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No, I will not vaccinate my children!

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posted on Nov, 25 2007 @ 09:50 AM
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VAERS



The Vaccine Adverse Event Reporting System (VAERS) is a cooperative program for vaccine safety of the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC) and the Food and Drug Administration (FDA). VAERS is a post-marketing safety surveillance program, collecting information about adverse events (possible side effects) that occur after the administration of US licensed vaccines.

Source

The government intercepts all reports of adverse events.

Rotoshield


Rotashield is the live attenuated rotavirus vaccine that was approved by the FDA in 1998, but removed from the market only a little more than a year later. The vaccine contained three reassortants, each with a different human gene encoding a specific serotype of VP4 or VP7. The human serotypes G1, G2, and G4 were represented in the vaccine. For the G3 strain, they used the whole rhesus monkey strain, because it was genetically very similar to the human strain. The animal genes attenuated virulence while the human genes evoked virus-specific antibodies.

Source




posted on Nov, 25 2007 @ 10:34 AM
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Originally posted by RogerT
Great thread Stompk

Be prepared for the wrath of the conditioned and fearful minds, the junior high school biology rants and the disease paranoia.


Paranoia?

Okay, I'm out. This thread is obviously a honey pot for trolling.



posted on Nov, 25 2007 @ 10:39 AM
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reply to post by The Good Reverend Roger
 


Another diversion of the actual facts that I have posted. How about a response to the facts, such as a government chart or something.

Nothing but verbal abuse. Bye bye.



posted on Nov, 25 2007 @ 10:48 AM
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Originally posted by stompk


Nothing but verbal abuse. Bye bye.


How odd. I didn't see you complaining about FredT's verbal abuse.



posted on Nov, 25 2007 @ 11:24 AM
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reply to post by Fiverz
 


Your point is well made.

Now if you would just be consistent enough to apply the same logic to the links drawn between vaccination and decline in certain diseases, then you would have to go back and revise your last sentence where you assert that the polio vaccine protects against polio, which of course has no conclusive evidence to support it.



posted on Nov, 25 2007 @ 11:40 AM
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Both sides of this argument are never going to succumb to each other...so I may as well add more graphs, right?

The graphs here seem to say that vaccines do in fact work. There is a major decrease in the amount of people that get the disease after the vaccine is used. Even more so when it is widespread.
Source

And as for children who are vaccinated still getting the disease, you can read about how that could happen in my last post and read about the numbers at the source site I will post.


One common statement used in anti-vaccination literature is that when outbreaks of vaccine-preventable diseases occur, the majority of those infected turn out to be vaccinated children. 1 According to the anti-vaccination advocates, this shows that vaccines are not at all effective at preventing the disease. The problem is that the statistic quoted actually demonstrates exactly the opposite. You see, the problem with the statistic as quoted by the anti-vaccination advocates is that the vast majority of children are vaccinated. Thus, even if only a tiny percentage of vaccinated children get the disease, their numbers will be larger than the number of unvaccinated children who get the disease.


Source



posted on Nov, 25 2007 @ 12:12 PM
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Originally posted by MGauntz

The graphs here seem to say that vaccines do in fact work. There is a major decrease in the amount of people that get the disease after the vaccine is used. Even more so when it is widespread.
Source



Yes that's correct, the graphs do seem to show that. That's the common deception. Go further back than 1944 and you will be see a diametrically opposed picture.

99.4% reduction in measles mortality from 1901/2 to the 1968 introduction of the vaccine.

I posted lots of these more 'complete' graphs, with source references, on other threads, but they are very easy to find with google.

edit to add: Great, I actually just found a page showing both the graph on the deceptive article you posted, and the graph showing the more 'complete' data. Hopefully, this will be shocking enough for you to look into the subject a little closer.

Graphical Deception

Why does your graph begin at 1944? Because showing the rest of the data, freely available from CDC, UK Govt. sources and other 'official' statistical agencies, would not support the pro vaccine stance of the article, but would severely call it into question.

I believe this information has been shown and sourced already in this thread, did you not see it, not read it, or are you denying it or ignoring it?

[edit on 25-11-2007 by RogerT]



posted on Nov, 25 2007 @ 12:20 PM
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Originally posted by MGauntz
And as for children who are vaccinated still getting the disease, you can read about how that could happen in my last post and read about the numbers at the source site I will post.


