China heightens Christian persecution

Originally posted by Damien_Hell
I don't like Christians, I admit that. Your annoying, and 95% of people who are part of the KKK or other prejudice groups are Christians. Now I doubt that thats the case over in China. It may just be some ordinary people being bothered, I don't care enough to read about it. But the problem with the complaint is this: The people are stupid. China is still communist right? Communism rejects religion, I'm sure theres a way to get a church or something like that in China, if there is FOLLOW THE RULES. If not then MOVE. Its that simple.
Goes without saying but I'll say it anyway. The actions of Communists do not in anyway reflect those of Atheists, because Communism is so dogmatic it could be a religion.

The issue with communism and religion, is that in China, communism *is* the religion, thats why they will not tolerate other systems of belief.

besides compared to the Jews, Blacks, Asians, etc Christians know NOTHING of persecution so quit complaining

Originally posted by Damien_Hell
besides compared to the Jews, Blacks, Asians, etc Christians know NOTHING of persecution so quit complaining

Who's complaining? This is a discussion. Christians are not being put to death over here in the West but most certainly they are in the East. That is what we are discussing. Churches are blown up with their congregations inside, people are put to death for converting to Christianity, many flee for their lives, the church in China is government mandated and Heaven help you if you get caught gathering outside a government regulated church, etc. The only thing we have to worry about over here is belittlement. No big deal- just get some thick skin. Over there they are being killed for it.

reply to post by Damien_Hell


I guess you're in a top University, studying History.

Have you ever heard about the Roman colosseums?
What about the inquisitions?
How about the Rallions?
Or the anabaptists?

Originally posted by Clearskies
reply to post by Damien_Hell

 

I guess you're in a top University, studying History.

...whered you get that idea? I do know of the Salem Witch trials, and the dark ages

[edit on 10-2-2008 by Damien_Hell]

yep, and even other christian groups like the cathars and gnostic christians.
alot of "christians" have been killed down thru history, for being
a specific brand of christian or not being a specific brand of
christian. that's cause the guys at the tippy top, aren't interested
in the actual christianity but in power and control.

now that it isn't as useful to them, they blame the people for it, instead of the organizations who caused it. it isn't the common christian that is the problem and never has been.

[edit on 10-2-2008 by undo]

Originally posted by Damien_Hell
Over there they are being killed for it.

Have you got any indubitable evidences that people
are killed for their believes in China today?
BTW, I live in China.


[edit on 10-2-2008 by gs001]

Those blood cultists in China must have had it coming to them, according to Paul...

For rulers are not a terror to good works, but to the evil. Wilt thou then not be afraid of the power? do that which is good, and thou shalt have praise of the same: For he is the minister of God to thee for good. But if thou do that which is evil, be afraid; for he beareth not the sword in vain: for he is the minister of God, a revenger to execute wrath upon him that doeth evil. So put yourselves under the authority, not for fear of wrath, but because you have the knowledge of what is right.

So if Paul is to be believed the Chinese authorities are the Ministers of god to deliver wrath upon the evil doers. Xians should stop doing evil and respect god's ministers.

paul was an interesting man,
but he was definitely not jesus.
when i read his stuff i have to do a double take sometimes.
the more i read jesus, and then paul, the more i realize,
paul was a smart guy who had an extraordinary experience.
jesus should be the focal point though. paul, like moses,
was a guy doing the best he could under the circumstances
he was in at the time.

reply to post by Lilitu


Well, I'll assume you are joking due to the use of the "" smilie. We are also told in other passages that although we are to obey the law of the government, the government never takes precedence over God. This means to be passive and nonviolent in a political sense because no matter what happens, they cannot destroy what is inside of us. Good will always come out ahead in the end.

Cordially Yours,
ATS's resident "Blood Cultist."

[edit on 2/11/2008 by AshleyD]

reply to post by gs001


You mean, like Chinaaidorg


Or gospelweb

or sunlituplands




or Asianews.it
To quote the article;

"Hu recalls a few of the many cases: Lin Hongying, a farmer and vegetable vendor who was beaten to death by the municipal police in Jiangsu on July 20th, 2005. Wu Shouqing, a bicycle repairmen, was beaten to death by the police in Wuxi on November 19th, 2005. Duan Huimin, who had presented a petition, was killed by the police in Shanghai in January of 2007. Chen Xiaoming, a human rights activist who had presented petitions, was imprisoned in Shanghai and died on July 1st, 2007, of an untreated illness. And 200 authors of petitions were a arrested in Beijing on August 5th, 2007, precisely one year before the Olympics."

[edit on 11-2-2008 by Clearskies]

Originally posted by AshleyD
Good will always come out ahead in the end.

Christendom has had what, nearly two millennia? Hello! It doesn't seem to be working. Either that or there is nothing good in it to come out. Even if we were to assume that christianity although founded in myth means well and can help its adherents to overcome whatever chains they have imagined to bind them, one should at least be able to expect 50/50 results. Yet the overall effect of christendom has been a detriment to humanity. One can only speculate where humanity might be developmentally if christendom had not set us back for more than a thousand years. So I cannot blame China for taking steps to squash a known harmful influence. Religion is a disease and needs to be treated as such.

reply to post by Lilitu


Did you expect heaven on Earth?
America's a pretty nice place, considered.

BTW, What is YOUR religion?
I mean everyone has one, whether it's worshiping
pleasure or drugs or their intellect
or a sexual partner.
You can't escape Man's innate superstition or God.

[edit on 11-2-2008 by Clearskies]

So I cannot blame China for taking steps to squash a known harmful influence.

