Hints on the possible "Whore of Babylon"

Originally posted by Nakash
Pagan tradition.

Sacred tradition. Two different things.

www.catholic.com...
www.catholic.com...
Thus Paul tells the Corinthians: "I commend you because you remember
me in everything and maintain the Traditions even as I have delivered
them to you" (1 Cor. 11:2), and he commands the Thessalonians, "So then,
brethren, stand firm and hold to the Traditions which you were taught by
us, either by word of mouth or by letter" (2 Thess. 2:15).

Sola scriptura is precisely that- to refuse to acknowledge commentary over scripture.

Sola Scriptura is the refusal to acknowledge sacred tradition and
oral teachings. Those are things the bible acknowledges as good
and holy. Sola Scriptura's refuse to acknowledge any truth outside
of the bible - historical documents and the rest. They think life ended
when the bible finished being written. It didn't. But hey ... if Sola
Scripturas want only part of the story, that's their choice.

The RCC is undoubtably heretical

Your opinion. And most likely the opinion of the other
fundamentalists that you hang out with in an echo chamber
somewhere. Tribfarces.com???

and everybody knows that.

Now really- do you honestly believe in transubstantion?

Yes. Of course. Christ said so. I posted HIS exact words on this.

Most Catholics believe it to be symbolic

No they don't. It's the basic teaching of the church. If they
believe it to be symbolic, then they aren't really catholic.
Those age 18-24 haven't been taught their faith. The older
the Catholic, the better they have been taught what the
Church believes. Those are the pathetic 'fruits' of Vatican II.

are horrified at this idea once we tell them what
the RCC official doctrine is.

Careful .. your agenda is showing.

God cookie

and your Jack Chickisms are showing.

You are nothing more than a proselytizer for your fundamentalist cult.


[edit on 4/12/2006 by FlyersFan]

Great. Transubstantion was denied by Christ in clear cut terms it's symbolic as he said:


"DO THIS IN REMEMBRANCE OF ME"

-Luke 22

He was God himself: fully Spirit.
And told US, this world,
*NOT* to create him in an idol.

May Thor be your next Pope, because the RCC is heretical and you know it. Better buy that indulgence quickly while they are on discount flyers


It is truly an honour to carry the message of Jesus Christ instead of giving in like Balaam. Your "insult" was a compliment. Thanks fly, good to know I'm doing a proper job.


[edit on 12-4-2006 by Nakash]

i dont know, but that eucharist doesnt look like the unleavend passover bread (the whole ceremony departs from passover). Who came up with the idea the bread should be round, the popes hat should look that way, he should hold the bread exactly that way. Its the little things like that you have to look out for.

Images of Flatbread

Originally posted by Nakash
Flyers, he also said "Do this in Remembrance of me" which clearly denotes it as a symbolic act, as opposed to what the priests do- having the gall of saying they have magic powers to transform God into a piece of bread, then parade him around in a monstrance.
[edit on 11-4-2006 by Nakash]

Jesus was the WORD made FLESH. this simply means that our spiritual food (the hidden mana), nourishes our minds and feeds us.

Joh 6:63 It is the spirit that quickeneth; the flesh profiteth nothing: the words that I speak unto you, they are spirit, and they are life.

Jesus is saying right here that hes not talking about cannibalism when hes talking about his becomming our passover. (his word is the UNLEAVEND bread. Meaning its the word of God without pharasee tradition. His blood is the blood of the lamb, which u put over your dwelling or spritual body to wash sins and make the death angel pass over you).

Joh 6:58 This is that bread which came down from heaven: not as your fathers did eat manna, and are dead: he that eateth of this bread shall live forever.

Joh 4:14 But whosoever drinketh of the water that I shall give him shall never thirst; but the water that I shall give him shall be in him a well of water springing up into everlasting life. (was jesus talking about drinking his blood here?)

