@ torbjon:


From Serpo.org:

Q: Why did they take 9,000 lbs of supplies but no microscope – although they took three telescopes?
A: Not clarified. Good telescopes would have been necessary to make accurate astronomical observations. (Note: the 9,000 lbs figure was subsequently amended to 90,500 lbs.)

[edit on 12/22/05 by vietifulJoe]

It would have to be ammended, 'cause it didn't add up. Although I find the 90,500 number even odder... now we've gone from 4.5 ton, 9000 pound simple typo (45 ton, 90,000 pound) to 45.25 ton 90,500 pounds *rolls eyes*

My numbers still don't include water.

Two years worth of water would have been another 46,000 pounds (and that's less than the "minimum" daily requirements)

Nobodies watch had a date function

The ED doesn't work around a magnetic field, yet generated electron flow, which generates magnetic field...

I'm still suspect of 420...

I can believe in a lot of crazy stuff, but so far this story is Not crazy enough for me *shrugs*

Major ammendments make me skeptical...

Originally posted by torbjon
It would have to be ammended, 'cause it didn't add up. Although I find the 90,500 number even odder... now we've gone from 4.5 ton, 9000 pound simple typo (45 ton, 90,000 pound) to 45.25 ton 90,500 pounds *rolls eyes*

My numbers still don't include water.

Two years worth of water would have been another 46,000 pounds (and that's less than the "minimum" daily requirements)

They were able to drink the EBE's water, so no need for that.

And I expect them to be able to grow something on the EBE planet, if they brought the seeds. Would have taken quite some time of course.
Maybe they counted on being able to eat some of the EBE's food.. I would be surprised if they did eventually.

I don't see why we should expect them to take basic material that could be refined/found elsewhere. Heck... one would expect that a race that can build a half mile long spaceship could also afford the Culligan Man.

Originally posted by Centrist

There is too much talk, where are the pictures, videos, evidence and full disclosure.

Im giving up on this crap

I think that most of us have tended toward the skeptical side since the very beginning of this whole ordeal, but all I know of is the promise of pictures -- I don't recall anyone saying that "full disclosure" or videos were on the way... so I'm not raising my hopes unrealistically (or even noticeably) high. There's no reason to hold your breath, waiting for some grand event to occur. Although, you should feel free to speculate wildly on anything you've seen, read, or thought up to this point

As for me, I'm researching a whole different topic on ufology at the moment. Sure, I check my email, ATS, Serpo.org, etc. regularly, but I'm not in or out on Serpo until more is released.

If Serpo leads to disclosure, I think we'll all be more than a bit surprised. If it doesn't, then we just go on. While we're waiting, if you get bored, read this article on why Alpha Centauri might be able to harbor life.

[edit on 20-12-2005 by Centrist]

I have been interested in this whole subject since I was a boy in the 1970's - I have become tired of waiting for disclosure. I was there buying everything I could when Tim Good was releasing his books in the eighties, and scared myseld #less reading Whitly Strieber - I have maitained an interest ever since. (For one reason or anover i thought 1997 was going to be the big year) - the thing is this is not a hobby for me. I do not want to endlessly talk about this. - the fact is I like so many just want to know. - I am now a father and although I have always been open to the fact that extra solar entities have made contact with earth I need proof. I am extremely reluctant to promote any sort of acceptance of this subject to my children if we are to be continously manipulated.

Its all or nothing for me now - get on with it now and show us some stuff or shut up and stop playing games.





[edit on 22-12-2005 by akabigfoot]

[edit on 22-12-2005 by akabigfoot]

[edit on 22-12-2005 by akabigfoot]

[edit on 22-12-2005 by akabigfoot]

Originally posted by onlyinmydreams
I don't see why we should expect them to take basic material that could be refined/found elsewhere. Heck... one would expect that a race that can build a half mile long spaceship could also afford the Culligan Man.

Much of the stuff have to be remade then, the EBE's have bigger eyes, no thumbs, smaller body etc. etc.
On top of that, the EBE's apparently used very different measuring scales, so everything actually had to be made from scratch, and that had to be hard since they couldnt understand them perfectly.

I guess I just see the whole 9000, 90,500 pounds of stuff issue crazy. They can make a space ship but can’t synthesize Tang, or create/provide any of the proteins amino acids sugars fats etc we need to live. Apple juice and paper pulp, that’s it. They can create a magic power source (ED) but can’t provide a recording device to keep records with (we took an ELECTRIC IBM typewriter *rolls eyes* why not a manual one? How much paper went with that? Carbon paper? Paper clips? Staples?) They can whip up a sewage treatment plant, but not a telescope? We took COFFEE POTS. Coffee Pots *rolls eyes*

I’m going where no man has gone before, and I’m taking my Coffee Pots because I NEED many Coffee Pots to make the instant coffee that comes in my two year supply of C-Rations.

