The Bible, Man's book or God's Word?

reply to post by No King but Jesus


Sorry, I think I posted the wrong one...there are two threads I posted the videos in....Ill post the original one for you...

www.abovetopsecret.com...

If you want to skip straight to the videos...here are the links, there are 5 videos.

Having trouble linking each vid separately....on page 2 of the thread the videos are embedded....if you scroll down.

www.abovetopsecret.com...

[edit on 2-7-2010 by LeoVirgo]

[edit on 2-7-2010 by LeoVirgo]

[edit on 2-7-2010 by LeoVirgo]

[edit on 2-7-2010 by LeoVirgo]

reply to post by LeoVirgo


No, I hadn't heard about it.

I'm in the process of watching the first video, interesting stuff thus far.

The thing about NDEs is that they seem to have a clear physiological cause, don't get me wrong I'd like for there to be an afterlife of some sort but I just don't think these constitute objective proof of that. One of my issues with it is that each NDE is different, I think this is because they are a product of the mind and each of us have slightly differing views of paradise. They do often have elements in common which does lend them some credence but that could also be explained by similarities in what people believe.

Even if they appear to have a natural cause NDEs are a very fascinating subject so thanks for posting LV. I do find it incredible that this NDE lasted 9 hours though, its certainly the first time I've heard of one with that kind of duration

[edit on 2-7-2010 by Titen-Sxull]

reply to post by LeoVirgo


very interesting so far on the first one, the fruits make me think-

They will say, "This land that was laid waste has become like the garden of Eden; the cities that were lying in ruins, desolate and destroyed, are now fortified and inhabited."-Eze36.35

[edit on by No King but Jesus]

reply to post by Titen-Sxull


We were not aware that at 9 in the morning, her kidneys started to fail. As she started having these 'visions' I kept going to get the nurses and they kept telling me she was fine....by 4 that afternoon....I actually drove to the doctors office and demanded he come right then to see her. They immediately shipped her to a larger hospital knowing then she was having kidney failure and the hospital she was at could not help her with that. By the time she made it to the other hospital, they said they had no idea how she was still alive, she was totally unconscious by then and immediately had to go on life support. She was then unconscious for 3 days.

The strange thing was....she now saw herself in a pst life but didnt believe in reincarnation. She said her mother was reborn to keep learning what she needed to learn, which again, went against her beliefs. She also experienced a frightening part about being believing Jesus died for sins of people. She was taken to a field of blood where her and many others were trying to clean it all up.

This is why I tell others....if you believe a man had to die...the blood will be on your hands.

Another strange thing is she went below the sphinx and saw many things. She has never heard of any stories about things being below the sphinx. She has never heard of a 'hall of records' or Edgar Cayce. Plus in her experience, she was told that what the Egyptians believed, about 'ra' being their 'god' was not wrong...but that there was much spiritual understanding in what the Egyptians believed.

Those things coming from a devout Christian, is a bit odd.

The last 2 things she said before the took her was 'what time is it and what is todays date'....It was about 5:30 then, I told her it was the summer solstice, June 20th. (that year the solstice was on the 20th).

She then said a few minutes later when she came to again....'Im at the gate'.

[edit on 2-7-2010 by LeoVirgo]

Im off to bed all...I hope to get some feedback though. And I agree Titen...even if this is psychological...it is still very interesting.

But to be honest, we have had alot of strange experiences in my family, I cant just shrug it off as such. But to each their own....I dont expect anyone to just believe it at all....we just want to share with others. I welcome honest opinions and thoughts always.

Nighty night
LV

Originally posted by Titen-Sxull
reply to post by FiatLux

 

Good point Fiat.

I've always thought of Jesus's message in the Gospels being summed up as "Save yourselves."... Jesus teaches that through loving each other we can essentially be our own Saviors, the Savior is within each of us in the form of LOVE. At least that's my personal interpretation of it. Jesus is one of the only redeeming parts of the Bible IMO that makes the book not entirely BS.

If humanity stopped waiting for a Messiah and started taking responsibility for the "log in our own eye" and helping each other we could make some progress.

So Titen - Am I correct to assume that you believe in the Lord Jesus Christ?
Do you believed his words also? All of it or just some - pick n choose?

