For your consideration

The following are the patent listings (Hughes Aircraft) for the CHEMTRAIL substances generated under contract and control of the USAF:

The following 4 patents are registered to Hughes Aircraft. Each contains the complete set of CHEMTRAIL chemicals:

Patent # 5,397,366 (Storage Cells)
Patent # 5,320,915 (Storage Cells)
Patent # 4,791,076 (Fiber Content)
Patent # 4,756,901 (Purification)

Please read the context of these patents. It is very informing !!!

The key is the 3rd patent #4,791,076. This is for a special carbon fiber that is doped with the CHEMTRAIL elements (Titanium, Aluminum, Barium, Magnesium, Calcium). This type of fiber is used to make highly reflective mirrors/space dishes. If it is ground into particulate, it can become airborne (lightweight). The USAF HAARP (High Altitude Active Aurora Research Project) creates "electronic" mirrors in the atmosphere to beam signals worldwide (do a search on HAARP - lots of sites).

With this particulate carbon fiber spread in the upper atmosphere worldwide, HAARP can downlink its signals (lo energy or Hi energy) anywhere (Plasma Weapons ??). Only problem is ... this "Highly Reflective" stuff causes global warming, droughts, severe weather, etc... A lot of knowledgeable scientists are saying HAARP is capable of generating hi energy signals in the quartz content of earth to generate manmade earthquakes. Areas where spraying has been heavy have reported "Webbing" of the CHEMTRAIL as it descends to earth. Ionized chemicals (by the sun) in the carbon fiber can cause this same effect.

HAARP got congressional funding to go "Full-Power" in Jan. of this year. Since then, Chem Spraying has dramatically increased. The Gov. has decided to "Lease" 100 additional Air Force Air Tankers to ... increase spraying ???

Originally posted by KMFNWO
For your consideration

The following are the patent listings (Hughes Aircraft) for the CHEMTRAIL substances generated under contract and control of the USAF:

The following 4 patents are registered to Hughes Aircraft. Each contains the complete set of CHEMTRAIL chemicals:

Patent # 5,397,366 (Storage Cells)
Patent # 5,320,915 (Storage Cells)
Patent # 4,791,076 (Fiber Content)
Patent # 4,756,901 (Purification)

Thank you sir for a patent verification.

I am at the point where this has become war. The disinfo and deflection agents are working overtime. We are winning the internet battle and must continue.

No one can sway us from what we can see in the skies. If you do you are an enemy. No way around this.

You will loose this war, mark these words.

Originally posted by KMFNWO

The key is the 3rd patent #4,791,076. This is for a special carbon fiber that is doped with the CHEMTRAIL elements (Titanium, Aluminum, Barium, Magnesium, Calcium). This type of fiber is used to make highly reflective mirrors/space dishes. If it is ground into particulate, it can become airborne (lightweight). The USAF HAARP (High Altitude Active Aurora Research Project) creates "electronic" mirrors in the atmosphere to beam signals worldwide (do a search on HAARP - lots of sites).

Are you saying that this is what is being sprayed and that all these persistent contrails folk claim to be chemtrails are indeed just persistent contrails after all?

The possiblity of stuff being sprayed is not being denied (though I have yet to see proof).

All we're trying to do is demonstrate that peristent contrails and cirrus clouds are persistent contrails and cirrus clouds - just as they were 30 years ago. There are simply more of them today because of the huge increase in air traffic over the past decade - hence why we are studying their impact on climate and weather!