I’m taking my Coffee Pots because I’m strung out on caffeine and I’m going to a place that can’t even make Tang (let alone my double mocha latte with a twist) and I was chosen as a Team member because of my addiction to caffeine and my ability to realize the survival value of Coffee Pots in an alien world.

I’m taking my electric razors, too, dangit. God forbid I should grow a beard or have unsightly underarm hair. How am I going to score with all of those hot eben chicks if I have unsightly underarm hair? And I’m military trained, so I don’t know how to use a normal light weight military issue razor blade, I need a big bulky heavy 1960’s non-rechargeable electric razor that rips out more hairs than it cuts because, you know, I’m tough.

I need 90,000 pounds of creature comforts ‘cause I’m going to a non industrialized primitive society that doesn’t even know how to bang the rocks together yet… oh no, what a minute, they’ve conquered the light speed barrier and have magic energy devices, duh, silly me. I’m taking 90,000 pounds of junk because I’m stoooopid.

How ‘bout just taking a few thousand pounds of illustrations showing how to build the tools needed to build the tools needed to build the junk I want to take?

Then I can take 88,000 pounds of coffee for my coffee pots.

After all, life without coffee ain’t worth livin’.

Originally posted by Thain Esh Kelch

Originally posted by onlyinmydreams
I don't see why we should expect them to take basic material that could be refined/found elsewhere. Heck... one would expect that a race that can build a half mile long spaceship could also afford the Culligan Man.

Much of the stuff have to be remade then, the EBE's have bigger eyes, no thumbs, smaller body etc. etc.
On top of that, the EBE's apparently used very different measuring scales, so everything actually had to be made from scratch, and that had to be hard since they couldnt understand them perfectly.

No... what I mean is that water is H2O everywhere in the galaxy. Yes.... the team would need to bring equipment that the aliens did not already have that was anthro-centric in design... but they would not need to bring along raw materials/chemicals that are presumably easy for the Ebens to acquire.

Torbjon,
What are you raving on about? It seems pretty clear that the team brought machined tools they thought they would need while they did not bring raw materials like water, iron, etc.

You're complaining that they brought a typewriter while, later on, the Ebens built a sewage plant for them. The problem with this complaint is that you are forgetting that every person in this project would have had a 'point of view' and that they were not omniscient. The team, for instance, would not have known what the Ebens would do for them. They did not know, when they stepped on the ship, that they would be treated the way that they were treated.

To be honest.... I'm kinda getting frustrated with these criticisms/debunkments that seem to forget that -- if this is real -- that the players would not be omniscient. I've noticed this on several threads, actually, and I'm still waiting for the day when most ATSers realize that something isn't 'debunked' if it does not fit with what they would have done (or with their perspective). ATSers often argue from one specific standpoint that they assume to be universal... and such arguments, ultimately, become debates with people who don't believe that the British army ever existed because they cannot fathom why an army would wear bright red uniforms.

This sort of logical error passing as 'reason' has come up on ATS before. In the John Titor threads people often stated that because Titor didn't talk about the Columbia accident he had to be a fake.... to which I responded by asking ATS about the R101 disaster. Now... the point of this was to show that it's foolish to assume -- and argue from -- the position that you not only know everything... but that your sense of what is and what is not important is universally shared. The R101 was a british dirigible that crashed and killed a lot of people... and was a major news story in its day... yet no one on ATS had heard about it from memory. Many ATSers, however, assumed that, even though their own view of the world was quite contemporary, that someone like JT would manage to share their exact perspective in regards to Columbia.

Now... I am not saying that JT was real and I am NOT trying to make this a JT thread. What I am saying is that a lot of the 'debunkment' going on here is of the same low, myopic quality. Seriously... saying stuff like, 'X couldn't have happened because I would have done Y' or 'X didn't happen because I think Y happened' is not a debunkment.... it's just a competing statement without any internal logic that proves it to be true.

So please... no more of this 'Serpo has been proven to be fake because the team members don't have my taste in donuts' stuff. And... please... no more of this 'Serpo isn't real because it conflicts with my pet theory' stuff.



[edit on 22-12-2005 by onlyinmydreams]

[edit on 22-12-2005 by onlyinmydreams]

So please... no more of this 'Serpo has been proven to be fake because the team members don't have my taste in donuts' stuff. And... please... no more of this 'Serpo isn't real because it conflicts with my pet theory' stuff.

You're kidding right.

So were to take the fact that we sent 12 humans to a distant planet at face value, because an anonomous source said so!

I have bridge for sale. U2U me if your interested! Its a real bargin!

PS I think torbjon, brings up some valid points. You would never want to take something with you on a journey of that magnitude that has shown to be addictive. What happens when it runs out in 4 years. Your worse off than had you never brought it! And I hardly think its essential!


