The Truth part 2

Here's a question for you regarding Scientology.

If what L Ron Hubbard wrote is irrefutable and must never be altered, why have there been changes made to the tech and his writings? Is this not a contradiction?

Being a suppressive meat puppet wog ant, I'm sure I'm not entitled to any answer, but your refusal to address questions you don't like says more about Scientology than you might think.




[edit on 16-6-2006 by Duzey]

Originally posted by Techsnow
There you have it. Now I have a couple quick questions if you could please answer Mike.

1) If I don't agree with somthing would that mean I'm not allowed in?
2) If I don't agree with somthing or don't know about it for example, =The pyramids were built by homo sapien or alien with the use of telekenisis, does the church have any evidence for such a claim that might help me believe this?
3)How much does it cost, exactly, to join?

1) Absolutely not the case. If any part of Scientology is not real to you, it's not real.
2) Yes LRH knows a lot, hints to many things, and discusses issues that modern History can't explain because modern historians don't have access to a record such as the "time track" of thetans.
3) Becoming a member is a hundred or so, being a lifetime member is a thousand or so, but you don't have to officially "join" per say, you should, but it's not like everyone in the Church is a member. I would recommend going to your local Church, take a personality test (OCA), maybe get an interview, and sign up for a course or 2, read a book, talk to someone, just tell them your life game plan and ask how they can help you (it's what I did)

Originally posted by Duzey
Here's a question for you regarding Scientology.

If what L Ron Hubbard wrote is irrefutable and must never be altered, why have there been changes made to the tech and his writings? Is this not a contradiction?

Being a suppressive meat puppet wog ant, I'm sure I'm not entitled to any answer, but your refusal to address questions you don't like says more about Scientology than you might think.




[edit on 16-6-2006 by Duzey]

I never called you an SP. From what I understand the alterations were small, and from LRH making jokes that to a bad person could be manipulated or misused. Contradiction? Yes, but people make mistakes, and people make good decisions, who am I to judge that action made by a high-level OT.

You aren't entitled to an answer, but you did ask a question, and I don't think you are bad. The_Doctor, is a suppressive though, no question. As for me responding to questions I don't like and that saying something about Scn, I am not Scientology. My name is Mike, and I speak for Mike. I am not high up in Scn. I don't make decisions for them. I am just a regular guy named Mike who isn't even clear. I won't respond to questions that are obviously slander, lies, and deceit created by these 2 1/2% of insane violent people running all over society.

Originally posted by Gemwolf
Jagmike, as I said earlier, I removed myself from this 'discussion'. Can I just ask you not to refer to me as 'the dog with the cigar'. It's Gemwolf. Really not that hard. The dog's name is Frank Btw. And I did some more homework and saw that I can't afford to be a member of scientology on my salary. Lucky me? I'll say!


-


Posted Via ATSmobile (BETA v0.3)


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Dog with Cigar,
That's really too bad. Eternity and more money than you can imagine will pass you by, and a long time from now when you're on your death bed, try to remember to get it right next life... that is if you don't get severely brainwashed and have your memory erased on Jupitor and then sent to a planet without Scientology.

Originally posted by jaguarmike

1) Absolutely not the case. If any part of Scientology is not real to you, it's not real.

So are these your personal "truths" or are these main beliefs of Scientology?

Originally posted by dAlen

Originally posted by jaguarmike

-Our souls are alien souls... I.E. we are all aliens trapped in these bodies
-Our soul is immortal and records everything we experience.

Look in science...there is no soul...as of yet. There may be, but how would you feel if I said once you die your like a drop of water in the sea...your particles spread out everywhere...and you can call it reincarnation as bits of you feed earthworms, other bits make the flowers grow.

What if thats it for you? NO ONE has PROOF of life after death. sorry, all is hope and stories cause none of us can fess up and say we are scared of the potential that we will go back into nothingness which we came.

Old wise solomon...read his stuff...he said enjoy life, as afterwards you wont know a thing as you will be in the grave.

As for immortality, it may be possible, but you better figure it out before the earth worms get you.
As I posted somewhere else, even if someone were to clone you, would it be the same true essence? If you have a soul, than I guess not.

Something for us all to ponder.

peace

dalen

We are all thetans trapped into human bodies. There are people walking around that are operating as their thetans while still controlling their bodies. The things they can do are literally out of this world, amazing, and would make your jaw drop. To heck with modern day science, it is useless- figure out your recorded time track for millions of years and you'll remember better science and technology. Soloman was right, you need to enjoy your life, because afterwards you get sent to a Thetan processing base, memory erased, implanted, and brainwashed.

Ever wonder why people cry when other's die? Think it is just because they miss the person? The whole experience is not good.

for more info on this, read "The History of Man" by LRH or listen to the videocassette "Between Lives Implants"

Originally posted by Techsnow

Originally posted by jaguarmike

1) Absolutely not the case. If any part of Scientology is not real to you, it's not real.

