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For those opposed to the death penalty, explain why it shouldn't be used in this case

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posted on Jun, 7 2008 @ 06:21 PM
reply to post by Anonymous ATS

Severe imprisonment? You mean the kind where he is put in solitary confinement for his own safety? Where the prison will protect him from other inmates?

Nah, I'll pass. He needs to suffer tremendously.

posted on Jun, 7 2008 @ 06:36 PM
I think killing him will only be setting him free from the hell that he has created for himself. I say let him rot and stew in prison where he can forever regret what got him to this point, that would be immensely more tortures than one minute of torture. I imagine a life in a cage with no hope of freedom and death almost sounds like showing pity. Allthough, I like the idea of the victim choosing the punishment and call me sick but torturing this guy would be very gratifying only because he should have to feel what his victim felt. 3 warm meals a day and a bed to sleep on isn't justice enough for such a crime, I say early morning water boarding and a late evening anal pummel every day might do it.

posted on Jun, 7 2008 @ 06:39 PM
Horrific indeed. Atrocities like this are occuring everyday. This man will be burdened for eternity with these acts (unless he can truely come to terms with what he has done and release his karmic weight), bringing physical death to him sooner will not solve anything.

I am not sure how much longer we can continue with an eye for an eye mentality as a race. I am in no way justifying what he has done, as it is utterly disgusting, but ultimately it brings sadness to my heart.

posted on Jun, 7 2008 @ 06:47 PM
reply to post by Asmus

That's not really the problem we're faced with here... it WON'T be a burden to him UNTIL he can truly come to terms with what he has done. THAT is the true problem. Anything that is done to him now is either ensuring the security of other possible victims, or vengeance for the victim, depending on how you personally see the situation.

posted on Jun, 7 2008 @ 07:03 PM
I guess for me it just comes down to whether or not we should harm others who have harmed us. I know this is a sticky situation though, and I am not in that family's shoes.

posted on Jun, 7 2008 @ 07:21 PM
Do you know what would have saved this young woman? If politicians would keep their damned noses out of our business. That's right. Had she been allowed to exercise her 2nd amendment right, she would have at least had a shot at stopping things before they even started.
I carry a gun. It's illegal to do so in my state, and I understand the consequences of my actions should I be caught. However, I also understand the consequences of not having the ability to defend my life, should the need arise. And I'm sorry, but with the world the way it is today. That need is more and more a likelihood every day.
Aside from that, I can't even describe to you the things I would do to this guy given the opportunity to exact justice.

posted on Jun, 7 2008 @ 08:47 PM

Originally posted by tebyen

Originally posted by slackerwire
Absolutely horrible story, and nothing but years and years of brutal torture would be punishment enough for this creature.

So, because he did something incredibly horrible to that girl, someone should sink to his level, and do something incredibly horrible to him, or kill him out right? Will killing him, or torturing him, erase the horrible events that happened to her?

What should be done is keep him alive. Force him to work under heavy security to pay every dime for her medical treatment, both physical and mental, and then some.

After that, use him for medical experiments, that might result in actually helping people.

Have you ever heard of the saying "an eye for an eye"? Anyone who burns someones house should have his house burnt the same way. No one can possibly imagine the pain and torment this woman had to go through.. and what for? In these cases, I actually wonder if there is a God, or if there is, does he actually believe in vengeance?

I somewhat agree with you on the second point, "keep him alive. Force him to work under heavy security to pay every dime for her medical treatment"
Although this may be a good idea, or even better, to do experiments on him. , however the punishment is no way near as inhumane as what he did to that poor woman. Death penalty is too good of a punishment for him.. I believe the EXACT same thing should be done to him by his victim.. then, can he see with his own eyes and feel the pain he caused. That would be the first punishment. After death, God can judge his soul.

posted on Jun, 7 2008 @ 09:10 PM
I am against the death penalty. I am not against killing scum of the earth like this swine, but since it is illegal for me to kill him, I don't believe it should be legal for the GOVERNMENT of all things to do so either. That reeks of do as I say not as I do.

Also, I was once falsely accused of a crime. I don't believe the people who are our prosecutors, and judges, to be NEARLY competent or nonbiased enough to make those kind of decisions either. They were not in my case.

Lastly, I firmly believe in cases like this, lwop should be mandatory, and special lwop prisons built to house only those who will die in the system. They deserve nothing but an exsistance away from other inmates who may have a chance outside of the system.

posted on Jun, 7 2008 @ 09:19 PM

Originally posted by slackerwire
Kind of odd that this story didn't make national headlines.
I wonder what would happen if the races of the perpetrator and the victim were reversed.

