Questions for masons

That's "Skull & Bones" "Supposedly"

Well if the images I’ve seen from the Cremation of Care are real and are some sort of ritual - then it seems skull and bones is also a secret society, some sort of cult group. That scares me to know Bush is apart of something like that then joining masonry.




[edit on 7-3-2008 by andre18]

reply to post by andre18


Presidents have been going to the Bohemian Grove for a very long time. There's some good threads about it here on ATS. You can even see pictures of the effigy burned in the Cremation of Care. The Cremation of Care is probably a theatrical ceremony not unlike those used in Freemasonry, (only in the fact that it's theatrical and not a literal ceremony, not suggesting Masons perform mock human sacrifices.) The Cremation of Care is a tradition the members of the Bohemian Grove have been carrying on for over a hundred years, I believe. As the title suggest, the moral of the ceremony is that they "cremate" care, leave their worries behind, and just spend the two weeks having homosexual relations with each other while dancing around campfires completely whacked out on ecstasy. (Or so the rumors say...) It's meant to remind the members that politics and business should stay out of the Grove, though apparently they no longer take they advice.

reply to post by an3rkist


This is how I see it….. If Bush and other presidents have been apart of this group called the Skull and Bones in which initiation happens at Yale (was it Yale? Well some university anyway) that then leads them to be accepted into the bohemian grove because of their initiation as a Skull and Bones member – then does that not mean the next president will also get into this club…? Hillary or Obama…..? which also begs the question did Hillary or Obama both join in the Skull and Bones in university?

Hillary went to Yale Law, but way before Skull & Bones was coed. Obama never went to Yale.

Sorry.

reply to post by andre18


You don't have to be Skull and Bones to get into the Grove..

In fact you just need to be influential so yes, the next president will be a member because of his influence.. also money plays a big factor, but typically, money and influence go hand in hand.

1) What do you believe about Alfred Pike's involvement with the KKK?

2) Do Mason's still exclude women?

3) Does Bohemian Grove still exclude women?

4) What are all of these big-time, high-placed Masons discussing behind closed doors?
The Chosen Few -SF Chronicle

5) What do you think of Nixon's famous description of Bohemian Grove: "..the most faggy goddamned thing you could ever imagine."
Gay Porn Star Serves Moguls - NY Times

6) Do they still have gay porn stars working at the Grove?

Originally posted by Trauma
1) What do you believe about Alfred Pike's involvement with the KKK?

I don't believe had any involvement with the KKK, at least not the evil vicious racist one of the 20th Century. I have heard that he may have been part of an entirely innocent earlier predecessor in the 19th Century but I really wouldn't know.n?

2) Do Mason's still exclude women?

There is male-only freemasonry; female-only freemasonry and mixed freemasonry. One of these excludes women, one excludes men and the other includes both.

4) What are all of these big-time, high-placed Masons discussing behind closed doors?
The Chosen Few -SF Chronicle

This article doesn't have anything to do with freemasons. Since the article itself doesn't even mention masons other than a passing reference to masons being male-only, I'm curious as to why you have even mentioned them. There were no football players, pastors or beauticians mentioned in the article either - are they too conspiring against us?

Since there is no connection between masonry and the grove, I don't get the last two questions - how would any mason know the answer to that?

I know this isn’t really anything to do with masonry…..but, doesn’t it look a bit dodgy? Presidents involved in cult rituals such as the cremation of care, Skull and Bones secret societies

Let me slow it down for you all……presidents…..cult….. cremation….rituals.
It just doesn’t sound right…..

Yeah it ain't right, but it belongs in a separate thread unless you can relate it somehow to Masonry. Either start a separate thread or get back on topic.

Greetings allI'm a first-time poster and impressed with the tone of this thread. As to Bro. Pike's alleged involvement with the KKK, this link may prove to be informative:

Albert Pike did not found...

Looking forward to more posts from non-brothers and brothers alike.

reply to post by andre18


"Cult" .. I don't see the Grove as being a Cult.. nor the Occult, or even "Pagan" by any means.. however I do wonder why many seem to think these people need to oblige by .. strict religious teachings.. you never know who may be a closet pagan lol..

Rich men doing eccentric things... surprising? No. If anything it shows they are Human compared to the stiff no-nonsense political light we see them in everyday .. in reality behind closed doors they may be entirely different.

But thats media. Nothing is personal anymore.

Some stuff I’ve been thinking about…..

1. What does the All Seeing Eye represent to you as a mason personally?

2. How did the ‘masons are controlling the world’ conspiracy start?

3. Is there a collection plate type thing in Masonry? Eg: donate to the cause…

4. Is money an issue?

Originally posted by andre18
Some stuff I’ve been thinking about…..

1. What does the All Seeing Eye represent to you as a mason personally?

God/Jesus Christ

2. How did the ‘masons are controlling the world’ conspiracy start?

No idea. It wasn't started by the masons, thats for sure.

3. Is there a collection plate type thing in Masonry? Eg: donate to the cause…

Yes. Although the cause varies, it is always charitable. In my lodge the Master picks a local charity, and we split the funds between that and the lodge charity funds.

