Has anyone witnessed a blatant Satanic ritual within a Freemasonry Lodge/Temple?

No problem Blackguard....although I'm not really defending anything per say.....I'm just saying that it seems to me that it is acceptable for christians/religion to have their rituals - but its not ok for other groups/societies/etc to have them too.

Masons are good people, with traditions. Why do people have to persecute a group just because they do things differently than the almighty religions deem 'acceptable' - when the almighty religions do
exactly the same type of thing. Doesn't make any sense to me to
be judgemental and prejudice towards Masons when that is the opposite
of what God teaches (in my opinion). Its the same with many minority groups in the world....they condemn what they say is no good.
What makes these heads of the church the all knowing God to make decisions like that? Masons weren't around when Jesus was here - so don't recite the bible to me please. The Masons do GOOD for their fellow man. End of story.

Rituals are rituals. Doesn't mean their evil. The Catholic church would defend THEIR rituals all the way to pluto and back Can't blame Masons or anyone else for doing the same thing.

Originally posted by sanse_nz
Why do people have to persecute a group just because they do things differently than the almighty religions deem 'acceptable' - when the almighty religions do
exactly the same type of thing. Doesn't make any sense to me to
be judgemental and prejudice towards Masons when that is the opposite
of what God teaches (in my opinion). Its the same with many minority groups in the world....they condemn what they say is no good.

It's an interesting point, sanse_nz. Here in Europe there is a furor over some cartoon depicting the prophet Mohammed that has half the Muslim world up in arms. It would be interesting (if perhaps a little comic) to imagine freemasons storming the bastions of the media in response to unfair coverage, marching on Fleet Street lobbing well aimed trowels at the editors etc etc.

Of course it wouldn't happen because tolerence is a key part of freemasonry, which in this context has (until very recently) has been interpreted as 'turn the other cheek'.

Originally posted by Peace to you all
I am sorry to say this, but Freemasons who claim there is nothing sinister about the whole thing are normally within the 1-3 degrees range.

Sorry, you're wrong there - my best friend is an 18th degree and my sponsor was a 33rd degree. They havent reported anyting sinister

How do you know what goes on at a higher level if you have not reached that level yet? Also, isn't there some oath (even for the first 3 degrees) that states bad things will happen to you if you reveal the secrets?

"Bad things" is very subject to interpretation. But yes you take an oath not to reveal the secrets.

And, there is this thing that states you should look out for your Brothers.

Sorry, that is incorrect. The oaths of Freemasonry do not interfere with your civic or religious duties in anyway. In fact, to become a Freemason you have to be a law abiding and respecting citizen.

Does this mean that if you are a cop, you let people off speeding tickets if they give you a handshake or show a symbol? Does this mean that you can give a Brother a promotion in a major company?

Thats a hard one too....If you had friends that were a cop or friends that were in a Major company - wouldnt they look out for you a little more than a complete stranger? While freemasons are not all friends, it is easy to identify with a fellow mason because you share the same moral views.

Originally posted by xxxfootyxxx
II have been in freemason halls and ritual rooms with the big "G" hanging from the roof. G standing for Gnosticism "possessing intellectual or secret spiritual knowledge". As a Christian i am not one for judging someone's christianity... But how can you justify being a Christian, a religion willing to accept anyone through the name of Jesus Christ, and be a Freemason, a man who is enlightened through secret knowledge and possession.

Sorry for being picky - but how can you, a non mason profess to know what the "G" Stands for?

You shouldnt just go around stating your interpretation as fact. Makes you look silly =)

For all the filibustering and arguing over (incorrect) semantics the point remains the same - the 1st degree of Freemasonry (Scottish or York Rite) is Satanic anyone care to actually offer some counter-evidence or just more noise?

As always here is a link to the history of The Scottish Rite for anyone who really cares

www.freemasonry101.org.uk...