I know Leo believes and have faith on the Lord Jesus based on what he said - which I'm gratefull.

ty
edmc2

reply to post by LeoVirgo


you say-"This is why I tell others....if you believe a man had to die...the blood will be on your hands."
and in another post you say you like "take up your cross(pole/tree) daily and follow me"

I die every day—I mean that -1Cor15.31

you also died to the law through the body of Christ, that you might belong to another, to him who was raised from the dead, in order that we might bear fruit to God.-Rom7.4

For Christ's love compels us, because we are convinced that one died for all, and therefore all died.-2Cor5.14

The only thing that counts is faith expressing itself through love.-Gal5.6

The law is not based on faith; on the contrary, "The man who does these things will live by them."-Gal3.12

know that a man is not justified by observing the law, but by faith in Jesus Christ. So we, too, have put our faith in Christ Jesus that we may be justified by faith in Christ and not by observing the law, because by observing the law no one will be justified.-Gal2.16

But we see Jesus, who was made a little lower than the angels, now crowned with glory and honor because he suffered death, so that by the grace of God he might taste death for everyone.-Heb2.9

For he received honor and glory from God the Father when the voice came to him from the Majestic Glory, saying, "This is my Son, whom I love; with him I am well pleased."-2Pet1.17

You see, at just the right time, when we were still powerless, Christ died for the ungodly.-Rom5.6

For what the law was powerless to do in that it was weakened by the sinful nature, God did by sending his own Son in the likeness of sinful man to be a sin offering.-Rom8.3

reply to post by edmc^2

I know Leo believes and have faith on the Lord Jesus based on what he said - which I'm gratefull.

Please dont put words in my mouth. I call no one Lord. I believe Jesus was a man just like you and I. If he was a son of God, then so am I a daughter of God and so is all others children of God.

I do pick and choose, what feels right to my spirit, where I can find Spiritual understanding from.

I do not accept that someone had to die for anyone. I do not accept that as Gods plan.

In fact, I think believing that another has to die or that animals had to ever be killed, for our wrongs....is some of the worst seeds one can sow.

Can I find truth in some of the things acclaimed to be said by Jesus, yes. Can I find truth in other places, yes. Do I accept ever word that is written and acclaimed to Jesus, no.

But this is my personal path and it really does not matter what anyone things of it, even though I do feel your genuine concern and I thank you for that, you have a good heart.

All my best
LV

reply to post by No King but Jesus


Hello No King

You took some things I said and pasted them....here they are again.

you say-"This is why I tell others....if you believe a man had to die...the blood will be on your hands." and in another post you say you like "take up your cross(pole/tree) daily and follow me"

In your own words please, what is your point in what you pointed out that I said.

We are to carry our own cross's....and to think another had to die and carry a cross for all is nothing less then killing them yourself. If it had to be done, would you yourself strike him down? Its God plan to be so...right?

To believe someone has to die, the blood is on your hands also. Carry your own cross...carry your own load.....face yourself in the mirror of the Divine eye. Jesus showed us a way to live for Spirit...he showed us just how much he believed in what he spoke of....for he actually did not fight for this life, he actually did turn the other cheek....he actually was able to offer back what was of Earth to Earth. He showed us how to be strong in Spirit.

In your own words, please tell me why you pointed out what I said in those two posts.

All my best
LV

reply to post by Titen-Sxull


It is no more God's word than the words of the Torah or Koran, and frankly history shows none of them are to be trusted with truth. They are all words written by men (not women either) eras ago. How about when these "words of God" were written? Every last letter was written by zealots with a vested interest in spreading their ideology.

Look at "civilization"; to me it seems we achieved much greater heights of knowledge before any of these books were written. In large part because of the Bible the world spent hundreds of years in brutal darkness and emerged fearing its own humanity and sexuality due to the repression and guilt taught by "God's word."

The more literal one believes the words of the Bible, Koran or Torah, the more ignorant and dangerous I KNOW that person to be. the most dedicated believers of the Torah are the arrogant and belligerent Orthodox Jews. The most ardent followers of the Koran are extremists who belive in death or conversion for all "infidels." The most ardent believers in the Bible are now re-writing textbook and trying to legislate through "Scripture." In other owrds, the most dangerous people in the world all over are those who "believe" the most in their religious "words of God."

reply to post by LeoVirgo


we would sacrifice our time energy and life for our children right? is'nt that what we're all here doing sacrificing our time and energies looking for the truth/support/help/info?



