China, it's military capabilities, and chinese nationalists

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posted on Jan, 20 2007 @ 02:03 AM
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Well, there are no such things as biological races in the sense that people are differentiated. Yes, race is a social construct. By being "culturist" you are simply choosing to socially construct "race" by another set of standards. For example, the Ancient Romans were by their own admission prejudiced against the German race. But how did they define them? Not through view or physical appearance, rather habit and language.

Wouldn't you agree these serial killers are psychopaths?



I think we also both know many middle aged smokers who find it hard to go up and down stairs because their lungs are filled with tar. I think the two are about the same. China and America/Europe have different public health problems. It doesn't mean that either is inferior.

To answer your question, though, about how many people will die as a result of smoking. I defer to Bo-Qi Liu of the Chinese Academy of Medical Science. He (and his colleagues) contend of the 300 million Chinese people currently aged 0-29, tobacco will kill 100 million of them. But hey, the people's government needs their monopoly on cigarettes to continue pumping money into their treasury. What does a hundred million dead comrades matter to the CCP if they can scrape a few bucks out of the pockets chemically addicted farmers?

www.bmj.com...

[edit on 20-1-2007 by XBadger]




posted on Jan, 20 2007 @ 06:00 AM
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1.Straights of Malacca.

Obviously china has no current protection from a American blockage of middle eastern oil, the reasoning to that one is easy to recognize. But lets consider the oil it can get via other methods like central asia or russia and its own oil production which accounts for 50% of its own use

Self-production - 3.504 Million bbl/day (2004)

Take away the civilian sector from the overall use and china has more than enough oil to supply its military for combat. Also we have to take note that American forces will use more than twice as much fuel because its a fuel guzzler of a war machine and it has to travel 1/3 of the world to get to its location. The US seems to be over deployed at this present state of time and would find it extremely difficult to supply each theater of operations while china fights local and supplies local

3. Do you honestly think that China would be able to bomb Guam or Okinawa?

YES. fighter bombers, Cruise missiles and ballistic missiles

4. No heat, no electricity, no ambulance, no repairmen.

Heat, electricity are mostly powered by coal. I did not mean the civilian sector as anything but military, i mean the civilian sector as civilians and not emergency services. Civilian use of petrol, restrict public transport and most importantly the use of civil shipping would have to be stopped which uses a lot of fuel. Fighter fuel is obviously more refined and is a static resource which is made of a entirely different process

5. rather giving real time intel to command and electronically painting targets.

What part of "Seal teams to sabatogue ocean ports " equates to painting targets?. I'll excuse that part

Its so simple getting seal teams into china?. Can i assume chinese SOF can also "sabatogue ocean ports" in America?

6. We do know that the US military ran several tests of "bombs" in 2002.

Can we assume china has EMP as well then?

7. I cannot possibly imagine that China would be the one to escalate to a nuclear conflict. America simply has too many ICBMs.

60 Nuclear weapons hitting America would make it a waste land of radiation. It doesn't matter how much nuclear weapons you have because a lesser number gets the same effectiveness. China might be turned into a piece of glass but then everyone in the world dies of horrible radiation and disease because America wanted "sweeter" revenge

8. you think they would convert to the yen?

Actually the meaning of that was another major world currency. The Yen and Euro instantly comes to mine so I named them. It was meant to say anything BUT the US dollar, what i found ridiculous was you actually claimed the US dollar will rise

9. Well, there are no such things as biological races in the sense that people are differentiated

If you found it so difficult to class a race, why did you call me a racist?

10. Wouldn't you agree these serial killers are psychopaths?

I wasn't meant to mean a serial killer but more of a "bum fight" , "jackass" type of person which American culture has raised. I doubt any other country would have "first" like America has made

Tobacco,

While Mr Liu has his studies which predict premature deaths in those men and women, that means dying because the average life expectancy of their supposed deaths. Being obese eats away at your health, how much "deaths" from obesity does America suffer every year



posted on Jan, 20 2007 @ 07:14 AM
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My point isn't that China is not capable of turning the Pacific Coast into radioactive hell. It obviously could. My simple point is that China would not escalate to ICBMs and America certainly wouldn't (since it would be in more of a position to project conventional force). I just don't see what the ICBMs do. Does China want to conquer Taiwan so badly that they are gong to launch their nuclear wad even if it means America retaliating ten fold? No. Come on, no matter how much of a nationalist you are you have to recognize that the CCP leadership is more saavy than that

Also, I am not sure how China would possibly defend the hundreds of miles of pipelines in REMOTE areas from bombing sorties leaving from Afghanistan and potentially Uzbekistan. I think it would actually be more difficult to stop importantion of oil from the Middle East than from Central Asia. Especially now the US has bases in Afghanistan and Uzbekistan, and are allied up with Pakistan (for flyover rights). The problem with pipelines are they are long (the Atasu/Alashankou pipeline will be 1000 km), not easily defended, and fragile things. They require pumping stations and often go through remote areas where roads are not easy to get the necessary repair material for a catastrophic failure (ie. being bombed.) As with every road through isolated areas (if China were forced to use that) there are bridges that could be bombed. I see more what you mean about civilian use, and forgot China's reliance on coal. Good point. Still, you have to think that the US would at least be able to SEVERELY interrupt.

