Permenant Magnet motor

muppets what a load.....any kind of magnets are dirt cheap, i can get 20 for £7

Originally posted by postings
Eh, are you sure? Why do they call them permenant magnets?

-P

Originally posted by Kidfinger
You do realize that a magnet is similar to a battery in that it will loose its magnitism over use, just as a battery looses power over use. It is a great concept, but it will not run forever as touted.

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Actually they are known as permanent because they retain polarized molecules in a natural state,like the lodestone.Manufactured perm. magnets are polarized from an external source.Non-polarized magnets are polarized from an external source,like a coil of wire around a core hooked up to a battery.As soon as the power is gone,the polarization decades.

Bargaindan, please sent me this thing to work on, I want to prove it to some of my friends and to my self. I tried the MXLO and the hutchison motor, the MXLO did nothing at all, and the hutch would never go all the way around because some magnets were slightly weaker/stronger then the rest and I don't have the cressent shaped magnets.

Originally posted by XL5
Can you give me some pics/drawings of the magnet motor you made Bargaindan? Just proof alone would be great and I have alot of rare earth magnets.

Sorry,the plans are long gone.I did this in 73-74 as a physics project.The motor worked quite well but was unable to produce enough power to be of any use beyond the novelty stage.It was of a similar concept to the "hamster cage" but was cylindrical,about 24" long.I had to turn in my papers before I developed any further on the project.For upscale info and designs check out something called a Searl Effect Generator.If you google onto "searleffect" you should be able to find some good stuff.By the way, this motor I made wasn't entirely original,I adapted a couple of different concepts from other sources.I tried to find publicized mat. on it but the periodicals I used are mostly no longer in print,such as Science and Mechaanics,but you can still research Scientific American archives and the like.It can be done but it takes time and money.

Hmmm ok, I'll look into it. Did it work without the different additions or were they added to increase the energy output?

THe unfortunate thing is that I have had a design in mind for the past 3 months, but I can't build it because it requires machining. I don't want to get it machined, because I am afraid of the design being stolen. Although, I guess that wouldn't be a big deal anyway since I am only going to release it free anyway! So if it does work, I will post plans etc. Has anyone had experience getting stuff machined? The other issue is that I don't have an technical drawings of it, and I don't want to spend any time with CAD. Bleh! I am my own biggest impediment. Anyway if people have suggestions other than "dude get it together" I would be very interested. I am great with creating ideas, but REALLY bad at putting them together, especially if I don't have the tools to make it happen myself.

-P

Well Postings, you need good drawings and measurements if you want it machined and its simple enough. If it can be made of wood/plastic then try to use hand tools and glues/fillers. If it needs to be made of big metal shapes, then your looking at a lot of money.

I had a 1 1/4" inch diameter (4" long) soft iron shaft bored out to a non exact depth with a 3/4" bit and it cost $30! I may have gotten shafted but its a better to think of an easier way to do it your self first just to see if it works first.

Originally posted by XL5
Hmmm ok, I'll look into it. Did it work without the different additions or were they added to increase the energy output?

Tell you what,I just bought a new home and everyhting is packed.After the move I'll try to get something together and post it.But until then,in a nutshell,heres the basic concept.-
You need to build two cylinders,one to place into the other.The outer needs to be fixed while the internal cylinder rotates.Make sure that there is enough clearence between the two for your magnets.Use disc magnets with holes in the middle.I think they were either 1.5 or 2.0 inches in dia.
put some iron filings on some cardstock and place two of the magnets under neath.You will see circular patterns in the filings.Adjust the two magnets so that the fields of flux seen combine on the meeting side.The fields will looked like flattened beach balls.Measure the distance between centers and this will tell you where to drill mounting holes on the cylinders.
arrange the magnets with alternating poles pointing outward on the inner cylinder and inward on the outer cylinder.Arrage them in rows like this:
first row N S N S N S N S N S
second row S N S N S N S N S N
The idea is to make a field of flux energy that will elimate any possibility of there being a weak spot.That is where a stopping place will be.Use as much plastic as you can,including the fasteners to attach the magnets.The first one I built I use a glue,but it created heat and the glue broke down.Also remember that this is not a permanent power source or motor.It will eventually break down.Play around and see what youcan come up with.I'll try and build one in October again.Its been a lot of years but I'm sure the memory will come back to me.Let us know how you are coming.Hey, maybe we can collaborate on line,build one and call it the ATS generator?

