Near-death experiences are real and we have the proof, say scientists

reply to post by mmariebored


Not true. It can be proven when they see things that could only be seen from a point of view looking down from the ceiling of the room, which has happened.

Originally posted by monkeybus
reply to post by TruthParadox

 

Yes, time is Human Perception.

Look at this clock


Fast, yes?
Now shift your eyes further along the screen, away from the image. Notice how it slows down?

Excellent attitude....

For once we see sanity, instead of the reasoning of primates, based on the double logic system, that has polluted there DNA, brought about by the actions of some undesirable visitors, a few thousand years ago.

Yes Time is only a primate perception based on his understand or should I say Lack of Understanding of Mind Processes.

When you look at the speeding clock you view this through the Inner section of your observation but when you look to one side, and notice the clock it changes because you are observing through the Outer section of your observation.

Everything you can thing of in your universe, has an Inner and Outer to its structure.

And everything is made from the opposites....

Yin and Yang.

as in Black and white Yellow and Blue left and Right Up and Down Inner and Outer etc etc.

reply to post by The Vagabond


I would Love to, but im afraid your mind is firmly closed at the moment, it's a shame the internet isnt more interactive, im certain i could sway your thoughts in real life...

If you read up a few posts you will notice i put forth a small post regarding ,my current belief on the suject at hand.

Originally posted by TruthParadox

Originally posted by monkeybus
Have a look at the Origins of life, Astro-physics, Meta-pysics. space, the earth, and slowly sink back into that defensive Rhetoric of yours.

I suggest you take a look at psychology.
Perhaps a reason why people like to think there's an afterlife.
Possibly because our main function as living beings is to continue living, and once we know we can't, we trick ourselves into believing we can.

Why is it more plausible that there's an afterlife than it would be to attribute an NDE to any number scientific explanations?
The truth is rarely what most people would like it to be.

Actually I have delved into that subject extremly deeply, studied a fair bit. maybe gotten too deep into it..........

What's your point? It's an optical illusion.

Exactly!

reply to post by admriker444


ask him if he would be happy to go on record as saying this.

reply to post by admriker444


Yes I've heard experiences like that, but it's not limited to NDEs.
I've heard of people having similar experiences with drugs. Someone I know took mushrooms one time and was telling me about it. He said he was on the 2nd floor but could see everyone on the first floor and what they were talking about.
This does not, however, mean that there's an afterlife or we have souls.
I believe that information is processed through our brains and to keep our sanity, it's filtered to the essential data that we need. When you have an NDE or take certain drugs, I believe these filters are removed. Call it a sixth sense if you like, but that doesn't mean it can't be explained by science.

But, there is another kind of NDE. The kind where you see whatever your mind believes to be an appropriate after life.
The proof that these are not real can be found in the fact that they don't agree with each other. They only agree with the person's belief system which is in their mind.

Originally posted by monkeybus

What's your point? It's an optical illusion.

Exactly!

Then you're reaffirming what I said?
My point WAS that a person's perspective of time varies.
That when someone says they have an NDE and they were out for 30 minutes, it could be in the 5 seconds that their brain is 'dying'. This could explain why a person can have such an experience when considered brain dead.
Then again, it wouldn't necessarily have to be, as we can't really call someone brain dead as we know so little about the brain. It's very possible that there could be undetected activity.
Doesn't your brain have to be alive to form a memory?

QUESTION:

Why are the experiences called "NEAR" Death? From what I've read, the
subjects were clinically D-E-A-D...like Jesus. Which means that they
came back from the Dead, like Jesus did. Right?

[edit on 9-11-2008 by carewemust]

Originally posted by carewemust
QUESTION:

Why are the experiences called "NEAR" Death? From what I've read, the
subjects were clinically D-E-A-D...like Jesus. Which means that they
came back from the Dead, like Jesus did. Right?

[edit on 9-11-2008 by carewemust]

Like was already said, a better term would be.

"temporarily dead experiences"

reply to post by TruthParadox


Yes, In a way.

Time is an Illusion.

Originally posted by neil a
reply to post by Memysabu

 

what about the blind being able to see and describing it, or the ones that can describe things on top of light fixtures and shelfs,or people who have no brain activity for many minutes but can tell the doctors what they were saying in there time of death.its easy to write something off without any research into it.

The blind people who conveiniantly could see but just not well enough to be able to give any decent discriptions to prove their claims?

Regarding the light fittings. Well, what do you think is on top of most light fittings? It's not hard to make guess, is it?