NUMBER
SCIENTISTS
AGE
CIRCUMSTANCE
DATE


#1
Jose Trias
Murdered
May 19, 1994

#2
Dr. Tsunao Saitoh
46
Murdered
May 7, 1996

#3-7 Microbiologists Plane crash October 4, 2001
#8 Jeffrey Paris Wall 41 Murdered? November 6, 2001
#9 Dr.Vladimir Pasechnik 64 Stroke November 21, 2001
#10-12 Dr.Yaakov Matzner, Amiramp Eldor, & Avishai Berkman
54, 59,50 Plane crash November 24, 2001
#13 Roman Kuzmin 24 Struck by a car December 2001
#14 Dr. Benito Que 52 Mugging December 6, 2001
#15 Dr. David Schwartz 57 Murdered December 10, 2001
#16 Set Van Nguyen 44 Found in airlock chamber December 14, 2001
#17 Don C. Wiley 57 Body found by river December 20,2001
#18 Ivan Glebov Bandit attack January 2002
#19 Alexi Brushlinski Killed/murdered? January 2002
#20 Victor Korshunov 56 Murdered February 9, 2002
#21 Dr. Ian Langford 40 Murdered February 11, 2002
#22-23 Tanya Holzmayer & Guyang "Mathew" Huang 46, 38 Murder then suicide February 28, 2002
#24 David Wynn-Williams 55 Struck by vehicle March 24, 2002
#25 Dr. Steven Mostow 63 Plane crash March 25, 2002
#26 Dr. Leland Rickman 47 Unknown June 24, 2003
#27 Dr. David Kelly 59 Suicide?/ Murder July 18, 2003
#28 Michael Perich 46 Car wreck October 11, 2003
#29 Robert Leslie Burghoff 45 Hit and run November 20, 2003
#30 Dr Robert E. Shope 74 Idiopathic Pulmonary Fibrosis January 19, 2004
#31 Michael Patrick Kiley 62 Heart failure January 24, 2004
#32 Vadake Srinivasan 78 Stroke/Car wreck March 13, 2004
#33 William T. McGuire 39 Murdered May 5, 2004
#34 Dr. Eugene F. Mallove 56 Murdered May 16, 2004
#35 Antonina Presnyakova 46 Accidental/Ebola May 19, 2004
#36 Thomas gold 84 Heart disease June 23, 2004
#37 Dr. Assefa Tulu 45 Hemorrhagic stroke June 24, 2004
#38 Dr. John Mullen 67 Acute arsenic intoxication June 29, 2004
#39 Dr Paul Norman 52 Plane crash July 2, 2004
#40 Dr. John Badwey 54 Pneumonia like symptoms July 21, 2004
#41 Dr Bassem al-Mudare Murdered July 21, 2004
#42 Professor John Clark 52 Hanging August 12, 2004
#43 Mohammed Toki Hussein al-Talakani 40 Murdered September 5, 2004
#44 Matthew Allison 32 Car exploded October 13, 2004
#45 John R. La Montagne, Ph.D 61 Sudden pulmonary embolism November 2, 2004
#46 Taleb Ibrahim al-Daher Murdered December 21, 2004
#47-48 Tom Throne & Beth Williams 63, 53 Car wreck December 29, 2004
#49 Jeong H. Im 72 Murdered January 7, 2005
#50 Geetha Angara 43 Murdered/Drowned February 8, 2005

although you know alot about atmospheric occurances you are obviously a moron because u failed to produce a single picture if a chemtrail.

None of your photos explain the obvious trails people have SEEN being left behind by aircraft that do not quickly dissipate like a real contrail would. Contrails formed by ice and water quickly vanish in the wake of a high flying aircraft. You can see this in video footage going back to World War II high altitude bombing runs. The trails you see left in the sky today do not quickly dissipate. They just hang there in the air and spread out. There may be natural cloud formations and other things going on, but you have failed to debunk anything here.

It almost seems as if weather modification is the red herring while "star wars" or weaponology seems to be more likely the truth.

Originally posted by Shroomery
Common sense? In this day and age? You mean you can't wrap your head around the fact that some people would do such a thing without informing you. That's not common sense that's being naive.

No, the common sense is that releasing anything that high up would not affect you one bit.
You can could stand on Mount Everest and not be affected
That's the common sense part. And the fact that winds that high are MUCH higher than here at the surface so spraying that high would end up hundreds of miles away. And the fact that spraying that high, if it could reach the ground, which it can not, would not fall in any regular or predictable pattern so they would be spraying themselves.

Please tell us what we don't know and how that proofs chemtrails are contrails.

First you'll have to actually SHOW ME A CHEMTRAIL! lol

No one has yet to provide any evidence of chemtrails. Do you know why? Because AGAIN, this is some whacked out theory started by Art Bell and friends to SCARE people. It is based on ABSOLUTELY NOTHING. What is so difficult to understand about that??
Do you guys even research the origins of these theories before you start believing them?
Unbelievable. That is VERY scary if you are that gullible or so quick to believe anything you hear.

You mean you cherrypick it to make an argument. Take some responsibility instead of blaming "other people".

This makes no sense at all.
I made my statement that it can't affect us on the ground based on people (on the ground) saying that it is reaching them on the ground and making them sick on the ground.
Now what in the world are you talking about? Who am I blaming? And what am I blaming them of?

Uhm, who said anything about weather? And why would I care?

