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Socialism is the collective ownership, or control, by the people of the means of production.
Originally posted by xmotex.
Saying "Barack Obama is a socialist" is simply untrue.
Ask any real socialist, they'll tell you he's just another capitalist
Originally posted by ANOK
Let's hear what you've got, from what I've read of your other posts it won't be much, bring it on...
Originally posted by ANOK
Your world of economics is just an illusion to control you. You probably wouldn't know how to survive without it...lol
Originally posted by budski
because capitalism works SOOOO very well.
How much you paying at the pump now?
How much extra are you paying for weekly groceries now?
Capitalism at work - and out of control - it's now government by corporate decree.
Freedom my backside - you have as much freedom as the corporate world allows you to have.
Originally posted by mystiq
Best Standard of Living in the WorldThe Nordic countries are overall the best countries to live in the world, according to the Human Development Report which is published annually by the United Nations. Norway, Sweden, Denmark, Finland and Iceland figure among the top countries on the UN index because of their high levels of education, democracy, income and public health.
There is no evidence of job loss from the last minimum wage increase.
* A 1998 EPI study failed to find any systematic, significant job loss associated with the 1996-97 minimum wage increase. In fact, following the most recent increase in the minimum wage in 1996-97, the low-wage labor market performed better than it had in decades (e.g., lower unemployment rates, increased average hourly wages, increased family income, decreased poverty rates).
* Studies of the 1990-91 federal minimum wage increase, as well as studies by David Card and Alan Krueger of several state minimum wage increases, also found no measurable negative impact on employment.
* New economic models that look specifically at low-wage labor markets help explain why there is little evidence of job loss associated with minimum wage increases. These models recognize that employers may be able to absorb some of the costs of a wage increase through higher productivity, lower recruiting and training costs, decreased absenteeism, and increased worker morale.
* A recent Fiscal Policy Institute (FPI) study of state minimum wages found no evidence of negative employment effects on small businesses.
Originally posted by Johnmike
Stop making fun of me!
...I don't get it.
Markets soon result in what are termed "market forces," "impersonal" forces which ensure that the people in the economy do what is required of them in order for the economy to function. The market system, in capitalist apologetics, is presented to appear as a regime of freedom where no one forces anyone to do anything, where we "freely" exchange with others as we see fit. However, the facts of the matter are somewhat different, since the market often ensures that people act in ways opposite to what they desire or forces them to accept "free agreements" which they may not actually desire. Wage labour is the most obvious example of this, for, as we indicated in section B.4, most people have little option but to agree to work for others.
Private property is in many ways like a private form of state. The owner determines what goes on within the area he or she "owns," and therefore exercises a monopoly of power over it. When power is exercised over one's self, it is a source of freedom, but under capitalism it is a source of coercive authority. As Bob Black points out in The Abolition of Work:
"The liberals and conservatives and Libertarians who lament totalitarianism are phoneys and hypocrites. . . You find the same sort of hierarchy and discipline in an office or factory as you do in a prison or a monastery. . . A worker is a part-time slave. The boss says when to show up, when to leave, and what to do in the meantime. He tells you how much work to do and how fast. He is free to carry his control to humiliating extremes, regulating, if he feels like it, the clothes you wear or how often you go to the bathroom. With a few exceptions he can fire you for any reason, or no reason. He has you spied on by snitches and supervisors, he amasses a dossier on every employee. Talking back is called 'insubordination,' just as if a worker is a naughty child, and it not only gets you fired, it disqualifies you for unemployment compensation. . .The demeaning system of domination I've described rules over half the waking hours of a majority of women and the vast majority of men for decades, for most of their lifespans. For certain purposes it's not too misleading to call our system democracy or capitalism or -- better still -- industrialism, but its real names are factory fascism and office oligarchy. Anybody who says these people are 'free' is lying or stupid." The Abolition of Work and other essays, p. 21
Originally posted by Alethia
Don't hear anything about life is tough, get used to it, we want an underclass.