[edit on by No King but Jesus]

Originally posted by No King but Jesus
reply to post by LeoVirgo

 

we would sacrifice our time energy and life for our children right? is'nt that what we're all here doing sacrificing our time and energies looking for the truth/support/help/info?



[edit on by No King but Jesus]

Offering and sacrifice are two different things. The Holy Spirit made the true offering of life....I dont see Jesus's life as a sacrifice that HAD TO BE DONE for us to be saved. I see that he lived his life for Spirit, and refused to fight for this life here. Knowing he was choosing to live for Spirit...he tells us to follow him, follow him in his ways of living....for Spirit.

reply to post by FiatLux

Another question. Why not ask if a person has faith in what is within them? Why teach people that someone else is our only hope?

No wonder humanity is in the shape it`s in. We are taught that our faith needs to be in someone other than within oneself. Faith needs to be within, not without.

Fiat, this is EXACTLY what got “humanity” as you say “ in the shape it`s in”. It is the belief that somehow we can “direct our own steps” (Jer 10:23). It is this belief that we can decide on our own what is good and what is bad. The first human couple according to the Bible, rejected God and his kingdom, they wanted to decide on their own what is “good and bad”. In short they trusted themselves with the aid of a rebellious angel and practically told God to get lost. They basically said to their Father, leave us alone and you have no right to govern us. So God gave mankind a chance to prove their challenge but at the same time provided a way back to him. (Gen 3:1-5, John 3:16).

More than 6000 years have passed, are we better off?
Can I ask you Fiat, do you have faith in yourself? Do you have faith that within you is the ability to always do what is right and good? Where do you based your faith if not Jesus? What about your fellowman, can we put faith that mankind will someday right all the wrongs done? Do you have faith that those who are ruling have within them genuine motivation of helping their fellowman for the best? Do you have faith on them, that within them is the ability not be corrupted by power? If you know someone who is able to rise above all of the failings and imperfections of man, please let me know. Really is the faith within them able to rescue themselves from their own shortcomings? What about those multi-million/billion dollar corporations, do you believe and have faith on them? That theirs is a pure motive to better their fellow man - no bottom lines? Please show me one that is not affected by greed? Or maybe those who wear the cloak, surely you have faith that these religious leaders have within them the purity to guide their fellowman to be pure at heart - never to hurt a child. If you know one please let me know.

So again like what you said “why not ask if a person has faith in what is within them? Can anyone please present themselves and show us their faith within them? Faith based on WHAT? If you Fiat truly believe that you have the faith within you that is able to both guide and save you, then you have conquered that which plague mankind. You have conquered the world and rendered Jesus existence to nothing but just a good man.

Is that why you said “Why teach people that someone else is our only hope? If not Jehovah God/Yahweh - the creator of Life, if not Jesus the savior of man, then who? Please let me know who is able save us from this dying condition?
Who can we put our trust on and never be disappointed? Is there one on earth other than Jesus? Ourselves?

For me I can’t say that, because I’m on the same boat as the apostles of Jesus were. I’m no better than anybody else but I try my best to live a life of a true follower of Christ. There are many times that I’ve disappointed myself and others. Can you say that about yourself? What about others? Do you have complete faith in them that they will not disappoint you no matter what?

Now please let me know if there’s truth in these statements:

Jesus said:

“Out of the heart come wicked reasonings, murders, adulteries, fornications, thieveries, false testimonies, blasphemies.” (Matthew 15:19)

The apostle Paul’s own admission:

“The good that I wish I do not do, but the bad that I do not wish is what I practice. If, now, what I do not wish is what I do, the one working it out is no longer I, but the sin dwelling in me.”

I find, then, this law in my case: that when I wish to do what is right, what is bad is present with me. I really delight in the law of God according to the man I am within, but I behold in my members another law warring against the law of my mind and leading me captive to sin’s law that is in my members. Miserable man that I am! Who will rescue me from the body undergoing this death? - (Romans 7:19-24)

Yes, our inborn selfish tendencies furnish a challenge for us when it comes to exercising self-control. Those tendencies reside in the figurative heart. That is why on our own it is a losing battle.
Paul’s conclusion:

