I have a question for you christians

Originally posted by SimiusDei
Stop the xtian bashings.

Please. It makes the rest of us look bad and you are feeding their fires against us.

Jasn

Who really cares how people look? Do you realize how bad Blacks looked during the times of civil rights? Thats where the term Uppity was coined.

I for one think it was a good thing they were Uppity.

Originally posted by thestatue
Wow some good responses.....tell me plague what about drinking or smoking......other than that God clearly says its okay to eat these animals but not these.......then later says do not concern what goes into the mouth after a vision of unclean animals so stop why would he say either of those if he didn't want man to consume meat come on!!!!GOD LISTS WHAT ANIMALS ARE OKAY TO EAT AT ONE POINT STILL!!! even if you can override with thoughts or explanations the whole all animals are okay now there is no denying the okay and not okay thing......on another note
mr.wumpy you stated that ones beliefs should be a separate matter.....in that case get rid of ATS and stop trying to convince people that things are wrong or bad or that the government is corrupt....NO!!!!!
DENY IGNORANCE that is this site's purpose to help those find the freedom from what this world enslaves them to believe
FREEDOM IS THE RIGHT OF ALL SENTIENT BEINGS!!!!-Optimus prime

As a Vaishna I have 4 main principals to uphold.
1) No eating meat
2) no Illicit sex
3) no intoxication
4) no gambling

So no I dont smoke or drink. Yes Gods list what animals are offerable to him. He then says that only the priests can touch or consume the meat. The only offering that anyone can eat is the peace giving offering. Then he follows it up by say the most important rule that must be kept is that you dont eat the fat or the blood. Now when you cook meat some of the blood comes out as a juice but most of it becomes absorbed in the meat and therefore you cant eat meat with out the blood, and you cant get all the fat out either because its all through the meat and impossible to get it all out. So yes he gave you a list of animals and then gave you a rule that makes it impossible to do.

Originally posted by Jesus-Is-Real

Originally posted by plague
My question is this. Do you love Jesus? Do you follow his teaching and examples? How about God? Do you follow his word?
Ok now the real question... are you a vegetarian? It is forbidden in the bible to eat meat. Among many things said in the bible the most blantent of all is in the 10 commandments... "THOU SHALL NOT KILL".

Meat: No. When it's preached that it is forbidden, it's a doctrine of demons, God's Word says. For all food is good to eat if it's received (eaten) and nothing to be refused if it's received with thanksgiving. And is sanctified by The Word of God and Prayer.

2nd witness:

1 Tim 4:1-5

4:1 Now the Spirit speaketh expressly, that in the latter times some shall depart from the faith, giving heed to seducing spirits, and doctrines of devils;

2 Speaking lies in hypocrisy; having their conscience seared with a hot iron;

3 Forbidding to marry, and commanding to abstain from meats, which God hath created to be received with thanksgiving of them which believe and know the truth.

4 For every creature of God is good, and nothing to be refused, if it be received with thanksgiving:

5 For it is sanctified by the word of God and prayer. KJV

[edit on 8/11/2007 by Jesus-Is-Real]

Ah yes Timothy Pauls brother in crime. Here lies what is wrong with Christianity today. It is not really Christianity that you are following it is paulianity that you follow. Paul never met Jesus and so therefore was never a disciple of his. He rebeled against what the other apostles or the real disciples of Jesus taught. They taught that you must uphold the 10 commandments and that is what Jesus taught. Trust me they know they were his discples they heard the word straight from his mouth. Paul however tried to say that by Jesus coming and being crucified that we are saved and dont have to do anything but believe (even though Jesus himself said that believing alone will not do). So Paul is wrong and its blantently obvious that he is. We are taught by Krishna Consciousness that a Vaishna must follow the rules of handed out by the disciplinic chain (also called Sampradaya ) for the chain starts from God himself. So God sent Jesus who then taught the 12 original apostles. Those 12 are the sampradaya not Paul and since Pauls not in the disciplininc succsession then neither is Timothy making his gospen null n void.....