So are these your personal "truths" or are these main beliefs of Scientology?

No this is actually a statement by LRH himself and is a big part of Scientology. If you don't believe it, then you don't believe it- period.

Only take from it what you know to be true, only apply what you know to be true. That's the message.

This is pretty funny. Anyone notice that he says, "more money than you know will pass you by." or something?

Money? This is about money? Money is the most common man made thing on earth. It's value is nothing, it's just used for trade instead of animals, etc.

I bet this is all about money for him. It's sad.

Money doesn't bring happiness. It brings you things, but eventually things get old.

Originally posted by Eteric Rice
This is pretty funny. Anyone notice that he says, "more money than you know will pass you by." or something?

Money? This is about money? Money is the most common man made thing on earth. It's value is nothing, it's just used for trade instead of animals, etc.

I bet this is all about money for him. It's sad.

Money doesn't bring happiness. It brings you things, but eventually things get old.

money is power pure and simple. money enables you to focus on your dreams while not worry about having to feed yourself and your family. I love money. I also love the idea of immortality, being a God, and helping 97 1/2% of you all who know nothing about this truth get there with me.

Originally posted by jaguarmike
I never called you an SP. From what I understand the alterations were small, and from LRH making jokes that to a bad person could be manipulated or misused. Contradiction? Yes, but people make mistakes, and people make good decisions, who am I to judge that action made by a high-level OT.

Yes people do make mistakes, but there are not only just small changes, but deletions of LRH's words.

Originally posted by jaguarmike
As for me responding to questions I don't like and that saying something about Scn, I am not Scientology. My name is Mike, and I speak for Mike. I am not high up in Scn. I don't make decisions for them. I am just a regular guy named Mike who isn't even clear. I won't respond to questions that are obviously slander, lies, and deceit created by these 2 1/2% of insane violent people running all over society.

See, through the beauty of comm we are getting somewhere. Most of the people on this forum have not had an opportunity to talk to a Scientologist within the church. To them, you do represent Scientology. How you behave, like it or not, reflects on Scientology simply because you are the one who brought it up and you are a member.

You're not the only Scientologist on this board, but the rest of them use a little more tact when refuting claims. It must be all the comm courses they have taken.

It's nice to know you don't consider me an SP, because I'm not. I have no problem with the tech or people that use the tech, it can be a useful set of tools. I don't like the church, but just as you are not Scientology, neither is the church. The tech is Scientology.

Being a pre-clear, it is interesting that you know about the alien origins. That is to be reserved for OT3 and higher. Did you know that according to the church, you should be dying from some deadly flu-like illness by now?

I'm curious, might I ask how long have you been involved with Scientology?



[edit on 16-6-2006 by Duzey]

"money is power pure and simple. money enables you to focus on your dreams while not worry about having to feed yourself and your family. I love money. I also love the idea of immortality, being a God, and helping 97 1/2% of you all who know nothing about this truth get there with me."

This post is a clear example of someone who suffers from megalomania and delusions of grandure...

Scientology is a criminal organization with it's members being involved from everything from racketeering to drug dealing. Many members have been criminally prosecuted hmmm I wonder why.

You know I have made a personal fortune without having the need of scientology nor have I ever scammed anyone to get where I am at finacially which is more then what I can say for you. Anyway the discussion is not about who has the most wealth and who knows how to use it. The richest people in the world are not scientologists...

Originally posted by Duzey

See, through the beauty of comm we are getting somewhere. Most of the people on this forum have not had an opportunity to talk to a Scientologist within the church. To them, you do represent Scientology. How you behave, like it or not, reflects on Scientology simply because you are the one who brought it up and you are a member.

You're not the only Scientologist on this board, but the rest of them use a little more tact when refuting claims. It must be all the comm courses they have taken.

It's nice to know you don't consider me an SP, because I'm not. I have no problem with the tech or people that use the tech, it can be a useful set of tools. I don't like the church, but just as you are not Scientology, neither is the church. The tech is Scientology.

Being a pre-clear, it is interesting that you know about the alien origins. That is to be reserved for OT3 and higher. Did you know that according to the church, you should be dying from some deadly flu-like illness by now?

I'm curious, might I ask how long have you been involved with Scientology?



[edit on 16-6-2006 by Duzey]

I'm a special case, there's a good chance I was born somewhere around clear. OT's like me a lot because I get what they are saying and can experience more than most people which I am grateful for. With that being said, I still did get the sniffles at times and overall felt the weirdest negative feeling and I can't explain it in words- it is not that it was terrible as in I was in pain or hurt, but that it was so akward as a feeling. I felt that for about 4 months after I learned the information, and just now feel better. When I wrote the Spanish Inquisition post I was COMPLETELY full of this akward feeling- probably why I ran to the computer to tell you all. As to the OT3 stuff, I was never shown THOSE documents, but unfortunately I can say i've seen them on SP sites about a year ago. I didn't get sick because I didn't believe it. The material is restimulative- what you experience flu/cold/sickness wise is your thetan remembering the past without the incident being handled. The Thetan is uber powerful, and creates. If it gets confused, it creates bad stuff- that's kinda an explination (read a book to find a better one though).