To the best of my knowledge China does not have an EMP program, but I could be wrong. To tell you the truth, the more I think about it, EMP has the potential to make this whole discussion mute, since it is theoretically possible to literally melt the circuits in every vehicle, machine, building and weapons system in up to an 800 mile radius. We've suposively been dealing with low (2-3 km radius) range bombs so far, but it should be just a matter of dropping at a higher altitude for a wider effect.


I know exactly how to define race. I study race for a living. I just am pointing out that you are using outmoded, nineteenth-century conceptions of it. Biology, Anthropology, and Cultural Studies have advanced quite a bit since 1890. I suggest you should as well, since your understanding of race appears to be straight out of 1840. It is a multifaceted concept that includes using culture as a way of differentiation. Think of the 15th and 16th European justification to enslave Africans and American Indians originally arose from religious differences, in and of itself a cultural aspect. Nineteenth natural philosophers such as Herder, Kant, Hegel criticized the culture of the region first, and from this hierarchy of cultures arose a supposed "biological" hierarchy and differentiation of race. Your view that there are such things as "races" as distinguished from "culture" is in and of itself the very vocabulary used by the European powers in the Century of Dishonor. I wouldn't let these kind of racist statements stand from a white guy, and I certainly won't from you either.

EDIT -- The Surgeon General estimates that 1/8 of American deaths will be caused by obesity, but much like the study on tobacco this includes dying at the average age of life expectancy due to obesity. That is the way most public health is calculated.


[edit on 20-1-2007 by XBadger]

[edit on 20-1-2007 by XBadger]

[edit on 20-1-2007 by XBadger]



posted on Jan, 20 2007 @ 07:35 PM
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Originally posted by chinawhite

Originally posted by pilotshinjiikaru
I dont need to, you can go to China and see for yourself.

Im in China already

More random accusations?. Now, why dont you go to china instead of watching documentries?


huh? you are in china already and you dare to post it here.
be careful not to get caught, you have disclosed too much information about china military here.



posted on Jan, 20 2007 @ 07:58 PM
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pilotshinjiikaru

I agree with you in some points, china is not as strong as some people may think.
When I know the number of J-6 and J-7 they still have in their air force, I really can't help but to laugh at the chinese leader's low IQ.
But they are improving rapidly you see, especially under the leadership of Hu Jin Tao, they made tremendous improvements.

Americans should feel happy about it, because for whatever reason if china break apart, US will switch his target to russia which has the capability of destroying US with his nuclear weapons. US want to control the world, and russia want to defend himself against colonisation, I don't see these 2 objectives can come together in peace.

btw, the main power behind china economics progress is not the US help. US even attacked Iraq for oil and military base, what a joke if one say US want to help china to advance economically.
If one day let's say china really become a democratic country, do you think the china government will so easily forgive US for attacking its embassy, hijacking its merchant ship, intefere in its civil war, support the terrorist in its region, support Japan in occupying its land, give shelter to their fleed corrupted officials and knock down its military aircraft. If the china government then give in, I am more than sure the voters will elect a more firm leader.

[edit on 20-1-2007 by TheSaint77]



posted on Jan, 20 2007 @ 07:58 PM
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I would rather be a few pounds overweight and be allowed to look at what I want on the Internet than be a chain smoker and have my sources of information filtered by the government, and if I dare speak against them run over by tanks. How about we play this little game. I will give you a list of political/philosophical websites and you tell me what is the first sentence on these websites. If you are even allowed to see them, then I doubt you will be willing to take the legal risks to visit them. Are you up for the bet, or does your government not trust you to think for yourself.

EDIT -- I guess our little bet won't work. I forgot that you live in Australia. I hope you enjoy your freedom of speech and thought.

________


PS -- thanks for "excusing" the "misuse" of word sabotage to refer to electronically painting targets. I guess I just used the first definition in Webster Dictionary which defines sabotage as "1. a deliberate act of destruction or disruption in which equipment is damaged." I thought that was the goal of electronically painting facilities and targets. Apparently in the Chinese military they just paint targets so they will look better.

