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Are you good enough to get to Heaven?

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posted on Nov, 21 2005 @ 05:41 PM
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Originally posted by Raphael_UO

Originally posted by Simon_the_byron
Of course, it's still the same word in Modern Greek. Or by that, do you mean the interpretation of the word?

If so, then I think I am better qualified than most to answer this question.

As I have said already in this thread - the background of the word 'aionion' is the word 'aiona/es' or century/ies. 'Aionio(n/s)' simply means for centuries to come, it is a measurable amount of time which is why I believe that 'everlasting' is an inaccurate word to use when translating it.

There is no perfect English word that fully conveys the meaning of 'aionion' as far as I know - but everlasting is definitely inaccurate.


I tend to think of Aionion as refering to an arbitrarily large amount of time-- unknowable, but finite.

For example, how long would it take to count every grain of sand in the world? Obviously this is a finite amout of time, but one whose length is not knowable until the task is accomplished.



That's pretty much how it is used in Greece and in Ancient Greece I assume

Edited because of awful grammar.*

[edit on 21-11-2005 by Simon_the_byron]




posted on Nov, 22 2005 @ 12:20 AM
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Well is it Centuries or Century

As I have said already in this thread - the background of the word 'aionion' is the word 'aiona/es' or century/ies. 'Aionio(n/s)' simply means for centuries to come, it is a measurable amount of time which is why I believe that 'everlasting' is an inaccurate word to use when translating it.



I see were you are talking of Centuries which does not give an end

Century will allow 100 years or so, That makes it very measurable but if it goes with Centuries would never will have an END

You'll keep going,going,going for Centuries.............



posted on Nov, 22 2005 @ 01:17 AM
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Originally posted by just me 2

To be honest,No. Heaven as imagined by Some is a sort of resting place for those that are deemed worthy. At least that is what has been presented to me by people around me my whole life.

I do personally believe in higher states of existance, that as of it have not been or never will be properly defined.

if asked what i feel i would like heaven or my eternal resting place to be, i would describe different than has been presented to me in life.(if i could find the words to describe it.)

I have been an outsider in alot of ways much of my life, so not being part of any particular group doesn't cause me any personal shame or discomfort(well at least most of the time).

but in the end, though my own beliefs might be different, i accept the fact that i have made certain choices and am willing to face the possible consequences or benefits. it wouldn't seem fair to me otherwise.


Here is a Biblical description of what Heaven will look like for all who go there. (written by Brent Riggs www.seriousfaith.com)


1Corinthians 2:9 "However, as it is written: "No eye has seen, no ear has heard, no mind has conceived what God has prepared for those who love him".

Do you think about Heaven every day as if it really, truly exists?

We go about trying to "get the most" out of our lives unaware or uncaring that this is only a whisper of our true existence. As I talk to people about this, it becomes apparent that most don't truly think of Heaven as a tangible destination but more of a dreamy concept that is of little consequence in our "real" life.

I often hear comments like, "it's scary to think about", or "I don't want the Lord to return yet, there are things I still want to do here" or "I just want to experience everything this life has to offer before going to Heaven". By far the most common response I hear is "I've never really thought about it all that much".

In truth, it should be difficult for us to get our mind OFF of Heaven. Let me ask you a question that might help stir your thoughts of Heaven today.
If you were told today that in one year you will inherit a beautiful estate and several millions of dollars, all free and clear, all yours.... do you think you would spend much time thinking about it over the next year? Do you think you would tell others? Would you plan for that day? Would you long for that day? Would you have a hard time NOT thinking about it?

And yet that is a paupers portion compared to the unimaginable joys and treasures our Lord is preparing for us the day we meet Him face to face.
Spend some time thinking about the reality of our life in Heaven:

• Most everything we truly love is either in Heaven, or will end up there: our Christian brothers and sisters, our saved family members, Jesus, our Father, the Spirit. (Heb 12:23, 1Pet 1:4, Phil 3:20, Matt 5:12)

• No tears, no sorrow, no pain, no regret, no sin, no temptation, no unending struggling with your flesh - the battle with sin will be over. You will live in perfect holiness, pure and sin-free for all of eternity and it won't be a desperate battle to win, it will be the simple nature of our existence (Rev 22:3-5)

• An eternity of never ending blessing and enjoyment in God's presence where everyday will be a new day of discovering God's goodness

• After a million million million years we won't be one day closer to the end or closer to exhausting God's capacity to surprise us with His greatness, creativity or love

• We will eat and drink for pleasure, not for sustenance (Rev 2:7)

• Unimaginable beauty and experiences beyond anything we could ever begin to dream of ("no mind has conceived")

• We will experience and explore God's new Heaven and new earth, all remade to perfection by God. If you think there are beautiful scenes on this earth, they won't compare with God's recreated Heaven and earth (2Pet 3:11–12)

• We will be in the direct presence of God the Father and Jesus our Savior... we won't have to be insecure about our relationship with Him anymore

• We will have a perfect body that never grows old, is never sick, is never injured or in pain (1John 3:2)

Do these truths excite you? If they are really true, we should have trouble NOT thinking about them. As Christians, our hope lies in our eternal destination that has already been decided, secured and prepared.

