The Third Electrical Current

Originally posted by Enkidu
This sounds like the revolutionary, paradigm-shifting breakthrough we've been looking for to free ourselves from dependence on foreign energy suppliers.
Where do I send my check?

Off topic for a moment.

I find it disturbing that Enkidu desires and is allowed to post a photo like this. It's beyond distasteful. Especially considering the evidence that he was stomped to death while in custody. The casual disdain for murder on both (all) sides of this mess is very troubling. In the name of God, please remove this very un-funny representation of western apathy toward the killing of foreign brown people.

And yes, patents are expensive and take time to get with no guarantee of remuneration for your efforts.

According to the diag SW1 (+) is closed and SW2 (-) is as well, so current is flowing from SW1 to SW2 so how is it flowing from negative to negative, and positive to positive....

The fluid medium is the completion of the circuit.

I know that...

It is switched from negative to negative and the other side is switched from positive to positive.

No...it's not according to the diag SW1 (+) and SW2 (-) are closed so it's switched + to - according to current flow ( you can't have a current flow from - to - )...

The current flow within the electrode changes direction[but not polarity], but only flows one way across the fluid medium.

Yep happens in a DC inverter, so it's nothing new...

Two negatives and two positives required to connect to the power source.

That happens a lot in digital circuits...

I see what he does and it's a clever idea but:

SDC and SullyWatt?

A new form of current?

No way, it is AC and DC within his circuit. The coils get AC. The electrolyt DC. A simple passive electrical network that you power switched, to archive exactly this.

So where in his circuit does he have his SDC he claims? You can not drag it out.
You can not use it. Not plug anything to it. Why? Because it is non existent.

Check self: where In his circuit do I find two points (poles) where I can drag SDC from it? You will find none. What does this mean? That means that there is no new from of current and the patent in that form had to be rejected.

So....
why cant one vibrate the elctrodes to get the bubbles off like previously sugested,
or is it advantages to have electricity do the work for you, maybe a high frequency
speaker or something, just enough shake to loosen them and let gravity do the rest ?

posted by Jedi Master
No...it's not according to the diag SW1 (+) and SW2 (-) are closed so it's switched + to - according to current flow ( you can't have a current flow from - to - )...

Dude, step back a minute and look at the diagram. The current isn't flowing - to -, the circuit is completed through the water. So current will flow from - to + through the water, which is how electrolysis happens in the first place. He is changing the direction of the current flow but not switching the polarity of the electrodes. Admitttedly, it's not rocket science, but it is a good idea, none the less.

It's surprisingly simple, which is probably why you can't see it. Not being offensive, but I get the same if I work on a fault for a while, can't see the wood for the trees sort of thing. Fresh pair of eyes and all that.

Originally posted by imbalanced
So....
why cant one vibrate the elctrodes to get the bubbles off like previously sugested,
or is it advantages to have electricity do the work for you, maybe a high frequency
speaker or something, just enough shake to loosen them and let gravity do the rest ?

You could do that, but you'd need more power for whatever motor you have to do the vibrating. It is far more efficient to get the current to do the work for you.

Originally posted by imbalanced
So....
why cant one vibrate the elctrodes to get the bubbles off like previously sugested,
or is it advantages to have electricity do the work for you, maybe a high frequency
speaker or something, just enough shake to loosen them and let gravity do the rest ?

Because you can't have an opposing polarity going through the electrode, even if its insulated.

It creates an electro-static field which will change the polarity of some of the gas ions causing the gas to mix.

The Applications will be in cases where DC is required, but AC effects are Desired.

You are right that there could be a mechanical connection from the vibrating device, or a nearly infinite number Rube Goldberg solutions.

Dear Mr. Sullivan could have walked that path, but he wanted something more elegant, and in the end what he discovered may turn out to be far more useful than a vibrator mechanically connected to electrodes in an electrolyzer.

artpad.art.com...

A neat motion diagram that shows what is going. I know its hard to see what is so special about it, and this should help.

So where in his circuit does he have his SDC he claims? You can not drag it out.
You can not use it. Not plug anything to it. Why? Because it is non existent.

When AC was new many people thought it no different than pulsed DC, or something similar, and they were right on some levels.

But there were things you can do with AC that you can't do with DC.

In much the same way there are things you can do with SullyDC that you can't do with either AC or DC.

And that, along with unique connections and switching for the power Source make it a new form of electricity.

[edit on 14-6-2006 by Malichai]

Perhaps if we badmouth the patent enough, the original creator will get annoyed enough to give us the real explanation.

Originally posted by johnsky
Perhaps if we badmouth the patent enough, the original creator will get annoyed enough to give us the real explanation.

Bring it to him.

You can reply without registering.

forum.physorg.com...

I've sent him an E-mail asking to check in there, here, and other forums where this is being discussed.

Thanks stumason for your input !
learned alot in this thread about circuits and electricity.
You guys should debate like this more often...lol

There are other things to consider.

There must be at least two paths in the DC part of the circuit, and the device[s] requiring AC current must be between these two points.

Think of the electrodes in contact with the fluid, and the coil as separate parts. The coil need not be in the water, but it must be between two electrodes.