1Co 5:7 Purge out therefore the old leaven, that ye may be a new lump, as ye are unleavened. For even Christ our passover is sacrificed for us:

Amo 8:11 Behold, the days come, saith the Lord GOD, that I will send a famine in the land, not a famine of bread, nor a thirst for water, but of hearing the words of the LORD:

Those that partake of Christ neither hunger nor thirst. Its symbolic, not a form of pagan alchelmical transubmutation where the passover is perverted into some ritual. (on a seperate note bulls often symbolize false preists in the bible, aka bulls of bashan).

Mat 16:11 How is it that ye do not understand that I spake it not to you concerning bread, that ye should beware of the leaven of the Pharisees and of the Sadducees?
Mat 16:12 Then understood they how that he bade them not beware of the leaven of bread, but of the doctrine of the Pharisees and of the Sadducees.

What is the body of Christ? It is the Church
Rom 12:5 So we, being many, are one body in Christ, and every one members one of another.
Eph 4:12 For the perfecting of the saints, for the work of the ministry, for the edifying of the body of Christ:

Whos main mission is what? Feeding the Sheep!
Joh 21:15 So when they had dined, Jesus saith to Simon Peter, Simon, son of Jona, lovest thou me more than these? He saith unto him, Yea, Lord; thou knowest that I love thee. He saith unto him, Feed my lambs.

With What? The WORD of God. Not Flesh, flesh profiteth nothing.


[edit on 2006-4-12 by NuTroll]

Exactly. Just passover, only better symbolism. That's all. No magic cookie turning into a God, no amazing priest holding the holy of holies like a piece of meat for a bunch of God-eaters. Nope, that's Egypt again.

[edit on 14-4-2006 by Nakash]

Jesus was the WORD made FLESH. this simply means that our spiritual food (the hidden mana), nourishes our minds and feeds us.

No, there is no need for symbolism here. This simply means exactly what it says. God was made flesh and dwelt among us. That God is Jesus. It has nothing to do with spiritual food or anything else.

John 1:1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.

John 1:14 And the Word was made flesh, and dwelt among us, (and we beheld his glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father,) full of grace and truth.

Good, but claiming that the Lord's supper is symbolic has nothing to do with Christ being the word made flesh, the bridegroom isn't here anymore, and won't be for a long time.

[edit on 14-4-2006 by Nakash]

"The Word of God is blasphemed by the satanic teaching of the Eucharist, changing the Lord's supper from a memorial observance to a sacrament, a repeated sacrifice of Christ for sin. Every time the words of consecration are used, the natural body and blood of Jesus is mystically present in the form of bread and wine (cannibalism).
The repeated 'sacrifice' denies the finished work of Christ's sacrifice on the cross. If Catholic priests can offer an acceptable sacrifice, then Christ our High Priest is robbed of His glory. It exalts sinful men into the position of mediators between God and men. The elements of bread and wine are exalted to a position of honor and veneration that is not warranted in Scripture.


The round 'cakes' were used in pagan worship in Egypt, where in 1854, an ancient temple in Egypt was discovered with inscriptions showing round cakes on an altar. Above the altar is a large image of the SUN. Near Babain, Egypt is a temple with the sun symbol above its altar with two priests shown worshipping.
In Peru (South America), this same image is worshipped. Even the Israelites, when they fell into Baal worship, set sun-images above their altars. The shape of the Catholic 'host' is influenced by sun-worship. Catholicism is a mixture of paganism, Judaism and Christianity. It is not Biblical and is not of God."

ahh another good subject dead in the water.

What you also have to remember is that in communion we use UNLEAVEN BREAD. If transubstantiation is correct, what's the point of whether to use leaven or unleaven bread? We use unleaven bread because its SYMBOLIC.

My question is, WHY WOULD IT MATTER TO CATHOLICISM whether or not its unleaven bread or grapejuice IF God himself "impute" the flesh of Christ.

transubstantiation is a doctrine of devils which appeals to the carnal and not the spiritual. By mixing truth with error, you get such nonsense as this.