Originally posted by MrNECROS
For all the filibustering and arguing over (incorrect) semantics the point remains the same - the 1st degree of Freemasonry (Scottish or York Rite) is Satanic anyone care to actually offer some counter-evidence or just more noise?

You are the one making the claim. On what basis? Given the large percentage of practicing Christians in freemasonry ATS members deserve better than just taking your word for it.

It would be impossible to disagree with trinityman here. Necros makes a spurious claim about the First Degree being "satanic' without offering the least bit of evidence, and then challenges us to prove him wrong. This isn't logical argument, it's silliness. Especially considering the fact that the rituals of McLenachan that he's so fond of are all Christian in nature.

You guys seem a bit "defensive"... Maybe Necros is right!!!

I need to go look behind some bushes now. One of them looked like it was harbouring a demon of some kind.

Originally posted by MrNECROS
For all the filibustering and arguing over (incorrect) semantics the point remains the same - the 1st degree of Freemasonry (Scottish or York Rite) is Satanic anyone care to actually offer some counter-evidence or just more noise?

As always here is a link to the history of The Scottish Rite for anyone who really cares

www.freemasonry101.org.uk...

Alright some people do get kinda defensive....so go ahead Necros, what is it EXACTLY about the 1st degree that you find offensive and satanic. at that point i will surely do my best to show how there's nothing satanic at all in masonry. go ahead and ask about degrees 2, 3, and 4 in the york right body...i know those as well.

If you want someone to prove you wrong then what is it EXACTLY that is sooooo satanic or wrong about ANY of the degrees?

Necros is up to his usual tricks again. Posts allegation, supposition and lies and then conveniently disappears. Its been 8 days since he last posted on this thread and despite four replies (including Roarks 'we are all as guilty as hell' post ) theres been no word from him.

He'll pop up soon enough, ignore any attempts to engage him on this topic, and try to derail some other thread.

[edit on 10-2-2006 by Trinityman]

More than likely the Ottoman-based Freemasonry "as was Jesuitism" connected to the black arts; more so than Western Lodges. Adolf Hitler has been publicly linked to the Turkish-Ottoman Freemasonry by the Theosophists-Anthroposophy folks. These darker arts were passed from Jundi Sabur (Iraq) via Roger Bacon and the like and thus spread into Europe etc.

It should also be mentioned that the Turkish peoples (white anglo-turks) were very much linked to the Thule society which was founded upon a perverted Mohatma/Buddist/Hindu Freemasonry and eventually degraded even more-so by the Nazi party. Many horrible tortures and the study of the black art were carried out by the Nazi's and I do hold to firmly that the driving force behind this was hidden within secret brotherhoods operating behind the front Ottoman-Freemasonry, while being supported by criminals like Rothschild/Morgan etc.


[edit on 12-2-2006 by markusjharper]

Originally posted by markusjharper
More than likely the Ottoman-based Freemasonry "as was Jesuitism" connected to the black arts; more so than Western Lodges. Adolf Hitler has been publicly linked to the Turkish-Ottoman Freemasonry by the Theosophists-Anthroposophy folks. These darker arts were passed from Jundi Sabur (Iraq) via Roger Bacon and the like and thus spread into Europe etc.

It should also be mentioned that the Turkish peoples (white anglo-turks) were very much linked to the Thule society which was founded upon a perverted Mohatma/Buddist/Hindu Freemasonry and eventually degraded even more-so by the Nazi party. Many horrible tortures and the study of the black art were carried out by the Nazi's and I do hold to firmly that the driving force behind this was hidden within secret brotherhoods operating behind the front Ottoman-Freemasonry, while being supported by criminals like Rothschild/Morgan etc.


[edit on 12-2-2006 by markusjharper]

This is champagne comedy.

I don't even know where to begin, except for asking if you would kindly provide something to back up this... this... whatever this is.

More twilight-rite... first the sarcasm and then the “asking for proof without clarifying the specifics...except with the addition of not knowing where to begin".