[edit on 22-12-2005 by CrossBone]

Onlyinmydreams:

Slow down comrade.

I’m a believer in the aliens… I haven’t been here alla that long, but poke around a bit and you’ll see that I’ve made the exact same argument that you have regarding aliens and alien behavior…

Aliens do crazy things because they are alien and we are human and putting human values on aliens is just plain stoooopid. They don’t put crop circles on the White House lawn because they don’t. They buzz Farmer Brown out in the fields but don’t buzz Times Square, because that’s what they do. They molest Farmer Browns daughter and mutilate his cattle, but they don’t molest the teevee news person while she is giving a live report nor do they mutilate her poodle, because that’s what they do.

They are Aliens.

Trying to nail aliens into a human mind set is just plain silly.

Trying to nail humans into a human mind set, on the other hand, is the same kettle of fish.

The Team members were military. This was a military run operation. The military has a phenomenal amount of experience in logistics and sending personnel and equipment into unknown and potentially hostile environments. While creature comforts Are important for moral, they take a back seat as far as Survival goes.

Every ounce, every cubic inch counts.

A Coffee Pot? HONESTLY? When you can boil water in the can your C-Rations came in? (as soldiers in the field do) And the coffee provided in C-Rations is instant. Did they waste More poundage on Maxwell House? Did they send people with a physical addiction? Why? Why a coffee pot and not the same weight in caffeine pills?

An Electric Razor? You’re gonna waste a pound on a gizmo that is gonna be dull in a year anyway, that has the potential of malfunctioning and becoming completely useless, and has No Other application than to remove whiskers when you can spend only a few ounces on a straight edge with a leather strap for sharpening, has a variety of uses, and no moving parts to go haywire or get gummed up…

mmmph.

I have no problems with the alien element of this story. Same ol’ whacky aliens doing crazy alien stuff.

The human element has a lot to be desired.

Sure Torbjon's post didnt debunk anything but it definitely got me rollin on the floor.
I see where your goin Torbjon. When I was in the Army we had very specific limits on what we went into the field with. After all we only took one canteen. And we heated our C's on truck engines.
but man that was funny.

[edit on 12/22/05 by longhaircowboy]

Yeah, these arguments about 'they're not doing things the way my mind thinks they should be done' are not very convincing of anything. It certainly doesn't prove this is a hoax, any more than Anon's posts prove it's NOT a hoax. They just show how some people can't think outside of a box. IF this is true, I'm sure there would be alot of 'out-of-the-box' thinking going on for the mission to be successful or to happen at all.

And as far as the coffe pot thing goes, you obviously aren't a coffe drinker, or you would know how important that coffee pot is to some people! Heck, I'm not a coffee drinker, and even I know that

the team member not mentioned in the 1st journal entry seems to be the female linguist mention in anon's 2nd posting, since the only linguist mentioned in the journal entry appears to be male.

"There were two females, one being a doctor and the other being a linguist."
"420 will try to use his language skills."

again more examples of a story being created on the fly without it all being thought out ahead of time. When 9,000lbs was not enough, whoops it was really 90,500

"its not real until maybe we get pictures or documents etc" Oh wait we have pictures and this is what they are of, but oh I cant show them to you just yet you have to wait.

And then wait so more

And then when everyone thinks its bogus you post about the "TEAMS" entries and again you rip off more sci-fi movies. Someone recall the portion in "Taken" where they say you can not be inside the scout craft for too long because the magnetic drive or unit in the craft has a tendency to make your brain into mush. (which is possibly quite true, when you have the right magnetic impulse it could draw the nutrients in the blood stream out of the blood causing them to pool in high density in places they should not, the result is vertigo, blindness, loss of hearing, loss of motor function and general feeling of fuzziness)

You have the landing bay direct out of starwars where you have seen the Jedi or Darth Vader board his shuttle craft from a star cruiser, big tall ceilings

You have the isolation rooms, where even though the TEAM only had their back packs they managed to have enough substance to survice 240 earth days

You have the bridge like a scene out of star trek and captin kirks chair You have walls and walls of televisions and you have one port hole window. Something that escapes me in the realm of WHY ? you have a ship that is FTL capable would you risk have some transparent panel to see space ? When you could have a camera convey all the information required.

And why does it look like the Kennedy Space center control room inside this alien craft.

Why not holographic panels, or individual eye sets for the crew.

limit the number of unecessary distractions and have the aliens wear individual eye information sets like the Borg's

To me its like taking a bunch of high technology stuff and letting some 3 world crew members run the show having no clue how to remanufacture any of their own technology.

kind of like humans and the technology that they got from the Zentradi (Macross) where humans become simple users of the technology but do not fully understand how it operates nor posses the means to recreate it. I realize that later on humans are able to utilize some of the technology but never fully understand the full scope of how it came to be. They got just reassemble the technology into new forms but could recreate it from scratch.