Revelation 17
The Woman and the Beast
1 One of the seven angels who had the seven bowls came and said to me, "Come, I will show you the punishment of the great prostitute, who sits on many waters. 2 With her the kings of the earth committed adultery and the inhabitants of the earth were intoxicated with the wine of her adulteries."
3 Then the angel carried me away in the Spirit into a desert. There I saw a woman sitting on a scarlet beast that was covered with blasphemous names and had seven heads and ten horns. 4 The woman was dressed in purple and scarlet, and was glittering with gold, precious stones and pearls. She held a golden cup in her hand, filled with abominable things and the filth of her adulteries.

5 This title was written on her forehead:
MYSTERY
BABYLON THE GREAT
THE MOTHER OF PROSTITUTES
AND OF THE ABOMINATIONS OF THE EARTH.
6 I saw that the woman was drunk with the blood of the saints, the blood of those who bore testimony to Jesus.

Revelation 13
4 They fell down and paid homage to the dragon, because he had bestowed on the beast all his dominion and authority; they also praised and worshiped the beast, exclaiming, Who is a match for the beast, and, Who can make war against him?

www.abovetopsecret.com...

What strikes me is the immense ignorance of Christians in regard to actual pagan traditions and how they are present in both catholicism and protestantism. it would be funny if it werent so tragic that people believe anything.

The rite of holy cummunion/The Lords Supper/whatever you call it in your sect is indeed in the bible, although in every version I read, its symbolic. However, Christianity is not the only religon to practice this rite, and it predates Chriatianity by far. People keep saying it comes from Egypt. Wrong. Egypt is one of many cultures that practiced the symbolic eating of bread and wine. Just about every single culture in the world practiced this rite as a harvest rite. The harvested grain symbolized the body of the sun god or fertility and grain god, whose body was sacrificed to feed people during the winter. The wine represented the blood of the harvest god from the grapes. This rite is nothing new and certainly is not unique to Christianity. the Romans, greeks, persians, babylonians, Phonecians, celts, ect all practiced it in some form. the ritual was usually symbolic, although in some religons, it was believed to be magically imbued with special powers. But it all boiled down to sun rites and the celebration of the harvest and the declining sunlight.

Christianity and catholisism are full of pagan traditions. Heres a few:

Christmas: originally taking place during the festival of the Roman Saturnalia, which was a huge party in Rome. Feasts and parties abounded, gifts were exchanged, and someone was appointed to be King saturn, Roman god of agriculture and time, to be revered and catered to until he was sacrificed at the end of the celebration. Also, the Christmas tree and Yule log were taken from germanic pagan traditions, as is the name Yule, the germanic name for the winter solstice. Decorating the tree, plus the adornment of holly, were celtic druidic customs. Lighting of candles was a common practice in northern Europe to celebrate the return of sunlight and warmth. December 25th was the birthday of the persian sun god, Mithrias. By the way, in pagan traditions of the yule, the sun god, whatever his name, was born of a virgin goddess. The timing of Christmas is purely pagan, and was used when Christians took over the Roman empire to Christianize and supplant the traditional pagan celebrations at the time. Christ was not even born in december if you go by the bible.

Easter: the name is from Eostora, the Germanic goddess of spring and fertility. So loved and revered was she by the pagan tribes that the Christians could not fully banish her, so her name was adopted for the holiday. Eostora was said to travel amonst the tribes when spring came, and with her traveled her beloved pet rabbit, who would lay colored eggs to the delight of the children, who Eostora had a special love for. Baskets of fruit and brightly colored trinkets were traditionally made up and given during this celebration, and things were decked out with flowers. Even the timing of Easter is suspicous: easter happens every year after the first full moon that occurs after the spring equinox. Curious timing for a "Christian" holiday.

Valentines day: Though not really a Christian holiday, it is celebrated by Christians. Though it was named for a catholic saint, the holiday comes from the pagan Roman feast of Lupricalia, meaning Wolf party. It was in celebration of Februs, whose name means fever, a goddess of passion, who was said to incite fever in mortals to make love. Lupricalia was celebrated by a big party, where some pots filled with names of the party goers were set out. The name you drew would be the sex partner for the evening. This is where we get the tradition of giving "valentines", though a much more watered down version.

Halloween: Not really a Christian holiday either, however, the catholics have all saints day on the day after. Halloween comes from the Celtic holiday of Samhain, which was when it was believed the veil between the world of the living and the world of the dead was at its thinnest. This is the last harvest festival, and the beginning of the Druidic new year.