Thanks to God through Jesus Christ our Lord! So, then, with [my] mind I myself am a slave to God’s law, but with [my] flesh to sin’s law.
Therefore those in union with Christ Jesus have no condemnation. For the law of that spirit which gives life in union with Christ Jesus has set you free from the law of sin and of death. For, there being an incapability on the part of the Law, while it was weak through the flesh, God, by sending his own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh and concerning sin, condemned sin in the flesh, that the righteous requirement of the Law might be fulfilled in us who walk, not in accord with the flesh, but in accord with the spirit. (Rom 7:25, 8:1-4)

Again going back to your question: ““Why teach people that someone else is our only hope? It’s not just someone else Fiat, Jesus is the only begotten son of God. Who dearly loved his father and reflect that love for mankind.
Consider please

“For God loved the world so much that he gave his only-begotten Son, in order that everyone exercising faith in him might not be destroyed but have everlasting life. For God sent forth his Son into the world, not for him to judge the world, but for the world to be saved through him.  He that exercises faith in him is not to be judged. He that does not exercise faith has been judged already, because he has not exercised faith in the name of the only-begotten Son of God. Now this is the basis for judgment, that the light has come into the world but men have loved the darkness rather than the light, for their works were wicked. For he that practices vile things hates the light and does not come to the light, in order that his works may not be reproved. But he that does what is true comes to the light, in order that his works may be made manifest as having been worked in harmony with God.” (John 3:16-21)

cont...

...
Tell me, can anyone surpass the teachings of Jesus? More importantly what disqualifies him in your book to be the savior of mankind? Please be honest and let me know. Those of you who agree with Fiat, please provide your best hope for mankind. This is not to put you on the spot but to see if you can provide something better than what Jesus offered - a real tangible hope.

Jesus said:

“I am the resurrection and the life. He that exercises faith in me, even though he dies, will come to life; and everyone that is living and exercises faith in me will never die at all. Do you believe this?” (John 11:25, 26)

A promise from God:

With that I heard a loud voice from the throne say: “Look! The tent of God is with mankind, and he will reside with them, and they will be his peoples. And God himself will be with them. And he will wipe out every tear from their eyes, and death will be no more, neither will mourning nor outcry nor pain be anymore. The former things have passed away.” (Rev 21:3-4)

Are these words meaningless?

If you only know / knew who Jesus is, your heart will overflow with praise and thanksgiving to God. I’ll be glad to show you.

Are you not thankful for what God and his son did - even a little bit? I hope so.

I’ll await your reply.
Ty,
edmc2

BTW -

Just to let you know, I’m on my 2nd bible reading (audio) and hopefully be able to finish it by the end of the year. In addition to a Bible reading program - we study the Bible five times a week - with respect to history, authenticity, accuracy, practicality, prophecy, science, family life, Christin life, etc.

Originally posted by edmc^2
reply to post by FiatLux

 

Fiat, this is EXACTLY what got “humanity” as you say “ in the shape it`s in”. It is the belief that somehow we can “direct our own steps” (Jer 10:23). It is this belief that we can decide on our own what is good and what is bad. The first human couple according to the Bible, rejected God and his kingdom, they wanted to decide on their own what is “good and bad”. In short they trusted themselves with the aid of a rebellious angel and practically told God to get lost. They basically said to their Father, leave us alone and you have no right to govern us. So God gave mankind a chance to prove their challenge but at the same time provided a way back to him. (Gen 3:1-5, John 3:16)

Really? Having faith in ourselves, and not in someone else has done this? I beg to differ. Forgetting what it is that we have deep within us, and a lack of faith in it has caused this, not a lack of faith in someone else. So your saying, we are not smart enough to figure out what is right, and what is wrong, and we need someone else to do it for us? Tell me, how does not having faith in oneself help anyone?

More than 6000 years have passed, are we better off?

How can we be, when we are taught not to have any faith in that which is within us? Nice of you to use a loaded question.

Can I ask you Fiat, do you have faith in yourself?

I have faith in that which is within me. Faith belongs in the all, not the self.

Do you have faith that within you is the ability to always do what is right and good?

Having faith in that which is within me gives me the ability to do what is right and good.

Where do you based your faith if not Jesus?

If you haven`t caught on yet, I will answer it again. In that which is within me.

What about your fellowman, can we put faith that mankind will someday right all the wrongs done?

When they find that which is within them and fully understand it, yes.

Do you have faith that those who are ruling have within them genuine motivation of helping their fellowman for the best?

I have faith that one day, they will understand, it is not about the self, but the all that counts.