Trust me, you are not the person I want lecturing me on English lessons, considering you confused a serial killer with someone who was rude and ""jackass" type of person."


I sure hope there aren't any serial killers behind me at the movie theater. I hate it when they talk during the show.


[edit on 20-1-2007 by XBadger]

[edit on 20-1-2007 by XBadger]

[edit on 20-1-2007 by XBadger]



posted on Jan, 21 2007 @ 12:40 AM
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Originally posted by TheSaint77
huh? you are in china already and you dare to post it here.
be careful not to get caught, you have disclosed too much information about china military here.


Doesn't that tell you that western media has exaggerated what the Chinese government has done?. If me and our other westerner in waiting Rogue1 post so regularly and the fact that ATS of all places isn't blocked in china mean that chinas sensors are about more relaxed than what you are led t believe



China doesn't have any J-6 in service

[edit on 21-1-2007 by chinawhite]



posted on Jan, 21 2007 @ 01:33 AM
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Every edit you made you added a paragraph, why couldn't you write such a little post in one go?. Little children at the candy store, "I want that and this and that and...and that"


Originally posted by XBadgerDoes China want to conquer Taiwan so badly that they are gong to launch their nuclear wad even if it means America retaliating ten fold?


Nuclear weapons are there to show a message a message to America, "Any attempt at intervention and be prepared to go ALL THE WAY". China knows that most Americans will not swap their own lives for that of Taiwan and its their choice to make. Intervention, even conventional could mean a chinese counterstrike involving nuclear weapons and that is the consideration we are under when considering nuclear weapon states. The question really is, does America have the guts to match chinas guts when it comes to the Taiwan situation because chinese people are clearly more involved than the average American about Taiwan.

Taiwan is like the South was to America, Its pride, its about who we are and putting the final piece of the unfair treaties to the end. Chinese people are more educated about their own history than America is, obviously because Taiwan has nothing to do with America


I am not sure how China would possibly defend the hundreds of miles of pipelines in REMOTE areas from bombing sorties leaving from Afghanistan and potentially Uzbekistan.


Chinas western areas like Xingjiang are not as remote as you make them out to be. The oil pipelines travel through major towns and cities and will be spilt along the way are intervals, you could even say those towns are almost supported by the fuel industry. Take not of the fact that Xingjiang was the scene of a massive military presence in the cold war and is the centerpiece of chinas new mobility based divisions also known as RRU, Xingjiang is not lacking in ground forces nor are they lacking in airdefences associated with the PLAAF which has airbases stationed there as well as the definite possibility of re-enforcements including mobile radar. Enough to protect much of chinas oil pipelines.

Now lets get to Uzbekistan, Pakistan and Afganistan.

Uzbekistan is a member of SCO and would be helping china. I doubt they would be helping U.S. Troops Leave Uzbekistan

Pakistan is a all weather friend and is obviously more friendly to china. The port of Gwadar which can be used as a port for oil imports as well as the extensive road network on its border which can be used to truck in oil. Afganistan is already hard pressed for troops not to mention a influx of chinese arms or even SOF which can be flown to get involved with the fight. China might not be able to protect around the world but its geared to local wars on its borders

I am one of the people who dont believe in those SOF operations, what Tom Clancy like people are made out of. They might take out a pipeline but that pipeline will be fixed in a matter of weeks or even days. One pipeline is insignificant to chinas total oil imports nor does it affect its own production of 3.504 Million bbl/day and its reserve of 90 days. Future conflicts under high tech conditions is chinas own motto for future combat and will be quick a desive in the first few days.

If you want me to believe America has a EMP program without any actual proof than will you believe china has a EMP program without evidence as welll?



I know exactly how to define race.


When dont you get back to my question about which race i offended. If you called me a racist and then find it so hard to define a race, why would you then call someone a racist. So did i offend the human race or did i ofend yourself?. Please dont side track this to the 1850's and someone relate this to the slave trade because it has nothing to do with that, its got to do with your definition of race and the reason for calling me a racist


On a side note, its interesting to think that currently 64.5% of adult Americans are overweight or obese while the figure then jumps to 73% in 2008, wouldn't these have their lives shortened by having weight problems. Not to mention the growing. On the note of the study, it stressed the deaths over a period of someones average life so you can divide the figure by 70 or so years. Other figures i have found are not so alarmistic



posted on Jan, 21 2007 @ 01:45 AM
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Originally posted by XBadger
I would rather be a few pounds overweight and be allowed to look at what I want on the Internet