Preistly vestments: Only for the Catholic church. The robes worn by cardinals and the pope, and high ranking Catholic figures in general, can virtually be traced directly back to the Roman priests of Jupiter. In fact, it is widely believed that when Christianity became the offical religon of the Roman empire, the old pagan preists didnt bother changing their gear, instead, they simply converted to the new religon.

Catholic saints: There are a number of catholic saints whose identity is a mystery, and it is not for certain whether or not they were indeed historical figures. certain theories put out by a number of scholars suggest that some saints might indeed be pagan gods in disguise: deities from native pagan cultures who were simply converted into saints to facilitate the assiminlation of the Christian faith amongst the heathens. St. Bride of Kildare comes to mind, who is quite possibly the Christian incarnation of Bridgitt, celtic goddess of fire, blacksmiths, and bards.

Holy water: Many religons of the world have various forms of holy water which is used to bless people and objects and cast out evil. Same with holy anointing oil. the practice predates Christianity.

Baptism: the practice of dunking people is not unique to Chrisatianity, and predates it. it is mention in the bible, of course, so it is not, per se, a Christian tradition gotten from paganism. However, many world cultures have engaged in the practice of dunking people in blessed water, or pouring water from a sacred source to bless and initiate the person into a paticular sect, make them leaders, or cure illness. In Northern European cultures, kings were made by bathing them in a sacred spring or pool, priests made the same way.

My space here grows short, I shall start another post to continue.

The Cross: This symbol is important to Christians because its what jesus got nailed to, what he died on. However, the use of the cross as a protective symbol predates Christianity. In almost every culture, the cross in some form is used as protection, blessing, or good fortune.

there are numerous other minor rites/peculuarities I could list, but for the sake of space, Ill leave them for you to find.

Also, i find that using catholics and Christians as seperate terms to be flawed. Catholicism, like it or not, you protestants, is one Denomination of Christianity. A Christian is someone who believes in the divinity of Jesus Christ as the son of the Hebrew god. Catholics most certainly fit this bill.

The assumption that every pagan diety is Baal is laughable. Baal was one of many pagan middle eastern gods worshipped, and any scholar will laugh if you attempt to draw lineage from him to everyone else's gods. he is the big bad god of the bible, the god blamed for all of Israel's evils. Thus, he is the one that Christians seem to think sum up every other pagan god/goddess.

The Whore of babylon? I myself dont really take much stock in the biblical prohecies, as they can be taylor made to fit just about anyone's agenda. Depending on who exactly you want to demonize, you can pull just about anything out of your hat. Taking the description of the whore from the bible, it says she sits on seven hills and wears purple and scarlet. First thing that comes to mind is the Catholic Church. Their higher ranking clergy wear purple and scarlet robes. The Vatican sits in Rome, a city on seven hills. Sounds good! But wait............Seattle also sits on seven hills (well, six now, they blew up denny hill years ago to make room for the Space Needle). Purple and scarlet are colors of royalty and wealth.....could the revalation be talking about BILL GATES???????? The cup of abominations and filth could be Windows, as well as the great internet empire gates has created! he is rich enough to make his own private army........

Or the city of seven hills could mean something completely different. The colors scarlet and purple could mean something different. Maybe its a flag of a copuntry or international entity. My point is, you can interpret revelations to suit your own agenda.

My sources? Its called reading. reading books. Going to the library and researching in encyclopedias. I will not provide links, as I think its high time people stop using the internet as the almighty source of infalliable information and actually try to look up more credible, legit sources in print. I have seen too many websites that bandy false or incorrect information about like its gospel.

For Suzy Ryan: Your comment made me laugh. I can think of a vast number of Christians, especially of the protestant persuasion, who make an artform of ramming their religon down peoples throats, as well as attacking and persecuting others who dont share their beliefs. In fact, I can think of several incidents where a group of born again Christians and their ilk have violated laws, attacked people, sent threats, vandalized, harrassed, and behaved in a less than civilized manner against people they deem "evil" because they follow another faith. Prime culprits: penecostals, assemblies of god, baptists, charasmatics, methodists.

