President Bush to Militarize Border?

Well, we'll just have to unionize those jobs so the workers can make more and then in response of course we'll have to move our farms overseas with our factories because we won't be able to pay the workers and keep our prices competitive with others. Ah well, I suppose once we get the guard deployed we can prevent those cheap imports from crossing our borders and then everyone would have to pay those high prices. We might start a little teeny international trade war in the process, but what the heck, we would be free of those criminal aliens trying to feed their families.

[edit on 14-5-2006 by Astronomer70]

The National Guard is in no position to fill that role. Maybe if they were re-assigned and re-trained to fulfill a law enforcement role along the border, and paid for their time - but that's not going to happen.

My suggestion is that Bush has no intention of actually doing this, he simply wants to maintain the appearance of listening to the bigots and idiots while doing nothing to effect the profits of his corporate sponsors, who thrive on illegal labor. The construction business especially.

It's been a very depressing scene there, in terms of labor wages, ever since the last hurricane season.

Bush and his supporters have no interest in militarizing the border. They do, however, have an interest in appealing to the senseless among us, who are more hateful than rational, and in maintaining the illusion of working for those who ostensibly elected them. Remember his base, his core? Not exactly progressive, rational, proponents of civil order...

Anyway, if anything is to be done about the border, shut it tight with active military. Eminent domain all the property along the border and re-deploy all units training for desert warfare to the region. If it's miles wide, tunnels are out of the question (they can cross the border, sure, and end up in the mess tent of a bunch of hot, thirsty, irritable soldiers) and people on foot won't have a chance.

Squeezing the border in one place makes it pop out another, so the Navy/coastguard would have to spend a lot of time picking people up and dropping them off (where!?).

We'll need immigration camps, just like Mexico's got - sprawling, filthy, crowded, inhumane conditions, meant to deter as much as detain. :shk:

That's the road we're heading down if we beef up the border. I'm not saying we can't do it, I'm saying that it is only one option.

Another option would be to open the border wide, and simultaneously cut off the welfare state, and the notion of automatic citizenship. Make it a test, a hard test, for EVERYONE. Watch the voting rolls plummet to about 50k or so.

That would simplify matters quite a bit, whereas militarizing the border would probably serve to increase the number of problematic incidents, the number of senseless killings, the tension between us and our neighbors, and so on.

If you don't want the NATIONAL Guard to have to protect our southern border there is a way to help.

Today, I gave my mother-in-law two Mother's Days gifts. These were her requests.

The first was send-a-brick.com.
12 bucks sends a brick (and a form letter, talking about how unhappy you are regarding our wide open border) to your representative of choice. I chose Harry Reid.
You are basically saying that you are doing your part, by providing a building block, to start contruction of a southern border wall. Ok, it's symbolic!

The second was a 15 dollar donation to the minuteman project.

So, if you don't want the National Guard stationed down there.
There are OTHER things you can do!

Get Halibuton to put a wall up. How hard would that be.

Are you kidding?

Putting up a wall is easy enough, keeping people from digging under it is much, much more difficult.

Not only that, but you have to consider all the people that come through concealed in vehicles, and anyone with a passport can get in legally by saying they're visiting relatives or going on vacation. When they don't cross back over, their name gets added to the ICE list, but if they plan on getting forged documents, it doesn't matter until they're picked up and fingerprinted (assuming those are on record).

Building a wall is not a viable solution, IMO, but it could be part of a larger 'lockdown' solution. Those sort of solutions create a whole slew of new problems though, people shouldn't delude themselves about the consequences of the policies they're lobbying for...

I honestly don't mind other folks coming into America, as long as they aren't here to hurt us. Just prove yourself worthy of trust, I really don't care where you are from.

I'm so confused with what is happening. There is allways some emergency that Bush comes up with that "requires" tightening security.

Troy

There are solutions to the Illegal Alien issue...

The best solution is for all Americans who want the illegals to go home....they should:

1. Post signs on their businesses stating "Illegal Aliens not served here!!!"

2. Request proof or legal residence from their gardeners and maids.

3. Refuse to eat at any restaurant that has ANY illegals working there...this requires a person to check the green cards of all of the kitchen workers and bus boys.

4. Boycott any business that has been known to hire or use illegals.

5. Boycott any products that are produced using illegals

6. Boycott any produce that was raised or harvested using illegals.

7. Boycott any gas stations, convenience stores or liquor stores that are owned by Middle Eastern Illegals or that fail to post proof of residency in their stations or stores.