You mean a hundred or even few hundred pounds and find it hard to get off your couch, how about your children who then suffer from growth defects and enter the biggest loser. How about playing in the school yard and end up "the 40 year old virgin". Overweight is not just about eating its about personal confidence its about going out having a life where people are so worried about being overweight. Smoking is actually relaxing and doesn't hinder someones life out of the house

Patriot Act 101 - Freedom liberties


I spent about 20 minutes writing that and wasn't going to my day thinking of the word, so i substituted another word in its place



posted on Jan, 21 2007 @ 04:18 AM
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Originally posted by Or_Die_Trying
pilot...your self-disdain is transparent. you remind me of african american cops who hate on other african americans in order to deny themselves who they are while sucking up to white america. When americans look at you do you think they see an american? no..they still see a chinaman. its YOUR views that are evidence of brainwashing...im chinese canadian here in vancouver bc....we're the largest minority by far....so large we're barely even a minority in most of bc...our culture here is strong, our influence is strong, and we dont apologize for being Chinese like you.


Brainwashing? I because I am disguisted by the CCCP? Or maybe not, like I said I see myself as a Chinese person but I have no affiliation to the government of China. I accepted the western belief that government serves the people not the other way around. I never said I hated China, I just hate it when my parents still carry the belief from China such as "watch what you say about the government in China if you ever want to return". Like I said my grandfather believed in the CCCP and paid for it in a reeducation camp after he spoke out when being encouraged to in the many political purges of the CCCPs great past. Many of you misinterpet what I write and assume im some super ignorant patriotic george bush self righteous american. Im just disguisted by the Chinese historical tradition and acceptance of despotism. Do I love Taiwan and the KMT? No, communism was right to flourish in the past like it did, the poor needed it. But communism was coming to an end and the CCCP did everything it could to survive not for the benefit of China but itself.
I dont apologize for being Chinese being Chinese doesnt mean I have to love communism and the CCCP. So it shows your either ignorant or didnt read my post in its entirity. I love my heritage and I am proud of it. I never embraced DISCARD YOUR INFERIOR CULTURAL VIEWS when I immigrated to the US and many ignorant members of the Chinese church community my family met tried to indoctrinate us with. I am proud of the fact that Americans cant pronounce my distinctly Chinese and pinyin last name. Once someone asked me if I wanted to legally change it to the correct english spelling of Hsu and I said no as people from Taiwan are Hsu and people from the mainland are not. I mentioned before I laugh at how ABCs from Taiwan think their better than us from the mainland and that were inferior and their ashamed of any comparisons to them. So I dont have to love the CCCP or communism to be Chinese. And if you think so then I feel sorry for you and Canada.



posted on Jan, 21 2007 @ 04:30 AM
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Originally posted by chinawhite

Originally posted by pilotshinjiikaru
Before Tinananmen Square everything from the West, western ideas were embraced by my parents generation without question, the west was cool, and it was always right.


Arent you making a claim there?.

Your parents generation is MY parents generation and being in remote tibet or inner china does not mean your parents thoughts spread to other parts of china. You might be influenced by people who fled china or what not and have this weird logic that everything they say happened, because you my friend are completely out of touch.

For my parents, the west was not cool, taiwan was cool.
For my parents friends japan was cool and moved there
For my generation Korea is cool and everything we watch is korean

I gurantee i have met more varied and different chinese currently than you would meet in your entire lifetime in your US town or city.


Lol and I could really care less, to correct you I am from Chengdu and so is my family, my grandfather worked in Lahsa, he was the mayor of Lahsa for a time in the 1950s after the invasion of Tibet. And my opinions are no more right or wrong that you are. You can say my opinion is out of touch and I can say your biased.

And for my parents, my father's family, and their extended family and friends watching watching the fear sweep down after Tiananmen Square was not cool. They believed communism was coming to an end after decades of change. They remember the horrors of the cultural revolution, the famines of the great leap forward. Like I said they always remind my sister when she doesnt finish her food about how they as children watched whole families die together out of starvation. Im sure your going to quote that right there and then attack me but I dont care as it doesnt matter. This is the internet, this subject is opinioned based. You can continue like your friends on this thread that embracing communism is patriotic or part of loving your heritage but I dont think so. I dont accept the CCCP, the world's changing yet the CCCP puts a bandaid on everything by giving economic prosperity but little political change. When my parents where my age loyalty to the CCCP above all else was the realities of the Cultural Revolution and so it is now. The CCCP is an idea an organization, it is temporary, China is not, Chinese civilization has survived 3000+ years (4000+ or 4500+ years if you listen to Xinhua) and it will do so long after the CCCP is gone. Im not saying the american democracy is great and wonderful and perfect for every nation or that the CCCP is like as it was 50 years ago. But the basic principles havent changed. China serves the CCCP not the other way around. There are laws but the CCCP is above the law and regularly ignores it especially if you dare to challenge in any remote way possible their authority.