I've always been under the impression that much of the ancient symbolism (regardless of sect) was to help encorportate higher concepts to the larger audience of a predominately illiterate populace.

And ironically, these days the intellectuals take symbols designed for the lower classes to back up their respective theories - a reverse of the original concept.

Of course everything we see will be influenced by what we have read, and we will systematically make the symbol fit into our present perspective.

The priests of old were there to make sure those who were spreading the "word" to the rest of the populace were all "on the same page" and not letting their personal interpretations of the mysteries slip through into the sermons.

I'm also a Catholic (although I don't attend anymore for personal reasons).

The CONSECRATED HOST is SYMBOLIC. My aunt is an ordained nun and a wonderfully scientific woman. She confirms this.

The ACT OF COMMUNION is A SYMBOLIC GESTURE OF GOOD FAITH. It is a very powerful act. Not only does the Host literally become part of our chemical makeup (as it is digested and absorbed into the system) it is also SYMBOLIC of "BECOMING ONE WITH CHRIST". "A piece of Him in Us" so to speak.

But back to the point -

Regardless of the culture and it's impressions of The Great Mother (which is a universal theme everyone can relate to) what makes us so sure the Whore of Babylon is not a symbolic reference to a "vessel" of sort - a container of spirit, intellect or experience?

Let's take this symbolic anaolgy a bit further :

The Whore of Babylon refers to the "body" of the majority of people who buy into the debauchery of Babylon hook, line and sinker. They lie, steal, engage in immoral sexual conduct and - on the whole - behave like hedonistic animals devoid of higher reasoning. They have soaked up the culture and disegarded all warnings of such actions. They blaspheme God and His laws at every opportunity -whether verbally or through their individual actions.

Just something to think about -

Not "doctrine"
Not "the end all be all word of God"

just a another take on the original subject at hand.


By the way - Satan is probably laughing his arse off in response to the fighting going on in this thread.

OVER AND OUT.

Very good points, Pyro.

You are correct about the symbolism. In ancient times, only scholars and the priesthood could read, that is, if that paticular culture even had writing. But symbols were something everyone could understand. One did not need a lengthy education to say, look at a symbol of the crescent moon and understand what god that shrine was dedicated to, and so forth. In fact, the great mystery sects often wrote down in written language instead of symbols whatever rites or beliefs they held, with the knowldge that the illiterate population, the kings and queens included, would not get a hold of their sacred knowledge, since few could read.

Symbols occur in even the most primitive cultures without writing. In the early days of the church, and up until the middle ages, it was the only way to convert or teach the population about anything.

Nice speculation on the identity of the whore, by the way.

I sincerely hope you guys are not referring to the actual whore of Babylon. Her name was Judy and she was in her mid 30's when the story was written. She still had a good body and delivered a job of work for a fee. It was an honest and honorable endeavor as she cheated no one and you basically got what you paid for.

This separates her from the majority of politicians, world “leaders” and men of god who almost never deliver on their promises.

So, there were plenty whores in Babylon but most of them were men. You’ve got your preachers, most of whom are whores. You’ve got your politicians, almost all of whom are whores. You’ve got you’re charities, stealing from both the giver and the intended recipient. You’ve got the constructors of what passes for the Christian bible who made up reams of supposed surviving documents at the behest of Constantine after the actual documents were systematically destroyed by the Roman military at the direct orders of Diocles, Constantine’s immediate predecessor.

Obviously I do not share the male-centric fantasy that women are somehow inferior to us boys. And my respect for women and kids is, in my view, the defensible position of the thinking man. I do not, therefore, view women and children as chattel a prevailing view of average men throughout history. We see this defensive and fear driven view in all religions and most laws passed by governments. I am not just referring to our current crop of Washington girly-boys who obviously fear women like the plague; we see this denunciation of women throughout history except from intellectuals.

So, whores in Babylon…sure but as I said, mostest of thems is boys.
That's my story and I'm stickin to it.

sayswho

.

