The drama is getting old... Let's put this to bed for once and for all.

Someone please list out the evidence (preferably with quotes) that Mr. Escamilla has promised to provide so I can make a formal request for it to be presented with a deadline attached that if not met will result in account privileges being terminated.

I have required the same of GK as well.

Springer...

Originally posted by rxnnxs
many will not understand how it should really work:
you do research in this area for free and give in all you can invest. but dont start putting in videos with a copyright and a name and a tm and aprice tag on it and so on.
this is contraproductive. those possible objects in the sky are not your invention nor your posession. give all your knowledge away for free. if you try to make one single dime

Okay Zorgon take a deep breath...

>>>sounds of dragging out a soap box<<<<<<

This kind of thinking really does irritate me... I am going to attempt to keep this reply general.... but one point first...

You 'attack" Jose on the 'dictating the rules' issue (admittedly a mistake here) but then proceed to tell us "how it should really work"

I am not going to defend any particular style of presentation... but the issue of money keeps rearing its head...

I here this cry many time in this field... that we should all spend our time for FREE, all the hard work, the expenses incurred, the purchasing of documents etc etc.. yet if someone goes to make a film, or sell a book all of a sudden its "If you don't do it for free... you have no credibility"

Do YOU work for free? The daily newspapers take pictures of 'things that are not their property' and they sell the news... the local TV stations make millions from advertising to show you the news... you can bet if CNN had these type of craft with any proof they would be making the money.

Now that does not mean people should be free to run scams... that would be silly (and fraudulent) but to say you are not allowed to make money producing a film or a book is stupid...

Phil Plait sells books and lecture tours
James Oberg make a living writing books and articles...

Both these and others make MONEY debunking alternate researchers... yet I don't see any of you "do it for free" crowd hassling THEM on their website to stop making money

As we just discussed information on websites disappears... even my own site... the minute I am no longer able to pay for it (out of my own pocket) for whatever reason 30 days after it will be GONE... deleted due to lack of payment... I know the skeptics would not grieve

Videos, books and CD's survive the author... people PREFER to have this material 'in hand" hence the sales figures...

Now if its a question of presentation...
Don't forget that Tabloids and Jerry Springer are favorites in America

I personally have a problem with how some people present the material, but this is still America... land of the (almost) free... many have given their lives to support freedom of the Press and our ways of Capatalism

Let the buyer decide...

>>>>kicks soap box into the corner<<<<



[edit on 19-12-2007 by zorgon]

Hello everyone,

Thank you ngchunter for your message. It reminds me about my earlier question regarding the black device seen in the back of the telescope shown in what could Mr Lenard's equipment.

Could it be some kind of tracking device ??!?

Your message reflects my latest conversation with my friend as he told me
that this technique was just an hypothesis and that to start with, you could hardly transvestite the photos to a very advanced degree and that it gets even worse with a film like you said. (good call)

One last question, could you speculate a little and tell us what is your opinion
about the probable "hoaxing" ? (Could it be something dumb enough we do not think about or that Mr Lenard did accidentaly while manipulating his "toys" ? )


Peace,

In Thrust We Trust

In regards to finding these objects with a scope:
If I can find them with the eyepiece first then switch the eyepiece with the cam fast enough without jerking the scope out of view, we may have it.
Even if I have the exact coordinates of the "crafts" this is what's involved:

The slightest movement, even .001 degrees can alter the view 1000 miles.
And I haven't mastered the tracking program yet.
I understand the program, it's getting the scope planted in my "exact" Lat/Long and pointing to "true north".
Again, if off .001 degrees in ANY of these coordinates, will put me another 1000 miles off. Ascension/Declination of the mount attached to the scope is critical also.
And again, can put you off.
It isn't a matter of just assembling the scope and mount, hit "find" on the controller and see what you want. Just tightening the screws to the assembly alters your position. And after repeated moving of the scope from inside to outside loosens the assembly a bit.
Lots of variables involved when using a portable telescope that has an equatorial mount, especially precision ones.
This is why "backyard amateurs" usually have their set-up in a shed with a retractable roof or something and don't move it once set-up.