I thought of a device, but its not very practical because of the complexity in the Sully DC power supply.

A light bulb that switches from dim to bright and back again.

Imagine the circuit diagram with only two water containers where the paths between the positive and negaive electrodes through the water is instead light bulb filaments.

Between the two filaments on the positive side there is a diode.

On the negative side just a conductive wire between.

When Sully DC is applied to the circuit one filament will light in the first half of the cycle, and two will light in the second half.

This could be extended to as many filaments desired with only one lit in the first half of the cycle.

Yeah, unless someone comes out with something spectacular, its going to be useless...

No offense, that last post was quite clever, but the idea leads to... a dimmer switch.
Something we already have, many, many years ago.

I like your thinking though, if anyone on these forums can make something of this, I think you have a great potential to be that person.

Still though, this "third electrical current" has no uses... as far as I can tell.

Originally posted by Malichai

So where in his circuit does he have his SDC he claims? You can not drag it out.
You can not use it. Not plug anything to it. Why? Because it is non existent.

...

In much the same way there are things you can do with SullyDC that you can't do with either AC or DC.

And that, along with unique connections and switching for the power Source make it a new form of electricity.

[edit on 14-6-2006 by Malichai]

No it does not! Because SDC does not exist. Its no more than a 'wet' dream of the one that wrote that patent application.
Don't ignore what I wrote. Give me any two poles where I can drag SDC from!

'unique connection and switching of power' makes it a clever use of ordinary electricity and not a new form of electricity. That is something completly different.

'unique connection and switching of power' makes it a clever use of ordinary electricity and not a new form of electricity. That is something completly different.

Unique applications make it a new Electrical Current.

Before Sully DC you could not do these things with either AC or DC.

Direction of current flow, and polarity do not need to have mutually exlusive restrictions.

When more applications are discovered the unique nature will become more clear.

In the mean time I would hope that people could keep a civil tounge.

Just imagine if you are wrong. What a fool you will seem to everyone else, and all for no gain.

No offense, that last post was quite clever, but the idea leads to... a dimmer switch.
Something we already have, many, many years ago.

I know, but people were demanding application, and it was the first thing that came into my head.

I am trying to visualize a system for Magnetic plasma containment built within the electrodes themselves.

I believe I read somewhere that part of the problem is how the DC static fields and AC EM fields interact with eachother.

We need a better rubber bands to make the jelly into a ball in order for fusion energy to be practical.

ADD:
Dear Mr. Sullivan has offered to send me diagrams for some new applications when he gets a round-toit.

Does anyone have a round-toit I can use?

[edit on 15-6-2006 by Malichai]

Originally posted by g210

No it does not! Because SDC does not exist. Its no more than a 'wet' dream of the one that wrote that patent application.
Don't ignore what I wrote. Give me any two poles where I can drag SDC from!

'unique connection and switching of power' makes it a clever use of ordinary electricity and not a new form of electricity. That is something completly different.

I have to agree with you...I went over the materials and it looks like he's just inducing currents within the electrodes, then claiming this allows nearly every dubious claim from Townsend Brown to Adelidicnander forces. I don't even buy the "shearing and tensile forces" bit about it improving electrolysis rates. Bubble formation on electrodes, yes that's an issue but I'm not at all sure this is better or more efficient than just sticking an ultrasonic transducer in the bath to keep them shaken off.

Originally posted by Malichai
Unique applications make it a new Electrical Current.

no.

Originally posted by Malichai
Before Sully DC you could not do these things with either AC or DC.

All the components in (your?) circuit are powerd eighter with AC or DC and not with 'SDC'. What you see as SDC is a mismatch in your network measurement methode. You measure two completly different things with your gauges. With the voltage gauge you measure the DC volatge in the electrolyt. With the Ampere gauge the AC current in the coils. Why you think you can connect the one thing with the other is a ridden to me. You need to measure the volatge and the current in the elctrolyt -> DC. And you need to measure the voltage and the current in the coils -> AC. But what you can not do is to take the one value (current) from the coiles and the other (voltage) from the electrolyt and then declare you have a new form of electrical current. There is no new form. There is AC in the network and DC nothing else. No silly Sully DC. You can also not find any 2 points (poles) in the network you could drag anything else than AC or DC. So there is no other current form than AC or DC in the circuit and you can drag no other current form than AC or DC from it. Where should something be that is nighter inside the circuit nor outside?

Originally posted by Malichai
When more applications are discovered the unique nature will become more clear.

The 'nature' of your circuit is absolutly clear to me. As I said a clever idea. But not a new current form. It's a pitty that the inventor did not simple patent his idea but wanted to bring in his name at all costs. And it's a pitty that the pattent office did understand nothing about it also.

Originally posted by Malichai
In the mean time I would hope that people could keep a civil tounge.

?

Originally posted by Malichai
Just imagine if you are wrong. What a fool you will seem to everyone else, and all for no gain.

I don't care what other think of me. There is no new current just a clever application and I hope to made it clear enough here why. If the world thinks different..fine for them. Then get happy with SDC.