Yeah huge surprise. The story reminded a lot of Christopher Newsom and Channon Christian even before I saw the guys pic. I bet we can guess what the victim looked like too.

posted on Jun, 7 2008 @ 10:12 PM
I Apologize, but timesl ike these i wish Sharia law would be applied...Not like perverse Iran..if this happened in iran theyd stone the woman....Iran is shia perversion, Real sharia law would have this mans genital cut off and his head beheaded in public....

posted on Jun, 7 2008 @ 10:19 PM
This crime is truly horrendous and no words can adequately convey what this poor woman suffered. However despite all that I am still firmly against the death penalty for the simplest reason in the world. It is a proven fact the justice system sends INNOCENT people to jail/death. If you put someone in jail and later new evidence emerges that shows they didn't do the crime (new dna techniques are being developed all the time) then there is something you can do about it. If you put the person to death then later it is shown the person was innocent there is nothing the state can do to correct that.

The police lie and fabricate evidence to suit them, the media lie and hype the stories to suit them, the jury are just out to pin the crime on someone, the lawyers just want their fee and the judges just want to further their agenda's. If you can come up with a justice system that guarantees 100% that no person will be convicted of a crime they didn't commit, then maybe I might entertain the thought of a death penalty. Till that day happens the death penalty will still be wrong and I consider people that support the death penalty to be no better than murders.

posted on Jun, 8 2008 @ 12:03 AM
Far be it from be to step on any toes, but those crimes are completely disguisting. Horrific even. However I dont think the old adage, 'let he who is without sin cast the first stone' is enough in this case. Rather, if society brings this man to justice and makes him a better individual, then perhaps some good can come out of it. Instead of suffering, healing can happen on both sides.

It's not for man to say who lives or who dies. A hanging, poison or even electrocution doesn't garuntee death. Pain, however is always a fixed. Perhap it's time to end the cycle of unneccesary suffering. If we're to improve as a society and even a species, then lets work to better each other - even in situations like these. Lets leave the case by case to God, Karma, Nature or whatever you believe in.

People have so much potential. Let's look beyond the misdeeds of one person, and promote our power as a whole.

posted on Jun, 8 2008 @ 01:56 AM
nyeh. this guy is #ed up. but thats the point, HE is #ED UP! somebody who would do that isnt right in the head. he needs to be put in a mental facility. perhaps if the u.s.'s governmnt would spend money and resources on mental healthcare rather than finding new ways to kill off its criminals, you wouldnt have sick bastards like this running around. people arent born good or evil. unless this guy was born with a mental problem (which i suspect), he was probably born just like the rest of us. its society and our environment which turns us into what we are. If society is churning out people like him, then attack the real problem. all this talk about punishment, people forget the solutions simply because they take time, money and support. you don't see well educated, middle class people with good upbringings turning into these kinds of monsters.

posted on Jun, 8 2008 @ 02:01 AM
They should legalize the Murder/Cure of pedophiles, then the Serial killers in our society can perform a vital Social Service whilst simultaneously sating their blood lust.

Sure, sociopaths will still kill innocents every now and then, but now they will kill considerably less of them. They could even turn it into a reality series, which would further discourage them from their evil deeds.

Imagine; 'Dog The Pedo Hunter' or a Survivor-type show with pedophiles where getting voted off takes on a whole new meaning.....

I am not so much a against the Death Penalty as I am for the return of 'Outlaw' status. The Government shouldn't get to have all the fun.

posted on Jun, 8 2008 @ 02:49 AM
Is it a wonder he's black!?!? This incident does not shock nor surprise me. There was an incident in my town a few years back involving a black man named Sessions Harper in Fort Dodge, Iowa who beat and raped a white woman. He didn't stop there. He also bound her up with telephone cord, gaged her, poured gasoline on her and set her on fire!!! I grew up with one of his brothers, and boy was he a mean sob!!

I say it's no wonder he's black because I feel these people have a greater propensity towards violence. Hell, I remember "race wars" ( black and white fights) as far back as first grade and continuing through High school. I can recount several incidents in which I and my white friends were accosted by blacks on numerous occasions for no apparent reason other than being white.

Again, this all happened in the little ole town of Fort Dodge, Iowa. It's easy for someone to become racist against these monkeys when you've experienced what I have.

So in response to the article, Yes! I think this jungle bunny should be executed!!!

P.S. Please do not call me a racist. I am a proud White Man of European heritage. I know derogatory terms like " monkeys ", and" jungle bunnys "are not PC. But when referring to criminals like these I feel name calling is a non issue.