What strikes me is the immense ignorance of Christians in regard to actual pagan traditions and how they are present in both catholicism and protestantism. it would be funny if it werent so tragic that people believe anything.

What strikes me is the immense ignorance of non Christians in regard to why these pagan practices are in place. These sun god practices have been put in place by the great deceiver to keep you from seeing the "Son of God". You are being deceived, simple as that.

The rite of holy cummunion/The Lords Supper/whatever you call it in your sect is indeed in the bible, although in every version I read, its symbolic. However, Christianity is not the only religon to practice this rite, and it predates Chriatianity by far. People keep saying it comes from Egypt. Wrong. Egypt is one of many cultures that practiced the symbolic eating of bread and wine.

Certainly these practices are in many cultures. The reason that the Catholic Communion is traced to Egypt is because of the letters I,H,S on the host or sun wafer. The letters stand for Isis, Horus and Seth from the Egyptian version of the lie that blinds the whole world from Babylon.

Christmas: originally taking place during the festival of the Roman Saturnalia, which was a huge party in Rome. Feasts and parties abounded, gifts were exchanged, and someone was appointed to be King saturn, Roman god of agriculture and time, to be revered and catered to until he was sacrificed at the end of the celebration.

Incorrect. The origin of Christmas can be traced to the birth of the sun god, Baal. The purpose is to get you to celebrate the sun god instead of the Son of God. You have been deceived. What you have given is just one of the many variations of the lie that originated in Babylon.

Also, the Christmas tree and Yule log were taken from germanic pagan traditions, as is the name Yule, the germanic name for the winter solstice.

Again, incorrect. The Christmas tree originated from the death of Nimrod. His mother, who was his lover claimed that Nimrod became Baal, the sun god at his death. Being pregnant she claimed the sun god Baal made her pregnant and she had a virgin birth. Her son Tammuz was killed by a wild boar at the age of 40.

It is claimed that an evergreen tree sprung up overnight from blood on the ground from Tammuz. This evergreen tree is where the Christmas tree comes from. It is in Jeremiah 10 of the Bible.

Decorating the tree, plus the adornment of holly, were celtic druidic customs. Lighting of candles was a common practice in northern Europe to celebrate the return of sunlight and warmth.

Again, you are incorrect. This practice was in place thousands of years before you are aware. What you have stated is just another version of the lie that blinds you from Babylon.

Jeremiah 10:1 Hear ye the word which the LORD speaketh unto you, O house of Israel: 2 Thus saith the LORD, Learn not the way of the heathen, and be not dismayed at the signs of heaven; for the heathen are dismayed at them. 3 For the customs of the people are vain: for one cutteth a tree out of the forest, the work of the hands of the workman, with the axe. 4 They deck it with silver and with gold; they fasten it with nails and with hammers, that it move not. 5 They are upright as the palm tree, but speak not: they must needs be borne, because they cannot go.

December 25th was the birthday of the persian sun god, Mithrias. By the way, in pagan traditions of the yule, the sun god, whatever his name, was born of a virgin goddess.

Yes, this is another version of the Nimrod story that originates in Babylon. Yep, a virgin birth and a resurection, all designed to keep you from seeing the truth of the Messiah, by the great deceiver.





What you have stated is just one of the many versions of the lie that blinds the world that originated in Babylon. Trace your story to it's origin point, Babylon. Then trace that to Satan, the great deceiver who has deceived you.

The timing of Christmas is purely pagan, and was used when Christians took over the Roman empire to Christianize and supplant the traditional pagan celebrations at the time. Christ was not even born in december if you go by the bible

Incorrect again. The paganism wasn't used by Christians, it was used to blind you from the truth. Constantine, the Roman Emperor, backed the bishops of Rome and formed the Catholic Church. Constantine was a high priest in the temple of the sun god. It is he that changed the worship of the Son of God, to the sun god who was worshipped on SUNday.

Much to learn you have, grasshopper. You are being deceived.

Baal, Baal-y, Baal-y, Baal-y Baal!