[edit on 19-12-2007 by gauncents]

Another tip for scopes:

My 8" SC assembly weighs 90lbs.
You need a concrete base. (I use my driveway)
Don't put these heavier set ups on grass/dirt. It will sink.
Not reccommended on a wooden deck. (anyone walking by will give an "earthquake" effect.
Ask bystanders, if any, not to kick the tripod legs. (easy to do in the dark)

If I think of any more, I'll post it, or if you have a specific question, I'll try to answer the best I can.
MC/HNY

Hey guys, this is just a wild thought of an experiment after anyone is able to pin point the location of the spaceships. Would it be somehow possible to attach a strong laser pointer to the scope and project it on the spaceship?

Wouldn't it be bent by the atmospehere or something?

My point is to let the aliens know that we know!!! Well eventhough it would be just a small point of light, there might be a chance they would be able to pick it up somehow. I think its a good way to initiate contact.

=======on the spaceship=======

OFFICER: "Captain, there is a beam of light being projected onto our hull."

CAPTAIN: "Is it coming from NASA?"

OFFICER: "No Sir, its an amature astronomer, and now I am already picking up three light beams."

CAPTAIN: "Inform the fleet to prepare for global contact initiation!"

=======on the spaceship=======

So what say yee?

Originally posted by zorgon

Okay Zorgon take a deep breath...

>>>sounds of dragging out a soap box<<<<<<
...
>>>>kicks soap box into the corner<<<<

well.. putting this in the box is wise. i dont understand how people really could think about patents as a right to make money because they think they stood above many else and invented something. they discovered it! it was there before, will always be there.
want me to start with the patent on a shopping cart? so many things are totally nonsense and in my eyes and unpatentable. why dont someone patent the law of physics?
if everybody would serve the community, no one would be workless and if so, then it would be ok because when there is nothing to do.. it doesnt mean the world stops turning. instead now the minds can start creating, thinking, loving!
its the same reason some people argue that it is impossible to live just for fun, without working 8 hours a day. imagine there would be an energy source which fuels robots and so on. imagine you could live independent, self sustaining devices at work.
who wouldn't like that? well.. those who profit from the unfair trade, those who draw the blood from the sheeps masses like a vampire. those who try to tell us work is everything. something nice here and there, thrown between the masses liek bread in former days to distract them from the reals interesting stuff.

dont ask what your country can do for you, if you can do something for your country... do it! if you have enough resources to do in your free time research, well.. you can decide if you want to get payed for it or give it away for free.

but patenting a device, and in this case somwhat undefined, total useless apparatus we now are supposed to forget about, which enables this and that, well..
and where the probability is high that thousands of people still use this knowledge right now but where none of them even dreamed about writing it down and making money out of it is the way i criticize.

but this is also the american way of life!
it is like project paperclip: getting every single grabbable bit from germany and then giving it as patents to ibm, jpl and whoever asked for it, patenting it and let the whole world pay for things that are not even new.

even now most people in usa are deep down in debts they never can pay back. who is paying their debts? just by printing more and more worthless $$ isnt solving the problem for the world, but it solves it for north america.. for a while.

i cant write down all that what is obvious in my eyes, but try to look at it from my perspective.

dont try to make money with stuff that has not a valuable price tag to it.
we may differ in this, but i think the only way one deserves hard money (preferably gold) is hard work. not the stuff thats just written on paper or counted bitwise.
the world is stalling because too much people try to make money out of hot air.
and this is where it comes back to reality, back to this thread.
just hot air, virtual hot air...

Originally posted by dave420
If Mr Escamilla was serious about his research, it would all be available free of charge, and he'd welcome critical opinions on it, as any scientist would.
Please correct me if I'm wrong, Jose.

i am sorry for correcting this, at least that what i have experienced is, that those scientists you described are in the minority.
there are unfortunately many scientist who do not allow anything published because they themselfes didn't discover it but some assistant.. so it disappears again and again...

and like i wrote before.. just one black sheep is enough to destroy many peoples work..

[edit on 19/12/2007 by rxnnxs]