posted on Jan, 21 2007 @ 04:53 AM
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And chinawhite like I repeatedly said I could careless how you attack me, your motivations are made clear you never comprehend what I was trying to say look at your earlier posts. Anyone reading this can see that you immediately interpet it as a attack on China's prestige. And I love how you cite military figures from unsubstaniated and uncrediable sources on the internet and criticize and laugh at FAS. To put it simply no one cares about your internet sources you can bragg about your 5000 or 500000000 posts you can and will still be wrong because 1. your views, statements and arguments are biased and extremely paranoid. When you miscomprehend my post and then uselessly attack an opinion based piece with internet links from uncredited websites you think your on a logical high horse. I really dont care ... why?

Because trying to win an argument on the internet is sad and pathetic, so I dont try. But keep it in your mind that Janes is paid for its info and FAS is accredited globally. 99.99% of the world will listen to them over your internet sources anyday. I'm sure many of your internet sources are true. But dont get on a high horse because you think OH MY GOD IM A GOD BECAUSE EVERYONE READS WHAT I WRITE ON A INTERNET FORUM WITH SECTIONS LIKE "CONSPIRACY" SO I AM ALWAYS RIGHT OVER ANYONE WHO CHALLENGES MY VIEWS. I dont care to back up what I say with internet sites because their opinion based on my experience and I dont scour the internet looking to prove you wrong. Im a college students with alot of other concerns. I only write this post because I have always been interested in foreign affairs and developements in China. And my opinions do matter because I am Chinese, I have ever right to say what I want in regards to my concerns about China as anyone in the world has a right to.

And you can talk about how me and my family and many many people are out of touch I can say everything you say can immediately be doubted simply because of what you wrote about Taiwan. I dont care what you say about your family, I was actually talking to a friend of mine whos French and whos studying in Taipei right now and she laughed at the idea of anyone in Taiwan whos not the elderly with connections and memories of China and the business community in Taiwan that wants to subvert to communist rule. Her friends in Taipei who I was talking to actually asked me to link your post to them. They thought it was laughable and said your probably lying. But I dont care nor do I wish to argue with you.

But I must say that you are funny with you think your argument is more correct because your using basic logic when you can never debunk an opinion based on personal experience. So then you try to belittle it and state your credability on the subject. But like I said anyone who read your posts and my posts in its entirity will see that off the bat you are biased to anyone to states anything that could be in anyone infringe on China's greatness or your view of China.

While I never said or think that my views are the way the universe is that it is absolutely correct. You are so set into your views that you cant accept the possibility of it being anything to the countrary so you go nuts. It went from a immediate over reaction to personal attack to paranoia and denial. But anyone who has watched Xinhua or reads WWW.CHINAVIEW.CN can really see what your saying is recycling their lines. Extreme left wing pathetic attacks on the US and the west because you assume I criticize the Chinese Communist Party that I'm some super patriot right wing war mongering fat american. Which is really sad...

[edit on 21-1-2007 by pilotshinjiikaru]



posted on Jan, 21 2007 @ 05:16 AM
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Originally posted by TheSaint77
btw, the main power behind china economics progress is not the US help. US even attacked Iraq for oil and military base, what a joke if one say US want to help china to advance economically.
If one day let's say china really become a democratic country, do you think the china government will so easily forgive US for attacking its embassy, hijacking its merchant ship, intefere in its civil war, support the terrorist in its region, support Japan in occupying its land, give shelter to their fleed corrupted officials and knock down its military aircraft. If the china government then give in, I am more than sure the voters will elect a more firm leader.
[edit on 20-1-2007 by TheSaint77]


Well your view of US involvement in China is really critical, in the most pessimistic sense. If it wasn't for Nixon, China would never be where it is. I would not be on the internet talking to you. I would never be able to for example have as a best friend a black canadian. Much less live in the country of the imperialist white colonialists.

If it wasn't for US supporting the KMT Japan would have taken Chongquing and then Chengdu my hometown in World War II. If it wasn't for the US armys dislike of Chiang Ki Shek and the KMT and their insistance that they cooperate with the Communist and his own general who kidnapped him until he agreed to work with the Communists the CCCP would not exist. Why? Before the Japanese invasion of China and its aggressions KMT virtually obliterated the CCCP thats why they had the Long March or whatever it was called were the Communist forces where decimated during their retreat and hide in Northwestern China until it recovered.