This is the duty of any red blooded American who is fed up with illegals. If we quit doing business with business that enables illegals, then they will have no choice but to go back where they came from.

I know it will be difficult. Many of us will have to do without things that we are accustomed to, but it is the price we MUST pay if we want to rid ourselves of this problem today.

Now tell me....where are the True Blue Red Blooded Americans that will make a stand on this?

Boycott and walk out of every business and away from every product that cannot show proof of citizenship or legal residency of all of its' owners and employees!!! Do it today, tomorrow and every day this week!!! Make your stand today!!!

Instead of the National Guard, I think Bush should stop cutting taxes, raise taxes of the rich, and use that money to hire more civilian Border Patrol officers. Unfortunately big business makes the policy, and what is good for the US isn't necessarily good for them, and they always win.

Originally posted by curme
Instead of the National Guard, I think Bush should stop cutting taxes, raise taxes of the rich, and use that money to hire more civilian Border Patrol officers. Unfortunately big business makes the policy, and what is good for the US isn't necessarily good for them, and they always win.

Look at that...3 lines, 2 periods and no wrecked homes and the problem's solved. But then again, this member seems to have more than a bobble-head on their shoulders.

Bush economics:

Pull a man from a $50k job
and put him in a $20k job
to guard the security of a $10k job.

BUT - he'll get to report FANTASTIC EMPLOYMENT RATES...just think, he's doubled the number of employed for the $50k job...and you guys don't get in the way of the mass stampede from the unemployment lines and entitlement roles to the strawberry fields when them $10k jobs open up...k?!

Unfortunately, the nidget hasn't used his calcumalator to see he's talking about dropping the tax revenue by over 3/5ths.

I'd just like to point out that the National Guard can be used without anybody leaving their full time jobs. They already do their two weeks a year, I assume the plan would be to make this their two week 'tour of duty'.

Originally posted by Astronomer70
Benefits are paid by the employer--that's a good one. I believe it is we, the purchasers of whatever products that actually pay any benefits.

actually yes, benifits usually are paid mostly by the employer
you may pay 10 - 40$ but your employer is paying the rest of it, hence why so many companies work 12 hour shifts, to minimize the number of employees and lower their opperating costs from the insurance

Originally posted by Valhall

Originally posted by semperfortis
You're going to pay for the health care either way. Because the AMERICAN strawberry pickers are not only going to demand higher wages, they are going to demand benefits. And so will the construction workers and the meat plant workers and the housekeepers. You're not getting out of anything here. You're stepping into it.

You seem to have completely forgotten that AMERICAN strawberry pickers, construction workers and meat plant workers will also pay AMERICAN taxes....illegals however don't pay one cent back into the system.

[edit on 15-5-2006 by Kung Foo Fighter]

I still say the best solution is a moat.
Ohh, and 10 foot field of rasor wire on each side of the moat as well as in the moat itself.
Anyone who gets through that can stay

OR
They just bypass jumping the moat and enter the country LEGALLY

Originally posted by Kung Foo Fighter

Originally posted by Valhall

Originally posted by semperfortis
You're going to pay for the health care either way. Because the AMERICAN strawberry pickers are not only going to demand higher wages, they are going to demand benefits. And so will the construction workers and the meat plant workers and the housekeepers. You're not getting out of anything here. You're stepping into it.

You seem to have completely forgotten that AMERICAN strawberry pickers, construction workers and meat plant workers will also pay AMERICAN taxes....illegals however don't pay one cent back into the system.

[edit on 15-5-2006 by Kung Foo Fighter]

I really have to agree on the tax issue
We need to do something about illegals, like manditory jail time and 100,000$ fines for the owners of a company per illegal found working in the company.

Dont treat the symptoms, go for the source.
They come here because they can find work here.
The symptom is them coming here, the source is the work they find.
Take the work away and they stop coming.

Originally posted by mythatsabigprobe
I'd just like to point out that the National Guard can be used without anybody leaving their full time jobs. They already do their two weeks a year, I assume the plan would be to make this their two week 'tour of duty'.

I don't think so. BUT - let's pretend that's it. Do you realize the financial burden this represents to the American people due to the logistics and transportation involved? Also, where are they supposed to fit this two weeks in? Is it an additional 2 weeks to that they've been using for combat re-training - because you realize that the training is constantly being updated, right? And every time they rotate into Iraq they should be going through a re-train period (hopefully - if things are working the way they are supposed to). And are these going to be the National Guard troops that have returned from Iraq or the ones waiting to go? Are National Guard troops in Iraq going to get the bad news - no rotation available...they're guarding against the brown tide!