Originally posted by Corum
To the few vegetarians who look down on meat eaters (not all do) I'd like to point out that when the fields are being harvested thousands of little animals die in the process, in other words unless you grow your own plot of land and hand pick your veggies you're a hypocrite.

Now your splitting hairs and grasping at ever little thing you can to prove a point. Ok yes some poor animals die and thats not good either but there is a difference between accidental killings (your material body has to eat until you reach a certain level in which you realize you dont need to eat to stay alive because you are not your body then you will realize you only need very little almost nothing) by digging up vegies and building huge factories and farms to breed animals just to murder and eat them.

So are you saying that it's more acceptable because the killings are accidental? There are no hairs to split in what I said, thousands of mammals die when fields are harvested.

Originally posted by Corum
So are you saying that it's more acceptable because the killings are accidental? There are no hairs to split in what I said, thousands of mammals die when fields are harvested.

What am I saying??? What are you saying???? You are comparing a farmer planting crops and then harvesting them and in the process accidentally killing them (yes accident im shure hes not thinking wow ima gonna kill these critters) to building a factory and then raising animals to be killed come on man ...... Caging chickens in pens so cramped that they trample each other to death and often starve to the point of cannablism. Not only is it barbaric but it cant be healthy to eat that after all that.

okay first place janastar accused me of reading the bible with a carnal mind......i'm an angel my dear angel of God that is,i was in heaven when alot of this eating food went on.also sadly plague regardless about how much you try to live by good doctrine it does nothing for you.good works will not save you only accepting the of redemption will save you Jesus was not a maharajah he was the son of the one true God Jesus christ of nazareth was the almighty in the flesh!!! glory to him forever AMEN....

Originally posted by thestatue
okay first place janastar accused me of reading the bible with a carnal mind......i'm an angel my dear angel of God that is,i was in heaven when alot of this eating food went on.also sadly plague regardless about how much you try to live by good doctrine it does nothing for you.good works will not save you only accepting the of redemption will save you Jesus was not a maharajah he was the son of the one true God Jesus christ of nazareth was the almighty in the flesh!!! glory to him forever AMEN....

May I inquire about the angel thing? A good friend of mine is a conduite for angels... in other words she does angel readings. Do you even understand what a Maharajah is??? Yes there is only one true god but he is known by many names, and often reveals himself to people in different ways according to time and circumstance. Just as Jesus taught according to time and circumstance. He also taught according to your platform of knowledge ... so basically if you were smart enough he gave you the real essence of his teachings and if you were not so smart he gave you the elementary version. As far as you being in heaven when this was going on .... not all of us are fallen souls here to learn a lesson..


[edit on 11-8-2007 by plague]

according to my platform of knowledge???is this directed to me anyways yeah i'm an angel but um no i dont know what maharajah is....however i am alo not fallen i am simply in human form fighting the threats that may come to your freedom....

thestatue,
Jesus teaching according to intelligence was geared for everyone. Even myself...
Guru means teacher or instructor or spiritual master
Maharaja means giver or bringer of mercy

Jesus was a spiritual master who brought mercy of the lord to everyone.
Therefore I see Jesus as a Guru Maharaja.

As an angel what freedom do you protect of mine? Please explain this freedom? Were you sent by father?


[edit on 11-8-2007 by plague]

but that plays down who he really was.he was the son of God and God himself in the flesh....my dear about his teachings they are amazing and all men should follow but you see as angel i don't have a total free-will so i already am tied into God's will.

Originally posted by thestatue
but that plays down who he really was.he was the son of God and God himself in the flesh....my dear about his teachings they are amazing and all men should follow but you see as angel i don't have a total free-will so i already am tied into God's will.