The populating of the planet with the spores was to evolve the Species of the planet to the next level even if that ment man could no longer exist in his current form.

like I said before this story has already imploded into the typical circus. I guess the only thing to do know is watch the hole get dug deeper and deeper for Anon

Torbjon,

90,000 lbs for 12 people = 7,500 lbs per each person. I'm not going to assume the logistical planners and mission planners did this just because I would do it, but if I was in charge, I'd allow each team member up to 100 to 200 lbs each for non-essential personal/comfort items.

By the way, taking an electric razor would be less wasteful than packing a standard razor and a 10-year supply of blades and shaving cream. (by the way, have you ever tried to shave without shaving cream?)

Also, regarding the correction made to the story of 9,000 vs 90,000 lbs. Are you discrediting the story because of a typo or because they corrected it?

On your last post you used the word "moral" when you meant to say "morale." So should I discount everything you say as false and incorrect? No. I point out your minor error, now you're aware of it.

So what would you take for a 10 year trip to another planet?
I can't even pack my bags for a 2 day trip out of state without fogetting things and realising i have stuff i don't need.

Seems like a lot of people here would get there with a lot of technical equipment, hoping that it works. I can't help but think thou, if you only brought technical equipment, it wouldn't take long for to start wishing you brought simple items of everyday use that you don't think twice about on Earth so you had some basis for familiarity.

It would be very easy to go mad knowing your lightyears away from your planet, simple everyday items could be your only link back.

Is there any info or debate on what the EBENs had to bring to live on Earth?
Did they bring technology that was out of our world that they soley used and we didn't reverse engineer?
Did they bring utensiles as well or do they not have a need for them? - (which may be why the humans had to take so much everyday stuff).
Did they bring food?

Just some questions

Ebe #1 was the crash survivor from the craft found in Corona, NM in July, 1947.

Ebe #2 was the first exchange of an Eben scientist and was the second visitor left on Earth. I don't know the exact time period of his stay.

Ebe #3 was a female scientist.

J-ROD was a cloned Eben, created by the Ebens, who came as another type of visitor. J-ROD is a very complicated matter and the entire story will never be made public. The exact type of entity J-ROD was shall remain classified as "Above Top Secret."

Let your exclusive UFO Thread List membership know that this subject matter is closed and no future questions regarding this topic will be addressed.

Why s/he or it was named J-ROD is classified. People have speculated about that, and officially it means something, but that information shall remain shielded from the public domain.

was Anonymous talking about us,lol

ANONYMOUS: I will NOT supply that information.
For your information only (not for public view), Ebe #1 visited Washington D.C. in 19__ and stayed at _____ _____, _____ in a special _____. He did not meet with President ______ .
[Withheld for reasons of national security.]

[FACTOID – Victor Martinez:

The final segment of CLOSE ENCOUNTERS OF THE THIRD KIND which I viewed does have 12 people, 10 men and two women. Twelve people are also the number given in Spielberg's book version.

However, I got around to reading the end of Spielberg's paperback version of CE3. It reads the same as the movie except for two interesting things. The 12 Team Members are introduced as ALL MEN.

An additional dialogue not in the movie also takes place. They have a sit down with Roy Neary and have him sign a number of documents. While he signs the last one he is told the following:

"We have a possible problem in the area of canon and common jurisprudence outside of the parameters of our astronomy. The case could be made that you are, in effect, technically speaking... dead."

Is this a fancy way of saying that if anybody comes snooping around about what happened to Roy, they now have the legal right to tell them he is dead? Does that sound familiar?

"Spielberg tells me about the film. It's about UFOs, he says, but it is not science fiction. He calls it 'science fact.'"

COMMENT: Makes you wonder how Spielberg got the numbers and gender count right.

It is reported that after President Ronald Reagan watched a special screening of "Close Encounters of the Third Kind," he privately spoke to Steven Spielberg and said, "You don't know how true this really is." (The actual quote by President Reagan ) ]

know this is very interesting, i never really would think of speilburgh being told any of this.

Also i have yet to see the pics, and it is very strange how the craft never really had any windows. Except the one were the team member only saw the lights ("like we were traveling faster thanlight speed")

other than that, this was a really good read, keep it coming


one more thing about the communication used with both the humans and the ebes. You would think that since j-rod has been said to communicate by projecting images to the person and speaking in peoples head that the othere ebes could have done that to the team members. Or was it just that since j-rod was a clone he was special.

[edit on 22-12-2005 by ATSGUY]

Can we see the pictures, already?

The site alludes to groundbreaking photo evidence which is coming. When, exactly can we expect that since it will end of all of this speculation.

Pictures, please.