[edit on 9-11-2008 by triplesod]

reply to post by TruthParadox


Please Take science at a face value, It is never 100percent correct, and is almost all theories.

Drag yourself away fronn the knovvn and look for explinations to the unknown, it;s a great way to think and einstien thought like this.

reply to post by triplesod


hehe imagine if his fingerprints were in the dust!, now thats would be strange!

Originally posted by monkeybus
Please Take science at a face value, It is never 100percent correct, and is almost all theories.

That's like saying math is never 100% correct.
Simply because we don't have scientific means to explain certain things does not mean that they are unexplainable by future science.

I read your interdimensional theory, and while I hate to throw stones, I can't say it's incredibly compelling.

There are a lot of people out there who learned everything they know about higher dimensions from discovery channel specials that contained about 3-5 minutes of actual information, 30 seconds of which actually came from a physicist (usually Michio Kaku- who I actually think is awesome; I just don't like putting all of my theoretical eggs in one basket like that).
You take that, throw in a dash of 15 year old psuedo-science from some charlatan on another Discovery channel special, maybe some hollow jargon that the writers of Stargate SG-1 used to cover a plot hole, mix thoroughly and spread thinly over whatever point you're trying to prove at the time, and voila- you've got extra space. Extra space in which to store stuff that may or may not exist- Gods, Aliens, Souls, stuff like that.


Here's the problem. Kaluza was able to unify a few equations in 5 dimensions, but his 5th dimension was nothing like the 3 spatial dimensions were are familiar with- it was microscopic. A big part of the idea is that "broken" dimensions that only gravity can penetrate would explain why gravity is so much weaker than the other forces. It's too fascinating to ignore, so people keep adding dimensions or even subtracting them (suggesting the universe as a hologram imposed on a singularity) but as certain as it seems that we're on the right road, there's always something that won't quite fit (even the original KK theory came with some extra parts).

So in order to explain any observable phenomenon with extra spatial dimensions, you first have to explain the observers mode of perception in terms of a force that is not confined to the normally experienced 3+1 dimensions.

edit because i accidentally posted before finishing a sentence.

[edit on 9-11-2008 by The Vagabond]

second edit in the name of recapitulation. In case anyone missed the obvious, it follows from my last paragraph that one cannot use extra spatial dimensions to explain anything until one has used them to build a working theory of everything. Just thought I'd add that because it makes the task sound so much more daunting.

[edit on 9-11-2008 by The Vagabond]

reply to post by Jezus


Thanks for taking the time to let me know what the new (more accurate)
wording is for describing these experiences, Jezus.
-cwm

Originally posted by vehemes terra eternus
reply to post by The Matrix Traveller

 

hey matrix, I'm not insecure or superstitious. I just usually go for the most logical explanation.

Please tell us a little more about this optical interface.....

peace

"Human Logic" is based on a "Double Logic System" that exists in your DNA Structure and is responsible for your confusion, illnesses and death.
This is in all of us...

This came about by cross breeding, in about 3,500 BC with visitors that broke the rules, through their lust for the daughters of people on the earth.

This is part of the conspiracy that is being hidden today, by governments on the Earth, but for good reasons...


OK about this Optical Interface...

It is known in some Countries, such as China where I have just returned from, that The Mind is Not in or part of the Brain.

The Brain is a Decoder/Encoder that is Controlled by The True Mind.

I call it "The True Mind" rather than the human mind because the mind is Not of the Primate but rather the Primate is of The Mind and most in this world, do Not understand the Mind at all.

What we call our Mind, is actually a Droplet, of What I refer to as "The True Mind".

The Mind is our Real Self and can Not Die!!!!

The Body is a Biological robot, or machine that is to some degree, controlled by the Mind.

The Outer Mind has the Majority of the Control thank goodness... LOL..

There is an "Inner" Mind (Droplet) that you refer to as your Mind and your true Identity and there is its opposite which is The "Outer Mind"or in some cases is referred to the Mind or Life of The All.

I speak in the Graphical sense, when referring to the Inner and Outer Mind,
which has nothing to do with the subconscious mind or any other imagined part.

The experience that you are enjoying at present, is actually a Holographic Program.

There is a Program that includes Instructions, that Controls your experience and this has been known for thousands of years.

In fact in the distant past Optical Interfaces with this program were known by kings, Emperors, Pharaohs etc...

But today this has been lost because of a situation that was introduced a few thousand years ago. This was caused by interbreeding with certain undesirable visitors.

So Optical Interfaces are actually nothing new!