Jesus never claimed to be God.... I have yet to be shown solid evidence of this. Jesus often spoke of the father as different from him. Yet again we are all part and parcel of god and his energy. We are of the same quality of god but not quanity. In the Bhavagad Gita God speaks of himself as himself not of him being different or seperate to a degree. Krishna even says he is the seed giving father of all. That everything that is happening thru him and by him. Calling Jesus Guru Maharaj does not down play who he is in the least ... it is a great honor to be Guru Maharaj. As an angel you must be smart and have much knowledge of the absolute ... I beg of you to tell me about the absolute truth in which is the father of man and the soul and what binds us to this earth and why we are here? Again please tell me of this freedom you protect... what is it?

[edit on 11-8-2007 by plague]

i could take the time to go through every piece of scripture about Jesus but i wont.I'll tell you Jesus being Jesus Christ means that he was the messiah and Emmanuel.....God with us.....the prophesies.....all of that you know.....read genesis for that.....God..... YHWH...Johovah....Abba...nothing else....freedom is the ability to come to terms with the world and God.there is a God he sent his son to die for all mankind worship the lord your God with all your heart.along with that you must stay away from things that make you drink or high.....thatd freedom!!

Originally posted by plague
What am I saying??? What are you saying???? You are comparing a farmer planting crops and then harvesting them and in the process accidentally killing them (yes accident im shure hes not thinking wow ima gonna kill these critters) to building a factory and then raising animals to be killed come on man ...... Caging chickens in pens so cramped that they trample each other to death and often starve to the point of cannablism. Not only is it barbaric but it cant be healthy to eat that after all that.

A farmer knows before he harvests that he will be killing and maiming thousands of animals, he does it on purpose but doesn't give it a second thought because he knows he doesn't have much of a choice, which is fair enough, can't blame him for that. You yourself have no choice but to admit the obvious truth that thousands of animals die and are maimed for your vegetables, it doesn't matter how you dress it up, the end result is the same.

Originally posted by thestatue
i could take the time to go through every piece of scripture about Jesus but i wont.I'll tell you Jesus being Jesus Christ means that he was the messiah and Emmanuel.....God with us.....the prophesies.....all of that you know.....read genesis for that.....God..... YHWH...Johovah....Abba...nothing else....freedom is the ability to come to terms with the world and God.there is a God he sent his son to die for all mankind worship the lord your God with all your heart.along with that you must stay away from things that make you drink or high.....thatd freedom!!

True freedom is shedding your material skin to take your rightful place in gods abode in the spiritual plane. This material universe and its stringent laws allow no real freedom. Freedom is the escape of the falseness of birth and death. ESCAPING BIRTH AND DEATH IS THE ONLY TRUE FREEDOM IN THIS KNOWN MATERIAL UNIVERSE. The spirit soul or Jiva as it is called is eternal just as god is eternal, and was never born and will never die. We are part and parcel. The soul can never be hurt, scarred, burnned, ripped or killed. You are an angel you should know this already.
NO INTOXICATION...NO ILLICIT FORNICATION....NO EATING MEAT ...
They are the path way to freedom but not freedom why? because you are following rules to which to guide your life when you come to the realization of who and what you truly are, you will be what is called self realised and these material problems and lust for the material world will leave you. SELF REALISATION BECOMES SARANAGATI or surrender. WHEN YOU SURRENDER YOUR SELF TO GOD you will no longer need the 4 regulations because you are beyond the stringent hold of maya and will not even partake in these acts of sin and God will help you and make shure that the path is clear because you have proven yourself as a pure devotee to the lord. Renunciation of the material world is true surrender and is the path that leads you back to god. Jesus taught this to his followers and as an angel you should be well versed in surrender. This is true freedom....

God has millions of names but it is still the same god. He is our father who is in heaven... no matter what the name. You know in heart of hearts which is God and which is Demigod.

Wrap your thoughts on this. Krishna is the sanskrit word for God it means "All attractive one" now only god can be ALL attractive. Krishna translates into greek as Christos which as we all know translates to hebrew as Christ.

Why do you think Jesus called himself son of man? He was man just like us except he was an avatar of god I will even except that he was a direct incarnation either way He was special and was sent here for a special reason. He was not the first nor the last to come.