If Heaven is not "real" to you, ask the Lord to show you why.
• Is it because you have a lack of knowledge concerning what the Bible teaches about Heaven?

• Is it because you have embraced some myths about Heaven such as:
o It will be boring because all we do is sit around and have church
o We will float on clouds and play harps
o We stand around the throne of God and sing praise music for all eternity
o It won't be any fun
o We'll be God's robots for all eternity
• Is it because you are to consumed with what THIS life has to offer?

o Where is your treasure? In this world or in Heaven? Where are you investing your time and resources?
o Do you love the things and pleasures of this world so much that Heaven is not enticing?
o Are you so consumed with the pleasures of this life that it leaves no time or room to long for Heaven?


Are you still lost in your sin and not sure if you will even go to Heaven?



[edit on 11/14/2005 by just me 2]



Why do you feel that i'm Lost in my sin?Do you believe becasue my views so different that i am some sort of depraved human demon living in nothing but sin day in day out
or Do you think because i don't share your personal views on spirituality that somehow I wallow in some sort of shame? As i stated before I am more than willing to face
the time when I come face to face with whatever I have to when i have breathed my last breathe. It is probably part of my upbringing to do as right as i can and face the ALL consequences i must to be fair and right. I don't think about my afterlife because I have come to terms with the fact that i can only do as much as I can. I was cast into a certain situation and find myself dealing with it as best I can(the situation being life of course). If I show kindness on others i don't see it as paying my way to heaven or even Showing how I much i derserve to be there, I see it as paying back This Huge debt i owe for being where i am. and giving people who need it a break where they can
get it.

I'm not saying I'm a great person , but I know I do as much as i see feasable, I don't help people because of some sort of treat being dangled at the end of the tunnle, I do it because its the right thing to do. Once again ,I bid you farewell.


Bordnlazy



posted on Nov, 22 2005 @ 03:26 AM
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ahh heaven and hell. By the sounds of it there is little difference. I have to say to both Gazrok and Zed hit my feelings on the dogma.

Now my answer. By most accounts I'm headed for hell. To be honest I'm not so sure I wouldn't welcome it as well. I will live with as few regrets as possible. I will not regret my fate whatever it may be. If god cannot except the fact that I have lived the best I could, then so be it.

Now to hit on some points brought up in the thread and give my take on them.


dbrandt
The notion that demons with pitchforks running around poking people is incorrect. Hell will be loneliness, emptiness, mental suffering, emotional suffering, physical suffering. It is also described as darkness. It is also a place place where each will realize that they are there by a choice they made, to reject the forgiveness offered in Christ.


To be honest this is, perhaps, not the worst of fates. Either one, the hot firey pit or eternal darkness/loneliness. The first I'm sure I will join my friends and some of my family. It'll be like old times. The second doesn't bother me in the least. I have walked several paths, and I do not fear walking alone. For walking alone, one becomes stronger, though perhaps none the wiser. I do not fear the darkness, for I'd be forced to face it. I have experienced in my short life the poetry the earth has brought me. Even now I can still smell the scents of Jasmine and sassafras. I can still feel the wind and rain on my shoulders, the sun on my skin. I can still hear the rustling of the quaking aspen trees. I take delight in these little pleasures but not only that, they have become part of my soul.

As for being there and realizing that I have rejected christ, wouldn't phase me in a bit. I did not reject christ, I merely followed my own paths and have no regrets that would haunt my soul. In other words I already realize the choice I have made and am at peace with it. I'm stubborn enough that even an eternity won't change my mind once I set it.

In the end, to me, it comes down to the fact that I am part of this universe, this earth. I was born of it and i will die part of it. That is the only absolute truth I know. In between that time I plan on taking as much out of life as I can because by the sounds of it I'm going to have a lot of time to myself.



Just 2 me
Because Jesus commanded me to "preach the Gospel to every creature."

I hate to sound sarcastic but there are a lot of trees that haven't been preached to. Man plus think about the poor fish flies that only live for 1 or 2 days, and the ammount of them. I wish more people would preach to them, because the poor things are often left out of the conversation. By your own account you don't have to preach the gospel, it's not a requirement to get into heaven.

Edit: I find that my thoughts are much the same as Bordnlazy.

[edit on 22-11-2005 by silentlonewolf]



posted on Nov, 22 2005 @ 01:38 PM
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Why do you feel that i'm Lost in my sin?Do you believe becasue my views so different that i am some sort of depraved human demon living in nothing but sin day in day out



Bordnlazy~

What do you plan on saying to God on Judgment Day? What will you say to God if He asks you, “Why should I let you into Heaven?”



Silentlonewolf said:


By most accounts I'm headed for hell. To be honest I'm not so sure I wouldn't welcome it as well. I will live with as few regrets as possible. I will not regret my fate whatever it may be. If god cannot except the fact that I have lived the best I could, then so be it.