Do you have faith on them, that within them is the ability not be corrupted by power?

Read above.

If you know someone who is able to rise above all of the failings and imperfections of man, please let me know.

Has your short sightedness, and the willingness to follow a book blinded you within?

Really is the faith within them able to rescue themselves from their own shortcomings?

Yes. Why would we want to deny faith to that which created us?

What about those multi-million/billion dollar corporations, do you believe and have faith on them?

When any business no matter how big or small, is run in a selfless manner, yes.

That theirs is a pure motive to better their fellow man - no bottom lines?

Read above.

Please show me one that is not affected by greed?

Off the top of my head, do a search on Jon Huntsman and his corporation.

Trying to stump me? That`s good, I like games.

Or maybe those who wear the cloak, surely you have faith that these religious leaders have within them the purity to guide their fellowman to be pure at heart - never to hurt a child. If you know one please let me know.

Why do you judge everyone, by the actions of a few?

So again like what you said “why not ask if a person has faith in what is within them? Can anyone please present themselves and show us their faith within them?

My faith is in the living creator within, not a book.

Faith based on WHAT?

Based on that which created everything that is.

If you Fiat truly believe that you have the faith within you that is able to both guide and save you, then you have conquered that which plague mankind. You have conquered the world and rendered Jesus existence to nothing but just a good man.

It`s not the faith that guides me, but that which created all. It`s not the world that needs conquered, only the selfishness that is within us.

Is that why you said “Why teach people that someone else is our only hope? If not Jehovah God/Yahweh - the creator of Life, if not Jesus the savior of man, then who? Please let me know who is able save us from this dying condition?

When I said someone else..................I meant Jesus. Do you need everything spelled out to you? Is nit picking part of this game you play? If it is, two can play it better than one. I believe if you go back over this thread, you will see my faith is in our creator.

Who can we put our trust on and never be disappointed? Is there one on earth other than Jesus? Ourselves?

Already answered that one. You need to ask other questions besides the same things over and over again. Our Creator, our Creator, our Creator. Are you looking for a different answer to each of these questions, or what?

For me I can’t say that, because I’m on the same boat as the apostles of Jesus were. I’m no better than anybody else but I try my best to live a life of a true follower of Christ.

We are all the same in eyes(figure of speech)of our Creator.

There are many times that I’ve disappointed myself and others. Can you say that about yourself?

Sure, many times. If we were perfect, would we even be here?

What about others? Do you have complete faith in them that they will not disappoint you no matter what?

First of all, what makes you think i set myself up for disappointment from others? I don`t ask for more from people than they can handle.

Now please let me know if there’s truth in these statements:

Jesus said:“Out of the heart come wicked reasonings, murders, adulteries, fornications, thieveries, false testimonies, blasphemies.” (Matthew 15:19)

It is true, when one places the self before the all.

The apostle Paul’s own admission: “The good that I wish I do not do, but the bad that I do not wish is what I practice. If, now, what I do not wish is what I do, the one working it out is no longer I, but the sin dwelling in me.”

I find, then, this law in my case: that when I wish to do what is right, what is bad is present with me. I really delight in the law of God according to the man I am within, but I behold in my members another law warring against the law of my mind and leading me captive to sin’s law that is in my members. Miserable man that I am! Who will rescue me from the body undergoing this death? - (Romans 7:19-24)

We have endowed within us, both good and bad. It is up to each of us which one we choose to use in our life time.

Yes, our inborn selfish tendencies furnish a challenge for us when it comes to exercising self-control. Those tendencies reside in the figurative heart. That is why on our own it is a losing battle.
Paul’s conclusion:
Thanks to God through Jesus Christ our Lord! So, then, with [my] mind I myself am a slave to God’s law, but with [my] flesh to sin’s law.
Therefore those in union with Christ Jesus have no condemnation. For the law of that spirit which gives life in union with Christ Jesus has set you free from the law of sin and of death. For, there being an incapability on the part of the Law, while it was weak through the flesh, God, by sending his own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh and concerning sin, condemned sin in the flesh, that the righteous requirement of the Law might be fulfilled in us who walk, not in accord with the flesh, but in accord with the spirit. (Rom 7:25, 8:1-4)

It is only a losing battle if we allow the self to rule us. When we can bring a harmony between the self, and the all, and allow the all to flow from within un-impeded, our lives will change for the better.

