And So It Begins:-"Touched the screen for Barack Obama, the check mark moved to McCain"

reply to post by Toadmund

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Except that any machine can be manipulated if someone decides they want to. The touch screens aren't unreliable, they just need regular maintenance like any other machine. They can be manipulated, but if these particular ones weren't calibrated correctly before the voters used them then there is nothing nefarious going on aside from someone not being attentive and not doing their job.

You Americans say to be the greatest democracy in the world...?
Still been made a laughter in the rest of the world at the last Presidential election when clearly Al Gore won that battle, but BUSH somehow? still got it?.

Is this gonna repeat itself now? then i think the good old? US "have sold the butter and lost the money" forever...at least for me.
you all Americans need to put a stop to this charade that`s going on in front of your eyes.

There`s cover ups to the left and right in your country, and i wonder how long you all good decent hard working Americans are gonna let it continue?
I myself have relatives in the US, so i guess it goes for me to.

Best regards...

reply to post by Jenna

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It was directed at anyone who believes in the recalibration excuse. First off, if it is recalibration, WHY DID THEY DO IT!? It's the *snip* presidency, not the high school king and queen. Second, why is the programing so ridiculously flawed? Again, IT'S THE *snip PRESIDENCY! Third, I don't believe the recalibration excuse because Diebold *snip* admitted their machines dropped votes, and many others have shown how easy it is to hack into the diebold machines. It doesn't fit. The evidence is too great that believe some ridiculous recalibration excuse. Everyone has their excuses. The whole administration had force-fed the public excuse after *snip* excuse. The country's getting worse, to the point they want a new global currency system, and everyone still has their excuses. Nothing's getting better. Everything's getting worse.

I got your excuse: We're sheeple, and we're just going to keep taking it.

Mod Edit: Profanity/Circumvention Of Censors – Please Review This Link.

Mod Note: Let's keep the talk clean, please.

[edit on 10/19/2008 by maria_stardust]

On an interesting note, there is substantial consensus amongst astrologers that the alignment of planetary influences is ripe for hotly contested election results. There's also some suggestion that some sort of last minute switch is in the offing, possibly a P or VP changeout. Also, the HPH web bot is saying similar things in term of results of the election not reaching a consensus on interpretation until January of 2009.

this problem isnt just the touch screens . there are 1000s of ways of manipulating the outcome of this election.

the problem could be hacked software.

www.youtube.com...

voter suppression ?

query.nytimes.com...

the list goes on. god i used to believe all that crap in school about america being the greatest country on the planet and the beacon of hope for the rest of the world.

we deserve what we are about to get.

Paper ballots are the only way. This technology allows for mistakes and fixes to happen.

How are they going to recount if there is a problem? Machine logs? Yeah that's reassuring! This is just wrong...

[edit on 19-10-2008 by shoeshiner]

Eeee! Let's hope John McCain stays healthy!

I agree about paper ballots! We used them here.

reply to post by 1011010110

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Which is why I said all machines can be tampered with. Had you read my post you would have seen that. I also said that it is possible that these have been tampered with, but if you have a touch screen that has been not been calibrated in awhile or has been pushed on too hard that machine will not register the point you touch and will think you touched elsewhere. It is not an excuse, it is a fact. I used one constantly almost every day for a year and I know for a fact that they need to be calibrated every once in awhile or it will not register what you are touching.

Could these machines have been calibrated incorrectly? Yes they could have. I never denied that. But what I posted was in response to someone essentially claiming that you never have to calibrate a touch screen when in fact you do.

I don't recall reading in the article that these machines were made by Diebold. And please show me what evidence you have aside from this one article that says machines everywhere are not registering the correct vote. I would like to see this evidence.

I agree! Thank god we have paper ballots here!

It is not the system. It is the people we trusted to run our system. They are thoroughly corrupt. The country needs to be purged, from the west coast to the east coast, from the Canadian border to the Mexican border. THE COUNTRY IS BROKEN. First they said Iraq did 911, then the said Iraq was an imminent threat, then they said Iraq had WMD, then they said we have to stay because we're already there, to now they're just laughing at us.

Then these liars said the subprime wasn't a problem, then they said it was contained, then they said the worst was over, now they're saying it's going to cost anywhere from 1 trillion to 2 trillion AFTER we bailed out fannie and freddie. Where's that money coming from? You and me and all other hard-working taxpayers.

Now they're committing wide-open voter fraud, and Diebold openly admitted their machines dropped votes, and we sheeple are just saying "baaa, baaaa, baaa".