And the US had always given China the official status of Economically Favored Country so it had trade policies encouraging Chinese liberalization of its economy as Regaen and friends thought the uncontrolled capitalism would create prosperity and then democracy. The CCCP smiled and thought otherwise(just like the old propaganda said the West underestimates China).

And by supporting terrorists you mean the idea of that Tibet should be independent or that Xinjiang belongs to the muslims there? While the US never financially or physically leant them support it only offered support on principal and moral level. The Dali Lama was always peaceful in the struggle. And the sporadic crimes committed in the named of seperatism in XinJiang is self sustained, no one gave them anything or any moral support. But organizations in the US that called for their independence were offered support in principle only. That is until recently...

I mean like I said you can take the pessmistic view of it if you want to. But in reality Chinese foreign policy of none interferrence is really another to describe the fact that it doesnt care, it doesnt take stands on anything because they dont care about anything really on a moral level. Take buying oil with Sudan and blocking efforts by the UN security council to punish Khartom more. Because the motivating factor is $$, I mean sure everyones foreign policy is motivated by $$ but the Chinese government has no morality. Now I'm sure certain people will quote me and attack the American foreign policy but atleast I can say if it wasnt for the US foreign policy many many people around the world will not be alive or be where they are because simply the UN was funded and still is in large part by the US. Everyone knows in our quest to promote our self righteous views we have achieved good as if we followed that of the CCCP we would have never went to South Korea as it only threatend Japan not the US. Blocked Soviet establishment of a seperated Japan like Berlin after WWII. Hundreds of millions and adjusted for inflation over the lifetime of the UN hundreds of billions in financial aid we have given to countrys to promote democracy, to fight AIDs, to promote stability in places

[edit on 21-1-2007 by pilotshinjiikaru]



posted on Jan, 21 2007 @ 05:23 AM
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....in places like Africa where their destruction would have no real effect on us. So while you can be pessimistic about US foreign policy it has in the end done more good than bad, the world would be alot darker if the US went back to isolationism and protectionism after WWII and not took the active steps i did in foreign affairs. Like I said we have done alot of harm but more good than bad. My point is that our policies have done harm but their were done so unintentionally in most cases or out of ignorance. But in the end it has done the world alot more good than bad. If we only did what was best for our national interest everytime then we would have never donated so much aid and helped so many countries when their welfare has no direct effect on us. That is such as the Chinese foreign policy until recently. But then again Chinese interests in abroad were limited until the last two decade but even so the foreign policy reflects that of whats the bottom line, the $$ in it for me, so to say. You can say this is because of the West's values and morality coming from religion but Buddhism preached the same and so did confucianism in a sense but then again confucianism was perverted into unquestionable loyalty to state and family as soon as he died. And CCCP was athiest. But you get my point.



posted on Jan, 21 2007 @ 05:46 AM
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Originally posted by chinawhite
You claim to have met 100 Taiwanese in presumerly a overseas hate china secession. That actually doesn't make sense since most Taiwanese nationalist look at the KMT in a bad light which has nothing to do with nationalism. The elderly look at the japanese in a good light and most people who where born in china look at china in a good light.

Repeated again since you accuse me of being paraniod

Whos being paranoid?

A poster posts a thread about chinese weaponary and its anti-american?. You somehow even managed to assiocate videos of jihad on youtube to the tibetian american and made it seem anti-american. Now i ask, who is being paranoid when the only thing i posted that was anti-american was commenting on their massive military budget.

First you make absurd claims

- The lost of Taiwan would cripple America, Japan and South Korea
- Taiwans majority dont even see themselves as Chinese (from your experience from people in America)
- Dong Fong missiles that can finally hit all of the continental US(which it only has few of)
- I was merely saying that the Chinese government propaganda line of Taiwan wants to unite with China is nearly completely a lie. (where there is no propaganda line)
- I was taught how the west (whites) had pillaged and raped China and then the Japanese
- Chinese people as a race are racially superior to whites and that one day when our nation is strong economically we will strike back at the West as it is our rightful place as the people of longest living civilization on earth to rule the world and replace the US as the world's ruler(Lol).
- Accusations about Chinese threads from your own personal experience even though i got over 5000 hits on a single thread