Those are human beings, you know? They aren't a "harmful influence." They are people. They aren't stereotypes. They aren't the ones making the rules. They aren't the ones that committed the human atrocities. They are your neighbors, friends, co-workers, school mates, even your bartender could be a christian. Your vet. Your doctor. Your EMT. The librarian. The person who waits on your table, does your dry cleaning, All these people need to die because you have a problem with christianity?

Originally posted by Clearskies
Did you expect heaven on Earth?

Well isn't that what the bloodcultists have supposed to have been praying for? That "thy will be done on Earth as it is in heaven"? It has been two thousand years, what's the problem?

Originally posted by Clearskies
America's a pretty nice place, considered.

Oh you mean that country where the native Americans or "heathens" as they were called were all but exterminated in the genicidal frenzy of Manifest Destiny, a doctrine rooted in christian political thought? Where peoples of African descent have been enslaved and/or oppressed for most of our history? That America?

Originally posted by Clearskies
BTW, What is YOUR religion?
I mean everyone has one, whether it's worshiping
pleasure or drugs or their intellect
or a sexual partner.

I have no religion, no religious faith or belief in any gods, goddesses, otherworldly beings, superstitions or unsubstantiated philosophies. Lack of belief does not constitute a belief system. There is no "god-shaped" hole in my heart to be filled with something else although I will admit that the religious seem to be stricken with a god-shaped hole in their heads.

Originally posted by Clearskies
You can't escape Man's innate superstition or God.

Innate superstition? Please. Superstitions are learned and my parents didn't teach us jackass-silly nonsense. I do not believe in gods so there is nothing to escape. It is not a "god" I fear but the psychotics who promote the god delution, for they have an established historical propensity to eliminate any and all resistance to their "manifest desiny" or "dominion".

Originally posted by undo
Those are human beings, you know? They aren't a "harmful influence." They are people. They aren't stereotypes. They aren't the ones making the rules. They aren't the ones that committed the human atrocities. They are your neighbors, friends, co-workers, school mates, even your bartender could be a christian. Your vet. Your doctor. Your EMT. The librarian. The person who waits on your table, does your dry cleaning, All these people need to die because you have a problem with christianity?

They knew their actions were illegal in China and that they carried harsh penalties. They accepted that risk and violated Chinese law anyway. I have no pity for them. And no they were not my neighbors, friends, co-workers, school mates, bartender, vet, doctor, EMT, librarian, waiter or drycleaner. They were just people whose harmful god delusion lead to their premature deaths.

Originally posted by Lilitu

Well isn't that what the bloodcultists have supposed to have been praying for? That "thy will be done on Earth as it is in heaven"? It has been two thousand years, what's the problem?

We don't pray to have heaven on Earth, just God's will on Earth as in heaven.
His will is that we work and grow, not live in a bubble of perfection and fun. Sometimes it's not a bed of roses.

Oh you mean that country where the native Americans or "heathens" as they were called were all but exterminated in the genicidal frenzy of Manifest Destiny, a doctrine rooted in christian political thought? Where peoples of African descent have been enslaved and/or oppressed for most of our history? That America?

I am part Cherokee and glad of it.
Manifest Destiny was kind of like "the war on terrorism."
land grabs and mineral rights.
Greed.
But, there was violence on both sides.
Here is what John Wesley thought about it.

I have no religion, no religious faith or belief in any gods, goddesses, otherworldly beings, superstitions or unsubstantiated philosophies. Lack of belief does not constitute a belief system. There is no "god-shaped" hole in my heart to be filled with something else although I will admit that the religious seem to be stricken with a god-shaped hole in their heads.

Well, you DO seem to be smitten with your perceived, superior intelligence.

Innate superstition?

YES.

[edit on 11-2-2008 by Clearskies]

Originally posted by Lilitu

They knew their actions were illegal in China and that they carried harsh penalties.

"You will be assimilated....."
Thank God we can live free, here, for now.
Men weren't made to live as slaves to the state! Why can't you see that?
Even many God-hating atheists believe in free speech.

Originally posted by Lilitu

They knew their actions were illegal in China and that they carried harsh penalties. They accepted that risk and violated Chinese law anyway. I have no pity for them. And no they were not my neighbors, friends, co-workers, school mates, bartender, vet, doctor, EMT, librarian, waiter or drycleaner. They were just people whose harmful god delusion lead to their premature deaths.

Is it or is it not, the right of all people to believe in whatever god they choose? Does that line stop at christians only?

and yes, they could be and are your neighbors, your emt, your dry cleaners, etc. in fact, some of them pick the crops you eat, make the clothes you wear, under the less than humane conditions and pay scales of china.

as a woman, you have very little say about what happens to your body there. the elite believe they have the right to tell you what to think, what to worship and what comes out of your womb, if anything. since the 70's, they've had forced sterilizations, including forced operations to insert IUDs and killed somewhere in the vicinity of 500,000,000 female children, either unborn via abortion or as a result of neglect (no medical care or schooling for the third child and up) or death by their own parents to escape the fines and laws forbiding it.

you wanna defend that type of government? you need to go live there (but come back before someone hurts you or kidnaps you because dr. wu needs a wife (there are no women left)

[edit on 11-2-2008 by undo]

Originally posted by Clearskies

I have no religion, no religious faith or belief in any gods, goddesses, otherworldly beings, superstitions or unsubstantiated philosophies. Lack of belief does not constitute a belief system. There is no "god-shaped" hole in my heart to be filled with something else although I will admit that the religious seem to be stricken with a god-shaped hole in their heads.

Well, you DO seem to be smitten with your perceived, superior intelligence.

I neither said or implied I have superior intellect so just whose "perception" is that? Or is this just a feeble ad hominem attack? I think the latter. Regardless, no genius is required to understand that there simply is no such thing as a tooth fairy.