Again the paper makes sense on the surface, but unfortunately, the author gives no real examples, just says "this is how they can lie".

Did you read the NEJM paper on the Corpus Christi measles outbreak where 99% were vaccinated. The authors concluded that vaccination cannot guarantee preventing the disease outbreak, even at 99% saturation, and the authors are not 'anti-vaccine'.

Measles outbreak in a fully immunized secondary-school population





[edit on 25-11-2007 by RogerT]



posted on Nov, 25 2007 @ 12:26 PM
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reply to post by RogerT
 


Oh, believe me. I would never place 100% of my confidence in a vaccine. I'm assuming what happened in this case was that the measles could have mutated slightly into a form that the vaccine couldn't provide protection for. There is always a chance that the vaccine was not effective. It would be stupid of me to rule that out. But it surely isn't the only explanation.



posted on Nov, 25 2007 @ 01:58 PM
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Originally posted by dk3000
Back in 1982 the California gay community was invited to free vaccinations (we were told it was Globulin shots) which would prevent the spread of HIV/Aids or what we called "gay cancer". This was just the beginning and the community was scared and many of my friends and myself went down to Laguna Beach for the vaccines. I opted out at the last minute- but every one of my friends who received the vaccine died within a year.


I was fascinated by these comments and had to have a look around.

I'm sure you are aware of Cantwell's work on this subject, but felt it apropos to post a couple of his quotes about this exact same thing:


"As soon as homosexuals signed up as guinea pigs for government-sponsored hepatitis B vaccine experiments, they began to die with a strange virus of unknown origin. The hepatitis B experiments began in Manhattan in the fall of 1978; the first few cases of AIDS (all young gays from Manhattan) were reported to the CDC in 1979. Scientists have also failed to explain how a brand new herpes virus was also introduced exclusively into gays, along with HIV, in the late 1970s. This herpes virus is now believed to be the cause of Kaposi's sarcoma, the so-called "gay cancer" of AIDS. Before AIDS, Kaposi's sarcoma was never seen in healthy young men. Identified a decade after HIV, in 1994, this KS virus is closely related to a primate cancer-causing herpes virus extensively studied and transferred in animal laboratories in the decade before AIDS. Also downplayed to the public is a new microbe (Mycoplasma penetrans), also of unknown origin, that was introduced into homosexuals, along with HIV and the new herpes virus. Thus, not one but three new infectious agents were inexplicably transferred into the gay population at the start of the epidemic (HIV, the herpes KS virus, and M.penetrans)."--Alan Cantwell MD 2001



"There is no question that HIV was introduced into the U.S. male homosexual population via the gay hepatitis B vaccine experiment that took place between 1978 and 1981. My research clearly supports the outbreak of AIDS cases in Los Angeles and San Francisco shortly after the experiment began in those cities. Not surprisingly, the government has refused to release data on the number of AIDS deaths that have occurred in the large group of gay men who initially volunteered for the vaccine experiment." ---Dr Alan Cantwell


Alan Cantwell MD



posted on Nov, 25 2007 @ 02:41 PM
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For further support, I would like to point people to this article.



When the wicked leaders of a wicked nation want to:

• Create FEAR and CHAOS and TERROR throughout the world

• Take away the rights of citizens in every nation in the world

• Create a world-wide pandemic and annihilation of a large segment of a nation’s population by forced vaccinations that secretly contain live bacteria and viruses for AIDS, herpes, hepatitis, and small pox, as well as preservatives made from mercury that cause brain damage and autism

• Control every country in the world by allowing the World Health Organization (WHO) to enter and take over their emergency medico-political apparatus and place embargos or quarantines on the entire country

• Eliminate the Posse Comitatus Act of 1878 which bans the military from participating in police-type activity on U.S. soil. This act specifically prohibits the government from using the military against its own citizens. (This Posse Comitatus Act was severely violated at Waco, when U.S. military troops were used against the Branch Davidians.)

• Help create famines in order to annihilate a large portion of the world’s population by killing off the food supply of any and every nation, by killing their chickens, turkeys and other birds used for food.

• Declare martial Law and suspend the Constitution

All they need to do is create - out of thin air –

the Bird Flu “Pandemic” HOAX!