Lol I like you alot. I really do, you entertain me in the upmost sense. Your IM IN CHINA SO YOUR WRONG AND MY FAMILIES IN TAIWAN AND ANYONE WHO SAYS ANYTHING TO THE CONTRARY TO WHAT IM TELLING YOU IS LYING AND YOUR NOT CHINESE ENOUGH COMPARED TO ME. Which is what your underlying statement is. Well I must say it is obvious you never grew up in China as you said those are absurd statements. I can say something like ask any native Chinese person in China or I can call my relatives and they will agree with me on what you say is "absurd" statements. But i'm sure you can say that you know more than me, and that being in China you must be right, that your family connections make you right but like I said anyone who knows anything about China can read what you write and see your rejection of anything that can be wrong with China your minimizing of any flaws in can have is clearly unreasonable, illogical, nationalist based sentiments. That is your motivations and there is nothing further to say. I mean its funny to the point that I actually want to call up my parents and tell them theres someone that actually wrote this to attempt to discredit me. But I dont think they would care its just said. I guess the whole world is complicite in an anti Chinese conspiracy. China has no wrongs, no evils, it is almighty but has no ill intentions. Gosh you should immigrate to China and join the CCP your exactly what their looking for.... that its scary... way to go for the Australian educational system and media on making you so paranoid.



[edit on 21-1-2007 by pilotshinjiikaru]



posted on Jan, 21 2007 @ 05:53 AM
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Originally posted by chinawhite
I gurantee i have met more varied and different chinese currently than you would meet in your entire lifetime in your US town or city.


Gosh your so right there.... your more Chinese than me I'm so sorry. Im sure I attempted to discredit you by attacking your Chinese-ness and your family. And you and your family are much more Chinese than me. Being born there means very little when one can spit out and recycle Communist Party Lines like evangelicals quote the bible. So i'm sorry I admit I am wrong and I lose because of your consistantly "logical" personal attacks on my opinion based rant and assessment.

[edit on 21-1-2007 by pilotshinjiikaru]



posted on Jan, 21 2007 @ 06:15 AM
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Originally posted by chinawhite
What proof do you want then?, I've been down this road before, people doubting me being in Australia, people doubting where i live in Australia. Even people doubting i was even Chinese. You even telling to go to china instead of watching Xinhua even though i'm in china at this present state.Not this time, you provide your proof first because I'm sick and tired of trying to prove to eight day members who i am over and over again.

A poster posts a thread about chinese weaponary and its anti-american?. You somehow even managed to assiocate videos of jihad on youtube to the tibetian american and made it seem anti-american. Now i ask, who is being paranoid when the only thing i posted that was anti-american was commenting on their massive military budget.


Well maybe if everyone disagrees with you that could be a sign. And there you go on your ego trip on your highhorse about how you been on a internet forum with stuff like conspiracy theories and area 51 as topics longer than other people so you must be legit and correct. Oh lets all bow down to the mighty Chinawhite! Oh and by the way I never went and made this thread to target you. I wrote how many people on the internet do the things I stated. But you interpeted as a personal attack and then showed your underlining anti americanism and biased views again and again by attacking me, taking everything I wrote initally as that I was attacking you. Refusing to acknowledge my point about the strategic position of China vs. the US and quoting random internet sources to make your attack look legit. But that in itself in a way served my purpose and you made yourself and proved to the others that you are the people I described even though I never intended for that to be so.

So you proved me correct about intentions of you and many other zealous Chinese nationalists. Even though you say that my claim that China and most Chinese view America as its main and sole threat strategically, politically, and economically is absurd. But your mentality proves me right. By zealously making personal attacks to discredit my views when I did nothing but state my opinions making into a game of IM MORE CHINESE THAN YOU AND IM THERE SO WHATEVER I SAY IS RIGHT! And I never linked Jihad to Tibetans I dont know how you can think that. And conspiracy? no its just a mindset one that when I was a child I was indoctrinated into at school. I know your gonna say LINK ME YOUR SCHOOL PROPAGANDA ON THE INTERNET! well sorry to burst your bubble but random internet sources arent credable. WHAT??!?!! Sorry to burst your bubble and destroy most if not all the evidence your argument and your threads are based on. And down goes his egotistical highchair!

And Jihad videos on youtube are there, you can find them, im not lying. To say Chinese nationalism in terms of boasting of its military prowness is not linked to a rebuke against america and to an extreme and lesser extent in general anti american sentiments is to be in denial. It always has been and it always will, to quote yourself,

Originally posted by chinawhite
Nuclear weapons are there to show a message a message to America, "Any attempt at intervention and be prepared to go ALL THE WAY".

Thats the whole point about China and its desire to boast of itself through its citizen was one a way to unify the people and to an extent a third party way of say the US should not think to interfere in Taiwan and not to underestimate China. China's strategic position has always been and will be linked and defined by America's. Am I saying to be a nationalist is to be anti american? No, but to constantly brag about its weapons capabilities is, as China only builds its defense and military strategy based on countering US interests. And to say otherwise would be like denying America persuing Missile Defense Shield isnt in a way saber rattling at Iran and North Korea.

