Indian Air Force : News, Pics and Discussion thread

Hmmm, *thinks* this might turn out better for India as they could actually buy the entire design programme outright (unlike any of the other rivals) and develop it further themselves like they did when they turned the Folland Gnat into the HAL Ajeet?

Indian members. Can you tell me how indian currency is measured. Its confusing. 1 core is equal to how much etc.?

Something like that. Lowest forum to highest

1 core??!
1$ = 45 rupees approx. (check the latest rates for buying and selling)
coin denominations:
50 paise(.5 rupee),1 rupee,2 rupees,5 rupees
note denominations:
5 rupees,10 rupees,20 rupees,50 rupees,100 rupees,500 rupees,1000 rupees

[edit on 3-12-2005 by Daedalus3]

not like that but how much rupees equal the next biggest number.

Like ten one dollars equals ten dollars

Originally posted by chinawhite
not like that but how much rupees equal the next biggest number.

Like ten one dollars equals ten dollars

Yeah well thats how it is for rupees as well!

ten 1 rupee coins give one ten rupee note.
But there aren't many 1 or 2 rupee notes in circulation nowadays.
So the atomic unit for notes can be assumed to be 5 rupee notes, and for coins it's one rupee coins.
why all this info?

I was reading some indian defense news and was wondering how much all these things cost.

I remember they used something that looked like core. or Rcs?. The articles were about future indian navy investment

Originally posted by chinawhite
I was reading some indian defense news and was wondering how much all these things cost.

I remember they used something that looked like core. or Rcs?. The articles were about future indian navy investment

Re= Rupee
Rs=Rupees
RCS = Radar Cross Section!!

1 Crore Rupees = 10 million Rupees

1 lakh Rupees = 100,000 Rupees

Both Crore and Lakh are terms for denominations used in India(& other subcontinental countries like Sri Lanka, Bangladesh, Nepal, Bhutan, Pakistan) and terms like million, billion are virtually non-exixtant.

The Hindustan Times article is now widely regarded as a hoax by most now ... some inexperienced reporter has been taken on a jolly ride by someone in the MoD.

Hopefully some mod will lock out the countless threads that have been started on that topic.

Now getting to better things... India will in most probability be buying the Tu-22M3's that it leased from Russia sometime back ( delivery is still awaited)

Here is conformation :

India May Buy Tu-22M3 Long-range Bombers that it has leased

Russia may offer India the purchase instead of lease of long-range Tu-22M3 bombers, an informed source in the defense industrial complex reported on Monday to Interfax-AVN.

“The corresponding offer, as is expected, will be made to India’s prime minister, Manmohan Singh, during his visit to Moscow,” he said.

According to the source, “India will be offered Tu-22M3 missile carriers from Russia’s air force existing fleet which will undergo pre-sales export preparation.”

Source: 05.12.05, Interfax

___

Tupolev TU-22M Backfire

Origin: USSR
Type: medium strategic bomber and maritime reconnaissance/attack aircraft
Max Speed: 1,147 kt / 1,321 mph
Max Range 4,000 km / 2,485 miles
Dimensions: span 34.30 m / 112 ft 6.5 in
length 39.60 m / 129 ft 11 in
height 10.80 m / 35 ft 5.25 in
Weight: max. take-off 130,000 kg / 286,596 lb
Powerplant: two 20000-kg (44,092-lb) afterburning thrust turbofans of unknown designation
Armament: two 23-mm GSh-23 two-barrel cannon in a radar-controlled tail barbette; provision for 12000 kg (26,455 Ib) of disposable stores, including nuclear weapons and free-fall bombs carried internally, or two AS-4 'Kitchen' missiles carried under the wings, or one AS-4 'Kitchen' missile carried semi-recessed into the lower fuselage, or up to three AS-6
Operators: India(2006), Russia, Ukraine
www.combataircraft.com...



The Indian version will be the customised Tu-22 M3(I).

Pakis were trembling when the lease was announced ( www.pakalert.net... ) .... wonder what they think about the buy

Aerodrome India 2005 from tomorrow

Bangalore: Global aviation majors, airline companies, vendors, officials and policymakers will assemble on December 7 here with an agenda to synergise India's initiatives in the ever expanding airline operations when Union Minister for Civil Aviation Praful Patel will inaugurate the three-day meet, Aerodrome India 2005.

