Texan 'hero' shoots and kills burglars

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posted on Dec, 7 2007 @ 07:54 PM
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Originally posted by TKainZero


So here is my headline of the report.

Two illigal imigrant scumbags are killed by a patriot proctecting his neighbors property.


Hmmmmm?

So now the old guy checked the thieves and knew they were illegal immigrants,he then as a good patriot should do proceeded and kill them.

So it continues,its just changes a little.

Shoot and kill thieves it will make you a hero and shoot and kill illegal immigrant thieves and when their dead kick them in the nuts for good measure and your a patriot hero.

How did I know this was coming.


[edit on 7-12-2007 by gps777]




posted on Dec, 7 2007 @ 08:06 PM
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reply to post by TKainZero
 


After seeing this post I couldn't help but comment.

TKainzero is nothing more than a racist. 'They deserve to die because they were in our country ILLEGALLY!!!'
what a joke.

It wouldn't be so bad if they were here legally, right? Your predjudism is not welcome here.



posted on Dec, 7 2007 @ 11:29 PM
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Burglary suspects shot in back

This was where I saw it. Funny how the Horn supporters here were all "if they had crowbars coming at me, I'd feel it was life threatening." Well, what you got to say now, huh? Your precious "hero" shot the perps in the back like a coward.

Guess they don't make heroes like they used to, lol.



posted on Dec, 8 2007 @ 04:15 AM
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Originally posted by Rasobasi420
Oh you wacky conservatives and your deep desire to kill everyone always crack me up.




Seems to me that It was some years back in Dallas where a young man was going into a shopping mall to purchase some ammunition to use at the local shooting range. While walking up to the store he witnessed a man shoot his girlfriend five times and get into a car and drive away. He ran back to his car and got out his pistol and shot this other fellow several times through his car with a large caliber handgun, ,killing him.

This young man immediately drove home and secured the services of a lawyer and under the lawyers counsel turned himself in the next day.

This went to trial for murder. The jury found this young man not guilty. The prosecution decided not to retry the case.

I will explain something of great import to some of the posters here ..a concept seldom taken into consideration about values and thinking. This concerns Rasobasi420s post and this post on the first page of this thread

www.abovetopsecret.com...

Now..here is where all you feel good types miss the mark by a long shot...a far off long shot.

Nowhere do you ever declare or state what risk or danger people who have been robbed have taken to earn the goods that have been stolen. Both you folks and the legal system often leave these people behind in the risk..only to have to take the risk over twice or more to "re earn' the stolen goods again. This is never taken into account while crying out about the value of life. What about the people who often work in risky jobs where they can be killed or maimed to earn thier goods. YOu folks tend to diminish the efforts of these peoples in favor of your feel good sentiments.
You are condemming and minimizing the labor and risks of working people. To put people in a position where they must work and risk over and over with no relief doesnt make good nonsense while crooks get a pass through a ineffective legal system.
You are double jeopardizing these people who work within the system to the possibility of more life risking labor.

There are many peoples in this nation who daily take serious risk for thier moneys and goods with their lives and safety. You do not diminish or ignore their risk for your sentiments about the value of life ..while diminishing their risk taken in earning thier livings or goods. Only public education can dumb people down enough to condem others to taking the risk again over and over..to put ointment on others feelings.

Insurance will not often cover the costs of full replacement and many peoples do not insure. This does not make their risk disposable and expendable for the sentiments on the holyness of life. It makes these other people condemmed to take the risks over and over to replace these stolen goods. It diminishes thier lives. Only public education can dumb people down so far that they dont realize this.

If you want to steal from others you need to thoroughly understand the risks or otherwise find another way to make a living.

Many many Americans take serious risks in earning thier livings and property. They have the right to be heard and protect thier propertys and hence thier lives/risks.

YOu do not condem working people to more risk ...to protect theives. This is one of the major flaws in our legal system against the working peoples.

This shooting is sad for numerous reasons..but it is obviously more effective than most of the legal profession ...including the constabularly.

