Why did Israel kill so many?

After reading the quotes about Israel from a foxnews article posted below, does it make sense that 1200 people were killed in Gaza? A palestinian human rights group says only 95 were palestinian fighters(check prisonplanet.com). Meaning over 1000 civilians were killed. Even if the source is lying the number is still way too high. So why was Isreal firing so much and killing so many civilians if there wasnt much of a fight? Israel supporters please explain. I have never backed either side.

"The Islamic militant group's fighters put up little resistance to Israel's crushing offensive, and the army _ still smarting from its stalemate with Hezbollah guerrillas in their 2006 conflict in southern Lebanon _ emerged relatively unscathed and more confident."

"In contrast, Israel suffered just nine combat deaths, five of them from "friendly fire.""

"Yet soldiers returning from the battlefield said they were surprised by the lack of resistance from Hamas, a group that receives backing from Iran and had vowed to inflict heavy losses on Israeli troops."

"In an interview, an infantry reservist who fought in Gaza said he and his comrades experienced only light combat during over a week inside. They took no casualties, he said, speaking on condition of anonymity because army regulations prohibit troops from giving interviews."

"Whoever reads the Israeli media would think the military fought the most glorious war in its history, but that isn't accurate," said Israeli military analyst Reuven Pedatzur. "There wasn't even one battle."

The math is actually easy. Densely crowded urban environment. Liberal use of munitions against targets that included schools and hosptials means there is going to be alot of "collateral" damage. Then add WP into the mix and it makes for alot of this.

It never makes sense when any innocents die in war.
But many of these were far from innocents.
As Israel was leaving Gaza, they were firing rockets into Israel.
Both sides are to blame for this death of innocent civilians though.
Both sides.

It never makes sense that people ignore the real genocides and flock to anti-Israel topics to bash the Israeli government when the Darfur genocide gets overshadowed.
What is it by now? Over 300,000 people killed and more than 2.7 million displaced from their homes since 2003.

If the Israeli government really wanted to kill off all the Gazans, they would have done so more efficiently. For the millionth time these are called casualties of war, not genocide. Collateral damage is to always be expected in tight urban quarters. Hamas knew this and persisted with goading Israel into counterstriking.
Israel isn't exactly made for nation-building considering they've been through war after war these few years they've been in existence.

Of course, that doesn't take into consideration the Hamas fighters that dress as civilians. When the Gazans do their count, they are counted as civilians.

Originally posted by spec_ops_wannabe
It never makes sense that people ignore the real genocides and flock to anti-Israel topics to bash the Israeli government when the Darfur genocide gets overshadowed.

No one has to the best of my reading blown off Darfur. But Genocide is not defined by numbers and is abhorent no matter where.

G]enocide means any of the following acts committed with intent to destroy, in whole or in part, a national, ethnical, racial or religious group, as such:
(a) Killing members of the group;
(b) Causing serious bodily or mental harm to members of the group;
(c) Deliberately inflicting on the group conditions of life calculated to bring about its physical destruction in whole or in part;
(d) Imposing measures intended to prevent births within the group;
(e) Forcibly transferring children of the group to another group.
www.ushmm.org...

3 out of 5 If we were playing baseball the government of Isreal would be batting .600

Originally posted by dooper
Of course, that doesn't take into consideration the Hamas fighters that dress as civilians. When the Gazans do their count, they are counted as civilians.

Or the Mossad agents dressed as Hamas fighters conducting false flag operations. Hey if the Mossad will conduct false flags ops on US interests why not eh?

They met their objective. To create enough of a casualty base to keep the Gazan's too busy tending the sick and wounded and finding/burying their dead that they could not fight back.

Much as it seems barbaric (and it is) it has been a standard practice for many wars and many warring nations ours included.

They cannot fight back effectively when there are more casualties than rebels.

Bloody and effective at stifling back fighting.

All through history this has occurred and sadly it is usually the innocent that are the "targets".

Originally posted by spec_ops_wannabe
It never makes sense that people ignore the real genocides and flock to anti-Israel topics to bash the Israeli government when the Darfur genocide gets overshadowed.

For one thing, this is a topic about the recent Israeli invasion into Gaza. Another thing, are you saying there aren't any threads started by members concerned over Darfur, or that Darfur should be the only topic of genocide that should be discussed in this forum?

reply to post by Operation AJAX


This definition of genocide assumes a willful calculated effort, without justification.

Unfortunately, this definition doesn't apply when any of these events occur in response to being attacked.

Besides. Even then, they only hit two. And two out of five win nothing.

reply to post by Operation AJAX

So Mossad agents were killed, and counted as Palestinian civilian deaths?

Originally posted by dooper
[Besides. Even then, they only hit two. And two out of five win nothing.

Perhaps you did not read it carefull ONLY one gets you into the club (The bold is mine)

Genocide means any of the following acts committed with intent to destroy, in whole or in part, a national, ethnical, racial or religious group, as such:

You chose to target schools, you choose to target a hospital, you choose to drop WP and other munitions into densly packed urban environments. You chose to over-react. relief supplies at the UN et al.

How many Isreali citizens has Hamas killed in 20 years? (One is too many but humor me) How many has Isreal killed just in a few weeks?

Are the Isreali leaders that stupid? They have layed the grounds for the next 10-15 years of Hamas with this. Yet for the sake of an election they go in and kill all of those civilians. How many time has this worked for them in the past? Yep the center of a donut.