Sheesh man...
This whole thing is about weather processes.
You should care because THAT is what contrails do affect.

Sigh, we're talking about metal particles and other substances that have been found. Check the video's I've posted.

Oh please.
Those videos provide 0 proof to back up their claim. Why in the world would I believe them over the easter bunny?
They claimed the "chemtrail" fell to the ground, but as I asked before...they were able to take pictures of it while it was 30,000 feet in the air, but couldn't take picture of it descending? That makes NO sense at all and should have raised a red flag with you.

And what do you think happens to water after it evaporates? It condensates and falls back to earth, bringing other particles back to the ground.

lol!
Not at all my friend.
If that was the case we would have 100% cloud cover and constant rain 24/7 365. The earth would be uninhabitable.
Under the right conditions sure water vapor will condense and form clouds. Most of the time that's all that forms. If there is enough condensation and energy then it'll fall as rain or snow.

You do have a toilet in your house right? You know that water is evaporating right? Is it raining in your house right now? I'm guessing it's not

And funny too, lets not forget that this is YOUR argument, not mine, and since you obviously have a short attention span, here it is again:

Originally posted by ThatsJustWeird
Umm...what are you talking about?
Like all clouds, contrails dissipate or evaporate over time. lol
This is where just fundamental understanding of the atmosphere (and apparently gravity, lol) helps.

So, my argument that contrails dissipate over time is the same as contrails not dissipating over time?
Don't think so buddy.
You asked about them staying there indefinitely. I said yes, that would be a bad thing as we would have constant cloud cover. Fortunately they dissipate/evaporate over time.


anime

None of your photos explain the obvious trails people have SEEN being left behind by aircraft that do not quickly dissipate like a real contrail would. Contrails formed by ice and water quickly vanish in the wake of a high flying aircraft.

Says who?
Under certain weather conditions contrails can last for hours. That's not even disputed.

I think the I's have it. HAARP and heavy trails are linked at the hip. I could very well be wrong, but I don't believe so.

This is alot of BS. I have seen the planes spraying our area on a daily basis and there is too much reliable information on the internet that says you are wrong. Chemtrails NOT Contrails are being sprayed by government. I have tons of photos on this and it sounds like you are working for the government to give their lies or you have not checked into all the research on Chemtrails. The government likes to give double talk. Chemtrails are not from planes taking people on vacations. Planes spray in a criss-cross pattern and their chemtrails stay for hours, feathering out to cover the sky. Fallout from them show high levels of chemicals that harm our health. Germany has admitted spraying so I'll continue taking the photos and continue the grass root movement that believes this spraying is being done by government for secret reasons we probably won't find out about until years later when information is declassified in the Freedom of Information Act. Anyway, breathe the air deeply, when you come down with cancer- wonder where it came from !!

Originally posted by ThatsJustWeird
they were able to take pictures of it while it was 30,000 feet in the air, but couldn't take picture of it descending? That makes NO sense at all and should have raised a red flag with you.

Maybe the guy couldn't just sit there and take pictures of a cloud all day...If you doubt that possibility I guess you can start trying to find proof against it.

Originally posted by ThatsJustWeird
No, the common sense is that releasing anything that high up would not affect you one bit.
You can could stand on Mount Everest and not be affected
That's the common sense part. And the fact that winds that high are MUCH higher than here at the surface so spraying that high would end up hundreds of miles away. And the fact that spraying that high, if it could reach the ground, which it can not, would not fall in any regular or predictable pattern so they would be spraying themselves.

Not effect us one bit? Wow, and the evidence for this is..?
You have no idea what it's for yet you're guessing it wont affect us. Again, that's wishfull thinking.

Who says they even have to reach the ground to affect us?

The point is that it happens in secrecy and there's reason to believe it does have health implications. Even if they supposedly don't reach the ground, I would certainly never agree to releasing tons of that stuff into the air.

Originally posted by ThatsJustWeird
No one has yet to provide any evidence of chemtrails. Do you know why?

Yes I do. Because you are waiting for someone to convince you. You're not interested in finding out what really happens, you're convinced it doesn't happen so you'll focus on that evidence and ignore the rest for as long as you can.

There's enough evidence on the internet that there are scientist who do have proof, the fact that you don't want to see it does not mean it isn't there. If you really cared, you'd be looking for it, not waiting for someone to provide it for you.

Originally posted by ThatsJustWeird
Because AGAIN, this is some whacked out theory started by Art Bell and friends to SCARE people. It is based on ABSOLUTELY NOTHING. What is so difficult to understand about that??