What is the optical interface for?

Well it is a system, that is used to communicate or interface with "The Outer True Mind" and allows you to make alterations within the Program and import Manuals and Items into your World.

This is achieved by the actions of "The Outer True Mind" in response to requests or commands using the Optical Interface.

It is called an Optical Interface because all instructions are Visual using Geometry and Lettering or fonts conforming to the correct communication formats of "The True Mind".

How is this Done?

It is very easy to make up a simple and inexpensive device, that allows you to View the Processing of the System that displays your Holographic experience.

I have given the instructions in other threads on how to make this yourself.

There are No Secrets and I will try and explain anything you want to know, that is if I have the answer.

The Optical Interface, is used with geometric instructions on a map on Screen which is of the partitioning of the Mind and was known in ancient times as the Eye Matrix, or as some call it the "all seeing eye".

The optical Interface, in the modern form is made up of an LCD screen and Controlled partitioned back Lighting that can be strobed in required independent partitions, together with masks and frames in other locations.

All this has a Language and Format, known by some of the Ancients.

There is a huge amount of Historical Geometric pattern work, all over the Planet which you can find, in Government Buildings, Libraries, Palaces, Estates, Temples, Churches, Monasteries, Public Arcades and walkways.

You will soon learn to recognise this geometry if you look at all these different places.

Look at the pattern work in windows, ceilings, floors mosaics etc.

These are the Components used in the Optical Interfaces in Ancient times.

It is Not "sacred art" as believed to be by superstitious so called experts.

I now have a Library, of over 30,000 Geometric Drawings describing the whole system and all its workings if anyone is interested.

If any want this Geometric information, I am willing to send it to them via email.

A number of people, are introducing this technology in probably about 16 months time if all goes well, in the form of a child's toy to acclimatise people to this technology, because of the degree of superstition in the world regarding Geometric based Operating Systems.

Past history tells you, about people that have been accused of being witches or wizards and have been executed because they were playing with geometric systems.

These Executions were mainly implemented by radical religious groups often so called Christian but in reality were Not Christian, but followed Roman Doctrine.

I just hope the world is ready to accept this ancient technology now as a result of being exposed to computers etc.

I guess we are going to find out if humanity is ready yet for this or not.

The whole world will change in its understanding of what we are really a part of, and how to change physical things in this world through the use of these optical interfaces with The True Mind.

People are so full of superstition, they are dreaming up all sorts of reasons why the end of the world should come, but this is only interfering with technological evolution.

Even their own writings tell them, there is another 1,000 years yet to the end of this program of your universe and environment, but even this is Not an end to Consciousness, but is only one stage of the evolution of Creation.

Why do Primates have to lack so much Trust in Life beats me.

Things may change in the world but Creation will never finish, but keep on evolving in spite of human superstition and insecurity.

Programs will change regarding universes and worlds.

This world is a unique program that has nothing at all to do with the development of primates in this world but is to do with the mechanism that displays the Holographic experiences that the mind dwells in...

If you want to know more then feel free to contact me through U2U on abovetopsecret....


[edit on 9-11-2008 by The Matrix Traveller]

In the final analysis, those whose minds are firmly closed to continuation of consciousness (in whatever form) after physical death will brook no argument. They are firmly committed to materialism. It appears they have considerable stake in it. Why, then, are they expending what they insist is their finite lifespan in an open forum in attempts to convince others that life is finite ? Lol

Those who believe consciousness continues after physical death refuse to be swayed by the 'scientific' approach purportedly adhered to by the materialists.

It's moot


I lean towards separation of Mind and brain

I have no choice

I've experienced it. Yes, I have been outside my living, physical body and have witnessed things which could not have been observed by my physical eyes

'Science' is therefore no match for my own experiences.
Science fails absolutely to 'explain away' what I've experienced
Experienced spontaneously: no drugs involved

So, those who profess a 'scientific approach' to this issue can have no sway on me. Their arguments sound to my ears like those of a child who insists it should have a chocolate bar 'because it wants it'.

Mind and brain are separate

The brain is an organ, is physical

The Mind is connected to both the physical brain and to the Great Unknown

And science is a mere infant with delusions of grandeur.

Many of its lay-spokespersons are attempting vicarious 'superiority' and in fact, do science no credit

But as with all things, time will tell, eh ?

reply to post by triplesod
i doubt people who just had a traumatic experience are gonna make up stories and guess things to back it up.

reply to post by Dock6


Extremely well put...

Couldn't put it better myself!