[edit on 19/1/09 by Operation AJAX]

Originally posted by FredT
The math is actually easy. Densely crowded urban environment. Liberal use of munitions against targets that included schools and hosptials means there is going to be alot of "collateral" damage. Then add WP into the mix and it makes for alot of this.

There ya go. thats exactly it.

On a side note, I find myself getting more and more disgusted by this each day. I hear about more deaths more bombings, and I just shakey my head in shame.

I just wish both sides would stop. I never understood why we always feel that the only way we can work out our differences is through war.

I mean, war has NOT worked. From the dawn of man, we have been fighting wars in one fasion or another and what have they gotten us? Not much because we still go to war to "resolve" our issues.

For those of you who do not know, the definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over expecting a different result each time. Well war is insane. We keep going to war expecting it to solve our issues.

Why cant we see that its not solving anything?

I truly think its time we try something else. I dont know what that something else is, but continuing with war (IMO) would be nothing more than insane. Lets try something that isnt insane for once. Whoknows, We may be surprised and actually find a way to resolve differences that WORKS.

I just needed to vent. This thread seemed like a good place to share how I was feeling, so thanks for putting up with me for a minute. im just fed up with war.

They say that the best way to change the world is to start with yourself, So I suppose that means, in a sense, to lead by example. Show others that it is possible to resolve an issue without war. mabye someone will catch on. If just one person learns than I have made a positive difference in the world.

Originally posted by DJMessiah
For one thing, this is a topic about the recent Israeli invasion into Gaza. Another thing, are you saying there aren't any threads started by members concerned over Darfur, or that Darfur should be the only topic of genocide that should be discussed in this forum?

Ive seen this being said again and again today. its almost as if its a strawman or something. Kind of like a concerted effort to distract people.

Genocide is genocide no matter where it occurs.

Originally posted by dooper
So Mossad agents were killed, and counted as Palestinian civilian deaths?

We would not know eh? But its possible. Look if they are willing to lob artillery and WP at schools and hospitals, Im sure they will not shed a tear if a few of thier own got it as long as thier mission was a success

But it can't be genocide if it's in response to an attack. And it Israeli actions were in response to an attack.

Too bad. So sad.

Originally posted by dooper
But it can't be genocide if it's in response to an attack. And it Israeli actions were in response to an attack.

Too bad. So sad.

Ah yes, I see you are going all intelectually on me now I realize that we may have gotten to the point where your AIPAC talking points guide is out of answers but frankly I expected more from you really :shk:

Given that even CNN reports that it was the Israeli's that broke the ceasefire tsk tsk tsk. Very sloppy posting

No matter what the denials you come up with, EVEN if attacked first genocide is genocide.

reply to post by Operation AJAX


Oh, Ajax. I apologize that you expected more. You want more?

"If they [Jews] all gather in Israel, it will save us the trouble of going after them worldwide." Hizballah leader Sheikh Sayyed Hassan Nasrallah, Lebanon Star, October 23, 2002

"The jihad and suicide bombing will continue - the Zionist entity will reach its end in the first quarter of the current century. It is there fore up to you [Muslim Holy Fighters] to be patient - the Hamas takes upon itself the liberation of all Palestinian land from the sea to the rivber in the Rafah [in the south] and until Rosh Hanikra [in the north.]" Hamas spiritual leader Sheik Ahmed Yassin, Al-Ayyam, December 28, 2002

"We are teaching the children that suicide bombs make Israeli people frightened and we are allowed to do it ... We teach them that after a person becomes a suicide bomber he reaches the highest level of paradise." Palestinian "Paradise Camp" counselor to BBC interviewer, quoted July 20, 2001

This goes back a while -

"This will be a war of extermination and a momentous massacre which will be spoken of like the Mongolian massacres and the Crusades." Azzam Pasha, Secretary-General of the Arab League, may 15, 1948

"Our forces are now entirely ready not only to repulse the aggression, but to initiate the act of liberation itself, and to explode the Zionists presence in the Arab homeland. The Syrian army, with its finger on the trigger, is united ... I, as a military man, believe that the time has come to enter into a battle of annihilation." Syrian Defense Minister Hafez Assad, May 20, 1967

"Arab policy at this stage has but two objectives. The first, the elimination of the traces of the 1967 aggression through an Israeli withdrawal from all the territories it occupied that year. The second objective is the elimination of the traces of the 1948 aggression, by the means of the elimination of the State of Israel itself." Muhammed Heikal, Sadat confidant and editor of the Al-Ahram, February 25, 1971.

Talking about the 1948 aggression?

"The repersentative of the Jewish agency told us yesterday that they were not the attackers, that the Arabs had begun the fighting. We did not deny this. We told the whole world that we were going to fight." Jamal Husseini before the UN Security Council, April 16, 1948

Is that what you were looking for?

Kind of looks like the genocide is all directed against Israel, according to Muslims, Palestinians, Egyptians, Syrians, and if you want more, I've got lots more.

In their own words.

Actually the question is why didn't Israel kill so many? They are alledged to have WMDs, yet use none. They have all this superior weaponry and already won a war against multiple nations yet they don't use it. They could easily exterminate the Muslims and control the ME but they don't.

Originally posted by dooper
reply to post by Operation AJAX

 

Oh, Ajax. I apologize that you expected more. You want more?

Yes, but not your oh so tired Strawmans :shk: Really, are you so out of ideas that you keep having to repost the same boring old propaganda?