Up until I smoked pot back in highschool Freshman year I didn't experience much reactive mind and life was seriously like constant euphoria and powerful emotions everywhere and I felt affinity with everything even the bad people (which is hard to say now because I have to hold back my emotions with SP's, if it weren't for Scientology I probably would have ended up doing things in life I would regret and gone down in history as just another bad guy- such as taking out all SP's). It was seriously amazing to see what it feels like for most people, I literally felt my beingness drop down, it was terrible. Before I felt much higher up like I could touch the sky and then POOF down on the ground- it was disturbing to say the least.

As for tech. alterations, Scientology and the Technology is the most powerful force on the planet with a nuclear bomb coming in second. If Scientology is used in a bad way, Lord help us all... it would be the end. LRH made a lot of jokes, and from what I am familiar with he made some jokes about Scientology being used in a bad way. The government already stormed the Church back in the day to take control of material they could use and make sure the Church wasn't against them. These are some things I would like you to think about deeply.

Yes there are other Scientologists on this board and even one I know personally on this thread that I got into Scientology. I've been a Scientologist for almost 2 1/2 years as "JaguarMike"- but I feel like i'm just picking up where I left off- I don't have a doubt in my mind that I was one last lifetime. As for their methods being more tactful, yeah I could say that. The thing is, I feel we don't have a lot of time left. I'm sure you see what is going on with Earth right now. I know you see that something is wrong. All the pieces of darkness are falling into place, it's just a matter of time before something terrible happens, a council is formed, and the reign of evil starts. I come here to discuss the solution with people who are interested in things that are out of the box. You all know something is wrong. Even the SP's know something is wrong.

The answers are out there, and right now there is no time for anyone to argue with the only way the world can change. Time is ticking.


Contemplate 10 years, now 50, now 100, now 200, now 500, now 1,000, now 2,000, now 5,000, now 10,000, now 50,000, now 100,000, now 500,000, now 1 million. It was hard for me at 50,000. Our track is MUCH longer than a million years. It is time to break out of the Prison, and take back what is ours as Thetans.

[edit on 16-6-2006 by jaguarmike]

Originally posted by The_Doctor
"money is power pure and simple. money enables you to focus on your dreams while not worry about having to feed yourself and your family. I love money. I also love the idea of immortality, being a God, and helping 97 1/2% of you all who know nothing about this truth get there with me."

This post is a clear example of someone who suffers from megalomania and delusions of grandure...

Scientology is a criminal organization with it's members being involved from everything from racketeering to drug dealing. Many members have been criminally prosecuted hmmm I wonder why.

You know I have made a personal fortune without having the need of scientology nor have I ever scammed anyone to get where I am at finacially which is more then what I can say for you. Anyway the discussion is not about who has the most wealth and who knows how to use it. The richest people in the world are not scientologists...

No the richest people are a group of about 12 Suppressives like yourself called the MJ-12 that rule the planet... scum.

[edit on 16-6-2006 by jaguarmike]

Originally posted by jaguarmike
I'm a special case, there's a good chance I was born somewhere around clear. OT's like me a lot because I get what they are saying and can experience more than most people which I am grateful for.

It's odd how many people are special. I'm a natural clear with the ability to exteriorize. That doesn't make me any better or worse than anyone else here. It makes me, me.

Originally posted by jaguarmike
The government already stormed the Church back in the day to take control of material they could use and make sure the Church wasn't against them. These are some things I would like you to think about.

The FBI raided the church because the church had compromised their security. I'd like you to think about that. The church, proponent of ethics, had infiltrated govt offices to steal information regarding Scientology. That is a crime.

Originally posted by jaguarmike
As for their methods being more tactful, yeah I could say that. The thing is, I feel we don't have a lot of time left. I'm sure you see what is going on with Earth right now. I know you see that something is wrong. All the pieces of darkness are falling into place, it's just a matter of time before something terrible happens, a council is formed, and the reign of evil starts.

You're in the right place for discussion, I just feel you are going about it the wrong way. Disrepecting people, like persisting in calling Gemwolf 'Dog with Cigar', makes you appear irrational and hostile. And even for us wogs, perception is our reality.

I'm glad you have found something that works for you, I really am. I just think that by your behaviour, you are doing more harm than good. You aren't being a good example.