This type of thing happened here many many years ago where there was an all night grocery store open. Women frequenting this buisness were getting assaulted several times a week, beat up and thier moneys/pocketbooks stolen. The local police were totally ineffective in preventing this or simply did not put a high priority on it.

One night these crooks assaulted a woman who was a competition shooter and was carrying her pistol. When he beat on her and tried to steal her pocket book she resisted and shot him in the knee. While he was down screaming in pain she shot him in between the eyes.
This woman was to be charged with murder for executing this person. The public outcry was so immense and outraged that the charges were dropped. This woman was more effective than the whole police department in putting a dent in the assaults at this buisness establishment. Overnight the assaults went to zero.

I am not in favor of shooting people..but it is apparent that in many cases the political/legal system does not often work in prevention. It only works in data collection to justify more politicians and ineffectiveness.

Some of you figure out for yourselves which system gets better results.

This sentimentalness of which some of you are so in favor only condems those of us who try to live peacefully and honestly earn our propertys....to possible death or serious injury to re earn the propertys stolen by those operating outside the law. You have to go to school to get this dumb so as to think this is normal or justified. You totally ignore the risk many of us take daily in earning our propertys. YOu ignore the risk..you ignore and condem us and our lives. This is not justifiable.


Someone needs to point this out.

Orangetom



posted on Dec, 8 2007 @ 05:45 AM
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Originally posted by orangetom1999
[Seems to me that It was some years back in Dallas where a young man was going into a shopping mall to purchase some ammunition to use at the local shooting range. While walking up to the store he witnessed a man shoot his girlfriend five times and get into a car and drive away. He ran back to his car and got out his pistol and shot this other fellow several times through his car with a large caliber handgun, ,killing him.

This young man immediately drove home and secured the services of a lawyer and under the lawyers counsel turned himself in the next day.

This went to trial for murder. The jury found this young man not guilty. The prosecution decided not to retry the case.


Sorry, this is a different situation, because the person had shot someone and it is arguable that if anyone had approached the shot girl to render assistance that they would have been shot as well. I have had this specific discussion with some law enforcement officers that I go hang out with. Often guys that they have put in prison in the past will run into them when we are out, and one day I specifically asked what I should do if one of them ever attacked us. Also in the above situation witnessing someone you loved being shot will provoke a violent emotional response in a reasonable sane person, which falls under voluntary manslaughter.

I am sorry, but seeing your neighbors house being robbed, does not provoke that same level of emotional anger in reasonable sane person. You are comparing apples with oranges.


Originally posted by orangetom1999
One night these crooks assaulted a woman who was a competition shooter and was carrying her pistol. When he beat on her and tried to steal her pocket book she resisted and shot him in the knee. While he was down screaming in pain she shot him in between the eyes.
This woman was to be charged with murder for executing this person. The public outcry was so immense and outraged that the charges were dropped. This woman was more effective than the whole police department in putting a dent in the assaults at this buisness establishment. Overnight the assaults went to zero.


The same thing here, someone that was just attacked will have a reasonable fear, and anger and may commit a murder in the heat of the moment. These type of events are again far different then you getting directly involved in a situation which does not directly involve you personally, or create anger or fear. The man was obviously not in fear, and no reasonable person should be angry enough to shoot someone because he believe that they broke into his neighbors house and are stealing his neighbors goods. What the truth is here is that this guy was your typical Texas “grew up on cowboy movies”, and decided that he was going to play the town marshal.

[edit on 12/8/2007 by defcon5]



posted on Dec, 8 2007 @ 06:01 AM
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Originally posted by kaferwerks
Ok...let me get this straight...You are a criminal and in my country illegaly and you do not speak the language caught committing a crime and you are shot because of it...boo hoo...

My personal belief is these people that enter this country illegaly dont have rights. Not the constitutional rights that you would have as an american. I dont believe they belong here at all. They are criminals in the first place just by walking down the street. But I know there are people here that would disagree. How many other countries in the world would allow such an influx of mexicans and do nothing about it. How many wouls support them as our gvmt does? Not many...but hey we are the land of the free(handout) right?