Again going back to your question: ““Why teach people that someone else is our only hope? It’s not just someone else Fiat, Jesus is the only begotten son of God. Who dearly loved his father and reflect that love for mankind.

We are all sons/daughters of our Creator.

Consider please: “For God loved the world so much that he gave his only-begotten Son, in order that everyone exercising faith in him might not be destroyed but have everlasting life. For God sent forth his Son into the world, not for him to judge the world, but for the world to be saved through him.  He that exercises faith in him is not to be judged. He that does not exercise faith has been judged already, because he has not exercised faith in the name of the only-begotten Son of God. Now this is the basis for judgment, that the light has come into the world but men have loved the darkness rather than the light, for their works were wicked. For he that practices vile things hates the light and does not come to the light, in order that his works may not be reproved. But he that does what is true comes to the light, in order that his works may be made manifest as having been worked in harmony with God.” (John 3:16-21)

Yes, Jesus did a very loving thing, by showing us what the Christ Consciousness can do for all of us. When we all can come to the understanding, that what we do to someone else in this life, is the same as doing it to ourself. Maybe we can start to grow spiritually. To hate another, is to hate oneself. WE ARE ALL ONE.

Originally posted by edmc^2
...
Tell me, can anyone surpass the teachings of Jesus?

There are many religions around the world who had great teachers. I don`t fall for the "mine is better than yours" ploy, sorry.

More importantly what disqualifies him in your book to be the savior of mankind?

I don`t have a "book", but, anyway. What makes you believe he came to be our savior? Did Jesus state this himself? Or, did man state this? Yes, Jesus came to teach us about what is within us, if we look for it. But, to say he came to take away our sins? I don`t believe so. One must forgive themself before that can happen. To call oneself a savior, is to place oneself above all others, and I don`t believe that was his intention, not when we are all of one.

Please be honest and let me know. Those of you who agree with Fiat, please provide your best hope for mankind. This is not to put you on the spot but to see if you can provide something better than what Jesus offered - a real tangible hope.

They don`t even have to agree with me, they may see it in a whole different light than you or I do.

Jesus said:
“I am the resurrection and the life. He that exercises faith in me, even though he dies, will come to life; and everyone that is living and exercises faith in me will never die at all. Do you believe this?” (John 11:25, 26)

Yes, faith in the living Creator that is within all of us.

A promise from God:
With that I heard a loud voice from the throne say: “Look! The tent of God is with mankind, and he will reside with them, and they will be his peoples. And God himself will be with them. And he will wipe out every tear from their eyes, and death will be no more, neither will mourning nor outcry nor pain be anymore. The former things have passed away.” (Rev 21:3-4)

Are these words meaningless?

They are only meaningless to those who have forgotten, that our Creator never left us, but has been within, and without us all this time. Many have forgotten how to look within to find our Creator.

If you only know / knew who Jesus is, your heart will overflow with praise and thanksgiving to God. I’ll be glad to show you.

I believe I already know how to thank Jesus for his teachings.

Are you not thankful for what God and his son did - even a little bit? I hope so.

Sure, I thank Jesus for the teachings he gave us, and I thank our Creator for the plan used.

I’ll await your reply.
Ty,
edmc2

So be it.

BTW -

Just to let you know, I’m on my 2nd bible reading (audio) and hopefully be able to finish it by the end of the year. In addition to a Bible reading program - we study the Bible five times a week - with respect to history, authenticity, accuracy, practicality, prophecy, science, family life, Christin life, etc.

That`s good. When your done, are you going to look for our Creator within?

[edit on 5-7-2010 by FiatLux]

[edit on 5-7-2010 by FiatLux]

reply to post by edmc^2


Hello edmc

Something stuck out at me you said....

Just to let you know, I’m on my 2nd bible reading (audio) and hopefully be able to finish it by the end of the year. In addition to a Bible reading program - we study the Bible five times a week - with respect to history, authenticity, accuracy, practicality, prophecy, science, family life, Christin life, etc.

Please read my signature....read it several times.

Ever heard of the story of the man that was so stuck in his scriptures that when a angel came to his home, he could not notice the angel that stood before him?

If you are so bent on Jesus....then go figure out what he meant by telling you the kingdom is within, and how to use one eye.....to fill your body full of light.

Its just cause I care...and likes yas

But your path is yours to walk...mabey you are in need of the things of Earth still....mabey.