Land of the free indeed!

reply to post by elitegamer23

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I understand your frustration, but no, we don't. What's more is that the world does not deserve the disastrous consequences of a McCain presidency. I generally try to avoid getting partisan, but let's just be honest here - this is a night v. day contrast. McCain is belligerent, given to violence, opposed to negotiation, poor at the public exercise of logic and rhetoric (which has been a staple of political competency for thousands), and most certainly lacks judgement in the sense that he openly tolerates violent, racist rhetoric from his followers. Obama is no saint but he is is heads and shoulders above the alternative and the unquestionably better choice. All this talk of undercover Muslim terrorists sneaking into the white house and Obama being a latter day Marxist protege is absurd. It's fundamentally abusive and irresponsible of the proponents of these ideas to continue to wheel them out after they've been roundly debunked six ways to Sunday. Obama was a top notch constitutional scholar. Wouldn't you say we could use more of those kinds of credentials in government nowadays after the last eight years of rights erosion? Can't most sane and considered people agree about that?

Americans are not stupid and the polls are clearly showing that there is a popular leaning towards Obama. If we see another massive statistical anomaly in terms of exit polling, I think we'll know exactly what happened. The number of intelligent, productive, successful, tax-paying people I know who have promised to leave the country if McCain should somehow make his way to the big chair should be very concerning to Americans on either side of the aisle. And I agree with them. If your vote for a politician is not honored, then it's time to vote with your tax dollars and real human capital: labor. Go somewhere that's better, participate and contribute to their society, and pay taxes.

seriously does anyone really think this election is close?
i always question my sanity and intelligence but im not stupid enough or insane enough to beleive this election is anything closer than 60-40.

how can it be close when one of the guys we are voting on has problems finding space to fit all of his supporters when he has a rally and the other guy has to keep his flavor of the month vp candidate with him at rallies just to have 20,000 people show up.

this damn national iq test is going to become a joke.


the answer is not leaving this country. i love this damn country and i have always been proud of it. i still cant think of anywhere else in this world id want to raise my daughter.

the first thing we need to do is get obama in office. after that happens we as a nation can start talking about the next step of making america the great place we all dream it can be.




[edit on 19-10-2008 by elitegamer23]

No doubt, paper ballots are far more reliable than the voting machines. The security of the electronic voting machines are only as good as the programmers that created the program. Which is where the problem lies. As better programmers may be able to find holes in the security and manipulate the results. Add to that the reluctance of most computer related companies to admit that there may be security holes due to the potential loss of sales and you have a potentially insecure voting system.

Anyone that has ever worked in an IT department knows that is a constant battle to keep systems up to date with security fixes as more and more security holes are discovered. How often are these machines updated with security fixes?


[edit on 19-10-2008 by Kaploink]

Touch screens need to be recalibrated. Yes I use them alot at work
and it is in fact required that we recalibrate daily to log in.

The question isn't what type of voting method we use. THe question
is do these votes really get counted or do they could counted for the
person you actually voted for.

There is no such thing as an "unbiased" outside observer!

I have heard accusations and I have heard evidence of all sorts
of voting fraud, of stolen elections. There must be some way for
everyone to feel confident that the results are truthfull. I have not
found that way yet.

As far as this thread I agree that it is most likely a simple calibration
error. I also agree that if it happened to me I would not feel confident
that my vote went were it should have. I use paper ballots here in WI,
and I don't worry to much because Obama leads here by such a large
margin that he is almost sure to win WI. So no matter who I vote for
the electoral votes will most likely go to the Dems.

The electoral process is what desperatly needs to be retired.

We need a national popular vote pure and simple!!

reply to post by uncover_the_truth

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LOL This happens to homer on the simpsons
Is this really how we run our country? With a gad damn popularity contest?
HOMER VOTES

the problem with 'paper ballots ' is this.
THE ELECTION IS 16 DAYS AWAY.
its too late to change the process we vote for this election. the most important election in the history of the world.

i dont even think massive voter turn out will help obama. if the system is flawed and rigged, nothing will help.

a massive voter turnout will only give mccain a 55%-45% win. wouldnt that be something?

reply to post by AlienChaser

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Agreed. With the efficiencies offered by technological developments, we are rapidly approaching a point where it's feasible to tabulate and honor every vote.

that is all i ask for. every vote be counted correctly. i can live with any president as long as he is the actually choice of the american people.

Blah blah blah racism racism racism, Its all Obamas fault, its all McCains fault, you libs suck, the republicans rig everything..............jesus people.......enough already.......when will you learn that its when we STOP fighting each other and START fighting the corruption that things will get better.......and then it wont be a Dem or Rep thing........it will be an AMERICAN thing, and there wont be any party lines...........what the US needs is revolution.........what the US needs is for the PEOPLE to quit bitching, and to take back what is ours......and thats our country! Grab your pitchforks men

[edit on 19-10-2008 by ManBehindTheMask]