So what you all are trying to make this about is illegal immigration, but unless the shooter knew that they were in fact illegal immigrants then that has no bearing on the case.


Originally posted by kaferwerks
Defcon 5 says what if they were city officials working on something...Where do you live? Because where I live when the city shows up there is a vehicle that is clearly marked and people wearing reflective vests...at least one person wearing a hardhat...that arguement doesnt fly.


I have had the cable company show up and work on the cable box in my yard at 03:00 in the morning. Because they are contractors who were woken up out of bed in the middle of the night they were dresses in civilian clothing and driving their personal vehicle which was parked way down the street were they had initially started to work on the outage. So it does happen.

What if those people had been bounty hunters serving a warrant on his neighbor, and his neighbor did not realize that? I can think of a thousand different reasons that there could be civilian clothed people entering your neighbor’s structure with a crowbar. How’s about undercover DEA or ATF agents serving a search warrant and removing property as evidence.



posted on Dec, 8 2007 @ 06:06 AM
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Originally posted by kaferwerks
OK John Grisham, this guy will be judged by a jury of his peers…


Which is the same chance that should have been given to the victims in this case as well.


Originally posted by kaferwerks
Who says you dont get to argue like you do here???? I argued my ass off the last time I had jury duty...I wouldn't want 1 red cent of my tax money spent on it…


You do not get to argue in the courtroom as a juror, as a matter of fact you are not allowed to talk in the courtroom. You sit and quietly listen, then are given specific instruction before being sent to the jury room.



posted on Dec, 8 2007 @ 06:14 AM
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reply to post by orangetom1999
 


Come on man, what is "right" is not necessarily "constitutional." Yeah, those who perform such atrocities, in my opinion, should be dealt with (harshly). But that isn't the country I want to live in, where the crime isn't as bad as the punishment.

So you're saying that a 13 year old who steals a pack of gum should die? Sorry, you can't go both ways on this. Want to place an age restriction on B&E? You're being foolish. If the abortion debate has taught us anything, it is that we must be one way or the other with more thought out, more obviously right, conclusions. If you believe in first or third trimester abortions, you are pro-choice, otherwise, you are pro life. There is no in between, which is why this country in failing.

The trick to all things political is finding the perfect balance between each ideal. We all believe in each ideal, yet we must choose a lopsided version of each thought to be part of a party.

I am way off topic, but the fact is, the dude did something very wrong. He went ahead and took away someones' life without thought. He ended a person because they stole from someone else. Remove his hands? Maybe. Take his life? Its wrong, and as much as I believe they should be shot between the eyes doesn't make it right.

If I'm that person, I'd feel awful. I'd rather be in jail for life by putting them in wheelchairs than being free and knowing I killed 2 people who I don't know anything about.

OP: By the way, this entire "Illegal Immigrant" bull**** has nothing to do with anything. I am so sick of the Bill Oreilly's commentary on the subject. I managed many of these "illegals" and they worked harder than any american I hired. They work jobs no one wants to work, and they do it with much much more dedication. They are a godsend for those with small businesses. I took Mexican and African illegal immigrants and I'd do it again in a second. And yes, I had to deal with EO as much as anyone else, but the illegals were much better at the job.



posted on Dec, 8 2007 @ 07:54 AM
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Here is an update on the story. It talks about the police presence on scene.

Police were on the scene, they say seconds, but the detective that was parked in front of Mr. Horn's house. He didn't shout out or identify himself. They say he arrived seconds before the shootings but he was there parked. How long was it?

Police say the men were shot in the back in Mr. Horn's yard but autopsies state that it could be determined or wasn't stated at all.

I think the police are covering their part in the event.



posted on Dec, 8 2007 @ 08:31 AM
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Originally posted by roadgravel
Here is an update on the story. It talks about the police presence on scene.