You would gain more spiritual wisdom if you could open the box you and others have put God in, and use all of those hours you plan on in study of the Earthly object....and just sit out in nature and contemplate life.....if you are honest and humble, youll see your not alone in out there amongst the nature that surrounds you, youll find the Holy Spirit waiting.

You know what would do you good....take off your shoes and go walk in the grass for a while.



You search for truth!

I found wisdom one day, in some text outside of the Bible.

They said....
"Cut the wood, I am there.....lift a stone, you will find me"

Like fresh wind on skin....

[edit on 5-7-2010 by LeoVirgo]

Another very interesting thread here. Restating the obvious that the Bible is written by men for.....control of all. Christianity became Rome's state religion at a time when the Empire was failing and under weak leadership. Overt to covert control. Using the age old tactic of overlaying new rites with the local practices helped facilitate its acceptance. That and the fact that if you didn't attend church you'd receive a knock on the door, or, if you dared question the content you'd be denounced as a heretic, punishable by death. No wonder it became rather popular.

I do indeed study the Bible and have done so for many many years, however, I now recognise that this book has denied me a spiritual existence NOT given me one.

I am a Celt. My people have their own origin myths, their own prophets, and their own rituals. Trouble is Emperor Nero took the huff after a kicking by the Celts and had almost our entire history obliterated.

Reading through the Gnostic literature is an enlightening experience (for me at least). Why? Because they do not expect to be taken literally. They are designed to open our minds to contemplation of time, space that are ordinarily beyond human comprehension. A meditive tool so to speak.
The Nag Hammadi Library

In the Codex 'On the Origin of the World' you can read an alternative view of Genesis. A view which lays no guilt trip on humanity. 'The Hypostasis of the Archons' is another I would highly recommend.

It is the capabilities of the human mind that we have to recognise and explore - we don't know the half of it. We are amazing.

reply to post by LeoVirgo


Thanks Leo for the advice, I truly appreciate it.

You said

“You would gain more spiritual wisdom if you could open the box you and others have put God in, and use all of those hours you plan on in study of the Earthly object....and just sit out in nature and contemplate life.....if you are honest and humble, youll see your not alone in out there amongst the nature that surrounds you, youll find the Holy Spirit waiting.”

I did indeed gained a lot of spiritual wisdom and still learning a great deal more by studying the Book of Wisdom as well as the Book of Nature. And I’m indeed awestruck and humbled by all of God’s Creations.

His love, wisdom, power and justice are fully revealed right in front of our eyes (as you said) “amongst the nature that surrounds“ us. Here’s what I see - a simple sunset by the beach reveals God’s wisdom and love. While the atmosphere protects us from harmful rays from outside - it also has a calming effect seeing the different colors of lights in the horizon. A walk in the woods will do a lot of good to the heart - it makes you put things in perspective, why a giant sequoia is able to live for thousands of years and yet our life span is just but about 80-90s. Even a simple smile or a touch of a hand that we take for granted - have a calming effect on us. I can go on and on but the promises of a loving God and Father thru his son Jesus is what keeps hope afloat in this troublesome world.

Leo, I know you have a good heart and it reflects in your words, but how would you offer hope to someone who has nothing? Imagine going to poor places of the earth where little children go to bed at night without eating a meal, wake up the following day wondering where to get their next meal. Where families struggle just to stay alive. Or how about a parent who lost a child or someone who’s struggling with depression. We can easily tell them to look within themselves but what good will that do? Right now, in the real world we are facing “difficult times hard to deal with” (2 Tim 3:1). Both the rich and poor are affected and are losing hope and faith and see a bleak future. The problems that mankind is facing is growing, can we tell people to have faith within? Even the best selling books that deals with human psychology offer very little hope, unless they quote the Bible.

What would you tell this man (true experience)? A peaceful farmer in a war torn country, who lost his wife from a sniper bullet while savings his son, only to lose him the following year to a minefield while working the farm. Most of his relatives are either dead or can’t be located. He is now alone. How can we offer comfort and hope to such a person? Will it mean something to him if we say look within yourself, the answer is there? Or look within ourselves to find the creator.

No, for such word of comfort is meaningless. But the Bible, the word of God gives hope and this promise:

“With that I heard a loud voice from the throne say: “Look! The tent of God is with mankind, and he will reside with them, and they will be his peoples. And God himself will be with them. And he will wipe out every tear from their eyes, and death will be no more, neither will mourning nor outcry nor pain be anymore. The former things have passed away.” (Rev 21:3-4).