I'm spent a lot of time here defending Scientologists, and I have never been rude about it. I like to think I have shown some people here that there is nothing wrong with the tech and it's not full of crazy people. It bothers me that you are reinforcing negative opinions and acting like the stereotype they expect. I understand how you feel about Scientology, I've studied it for years as a hobby and frankly, you are the first Scientologist I have ever come across that treats wogs like stupid idiots. You even make me wonder if perhaps I was wrong.

And that's kind of sad.

[edit on 16-6-2006 by Duzey]

fixed a quote

[edit on 16-6-2006 by Duzey]

"No the richest people are a group of about 12 Suppressives like yourself called the MJ-12 that rule the planet... scum."

The Majestic 12 do not rule the world. They were a Us government operated group of highly regarded scientists formed back in 1947. It was created by president Harry Truman to investigate UFO activity. Most likely to see if they had posed a national security risk or not. I am pretty sure the group no longer existed past the late 1950's

Where you get your information is beyond me just another one of your blatent lies.

Look up MJ-12 many of their documents have either been leaked or declassified and none of them mention any plot for global domination. Groups like Bohemian Club, Bilderberg and the CFR among others are the most likely candidates to rule the world considering the members of these groups have real geo-political pull and more money then I could ever dream of. Not to mention most of the members of these groups belong to other groups with the same people and money. Even scholars agree that Bilderberg for example is making public policy and driving the steering the global economy. You are the first person who has said the MJ-12 rule the world which is highly inaccurate information.

Well that money comment pretty much sealed the deal for me. He's not looking for the truth, he's looking for money to make his dreams comes true.

What's the point of dreams if we're living on a prison planet? Why not devote yourself to helping others instead of serving your and other's blatant greed.

Jag, up to those comments I thought you were just brainwashed. I held nothing really against you, I just felt bad for you. But now I see that you're a greedy person, just looking for money.

You care only for youself, and your money. And it looks to me like you're becoming like Hubbard, a greedy man who never found true happiness.

And now, whenever I see scientology. All I'll see is a greedy old man's sick joke.

[edit on 16-6-2006 by Eteric Rice]

I see your post has changed since I responded to you and you mentioned something I'd like to follow up on, if you don't mind.

I also want you to know I'm honestly not trying to be mean to you, I just want you to realize that the way you present yourself here is going to impact people's opinion of Scientology. If you come across as dismissive and don't address people's concerns and call them a name - because let's face it, when you call someone an SP that's what you're doing - that gives them all the ammunition they need to use against you.

Originally posted by jaguarmike
As to the OT3 stuff, I was never shown THOSE documents, but unfortunately I can say i've seen them on SP sites about a year ago. I didn't get sick because I didn't believe it.

I find that absolutely fascinating. If you already believe this much of what you have been told why not that part? You believe in Thetans, why not believe in the origin of the implanting? If you were to reach OT3, do you think you would be more accepting?

edited to try to add some clarity

[edit on 16-6-2006 by Duzey]

The trick to brainwashing people into scientology is to get them to consider those that question it's valididty to be considered enemies of scientology. Then that way when it is scrutinized they will call the scrutinzizers SP's.

Originally posted by Duzey
I see your post has changed since I responded to you and you mentioned something I'd like to follow up on, if you don't mind.

I also want you to know I'm honestly not trying to be mean to you, I just want you to realize that the way you present yourself here is going to impact people's opinion of Scientology. If you come across as dismissive and don't address people's concerns and call them a name - because let's face it, when you call someone an SP that's what you're doing - that gives them all the ammunition they need to use against you.

Originally posted by jaguarmike
As to the OT3 stuff, I was never shown THOSE documents, but unfortunately I can say i've seen them on SP sites about a year ago. I didn't get sick because I didn't believe it.

I find that absolutely fascinating. If you already believe this much of what you have been told why not that part? You believe in Thetans, why not believe in the origin of the implanting? If you were to reach OT3, do you think you would be more accepting?

edited to try to add some clarity

[edit on 16-6-2006 by Duzey]

I did not believe it back then- now I do and I don't get sick confronting it. Absolutely fascinating? Condescending are we?

I'm not trying to be condescending, I just thought it was strange. It's such an integral part of the story and having stated your beliefs so far, I was surprised that you rejected this part out of hand.

It really caught my attention, and I wanted to know more. So much so, that I made another post just to ask you about it. Your statement raised more than one question in my mind and I wanted you to expand on it.

From dictionary.com:

fas·ci·nate ( P ) Pronunciation Key (fs-nt)
v. fas·ci·nat·ed, fas·ci·nat·ing, fas·ci·nates
v. tr.
To hold an intense interest or attraction for. See Synonyms at charm.
To hold motionless; spellbind.
Obsolete. To bewitch.

And now, so that you won't mistake it, I am going to be slightly condescending, because I think you earned it.

You aren't handling this very well at all. Pun intended.



[edit on 17-6-2006 by Duzey]