Did any of you listen to the call; this guy is a complete moron. He was told repeatedly by the 911 officer to stay inside, and he refuses. The dispatcher even tells him that no property is worth shooting someone over, and he agrees. There are zero grounds on that tape to call what he did self-defense, because he should not have left his house to begin with.
To make matters even worse, there were undercover police in the area, who were afraid that they he would shoot them as well. This guy definitely deserves to do some serious prison time over this one. First degree premeditated murder, plain and simple.



posted on Dec, 8 2007 @ 09:05 AM
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Originally posted by defcon5

Originally posted by roadgravel
Here is an update on the story. It talks about the police presence on scene.


Did any of you listen to the call; this guy is a complete moron.


Thanks. I posted an article that gives the recent facts from the investigation for those who are interested. Guess we should all just take your opinion on all parts of this story. I guess you already saw today's article.



posted on Dec, 8 2007 @ 09:08 AM
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i wonder what the robbery rate in texas per capita is compared to a more liberal state like california..
anyone know the statistics? it would be interesting to see if the threat of getting shot is a deterent. i've see other statistics that show places known to have armed citizens have lower crime rates.



posted on Dec, 8 2007 @ 09:08 AM
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Originally posted by roadgravel

Originally posted by defcon5

Originally posted by roadgravel
Here is an update on the story. It talks about the police presence on scene.


Did any of you listen to the call; this guy is a complete moron.


Thanks. I posted an article that gives the recent facts from the investigation for those who are interested. Guess we should all just take your opinion on all parts of this story. I guess you already saw today's article.


Not you, this Horn guy…
The call was attached to your article, that was the first time I heard the full call.

[edit on 12/8/2007 by defcon5]



posted on Dec, 8 2007 @ 09:36 AM
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reply to post by Mr. Pele Pele
 


[sarcasm]Could it just be another case of aliens versus predator?[/sarcasm]

Anyway, thanks for posting the link to the article.



posted on Dec, 8 2007 @ 09:40 AM
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Originally posted by grimreaper797

Originally posted by skibtz
Maybe if Texans sold their guns n ammo and invested the money in programmes for the community they wouldn't be living in a state of fear. They wouldn't feel threatened. Maybe Texas could instigate a process of peace that spreads to the rest of the world.

Let's have some good come of this eh?


Im not a texan but don't worry I am not living in a state of fear. I got my gun 3 feet from me. I don't feel threatened either because somebody would have a deathwish to rob any house on this block. The amount of guns on this block could fill every room of every house on it. You won't see people committing crimes in this little town. But the surrounding towns have crime. We don't have a police force in our town though, nor do we need one.

State police come through occassionally, but anyone that thinks they want to test their luck committing a crime here, be my guest.



You are completely right in your thinking grimreaper. I am from Louisiana now living in Texas. ALL Southern states, most western states, and even some northern states are willing to stand up to the face of evil and punish those evil people that would steal from them or harm them. The right to keep and bear arms belongs to EVERY United States citizen. If you choose to be a left wing commie liberal and not use that right then you are certainly entitled too. HOWEVER; you left wing bleeding hearts do not realize that our law enforcement can't be everywhere at once so you have to take care of YOUR OWN security.

If you choose to stay in your house or or drive around in your truck/car weaponless that is your right, BUT something like this /27npba is likely to happen to you. Yes, I know even with a gun bad things can still happen, but they give you a since of security and a real chance to defend yourself, and not die like a helpless weakling. Are you telling me that you forgive a perp of raping, killing, and stealing from you EVEN while they are doing it?

I hail this brave Texan as a hero. I will tell you why. This man knew that if these punks were stealing from a house next to his they would likely be targeting his house very soon. He did NOT know weather or not the punks were armed. He erred on the side of caution by killing them. The correct thing to do. He took his weapon and eliminated any future problems these worthless scumbags might have caused, such as: stepping up their criminal behavior to raping and killing during robberies. This man knew these punks could have very well planned on coming to his house next and maybe even killing or raping him or his family. He would have been called a coward had these men escaped and robbed, killed or raped, and they very may have been planning that. Who knows? It is our civic duty as a United States Citizen to watch out and protect when possible our family, friends , and neighbors. If you hippy left wingers don't like this then MOVE TO CANADA OR EUROPE. On second thought even Canadians will stand up for themselves more than you left wingers. So i would suggest you all move to Europe and live under some kind of socialist government.