I wouldn't call pictures, radar images, metal particles and apparantly bio-engineered material "absolutely nothing".

You're just like all the other debunkers "La La La I can't hear you, there is no evidence!". I think the problem is that you see evidence as something the general public accepts as truth. And "providing" it, as you say, means nothing more than seeing it on TV.

Originally posted by ThatsJustWeird
Sheesh man...
This whole thing is about weather processes.
You should care because THAT is what contrails do affect.

We're talking about chemtrails, not contrails.
Yes, they might affect weather, that has nothing to do with this discussion and what you're implying, that they are caused by certain weather, does not explain the evidence we see.

Originally posted by ThatsJustWeird
Oh please.
Those videos provide 0 proof to back up their claim. Why in the world would I believe them over the easter bunny?

Nobody said you should believe them, you just show your true colours by ignoring what they say, and continueing to claim there is no evidence.
Like I said, if you really were concerned with the truth, you would act different. You're concerned with protecting your theory, how can you not, after you've labeled the alternaty as whacked out? This is about prestige and ego, not about truth. As is often the case in these discussions these days.

Originally posted by ThatsJustWeird
They claimed the "chemtrail" fell to the ground, but as I asked before...they were able to take pictures of it while it was 30,000 feet in the air, but couldn't take picture of it descending? That makes NO sense at all and should have raised a red flag with you.

Descending?
You obviously haven't payed very much attention to these "phenomena".
The clouds slowly spread out and form a haze, they do not just fall to the ground. There are countless pictures on the internet to show this process. And this doesn't make any sense to you? A minute ago you were arguing they don't even reach the ground ever, now you think it's strange they don't fall to the ground?

Originally posted by ThatsJustWeird
lol!
Not at all my friend.
If that was the case we would have 100% cloud cover and constant rain 24/7 365. The earth would be uninhabitable.
Under the right conditions sure water vapor will condense and form clouds. Most of the time that's all that forms. If there is enough condensation and energy then it'll fall as rain or snow.

I'm so fed up with people like you going "lol that's not true" and then just repeating the initial explanation. But wait! You've added "under the right conditions" water condensates. Thank you Cpt obvious. Physics major I assume?

Originally posted by ThatsJustWeird
You do have a toilet in your house right? You know that water is evaporating right? Is it raining in your house right now? I'm guessing it's not

Carefull when you're trying to be funny based on your own ignorance my friend. It might come back to slap you in the face.

Originally posted by ThatsJustWeird
You asked about them staying there indefinitely. I said yes, that would be a bad thing as we would have constant cloud cover. Fortunately they dissipate/evaporate over time.

You do know that dissipating/evaporating, is not the same as dissapearing right?

Originally posted by ThatsJustWeird
Says who?
Under certain weather conditions contrails can last for hours. That's not even disputed.

Oh it's hours already. Last number was 20 minutes. Could you quantify "hours"? Because that's a little vague. And I'd dispute that.

And no, I dont say or agree that anything that lingers is a chemtrail. I see lingering contrails all the time. Especially in the winter when we have seriously cold temps. Fact is. Contrails come in all shapes, sizes and last for various amounts of time.

[edit on 8-3-2008 by greeneyedleo]

why do they vary so??

cold temp hot temp, and in-between, the lingering trails are present as are the short lived ones...what could be a possible explanation for the two types to occur on the same day within minutes of one another, if your position is that it is the temperature...?

Originally posted by Shroomery
Not effect us one bit? Wow, and the evidence for this is..?

Are you having difficult reading?
The fact that these are spayed 25+ thousand feet up.

You have no idea what it's for yet you're guessing it wont affect us. Again, that's wishfull thinking.

Read what I said. I said contrails DO affect the weather. The weather affects us. Any chemicals spread that far up no matter what the composition would not be able to reach the any level that is inhabited by human beings. If you have ONE shred of evidence even slightly suggesting otherwise, then PLEASE PLEASE by all means present it!

The point is that it happens in secrecy and there's reason to believe it does have health implications.

So, doing it in broad daylight is "in secrecy" now?
Wow, you learn something new every day

Even if they supposedly don't reach the ground, I would certainly never agree to releasing tons of that stuff into the air.

Tons of what stuff?
Do you have ONE shred of evidence it is anything other than exhaust and water vapor? Again, if you do please present it.