I have a question for you, and it might seem like an odd question, but you will see where I’m going with it in my next post after you answer the question.

Would you sell one of your eyes for a million dollars? Say it would look exactly the same as the other one, and the surgery wouldn’t hurt at all. How about both eyes?



posted on Nov, 23 2005 @ 12:16 AM
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Bordnlazy~

What do you plan on saying to God on Judgment Day? What will you say to God if He asks you, “Why should I let you into Heaven?”



I don't particuarly believe that that will be the situation after i pass on. I don't think if it was, that I would be asked to prove my worthiness either. I Would probably ask "why don't you already know the outcome?" .

I also don't Really agree with the christian perspective of after life, while it is always a possiblity that i might be wrong, I'm willing to stand by the choices i've made.



posted on Nov, 23 2005 @ 01:08 AM
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Originally posted by bordnlazy


Bordnlazy~

What do you plan on saying to God on Judgment Day? What will you say to God if He asks you, “Why should I let you into Heaven?”



I don't particuarly believe that that will be the situation after i pass on. I don't think if it was, that I would be asked to prove my worthiness either. I Would probably ask "why don't you already know the outcome?" .


Because I'm not God. Only He knows for sure. But I do know what His Word says, and by that standard, and by what you have said in your posts, it does appear that you will be going to Hell.


Granted, it was a hypothetical question, as the Bible does not say what God will ask you when you die, but I do know that He will judge you by the 10 Commandments.

Romans 2:12
"All who sin apart from the law will also perish apart from the law, and all who sin under the law will be judged by the law."



posted on Nov, 23 2005 @ 01:27 AM
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Originally posted by just me 2

Originally posted by bordnlazy


Bordnlazy~

What do you plan on saying to God on Judgment Day? What will you say to God if He asks you, “Why should I let you into Heaven?”



I don't particuarly believe that that will be the situation after i pass on. I don't think if it was, that I would be asked to prove my worthiness either. I Would probably ask "why don't you already know the outcome?" .


Because I'm not God. Only He knows for sure. But I do know what His Word says, and by that standard, and by what you have said in your posts, it does appear that you will be going to Hell.


Granted, it was a hypothetical question, as the Bible does not say what God will ask you when you die, but I do know that He will judge you by the 10 Commandments.

Romans 2:12
"All who sin apart from the law will also perish apart from the law, and all who sin under the law will be judged by the law."


And what have i said exactly that makes you think i'm going to hell? Btw thanks for the FYI i'll be sure to pack shorts and hawaiin shirts for my trip in the after life :p



posted on Nov, 23 2005 @ 01:49 AM
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And what have i said exactly that makes you think i'm going to hell?






I also don't Really agree with the christian perspective of after life, while it is always a possiblity that i might be wrong, I'm willing to stand by the choices i've made.


OK, let’s start over.
I’m sorry that I’ve offended you. I should have asked more questions first.

What is it that you don’t agree with on the Christian perspective of the afterlife? What are your beliefs?



posted on Nov, 23 2005 @ 02:16 AM
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Originally posted by just me 2


And what have i said exactly that makes you think i'm going to hell?






I also don't Really agree with the christian perspective of after life, while it is always a possiblity that i might be wrong, I'm willing to stand by the choices i've made.


OK, let’s start over.
I’m sorry that I’ve offended you. I should have asked more questions first.

What is it that you don’t agree with on the Christian perspective of the afterlife? What are your beliefs?


I'm happy you'd rather discuss this as oppose to argue it. You would be surprised how often the "Hell" card is pulled in a discussion or the "your Wrong" card. As people have stated on this thread already , There is no use in spreading anything if your not willing to listen. Sometimes the people your arguing with are thinking and saying the same thing you are, but are just communicating things a bit differently.

I've always thought you can't understand much more about a person if you dont' bite your toungue and allow them to speak their mind, Everything they are feeling is there, from the words they choose to say, To the rythem and pitch they choose they say them at. And most importantly their body languange.

As for my views some of what i feel was posted on the 3rd page of this thread. And Imho some people had some trully remarkable things to say.

And I was not personally insulted by your post.



posted on Nov, 28 2005 @ 08:33 PM
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And I was not personally insulted by your post.





And some can say that You do get Insulted Quite often with the threads, most often that Not....
......

[edit on 06/29/2005 by jfdarby]



posted on Nov, 28 2005 @ 09:23 PM
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Don't know, I hope so. I pray every day and night for people and for my wrongs. Ironic, considering the group I LOVE the most to listen to. LOL
- Toast to people going to heaven, Hell, and the Netherworlds. YAY!



posted on Nov, 30 2005 @ 08:06 PM
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What Does it take,


As much I have read and do understand, That there is really nothing we can do to grantee that we are going to live with Jesus..

The only thing I see is that Jesus really wants us to be with him, and with his love, He has gave us the way to be with Him.

And Jesus and His love and Grace is really the only way we are going to be with him and without his Grace, We are all going the other way at the time of cleaning...

[edit on 06/29/2005 by jfdarby]



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