Originally posted by Corum

Originally posted by plague
What am I saying??? What are you saying???? You are comparing a farmer planting crops and then harvesting them and in the process accidentally killing them (yes accident im shure hes not thinking wow ima gonna kill these critters) to building a factory and then raising animals to be killed come on man ...... Caging chickens in pens so cramped that they trample each other to death and often starve to the point of cannablism. Not only is it barbaric but it cant be healthy to eat that after all that.

A farmer knows before he harvests that he will be killing and maiming thousands of animals, he does it on purpose but doesn't give it a second thought because he knows he doesn't have much of a choice, which is fair enough, can't blame him for that. You yourself have no choice but to admit the obvious truth that thousands of animals die and are maimed for your vegetables, it doesn't matter how you dress it up, the end result is the same.

The end result is not the same. not even close... my dads side of the family are mainly farmers and Ive helped out quite abit over the years on there farms and I can honestly say that your over exagerating about the amount of accidental deaths that happen. But what about the slaughterhouse thats built for the soul porpuse to kill and package animals for food. Even if you think im wrong about meat=murder or god forbidding it you have to see that there is a big difference and as I said before you my freind are just grapsing.

Originally posted by plague

Originally posted by Corum

Originally posted by plague
What am I saying??? What are you saying???? You are comparing a farmer planting crops and then harvesting them and in the process accidentally killing them (yes accident im shure hes not thinking wow ima gonna kill these critters) to building a factory and then raising animals to be killed come on man ...... Caging chickens in pens so cramped that they trample each other to death and often starve to the point of cannablism. Not only is it barbaric but it cant be healthy to eat that after all that.

A farmer knows before he harvests that he will be killing and maiming thousands of animals, he does it on purpose but doesn't give it a second thought because he knows he doesn't have much of a choice, which is fair enough, can't blame him for that. You yourself have no choice but to admit the obvious truth that thousands of animals die and are maimed for your vegetables, it doesn't matter how you dress it up, the end result is the same.

The end result is not the same. not even close... my dads side of the family are mainly farmers and Ive helped out quite abit over the years on there farms and I can honestly say that your over exagerating about the amount of accidental deaths that happen. But what about the slaughterhouse thats built for the soul porpuse to kill and package animals for food. Even if you think im wrong about meat=murder or god forbidding it you have to see that there is a big difference and as I said before you my freind are just grapsing.

Yeah, for those who can't stand the sight of slaughtering, I suppose it's pretty ghastly. But for those who don't have any issue with it, it's not that big of a deal.

Originally posted by thestatue
okay first place janastar accused me of reading the bible with a carnal mind......i'm an angel my dear angel of God that is,i was in heaven when alot of this eating food went on.also sadly plague regardless about how much you try to live by good doctrine it does nothing for you.good works will not save you only accepting the of redemption will save you Jesus was not a maharajah he was the son of the one true God Jesus christ of nazareth was the almighty in the flesh!!! glory to him forever AMEN....

Could you refresh my memory, what the subject matter was when this was said? or paste me the quote? If I am wrong, I will be first to apologize, and certainly, did not mean to offend anyone. I would like to hear more about the 'angel-thing.'

I'm not going to wax expert on this subject but my two cents....

I think We are sinners, as told to us from God. And perhaps eating meat is a sin in the eyes of God, and therefore we prove, 3 times a day that we are sinners in our hearts without thinking of it. I wont discount that.

My belief is, this world that we inhabit in this small lifetime is designed to be flawed, as we are flawed. Without going through this because I am trying to stay on the subject, I think Eating meat falls into this as well.
Without even trying, we are opposing God. We are sinners.

But God has forgiveness in his heart, and thats the salvation.
Kinda beautiful, kinda nuts.
Kinda like me

I just came across some stunning revelation knowledge. I posted it on another forum, but felt it needed repeating. Many Christians have asked, "Why do the atheists persecute the Christians and not the other religions?" I figured it out! It's because we have the "turn the other cheek" teaching. So, people feel relatively safe.
One thing that should be kept in mind; a person only has two cheeks, after that, it's every man for himself. :-))