If the perp was white it would be just as easy to call him a honkey, white trash, cracker, hillbilly, etc...

posted on Jun, 8 2008 @ 03:02 AM
What benefit is it to society to use death or the threat of death in this case? It's easy to look at the details of a case like this and have the emotional response to want to string the guy up but our legal system must not be allowed to be run on emotion. It seems he's guilty of several serious crimes. Punish him for those crimes. If you're not happy with the degree of the punishment, your problem is with the legal system, not the perpetrator.

I'm not against the death penalty, I'm against using it foolishly. The best use of the death penalty I've seen was in the case of the Green River Killer in Washington State. They were after that guy for years and eventually they had enough on him to arrest him and probably sentence him to death. But they didn't have everything. To avoid the death penalty, he gave up information on several murders he had committed that police couldn't pin on him. The families were able to get some closure that they wouldn't have had if he had just been sentenced to death on the available facts. So he's in prison for life, he won't kill again. The death penalty is very useful as a threat, but pointless as a punishment.

posted on Jun, 8 2008 @ 03:14 AM
The problem here is that our justice system sucks ! It has gotten to the point where the concern is focused more on the rights of the criminal and less on the rights of the victim. There are people here saying we should try to understand why he did what he did, that we have no right to put him to death, or torture him, etc. What about the victim, what about her rights ? She has to live with this for the rest of her life, who knows how this will effect her ? Not to mention that she will have to relive this every time that she sees this man in court and will have to relive it when she has to sit in a court room and repeat what was done to her in front of strangers. When will her hell end ? Where is her justice ? If he is found quilty, which i'm pretty sure they will since they have witnnesses and DNA evidence, then she should decide what will happen to him, she should be allowed her justice.

This man needs to be taken completely out of society, he was charged in a murder as a CHILD. And then when an adult he attempted murder and served 8 years for it. There's part of the problem right there, there are states in this country that have a mandatory minium 10 year sentence if a person gets convicted of growing weed, but attemped murder and he gets only 8 years, that just doesn't make any sense to me. What kind of message is our judicial system sending out, that people can rape and kill and molest children and receive less jail time than a person that grows weed, and wonder why they aren't deterred ?

There is no rehabilitating this man, he has been a repeat offender since chilhood. Who knows how many other people that he may have done this to and was never caught? He tried to force her to cut out her own eyes so that she could not identify him. He knew very well what he was doing, he is a cold blooded, unfeeling, caculating repeat offender at the very least he needs to be locked up in solitary confinement with no contact with any people for the rest of his life.

posted on Jun, 8 2008 @ 03:18 AM

Originally posted by slackerwire

Naturally they won't erase what happened, but some people simply aren't fit to live. This creature is one of them.

The Nazis thought the Jews were unfit to live. Saddam thought that the Kurds should be exterminated. Turkey and the Armenians. Darfur. Yugoslavia and Albanian Muslims.
History remembers those that decide that others do not deserve to live as monsters. No circumstance is horrible enough to ask me to accept the actions of, or act like a monster.
Revenge is the laziest form of grief. Our efforts should always be focused on healing and helping the victims, not killing monsters to exorcise our demons.
When we ask for the death penalty the focus is on the perpetrator, why waste time discussing the rights of a person whose actions show us they are unfit to share in our society.
I think our only choice is to exclude these types of criminals from our society for life. Let nature do the rest.

Sometimes horrible things are necessary, this is one of those times.
Is it a necessary to kill this person? We have a choice. The harder choice is that we keep him alive, as horrible as that choice is, i believe it is necessay.

posted on Jun, 8 2008 @ 03:20 AM

Originally posted by Tembisa
you don't see well educated, middle class people with good upbringings turning into these kinds of monsters.

Many serial killers have just such upbringings yet they turn out to be monsters. To be so quick to blame it on society is foolish and factually inaccurate. Genes, genes, genes. Some monsters really are born. If one is molded into such a monster by outside influence other than genes then that influence is going to be extensive molestation, physical abuse and psychological abuse, not because they couldn't afford buns with their hotdogs or they had to sell drugs on the corner. What you are more likely alluding to our common criminals, society will definately have an influence on your common criminals depending on where they grow up but not the type were referring to.

posted on Jun, 8 2008 @ 03:28 AM

Originally posted by atlasastro

Originally posted by slackerwire

Naturally they won't erase what happened, but some people simply aren't fit to live. This creature is one of them.

The Nazis thought the Jews were unfit to live. Saddam thought that the Kurds should be exterminated. Turkey and the Armenians. Darfur. Yugoslavia and Albanian Muslims.

Lol, talk about using the wrong metaphors in exactly the wrong way. I don't even need to explain it, just use your noggin next time.

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