The meet will discuss, plan and strategise a "vision for civil aviation" for the next 10 years.

Officials from Ministry of Civil Aviation, regulatory bodies, representatives of airline companies, airport project heads and global equipment manufacturers will deliberate on issues to cope with infrastructure requirements and security in airports.

Organised by PDA Trade Fairs, the Airports Council International and the Society of Indian Aerospace Technologies & Industries (SIATI), supported by the International Civil Aviation Organization (ICAO), the Ministry of Civil Aviation, the Airports Authority of India (AAI), the Directorate General of Civil Aviation and the Bureau of Civil Aviation Security, the event will dwell on various issues.

Over 100 global civil aviation vendors/manufacturers will showcase their state-of-the-art equipment and technologies.

The seminar will have four technical sessions.

full article >> www.hindu.com...

[edit on 6-12-2005 by Stealth Spy]

Originally posted by Stealth Spy


Pakis were trembling when the lease was announced

( www.pakalert.net... ) .... wonder what they think about the buy

Why would the "pakis" worry about the Tu-22M3..
Its a obv. overkill w.r.t. Pakistan, i.e. not meant for them at all!
Also were the Tu-22M3s actually leased already??!Or are they(Russia) just trying to convert a "probable lease" to a "lucrative buy"..

here ... check this out as well...India would never buy some R.I.P. Mirage-4000 (unless for a very good reason that is kept under wraps) when it could have the Rafale itself. Its a 9 billion dollar deal that will be sealed by 2008 .. and its for 126 multirole aircrafts...and 100% tech transfer & Deep Lisence(including metallurgy of engine's, material technologies of the body, radar, full source codes, etc) for unassisted production within India is compulsory....(as was clarified by the Def. Minister at the recent press conf.) Infact the US congress itself has cleared for the Tech Transfer of the F/A-18 Sh and the block 70 F-16 (in additon to many more weapons systems like the Patriot PAC-3, etc). The same is true in Russia's and France's case as well.

Nobody is naive enough to buy a cancelled piece of junk gathering dust in some museum in some remote pocket of France. when you can get the Rafale or the block 2 S/H with 100% Tech Transfer.

Sources say efforts by the French and UK governments to persuade India to add the Dassault Rafale and Eurofighter Typhoon to the shortlist appear to have been successful.

www.flightinternational.com... es/EurobidIndia.html


____

[SIZE=4]European consortium pushes Typhoon for IAF contract[/SIZE]

NEW DELHI: Just days before the government opens bid for one of its largest arms purchase, of 126 multirole fighter aircraft, European defence consortium EADS made a quick last ditch effort on November 25 to push the Eurofighter Typhoon fighter into the $9 billion sweepstakes.

The Typhoon, a higher-end multirole fighter built jointly by UK, France, Germany and Spain, and set to be their frontline fighter in the years to come, was considered as an option late last year by the UPA government during the visit of the then British Defence Secretary Geoff Hoon.

However, considering that the IAF is looking for a medium-range multirole fighter, it was decided that the longer range and considerably more expensive Typhoon would be unsuitable for its immediate needs.

South Block sources indicated that the unsolicited offer by Washington for Boeing F/A-18 Super Hornet might have encouraged the European firm to make a final attempt to formally propose Typhoon for the competition.

The fact that this will be New Delhi's largest single purchase of fighters has seen countries offering their latest aircraft. Russia, which will field its MiG for the bid, has unilaterally offered the MiG-35, a much-improved variant, which is still to be fully operational.

www.newindpress.com...

________

[edit on 6-12-2005 by Stealth Spy]

Just found this also:

MOSCOW, December 5 (RIA Novosti)-Russia has no plans to supply India with two types of strategic bombers, the defense minister said Monday.

Sergei Ivanov, who is also a deputy prime minister, said no negotiations were ongoing on Tu-160 Blackjack or Tu-95 Bear bombers.

The minister said the Soviet Union had sold India Il-76 Candid heavy transport planes, and they were still in service with the Indian air force.

en.rian.ru...

Don't know what this could mean w.r.t. the Tu-22M3 deal, but its in the same field so to say.

Well, the Tu-160 and the Tu-95 took part in the recent India-Russia joint exericses ( link ) ... creating speculation for a possible sale of the same to India ... and that seems to have been put to rest by that. However - that is independant of the T-22 M3 deal, as specified in the link provided.