I don't know what you're driving at, Sun. According to Christianity (or perhaps not? I've read that Satan is called a god) there is only one God, and it sure aint Baal.
According to Christianity, Satan existed much before Baal. As Skaadi mentioned, Baal is just one of the gods worshipped. Baal is figment of the imagination. There is no Baal. Therefore the "this is Baal, that is Baal" thing is meaningless. Baal doesn't exist!

Of course people all over the world worshipped the sun! It's big! It's up there! It's warm and provides light. It helps crops to grow. The sun is not evil. It isn't some anti-christ god. It's just the sun.

I am blinded. Blinded by the light.



[edit on 22-5-2006 by babloyi]

Originally posted by Sun Matrix
.
What strikes me is the immense ignorance of non Christians in regard to why these pagan practices are in place. These sun god practices have been put in place by the great deceiver to keep you from seeing the "Son of God". You are being deceived, simple as that.

I am being decieved? I am not Christian. I am not being decieved, as I do not believe in any of it.

Certainly these practices are in many cultures. The reason that the Catholic Communion is traced to Egypt is because of the letters I,H,S on the host or sun wafer. The letters stand for Isis, Horus and Seth from the Egyptian version of the lie that blinds the whole world from Babylon.

I think you had better do a little research on your Egyptian mythology. The holy trinity of you refer to was osiris, Isis, and Horus, not Seth. Seth, or Set, as he is more commonly known, was the dark brother of Osiris who killed him. And the letters IHS have absolutely nothing to do with that.
altreligion.about.com...

Incorrect. The origin of Christmas can be traced to the birth of the sun god, Baal. The purpose is to get you to celebrate the sun god instead of the Son of God. You have been deceived. What you have given is just one of the many variations of the lie that originated in Babylon.

No, what i am giving you is factual historical data. Try actually looking at REAL scholarly works. Baal has nothing to do with it.

Again, incorrect. The Christmas tree originated from the death of Nimrod. His mother, who was his lover claimed that Nimrod became Baal, the sun god at his death. Being pregnant she claimed the sun god Baal made her pregnant and she had a virgin birth. Her son Tammuz was killed by a wild boar at the age of 40.

Again, you are incorrect. Have you bothered to do any historical research on anything here?

Again, you are incorrect. This practice was in place thousands of years before you are aware. What you have stated is just another version of the lie that blinds you from Babylon.

No, I am stating what is common historical knowledge for anyone who actually bothers to study history.

Yes, this is another version of the Nimrod story that originates in Babylon. Yep, a virgin birth and a resurection, all designed to keep you from seeing the truth of the Messiah, by the great deceiver.

More than likely you are being decieved by some half wit who pulls a bunch crap out of his backside and throws it all together, proclaiming it all facts, without actually bothering to do a little footwork.

What you have stated is just one of the many versions of the lie that blinds the world that originated in Babylon. Trace your story to it's origin point, Babylon. Then trace that to Satan, the great deceiver who has deceived you.

I trace my story back to credible historical research. Babylon is but one of many ancient civilizations of the world. many pagan traditions predate it. And since I do not base my own research on premise of some mythological spook with red horns and a pitchfork, I actually have a solid trail to follow. The Northern European peopl, as well as many other ancient people, had no contact with Babylon.

Incorrect again. The paganism wasn't used by Christians, it was used to blind you from the truth. Constantine, the Roman Emperor, backed the bishops of Rome and formed the Catholic Church. Constantine was a high priest in the temple of the sun god. It is he that changed the worship of the Son of God, to the sun god who was worshipped on SUNday.

Blind me from the truth? No, from YOUR truth. It wasnt the pagans who wanted to convert the world to their view, it was the Christians, and since the pagan faiths had already existed for thousands of years, it was the pagan beliefs the Christians used to enforce their new religon upon the people.

Much to learn you have, grasshopper. You are being deceived.

I would have to say it would be YOU who has much to learn. I am not being decieved. I have bothered to actually educate myself, not base my arguements off the ramblings of self styled "christian" scholars. lemme guess, your sources include Jack Chick, the Watchtower, or anyone else who cant be bothered to do actual research. Ill leave you to your myths of history, but some of us prefer the real world