What does these words mean? To me it means that our loving Father knows our pains and struggles and will remedy it soon. That all the tears and pains, like a loving parent will wipe them away. He has both the power and the love to bring them about. But these promises are only for those with humble heart and willing to listen to him.
And it is by means of his Son Jesus that God will accomplish his promises.

Listen to Jesus’ own pleadings:

“Come to me, all YOU who are toiling and loaded down, and I will refresh YOU. Take my yoke upon YOU and learn from me, for I am mild-tempered and lowly in heart, and YOU will find refreshment for YOUR souls. For my yoke is kindly and my load is light.” (Matt 11:28 -30).

What sort of person is Jesus besides “mild-tempered and lowly in heart“?

He is also approachable “At seeing this Jesus was indignant and said to them: “Let the young children come to me; do not try to stop them, for the kingdom of God belongs to suchlike ones. Truly I say to YOU, Whoever does not receive the kingdom of God like a young child will by no means enter into it.” And he took the children into his arms and began blessing them, laying his hands upon them. (Mark 10:13-16).

What about lepers, those who are rejected by society?

“There also came to him a leper, entreating him even on bended knee, saying to him: “If you just want to, you can make me clean.”  At that he was moved with pity, and he stretched out his hand and touched him, and said to him: “I want to. Be made clean...” (Mark 1:40-45). Can you see his feelings towards those in need? He has the power and the love to cure the sick.

He feels the pain of others: “Jesus gave way to tears. Therefore the Jews began to say: “See, what affection he used to have for him!” (John 11:35,36).

Again John 3:16 ““For God loved the world so much that he gave his only-begotten Son, in order that everyone exercising faith in him might not be destroyed but have everlasting life.”

Thus Jesus’ said “And this good news of the kingdom will be preached in all the inhabited earth for a witness to all the nations; and then the end will come.” (Matt 24:14 , 6;9 Dan 2:44)

Human philosophy is good at some point but it will never surpass the wisdom contained in Jehovah God’s Word the Bible for it holds promises now and the coming future.

cont...

Here are some more of the promises:

“The lame one will climb up just as a stag does.”—Isaiah 35:6

“The eyes of the blind ones will be opened.”—Isaiah 35:5

“All those in the memorial tombs will . . . come out.”—John 5:28, 29

“No resident will say: ‘I am sick.’”—Isaiah 33:24

“There will come to be plenty of grain on the EARTH.”—Psalm 72:16

He “did not create the earth simply for nothing” but “formed it even to be inhabited.” (Isaiah 45:18)

The righteous themselves will possess the EARTH, and they will reside forever upon it.”—Psalm 37:29

“There are new heavens and a NEW EARTH that we are awaiting according to [God’s] promise, and in these righteousness is to dwell.” (2 Peter 3:13)

Ps. 37:9- 11: “Those hoping in Jehovah are the ones that will possess the earth. . . . The meek ones themselves will possess the EARTH, and they will indeed find their exquisite delight in the abundance of peace.”

“He is making wars to cease to the extremity of the earth” Ps 46; 9.

“He will certainly render judgment among the nations and set matters straight respecting many peoples. And they will have to beat their swords into plowshares and their spears into pruning shears. Nation will not lift up sword against nation, neither will they learn war anymore. (Isa 2;4)

Psalm 67:6. – “The earth itself will certainly give its produce; God, our God, will bless us”.

“They will certainly build houses and have occupancy; and they will certainly plant vineyards and eat their fruitage. They will not build and someone else have occupancy;.. the work of their own hands my chosen ones will use to the full” Isa 65;21-24

Isaiah 11:6-9; 65:25.—“the wolf will actually reside for a while with the male lamb, and with the kid the leopard itself will lie down, and the calf and the maned young lion and the well-fed animal all together;.. the earth will certainly be filled with the knowledge of Jehovah as the waters are covering the very sea”.

Matt. 5:5: “Happy are the mild-tempered ones, since they will inherit the earth.”

Matt. 6:10: “Let your kingdom come. Let your will take place, as in heaven, ALSO upon earth.”



Ty,
Edmn2

Btw,
I mentioned the Bible reading programs as a reply to someone’s post.