To have a gun is to be a true United States Citizen. To protect Life, Liberty, AND Property. I was taught this every since I could speak. My family has participated in almost every war that the U.S.A. has been in - EVEN the Revolutionary war under Andrew Jackson.

Sorry if this seems like a rant, but it is not. Just speaking the truth. The United States of America seems to have a growing number of traitors that want to bash our Constitution into nothing and turn us into a bunch of pantie wearing, weaponless, castrated men who lay down and take anything that comes their way. I WILL NOT STAND FOR IT.

For all of your posters who support this Texan and his self defense, proactive actions I applaud you. You are my friends and TRUE United States Citizens.








[edit on 8-12-2007 by counterintelligence1]



posted on Dec, 8 2007 @ 09:45 AM
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reply to post by orangetom1999
 


Absolutely none of that is any justification of Mr. Horn's shooting and killing those men. He is still in the wrong. He is no hero. He killed 2 men for burglery and not even of his own home or business. The only excuse for taking the law into your own hands is if you live somewhere there is no law.



posted on Dec, 8 2007 @ 10:01 AM
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reply to post by defcon5
 

Ok. I see your point. And yes, it's possible the man operated outside the law.

Still, look how often people like the criminals repeat crimes over and over. These two, drug convictions (at least one of the men), deported and returned illegally again to keep doing more crimes. The police show up at the scene but it could be dangerous so the officer doesn't act before the shooting. May be he truly didn't have the time.

We are seeing a frustrated person acting because he knows nothing else will most likely stop the crime or return the property. If these two men stopped, the officer could have arrested them. I am will to bet they were not going to let that happen.



posted on Dec, 8 2007 @ 10:45 AM
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Originally posted by roadgravel
Ok. I see your point. And yes, it's possible the man operated outside the law.

Still, look how often people like the criminals repeat crimes over and over. These two, drug convictions (at least one of the men), deported and returned illegally again to keep doing more crimes.

According to the police there was a third man who was their driver. If Mr. Yahoo had not got involved, then the undercover officer could have quietly watched them go to their get away vehicle, then uniform police could have arrested all three in possession of the property. So now because of this guy not knowing all the facts, and going off half cocked, how do you know that the third guy, who would now be in custody, does not go off and kill someone.

Again, when you are instructed by the police what to do in a situation like that, and you obviously don’t have all the facts, you do not go off and do whatever it is you think is best, you let the professional folks handle the situation.

[edit on 12/8/2007 by defcon5]



posted on Dec, 8 2007 @ 10:46 AM
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Originally posted by roadgravel
We are seeing a frustrated person acting because he knows nothing else will most likely stop the crime or return the property. If these two men stopped, the officer could have arrested them. I am will to bet they were not going to let that happen.



No. We are seeing a bloodthirsty killer who saw a chance to murk a couple of "darkies." I'll bet that none of you are aware of the type of white people that live in Pasadena, Tx, predominantly. They're typically rednecks.

I'm not saying that to bash Texas; I'm saying that because it's true. When we first saw this on the news, we all figured that nothing would be done to this dude, since he was from Pasadena. We had a feeling the perps were black, and when we saw their pics, we were certain Horn would walk.

Nothing would be done otherwise? LOL. An undercover was actually THERE and witnessed the shooting. I'll post that news article sometime today. Like another poster said, the cops are covering their asses.

And, you "props for murkin them" crowd act like he couldn't keep the gun on them until MORE cops came. Why would that be worse than blasting big ass holes in these fools?

But of course, this is par for the course in Pasadena. LOL.



posted on Dec, 8 2007 @ 12:26 PM
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Honestly, I believe the right to carry is the only thing keeping my city (Houston) from total chaos. It is well known here that if you are committing a crime, there is a real good chance someone is going to shoot at you. The law works. Crime is bad enough.

Crime in our city is committed largely by illegal aliens. Therefore it is an issue after the fact. I doubt it had any weight in Horn's decision to shoot these guys.





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