Request denied!

Originally posted by markusjharper
More twilight-rite... first the sarcasm and then the “asking for proof without clarifying the specifics...except with the addition of not knowing where to begin".

Request denied!

I was going to reply to this......but I really just can't be bothered so I
deleted it and have decided to just use the visual ignore system instead.

There really isn't any need to defend something that doesn't do anything wrong no matter who demands and accuses.

"I Think. Therefore, I am....."

Should be instead " It thinks, me".

Originally posted by markusjharper
More twilight-rite... first the sarcasm and then the “asking for proof without clarifying the specifics...except with the addition of not knowing where to begin".

Request denied!

Well, considering that the Nazis murdered 80,000 Freemasons in the holocaust, it seems counter-intuitive and kinda ludicrous for you to attempt to attribute the holocaust to Freemasonry.

You don't think so?

Well, considering that the Nazis murdered 80,000 Freemasons in the holocaust, it seems counter-intuitive and kinda ludicrous for you to attempt to attribute the holocaust to Freemasonry.

You don't think so?

Now, I'll try and explain to you briefly:

Hitler shut down the Freemasonic lodges, as well as the Theosophical, Anthroposophical and the eventually even closed down the very "Thule/vril" society which was degraded even more-so. He was less harsh with the Buddhists but that was only at the beginning. He also murdered millions of Christians but it is hardly spoken of.

Hitler was a WHITE Turk and connected with Ottoman Frankism and they have their roots in "Zionism" and "Sabbatism". Hitler closed the lodges to cover for himself and destroy any other competition. Even Aleister Crowley “the beast" called Hitler a black brother "Sorat". Some researchers - not only myself, even go so far as to say that there is evidence to imply that the Rothschild blood is in Hitler. It is also well known that Rothschild created Israel, through Balfour.

Now many brave Jews today speak out against Zionism because Zionism is basically a form of Turkish-Frankism and these Turk leaders (false Muslims) murdered over a million Armenian Christians in Turkey WW1 - yet few speak of it!

After Rudolf Steiner spoke publicly and linked Adolf Hitler to Ottoman Freemasonry, the Thule society moved quickly to kill him. Eventually Steiner was poisoned by them.

But it goes much deeper than this because it is interconnected with the Jacobites and to this day, Zionists plan to exterminate both the Jews in Israel and also the Muslims and Christians in this has been the plan from the very beginning. The Holocaust is a test run and I am trying to make this clear that what is coming, will be much worse than anything we have seen in WW1 and WW2. Remember, the Rothschild’s needed to create a lasting conflict in the Middle East and they will continue to pretend to be a "Semite Jews" even though they are not!

Hitler was prepped and primed by the secret societies in Turkey and Germany within the Thule and Freemasonic lodges; this made a great meeting place. You should know by now, that each lodge is as unique as art itself but to say that Hitler was connected to Ottoman-Freemasonry is 100% correct, regardless. The history Freemasonry in the Ottoman Empire can be traced back to before Roger Bacon and the Sufi Assassins themselves, using a form of corrupted Aristotlesm; from the time of Jundi Sabur, in Iraq. This is not to be confused with Western Freemasonry but is a fact we must not pretend is a non-issue.

We have become lazy and foolish; what happened in WW1 and WW2 will occur again (beginning in March) and continue for a long time. I hope you've considered that what is coming will indeed be much worse than both WW1 and WW2 put together. Hopefully, you will find some time to stop laughing and consider this.....I have spent too much time here already and if anyone doubts what I have said, I ask you to sit back and continue to do exactly what you have been doing. When it all comes to pass, few will be laughing.

Hitler was a white Turk?

How is it that the rest of the world thinks that he was Austrian?

I mean, how did you uncover the "reality" of his ancestry?

Double post.

[edit on 14-2-2006 by Roark]

...

[edit on 15-2-2006 by Tamahu]