[edit on 21-1-2007 by pilotshinjiika

[edit on 21-1-2007 by pilotshinjiikaru]



posted on Jan, 21 2007 @ 06:19 AM
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And by the way Chinawhite im sure your well aware your own country Australia shares the same view or nearly the same view of China as the US. Its equally worried about its role on countering US interests, asserting its dominace, and military forces in the region and on Taiwan. Sure one China in name but no one expects Taiwan to submit to communism. And even if China wasn't communist like I said its developed differently so it still probably wouldnt want to unite with a democratic China in the far off future. Would Puerto Rico want to be a part of the US? No.



posted on Jan, 21 2007 @ 06:37 AM
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Originally posted by chinawhite
Not this time, you provide your proof first because I'm sick and tired of trying to prove to eight day members who i am over and over again.


Ummm never said you had to because I never wrote this thread targeting you specifically. You went on to attack me and then tried using your internet sources to discredit my opinion based assessment then USED even more logical fallocies. So if your going to use logic dont make logical fallocies. Dont go from citing sources (erroneously) to IM IN CHINA SO I MUST BE RIGHT or IM MORE CHINESE THAN YOU or I MEET MORE PEOPLE FROM TAIWAN THAN YOU or I HAVE FAMILY IN TAIWAN SO YOUR WRONG. And my favorite PEOPLE LISTEN TO ME! I HAVE 3000 POSTS SO I CANT BE WRONG. Now those are paraphrases mocking you but that is your underlying message wrapped in a nut shell of sarcasm.

And again I never attacked you, you started that, I never said you were wrong about anything until you made a counter attack, I didnt even mention you, you said I was wrong. I never said you had to prove yourself you told me I had to prove myself.

And anyone with reason can see your taking my inital post personally, because you only understood partially of what I wrote. And you believe that there cant be anything negitive with China that cant be justified in some way. So you flipped out.

So dont attack me, over and over, using multiple strategies, all erroenously and then turn it around to me accusing you of something as I didn't. Anything of the sort I said was in defense and in rebuttal of your strange and ill concieved attacks and the process of brushing your attacks off my shoulders.

Gosh I refer to positive western values and he counters with pathetic left wing attacks on America... so I guess since were all overweight that makes democracy wrong. Freedom and liberties wrong, government that serve the people wrong. Yes we are. But oh wait! THERES MORE KFC IN CHINA and McDonalds than there probably are in the rest of the world. So China is getting fat too! So then they must be embracing those values you attacked. Gosh talk about losing weight alot of Chinese in China are obsessed with internet games but I guess there cant be fat people in China. ONLY IN AMERICA! Yes countering legitmate point with worn out stereotypes IS CORRECT!

[edit on 21-1-2007 by pilotshinjiikaru]

[edit on 21-1-2007 by pilotshinjiikaru]



posted on Jan, 21 2007 @ 07:30 AM
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I usually spend a maximum of 20 minutes replying in ATS while you have used 2 hours + of your life replying to me. I'll just going to weigh the benefits and negatives of wasting me time replying to you

The post you have just made are exactly the same. I did not even mention CCP in any of my post and yet you go on ranting about CCP and Chinese cultural defects etc..... I don't get my opinions from chinese newspaper, i read multiple international newspaper and get forum opinions. One trap not to fall into is tabloid papers with alarmist headlines which you read.


I actually replied because of your generalization based on personal experience and your assumption about Chinese posters being nationalistic because they are supposedly in your face America *Note my thread about the Chinese fleet was pictures and numbers yet i said nothing about America

- All Taiwanese hate the mainland based on your personal experience of 100 overseas chinese
- Chinese opinion of the west
- Chinese nationalist



Originally posted by pilotshinjiikaru
IM IN CHINA SO I MUST BE RIGHT or IM MORE CHINESE THAN YOU or I MEET MORE PEOPLE FROM TAIWAN THAN YOU or I HAVE FAMILY IN TAIWAN SO YOUR WRONG.


Actually you told me to go to see the so called "real" china as opposed to the fake china Xinhua was supposedly showing me and i replied that im in china right now.

I actually said that i met recent arrivals for taiwan and been there to see the current taiwan while the people you met are living in America and would be out of touch since i know that the older generation guided by the KMT obviously protrayed the CCP as evil while i met the new generation


But you interpeted as a personal attack and then showed your underlining anti americanism


I'm anti American?.

Because i challenged your views I'm now Anti-American?. The most Anti-American thing i did was criticize Americas military budget





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