Yes I do. Because you are waiting for someone to convince you. You're not interested in finding out what really happens, you're convinced it doesn't happen so you'll focus on that evidence and ignore the rest for as long as you can.

Get real man. I have seen ALL the videos, I have read all that stuff.
The reason why I know chemtrails is a bunch of nonsense is because I DO know what really happens. I know how our atmosphere works. I've also read about the origins of these theories. A subject you are constantly ignoring.

Other evidence?? LIKE WHAT!!!!??? Again, how about you stop talking and present this evidence. You'll change the world. So please present it.

There's enough evidence on the internet that there are scientist who do have proof, the fact that you don't want to see it does not mean it isn't there.

That is the biggest load of BS ever.
I have been asking you to present this evidence but either you can't or won't. I would LOVE to see this evidence.

If you really cared, you'd be looking for it, not waiting for someone to provide it for you.

Smell that?
More BS.

I have been looking. All I've seen so far are people claiming contrails are chemtrails but not backing up their claims. I'm asking you because you say you have some or that there is some out there. If I can't find it on my own then of course I'm going to ask someone.
You are complaining about me asking for info??? wtf??

I wouldn't call pictures, radar images, metal particles and apparantly bio-engineered material "absolutely nothing".

Link? Article? Anything?

You're just like all the other debunkers "La La La I can't hear you, there is no evidence!". I think the problem is that you see evidence as something the general public accepts as truth. And "providing" it, as you say, means nothing more than seeing it on TV.

I study the weather and weather phenomenon for a living. You're telling me phenom that I study is something else simply because you saw some video on the internet telling you it's something else? Now tell me how much sense does that make to you. NONE whatsoever.
I could care less what the TV says or what the public accepts. Also, just because the public accepts it doesn't make it wrong. I'm not sure why you think that.....

We're talking about chemtrails, not contrails.
Yes, they might affect weather, that has nothing to do with this discussion and what you're implying, that they are caused by certain weather, does not explain the evidence we see.

Well so far the only thing that has been presented is contrails. So if you have any evidence of these chemtrails, please present it.

Nobody said you should believe them, you just show your true colours by ignoring what they say

Do you want me to analyze word by word what they say?

and continueing to claim there is no evidence.

Perhaps there is. I would like to see it

You're concerned with protecting your theory, how can you not, after you've labeled the alternaty as whacked out?

I don't have another theory. I have what's going on.
The alternative is whacked because 1) of it's origins 2) it makes absolutely no sense (as what's being claimed is simply not possible/feasible) and 3) see #1 and 2.

[Descending?
You obviously haven't payed very much attention to these "phenomena".
The clouds slowly spread out and form a haze, they do not just fall to the ground. There are countless pictures on the internet to show this process. And this doesn't make any sense to you? A minute ago you were arguing they don't even reach the ground ever, now you think it's strange they don't fall to the ground?

How about you try reading what I said for once.
The man in the video claimed the clouds descended and he was able to collect samples. My response was to that. He was able to take pictures of the clouds when they were 30,000 feet but apparently he couldn't take pictures of them while it descended. Nonsense.

I'm so fed up with people like you going "lol that's not true" and then just repeating the initial explanation. But wait! You've added "under the right conditions" water condensates. Thank you Cpt obvious. Physics major I assume?

No, not physics but close enough.

And yet more BS from you. How surprising. You said water condensates after it evaporates. That is not the case. It only does so when conditions are right.

You do know that dissipating/evaporating, is not the same as dissapearing right?

In a lot of cases sure it is. As in, it's there one minute and not there the next. Nothing on this earth lasts forever.

Oh it's hours already. Last number was 20 minutes. Could you quantify "hours"? Because that's a little vague. And I'd dispute that.

"Hours" as in more than one hour.
Who said anything about 20 min.?



maggy
I'm not sure who you're talking to, but I love it when people say stuff like this:

Chemtrails NOT Contrails are being sprayed by government. I have tons of photos on this and it sounds like you are working for the government to give their lies or you have not checked into all the research on Chemtrails.

So because I don't believe in some theory that has NO basis and that was started to purposely scare people, I work for the government now? LOL!!!! LOL!!!

Incredible.
The moto of this site is to deny ignorance. I have done so. I have researched this. I study related fields for a living. Yet, you are going by what other people (who can't even back up their claim) on the internet are telling you.
Hmmm.....maybe YOU are the one working for the government. Purposely spreading lies to deceive the public. No wonder America is so far behind other countries in education. We're teaching people to believe anything they see on the internet and not think for themselves.