P.S : India also operates 8 Tu-142's which were upgraded last year with new Israeli radars and communication and navigation equipment. link

Indian Air Force Attack Helicopter Purchase

The Indian Air Force has an expressed need for 80 new attack helicopters. ENS also reports that the US will soon offer its top of the line AH-64D Apache Longbow to fill that need.

The IAF is in the market for light and agile assault helicopters for possible use in counter-insurgency operations, and HAL's indigenous Light Combat Helicopter (LCH) is estimated to take at least another decade before it will see service.

If India does proceed with its attack helicopter project, the Apache Longbow will likely have company. Competitors range from the Russian Mi-28 Havoc and IAI/Kamov Ka-50/52 Black Shark, to the Eurocopter Tiger, South Africa's Denel Rooivalk, and Bell AH-1Z King Cobra.

Source : DiD

Originally posted by Stealth Spy

Nobody is naive enough to buy a cancelled piece of junk gathering dust in some museum in some remote pocket of France.

when you can get the Rafale or the block 2 S/H with 100% Tech Transfer.

The IAF love the Mirage - and i can see them actually looking forward to the ultimate expression of the MIR they allready fly.

but they`ll probably buy russian

The Hindustan Times article is now widely regarded as a hoax by most now ... some inexperienced reporter has been taken on a jolly ride by someone in the MoD.

How do you know that? please supply anything to support your claim.

Originally posted by Harlequin
How do you know that? please supply anything to support your claim.

> Only HT has reported on the Mirage-4000, while the rest of the more accompalished Indian media say that their "sources" say its the Mirage-2000-5 or the Mig-35

> HT fails to tell its readers who these "sources" are. ususally such articles are bogus.

> The proposition put by HT is beyond comprehension and is devoid of logic.
Mirage-4000 was never issued a ticket to participate in the MRCA ... and only the Mirage-2000-5 was ( in addition to the F-16, F/A-18, Mig-35, Gripen , and possibly EF&Rafale)

> The views of several Indian journalists and other prominent Indian defence industry related people participating on other forums have called it BS

____

Take a look at the insane article www.hindustantimes.com... ... full of loopholes ... suggesting that its total B.S

The Defence Ministry might be on the lookout for a new Air Superiority Fighter (ASF) aircraft for the Indian Air Force (IAF) but it is not going to be the US F-16.

The tender is for a Multirole Combat Aircraft, not for an air superiority fighter.
The IAF alredy has Su-30 MKI's for that role.

the government has zeroed in on Mirage 4000, manufactured by Dassault Bréguet of France.

Manufactured ... what crap

the latest from the Mirage stable

This is by far not the latest ... its been rusting for ~20 years

.. despite PowerPoint presentations ..

Seriosly, do senior US defence Industry personnel make presentations in Powerpoint ?

..IAF plans to buy an aircraft which Pakistan and other neighbours have not used..

Is that a justification for buying the museum Mirage-4000 ? Pray someone tell me which Indian neighbour has ever used the Mig-35 or the F/A-18 or the Mirage-2000-5 or the Gripen or the EF or the Rafale ?

India is satisfied with its ars-e-nal of MiG-29 and Sukhoi-30, it wants an alternative to Russia-developed aircraft in case there are problems in acquiring spare hardware. "India does not want to suffer like it did with the MiG after the end of the Soviet era.

Then why was the Su-30 MKI bought ?? and why is 80% of the weaponry that India is currently buying still coming from Russia ?

..senior official in the ministry...

another figment of the author's imagination in his unimpressive fictional work.

[edit on 6-12-2005 by Stealth Spy]

Originally posted by Stealth Spy
Work on the indegenous stealth fighter gets underway

BANGALORE: The Aeronautical Development Agency (ADA), the aircraft design house of the Defence Research Development Organisation (DRDO) in Bangalore has formed a core team to design a medium combat aircraft (MCA), an advanced multi-role fighter with stealth capabilities.

Besides incorporating many features of the indigenous single-engine Light Combat Aircraft (LCA) that is undergoing flight trials, the MCA will use radar-absorbent materials to reduce detection by radars, making it a stealth fighter.

The new generation fighter is expected to replace the Jaguar and the Mirage-2000 fleet of the Indian Air Force in the coming decades. “The design work is getting ready. It should be completed in a year,” DRDO sources told DNA.