Originally posted by Kung Foo Fighter


You seem to have completely forgotten that AMERICAN strawberry pickers, construction workers and meat plant workers will also pay AMERICAN taxes....illegals however don't pay one cent back into the system.

[edit on 15-5-2006 by Kung Foo Fighter]

Here's the IRS tax calculator. For a single person who pulls in a whopping $10,000 for the year...

www.irs.gov...=14806,00.html

We're being robbed of $156 in Federal Income Tax.

For two $10k people married with one kid (so joint filing at $20k total):

ZERO Federal tax obligation...ZERO.

POLITICAL FOOTBALL.

EDIT: Forgot link to calculator.

[edit on 5-15-2006 by Valhall]

That means if EVERY one of the 500,000 illegal aliens with minimum wage jobs were replaced with a single person with no dependents we would recoop a whopping $78 million.

How many C130 round trips to rotate National Guard every two weeks will it take to use up $78 million. - PLUS the National Guard salaries (2000 National Guardsmen at $20k is $40 million. Meanwhile you've dropped (assuming everyone of them make $50k in their regular job) their tax obligation (assuming they are married with one kid) from $3719 per year to ZERO - that's another $7.4 million in lost taxes)) - PLUS the meals for the National Guard. PLUS the equipment transportation so they can run back and forth to the latrine.

The Porta-Potty contract alone will be mind-blowing.

And to the genius explaining that the employer pays the majority of the benefit costs - YEAH, WE KNOW - that cost is passed on in the price of the goods or services. Employers aren't in business for charity purposes.

[edit on 5-15-2006 by Valhall]

Any of you actually LIVE in an area that has been overrun by illegals? Any of you see on a daily basis the squalor, crime, and host of other problems associated with illegal immigration? Any of you seen your commute to work increase by 50% in the past 3 years due to illegal immigration? Well i have and i do on a daily basis because im stuck in the middle of a town that has been consumed by it. If not then keep your yaps shut because you dont know wtf you are talking about. Nothing annoys me more than to listen to some liberal living in their comfy little canadian or new england communities far away from these problems spout out about how illegals are people too and that our economy will plummett, etc, etc. I dont understand how we as a country managed to do anything for ourselves before this pool of cheap labor If you think any of the savings from the work that illegals do is being passed on to you as a consumer then you are sadly mistaken. It is just more profit for the company and for their management. There are no savings for the consumer when it comes to illegal immigration, only costs.

Anybody in here that has used the words racist or bigot can refer to my sig as they have already been ignored for being ignorant. The first and last excuse of an ignoramous is to pull the race card. I hope they lock the border down so tight you couldnt squeeze a fart through. We can then work on kicking out the others who have been here less than 5 years.

Originally posted by Escrotumus
Any of you actually LIVE in an area that has been overrun by illegals? Any of you see on a daily basis the squalor, crime, and host of other problems associated with illegal immigration? Any of you seen your commute to work increase by 50% in the past 3 years due to illegal immigration? Well i have and i do on a daily basis because im stuck in the middle of a town that has been consumed by it. If not then keep your yaps shut because you dont know wtf you are talking about. Nothing annoys me more than to listen to some liberal living in their comfy little canadian or new england communities far away from these problems spout out about how illegals are people too and that our economy will plummett, etc, etc. I dont understand how we as a country managed to do anything for ourselves before this pool of cheap labor

If you think any of the savings from the work that illegals do is being passed on to you as a consumer then you are sadly mistaken. It is just more profit for the company and for their management. There are no savings for the consumer when it comes to illegal immigration, only costs.

Yeah! I lived right in amongst them! Some of the best and friendliest neighbors I've ever had. They go to work every day. They pay their rent. They feed their kids. And they mow their yard.

I can see how that's making your life miserable. You seem to have issues. And I'm neither a liberal, nor do I live in Canada or New England (as if that makes a stinking bit of difference). I just have a head on my shoulders and a mouth that refuses to swallow B.S.

[edit on 5-15-2006 by Valhall]

yeah i have issues because i hate sitting in traffic for 2 hours each day, hate seeing my town converted to spanish signs, and hate seeing the quality of my kids education go down because half their classmates require special consideration because they dont speak english. Yeah i must be a racist...seriously think before you speak.