Originally posted by carslake
Obviously socialism is not what Barack Obama stands for,
Originally posted by disgustedbyhumanity
That is just faulty thinking. .No matter what the tax rates people will always invest their extra money.
Originally posted by KrazyJethro
This is the foundation of liberty: personal property.
Regardless of what the proponents of Socialism might say, I owe nothing to my fellow man. Fundamentally, unearned money is spent far less prudently than money earned. Social Programs, for the most part, equate to unearned and undeserved money.
It doesn't take a rocket scientist to know that raising the minimum wage results in fewer jobs, as business owners are forced to cut back on staff so they don't have to raise prices.
Originally posted by FlyersFan
Obviously it is. A NWO socialism. His 'global poverty tax' is a prime example. He wants to tax the American working class to death and make them vitally dependent upon the government to survive. This goes against the very fabric of America .. it goes against her spirit.
Socialism, in it's traditional and true definition, means "the workers democratic ownership and/or control of the means of production". Such a definition implies that rather than a government bureaucracy for managing such means, there is a focus on highly democratic organisation, education and awareness, and every individual is encouraged to become an active, rather than passive participant in that which effect their lives…
…It is recognized that there are authoritarian systems and behavior, distinct from libertarian, or non-authoritarian ones. Since capitalism's early beginnings in Europe, and it's authoritarian trend of wage-slavery for the majority of people (working class) by a smaller, elite group (a ruling, or, capitalist class) who own the "means of production": machines, land, factories, there was a liberatory movement in response to capitalism known as "Socialism". In almost every case, the socialist movement has been divided along authoritarian, and libertarian lines. The anarchists on the libertarian side, and the Jacobins, Marxists, Leninists, Stalinists, and reformist state-socialists on the authoritarian side. (And liberals more or less split down the middle.)
Originally posted by Alethia
I don't know what is wrong with you man, you have no ability to read or accept the truth. It is not my opinion that the minimum wage is a "living wage", Santa Fe LAW defines it as a "living wage". I didn't make that law, they did. My opinion doesn't come into it.
The 2 previous times there was an increase in the minimum wage, EPI and FPI studies showed that there was no negative impact on job losses. It is not my opinion that an increase in minimum wage caused job losses, studies show it didn't. In fact, the studies show that there could be a positive overall effect.
Today the Employment Policies Institute (EPI) criticized SB 875, legislation scheduled to come to a vote today in the Minnesota House, which would increase the state’s minimum wage by nearly 30% over the next 15 months. The group stated that any attempt to assist low-income employees through mandated wage hikes is misguided and will result in job loss for the very people targeted for help.
Among the new research finding job loss from higher minimum wages is a paper by Dr. Lowell Taylor of Carnegie Mellon University (The Employment Effect in Retail Trade of a Minimum Wage: Evidence from California, the Employment Policies Institute and forthcoming in the Journal of Business and Economic Statistics). Using the changes in state-level minimum wages (which were also used in the fast food studies), Dr. Taylor found that significant employment lost jobs as well as declines in employment growth took place as a result of these wage increases. In contrast to the fast food studies which attempted to measure employment changes over a period of months in one small segment of minimum wage employment Dr. Taylor's work included all workers in all sectors of retail trade (including fast food), broken down into 64 industry sectors, analyzed on a county-by-county basis, over the course of a full year, in the nation's most populous state (California). Taylor's work showed a significantly depressing effect on job growth in retail trade following a minimum wage increase.
It is you who has the opinions that are based on selfish ideology and not fact, not past proof where it happened the way you think it will this time.
The most galling factor is that you state you're not going to vote, yet anyone who votes for Obama is going to turn the country to sh*t. Well, if that's the case, vote for McCain so at least the country doesn't go to sh*t. If you are so concerned, vote to make sure it doesn't happen and Obama doesn't get into power, put your money where your mouth is, don't just throw your toys out the pram and put the onus on others.