4. Is money an issue?

Money is never an issue, only lack of it causes a problem

Andre18:

You asked two questions: what does it mean to me as a Mason, and what does it mean to me personally. Masonically the all-seeing eye represents the Great Architect of the Universe, or God, the organizing principal of all creation. For me personally it represents the Christian ideation of God. I tend to separate God from Christ when it comes to Masonry, as the teachings of Freemasonry are based in part on the Old Testament. Jesus does not figure in those teachings, and only appears in advanced degrees of the York Rite.

as for the

Originally posted by andre18
Some stuff I’ve been thinking about…..

1. What does the All Seeing Eye represent to you as a mason personally?

2. How did the ‘masons are controlling the world’ conspiracy start?

3. Is there a collection plate type thing in Masonry? Eg: donate to the cause…

4. Is money an issue?

1.) Absolutely nothing.

2.) I don't know.

3.) Yes, at my lodge, we have a collection, all of which goes to charity.

4.) No, as long as you can pay your annual dues.

Originally posted by andre18
Some stuff I’ve been thinking about…..

1. What does the All Seeing Eye represent to you as a mason personally?

Nothing in masonic terms. Not even sure there's one in my lodge as decoration. Certainly not prominent if there is. On a personal level, hell, I was a fan of the Illuminatus! Trilogy when I was younger, and got the Steve Jackson Games "Illuminati Membership Kit" with the lapel pin, bumper stickers, and other gag props. Still trying to tack down my Illuminati Special Ops black pin to add to my Scottish Rite cap, just for grins.

Ultimately, there are a LOT of cool symbols in masonry. I still think one of my favorites (often overlooked) is the 24" Gauge:

The twenty-four inch gauge is an instrument made use of by operative Masons to measure and lay out their work. But we, as Free and Accepted Masons, are taught to make use of it for the more noble and glorius purpose of dividing our time. It being divided into twenty-four equal parts, is emblematical of the twenty-four hours of the day; which we are taught to divide into three parts, whereby we find a portion for the service of God and a distressed worthy brother; a portion for our usual vocations, and a portion for refreshment and sleep.
—The Monitor of the Lodge

See, that's just cool. "Don't waste time, and use the time you do have wisely." Certainly a good way to lead your life.

2. How did the ‘masons are controlling the world’ conspiracy start?

I lean towards Nesta Webster's "World Revolution" (1921) as being one of the earliest conspiracy texts that I've seen that related masonry, the Illuminati and the French Revolution. There were probably a handful of texts prior to that though.

3. Is there a collection plate type thing in Masonry? Eg: donate to the cause…

In my lodge there's no regular collection. In the Scottish Rite, there are collection plates that get passed around at each meeting, with the suggestion that you put in "no more than you might spend frivolously in a day". So instead of super-sizing that big mac, toss a few dollars in the jar.

4. Is money an issue?

Do you mean, do you have to have a lot of money to be a mason? No. My money is pretty tight, with a house & a kid, and back in school, and only working part time, etc. You know, the daily grind and sob story for a LOT of people. I manage to pay my annual dues OK and recently when I was semi-unexpectedly inducted into the Knights of St. Andrew (a service group within the Scottish Rite), and I didn't have $30 for initiation (because I didn't know I was getting in that night), a brother paid my fee for me.

[edit on 3/10/2008 by JoshNorton]

reply to post by Saurus


1) To me, personally, it represents concurrently geometry and a reminder to always continue my studies in the liberal arts (because I suck at math, but I'm pretty good in the rest of them!) and the all seeing eye of God, reminding me to square my actions and circumscribe myself within due bounds of all mankind (that part comes from ritual, but thats the personal meaning to me). That is JUST my person interpretation, and it is N O T what is taught in ritual. And that's OK, part of the great thing about masons is we can individually interpret the symbols.

2) I think it comes from the desire for people to make sense out of their surroundings. It is much easier to blame all the worlds problems on "the masons" rather than closely examining what is really going on. I have no idea what the actual historical source is, but this sort of thinking is the root of all mason conspiracies.

3) My blue lodge does pass around a "plate" for charity, with the understanding that since we do this every meeting that we are not all going to be throwing big money in, but a few dollars here or there.

4) I'm not sure what you mean. Is money something that people notice in the lodge? No. In fact most of us are poor, but someone or a group of people always steps up to fund charity efforts when the funding goes low.

Yes, at my lodge, we have a collection, all of which goes to charity.

That's cool, it's just that when I think collection plate I think in religious terms - the church needs money - god needs money? No tax etc.....

Is the Lodge like a church in that it doesn't pay tax?

Originally posted by andre18

Yes, at my lodge, we have a collection, all of which goes to charity.

That's cool, it's just that when I think collection plate I think in religious terms - the church needs money - god needs money? No tax etc.....

Is the Lodge like a church in that it doesn't pay tax?

Many Round Table, Lions and Rotary clubs also have a charity collection.

Tax would depend on the laws of the country, but in most countries, lodges are registered as non-profit organizations and do not pay tax.

Church collections are generally used to support the church, whereas the collection at a lodge is all given to charity.

[edit on 11/3/2008 by Saurus]