Source


Or any other Pandemic. Staph Superbug, SARS, West Nile, etc.



posted on Nov, 25 2007 @ 02:45 PM
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Originally posted by Astyanax

Originally posted by Long Lance
the paranoid in me would now hazard a question: how many physicians are willing diagnose, say, tetanus in a vaccinated person? i'd wager most of them would consider such an occurance impossible and therefore file the case under a different diagnosis.

Which, of course, is why deaths from tetanus are rising off the graph, eh?

Next time, I suggest listening to the voice of reason instead.



even in vaccinated persons? rising?

www.cdc.gov...

ends in 2000, so i don't know what to believe. perhaps it really took off in the last years. even so, the question remains how many cases officially occured in adequately vaccinated people and how accurate the statistics are.



posted on Nov, 25 2007 @ 03:56 PM
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Originally posted by The Good Reverend Roger

Originally posted by Xtrozero
It would be interesting to know as to what was causing the downward trends and IF those trends would have leveled off above the vaccination points instead of continuing to very low single digits per 100,000.


1. Knowledge of germ theory, better personal hygiene, and better preventative measures.


You missed mass sewage sytems, clean water, engineering, education, refrigeration, nutrition... etc. Same things that continued the diseases decline after the introduction of ineffective vaccinations.

Some may also argue that there are natural disease cycles in play too, but I wouldn't know about that.

Germ theory may have stimulated cleanliness, so that's a good thing, but it's a pretty lousy theory where disease is concerned. Bechamp's cellular theory is much more on the mark IMHO.

[edit on 25-11-2007 by RogerT]



posted on Nov, 25 2007 @ 04:11 PM
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Sorry, I have nothing to say to you. After all, I disagree with you, so I must be a - what did you say - a diseased paranoid?



posted on Nov, 25 2007 @ 04:18 PM
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No, I didn't say that, but it's another nice clear illustration of your posting style.

[edit on 25-11-2007 by RogerT]



posted on Nov, 25 2007 @ 04:38 PM
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Originally posted by RogerT
No, I didn't say that, but it's another nice clear illustration of your posting style.

[edit on 25-11-2007 by RogerT]


Probably. Then you'd be better off not speaking to me in the future, right?

It's win-win.



posted on Nov, 25 2007 @ 04:42 PM
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I watched my sister almost die from having the MMR here in the UK (measles, mumps and rubella).

She went from being a normal toddler, to not being able to eat, to not being able to hold her own head up.

When the Dr's finally admitted that there was something wrong (after many trips to the Drs they wouldn't do anything til they saw her with her head rested on her shoulder and black eyes - and they thought my mum had beaten her)
she did get better but was not the same child. She was quiet, she wouldn't eat.

She has now been diagnosed with autism. She still is the fussiest eater I know and often gets aenemic. Maybe that's better than dying of Measles/Mumps/Rubella, but then my friends cousin wasn't so lucky and died from Epliepsy caused by the MMR.

Drs will never confirm that the autism/epilepsy/other brain damage is due to the MMR.. but you only have to watch it happen to know it's true



posted on Nov, 25 2007 @ 04:52 PM
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reply to post by The Good Reverend Roger
 


Well if I quote one of your posts, it will be to point out the factual errors in your assumptions, or the fallacy of your rather weak argument.

However, so far, you posted little more than abuse, criticism, challenges and empty rhetoric, so I've not had much to comment on.

So don't take it personally, I'm not actually talking to you


mkay?



posted on Nov, 25 2007 @ 05:01 PM
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reply to post by stompk
 


um... isn't polio a disease we no longer hear about?

i'm sorry, but vaccination is sound science. it's validated and this anti-science fear mongering is the type of thing that's taking us back to the stone age



posted on Nov, 25 2007 @ 05:15 PM
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"In June of 1959...all non-paralytic cases of poliomyelitis were to be henceforth recorded as 'meningitis, viral or aseptic,' a disease which itself only became reportable in 1952 (Canada)."--Catherine Diodati MA (Immunization History, Ethics, Law and Health p116)


I think we still hear about meningitis?

What makes you so sure immunisation is a sound science. Can you provide some of this validation?

I've asked the question more than 10 times in 6 threads, and after more than 600 posts I've yet to see some 'sound' evidence that vaccination has eradicated anything.

[edit on 25-11-2007 by RogerT]



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