The advanced aircraft will be build with extensive use of composites and have smart sensors like micro electronic mechanical systems (Mems), that can automatically detect strains or weaknesses in the airframe or wings. “The IAF is giving a lot of inputs for the design,” sources said.

Once the design is frozen, the DRDO would present the project to the government for sanction of the MCA project estimated to cost about Rs 6000 to Rs 8000 crore. The MCA will be a 12 tonne weight class fighter with a maximum take-off weight of about 18 tonnes.

It is to be powered by two “thrust vector’’ engines that facilitate controlling the flight by controlling its thrust, giving the pilot greater manoeuvrability.

But there are snags in developing Kaveri, the indigenous engine that will be used for the LCA and upgraded for the MCA. The DRDO has invited bids from global engine makers to participate in building the engine.

“The stealth features and engine are two areas that we are weak. We will bridge this gap,” sources said.

Many systems and technologies developed in India for the LCA, Intermediate Jet Trainer (IJT) and the Advanced Light Helicopter (ALH) like the flight control systems and composite wings will be used in the MCA.

“It will take about six to eight years for the first aircraft to be developed,” sources said.




Read full article >> link

New pics of the proposed MCA are out ... obtained by rakall of BR from an ADA presentation at an IIT.

The old artists impression can now be discarded

Posted with credits to rakall :

This is the design that is fianlised :


^^ evloved from the LCA and shares commonality with the LCA





IMHO it looks a lot like the F-35.

It appears to be in a pretty advanced stage ... because Pakistan just bought the "best for anti-stealth role" VERA-E radars from Eastern Europe.

_____

Infact the entire ADA presentation has leaked ... and has been hosted at rapidshare.de... It can be downloaded from here as well

More on the Eurofighter offer

Learning about India's multi-role combat aircraft requirement, the EADS (European Aeronautics and Defence Systems) is pitching for its multi-role Eurofighter Typhoon. (notice the phrase "multirole" has been specifically used)

The EADS team which is now visiting India is hopeful that the country can take advantage of the latest technology at a cheaper price, and the Typhoon can be entirely produced here.

EADS executives say that Typhoon is truly multi-role, suitable for air defense, bombing and air superiority missions, and the other advantage is that India would be involved, should it choose, right from R&D stage.

EADS participated in the advanced light helicopter project in the late-Eighties, which is today a success story, and in briefings to the government, it has offered to take India on board its fifth generation fighter aircraft project, which is far well advanced than the Russian project, and the first Typhoons could be delivered by 2006.

Full article >>

Like i said, everybody is now taking a shot at 9 billion $ sweepstakes.
Now EF's offering India local production and surely that means tech transfer.

But will someone enlighten me on this "5th gen" project that is more advanced than the Russian offer that it is using as a bait for India to buy the EF ??

[edit on 6-12-2005 by Stealth Spy]

The Indian Eurofighter might look like this :



Allowing local production by transfering technology causes a major drop in the unit cost of an airplane.

Check out the case of the Su-30 MKI ....

HAL chairman Nalini Ranjan Mohanty has said that the Indian-built Su-30s will cost only about $22.5 million a unit against the current import price of about $37.5 million

link

India also got 100% Tech Transfer on the Su-30 MKI ... this includes 100% of the source codes, 100% of the elcetronics and related documentation, 100% of the radar technology, 100% of the metallurgy ... single crystal turbine balde technology, powder metallurgy and the FADEC, etc of the Thrust Vectoring Al-31 FP which will also be manufactured in India.

It might take India upto 2009 to absorb all these technologies...a lot of it is alredy being applied to domestic products.

Since 100% Tech transfer is compulsory for the 9 bil $ MRCA tender .... if India chooses the Eurofighter ... the prize catch will surely be the EJ200 and its metallurgy. However the EF's radar is non ASEA...heck its not even ESA and the EF is literally smoked in this department by all of the compitition....Russian IRST's (like the new one on the Mig-35) are considered better than the PIRATE. Quite honestly, apart from cool sounding acronyms (CAPTOR, PIRATE, JOUST, PIMAWAS, DASS, ACS, etc ... etc ... its never ending ) the EF's present sensor and avionics suite fails to impress.

Perhaps the Rafale might be a better buy

[edit on 6-12-2005 by Stealth Spy]