed
Jeesh what is wrong with you people? This was an 11 year old CHILD!!!!!!!!!!!!

"Damien" is a "child" too.

Originally posted by Sonya610

Originally posted by amazed
Jeesh what is wrong with you people? This was an 11 year old CHILD!!!!!!!!!!!! Do you people NOT SEE how WRONG this is?

That child could have hit puberty 2 years ago.

You think children are all harmless? Come on down to Atlanta where there are 12 and 13 year old gangbangers that will shoot you in the head fr $2. But don't worry, the fact you are shot by a CHILD makes it much easier to take.

Most of us know how much you dislike children, you have admitted this in another thread before. I am not surprised that you think abuse of a child is appropriate. I would gather you feel it is appropriate for a child to be tasered, but I would bet if a dog were to be tasered you would be up in arms.

Like I said in my previous post..... What happened to people paying attention to this child BEFORE such a thing as this took place? mmm?

We don't know the full situation, but working in the school system, I have seen over and over and over again, children being bullied and no one stepping in to help them. Then when the child "snaps" and hits back, the child gets in trouble, because usually when they "snap" back, it can be pretty violent. I don't know that this is what happened, but I would guess that this could be a plausible scenario.

Again, let's pay attention and step in BEFORE such a thing even seems reasonable to do.

No, I don't think all children are "harmless", I think children act out when it is acceptable in a society that allows abuse and bullies. Children learn what they see, by the adults around them.

The fact that we have a society which includes 12 and 13 year old children running around with guns is a symptom of something gone awry. Not a symptom of children just being (insert your own abusive words here).

reply to post by amazed

I think that crack about disliking children was off-base. If you knew me, you would never dream of stating such a thing. I happen to love children. That does not mean I think they can run around willy-nilly slapping cops in the face, pushing other kids into traffic, and shoving and spitting at teachers. Love does not mean blanket acceptance.

Of course the child has problems, and as I stated, these should be dealt with. But the situation encountered by the cop was not one of a child needing help, it was one of a child being out of control. Allowing continued behavior such as this, regardless of the cause of such behavior, will only make matters worse. This is how those 12 and 13 year old gangbangers Sonja mentioned come to be: there is no discipline, no moral ground, no line they cannot cross until finally they become animals instead of people and have to be put down (if they don't kill themselves first).

Research the term 'tough love' and try to understand that you can't help someone by enabling their destructive behavior. The girl needs a hug right now, but when this went down, she needed discipline.

TheRedneck

Originally posted by TheRedneck
reply to post by amazed

I think that crack about disliking children was off-base. If you knew me, you would never dream of stating such a thing. I happen to love children. That does not mean I think they can run around willy-nilly slapping cops in the face, pushing other kids into traffic, and shoving and spitting at teachers. Love does not mean blanket acceptance.

Of course the child has problems, and as I stated, these should be dealt with. But the situation encountered by the cop was not one of a child needing help, it was one of a child being out of control. Allowing continued behavior such as this, regardless of the cause of such behavior, will only make matters worse. This is how those 12 and 13 year old gangbangers Sonja mentioned come to be: there is no discipline, no moral ground, no line they cannot cross until finally they become animals instead of people and have to be put down (if they don't kill themselves first).

Research the term 'tough love' and try to understand that you can't help someone by enabling their destructive behavior. The girl needs a hug right now, but when this went down, she needed discipline.

TheRedneck

I was not speaking of your past postings in these forums, I was speaking of sonja, and her past admittance of her dislike of children, but love of dogs.

You guys missed my point again.

What happened to paying attention to this child BEFORE such a situation took place?

Not once do I advocate ignoring bad behavior, but I definitely do not advocate abuse of a child. In my book tasering an 11 year old is abuse.

I would never accept such behavior from my children, they know this.. Like I said, this girl needed someone to pay attention to her BEFORE this took place. Not calling her an "animal" after the fact. But realizing she is a human child, and needed someone to look after her BEFORE she took such inappropriate actions.

The girl needed a hug BEFORE this situation took place, it is obvious that she also needed help, and appropriate discipline.

Tough love is an expression used when someone treats another person harshly or sternly with the intent to help them in the long run.

Following a rise in the number of deaths of teenagers participating in tough love–based programs, some have questioned the very principle of tough love.

en.wikipedia.org...

Teen dies in tough love program (Newsweek, July 2001)
www.rickross.com...

Teen starves to death as result of tough love ("Loving them to death", Outside Magazine, October 1995)
outside.away.com...

The Trouble With Tough Love
www.washingtonpost.com...

reply to post by amazed

You'll get no argument from me on the fact that this situation was allowed to fester way way too long, leading to this incident. I, too, am concerned over what type of home environment caused her to be like this. I would personally expect the result of that query to be neglect, a type of child abuse that is extremely common in today's 'enlightened' society.

But the past cannot be changed, and I think that is where we differ. I do not normally advocate the use of tasers. From decades of electronics work, I know all too well the effects a taser can have on the human body. Typically non-lethal, yes, but occasionally lethal and notoriously painful. It is a shame that a child had to be subjected to this, and I wish there had been some way to prevent it at the time.

But I am not considering the things which are set in the stone of history. My concern is for the now, and for the future. How can this poor girl be helped? Certainly not by allowing her to slap cops and threaten teachers; that will only reinforce her apparent belief that she is somehow immune to the consequences of her actions. Certainly her past cannot be re0-written; that is simply beyond our ability to do. Under the circumstances, I cannot second-guess the policewoman who administered the tase, and I doubt you could either, if you were honest.

Neither you nor I nor the police nor the politicians nor anyone on the planet can change what has happened. If a child is allowed to bully without consequences for too long, they will become an animal. That is fact, proven over and over again in society. The correct course of action for any compassionate human being is to first neutralize the situation with as little damage as possible (the girl did not die, nor did I see any reports of permanent injury), and then try and correct any dangerous behavior tendencies the girl may have. Should that be shown to be impossible (or even impractical), then it behooves any caring society to separate the perpetrator from such society, in order to care for the majority who do not go around threatening others. We must care for all in society, not merely for those who are demonstrating anti-social tendencies.

Yes, I feel for the girl. But tell me, what would you have done differently than the officer, given the same circumstances?

TheRedneck

If this had happened in L.A. they would have shot her dead...
She was in FACT a danger to herself and others...11 years old or not. She was a large woman size child that appears to have been very pissed off about something...
She's ok.
I agree with the poster that said something about the 13 year old gangbangers; some of you have NEVER seen BADA$$ kids in your lifetime. I have. They would send chills down your spine...