What was the clearance between the inner and outer tubes magnets?
Are the NSNSN rows the same on the inner and outer tubes and were the rows spaced out frome each other as they are when spaced side by side?

Originally posted by XL5
What was the clearance between the inner and outer tubes magnets?
Are the NSNSN rows the same on the inner and outer tubes and were the rows spaced out frome each other as they are when spaced side by side?

I don't recall clearance,but you will have to guage your own based on what you have for magnets.I'm thinking a 3" pvc pipe for inner and a 5" for outer.When I built mine in 73 I made frames and covered them with varnished cambric.But the more magnets you have the bigger the diameter will have to be.The rows are the same as each other,(inner and outer) and you should have it built so that the fields of flux are constantly at odds to each other.Maybe this is better:
inner NSNSNSNSNSNSNSNSN]
outer NSNSNSNSNSNSNSNSN]Row one
inner SNSNSNSNSNSNSNSNS]
outer SNSNSNSNSNSNSNSNS]Row two
and so on around the cylinders.If I remember right I had a hard time lining them up at first.The opposite rows wanted to lock in with the outer cylinders opposite rows.I ended up putting one extra row of magnets on the outer cylinder.That offset the fields if memory serves.

That was definitely the original spirit of this thread. Maybe I should create a project out of it. If I do, it won't be today. Perhaps soon.

-P

Originally posted by bargaindan

Originally posted by XL5
Hey, maybe we can collaborate on line,build one and call it the ATS generator?

Originally posted by postings
That was definitely the original spirit of this thread. Maybe I should create a project out of it. If I do, it won't be today. Perhaps soon.

-P

Originally posted by bargaindan

Originally posted by XL5
Hey, maybe we can collaborate on line,build one and call it the ATS generator?

Like I said, after I move and get my new workshop set up I think I will take a shot at buiding one.Again.It'll probably be in October.If it works I'll post the info and plans.I still don't think it will produce any useable HP though.
bargaindan says "screw the rules,just don't blow yourself up."Have fun!!

Same goes for me. I already said im going to rebuild a PMM. Back in around year 7 (cant remember the equivilent in america) i built a small scale model PMM and it worked like a charm! Once i rebuild it, i will post a load of video and pics or whatever.

(im in new york for two more days, been to boston, portland etc, and can i just say that i have fallen in love with America! it rocks and it seems that whatever the english have, the americans have done one better! yum yum.......Does that make me a traitor to my country???)

FYI, I did try building the device according to what was written in the links I provided, but wasn't able to do so successfully. Actually there are several devices that are depicted there, so I am sorta not done yet. One of them was a hamster-cage contraption that looked REALLY promising. I will hopefully give it a try fairly soon, and give you all an update on how it went. Also, I just wanted to thank you for helping me with this! I would really like to make this a reality, and if a group of us develop this motor, it will make it much more difficult to be supressed.

-p

Thanks bargaindan! I will definitely look forward to the October timeframe then!

-P

Originally posted by bargaindan

Originally posted by postings
That was definitely the original spirit of this thread. Maybe I should create a project out of it. If I do, it won't be today. Perhaps soon.

-P

Originally posted by bargaindan

Originally posted by XL5
Hey, maybe we can collaborate on line,build one and call it the ATS generator?

Like I said, after I move and get my new workshop set up I think I will take a shot at buiding one.Again.It'll probably be in October.If it works I'll post the info and plans.I still don't think it will produce any useable HP though.
bargaindan says "screw the rules,just don't blow yourself up."Have fun!!

AAAAARRRRGGGHH!!!Theres a patent on a similar device.(sorry,I know its not polite to shout,but I just needed to.)Log on to oriharu.net... and read all about it.However,he used electromagnets in his model.Since I'm not it can still be done.Still the principals are the same.You might want to read it and see if you can use any of it in building your own.I just located this one within the past hour or so.

Wow excellent find! this is the kind of stuff we were talking about!!! gud stuff!

Great find bargaindan! I will be studying up on that!

-P

Turns out there are several people developing this sort of technology.I won't post any links since I haven't had time to digest them all or check for accuracy and such.However,try this on google
"magnetic flux motor" and see what pops up.Also different variations get you different sets of links.But at any rate,it seems as though this may ultimately be a valid source of energy,if we can solve the riddle of the lodestone.

Hey guys,I've got an additional part of the solution to think about.There are about 5-6 motors that have been built,none of which have been able to produce any viable HP for work.Does anyone have any thoughts on constructing a low input-high output transmission or torque converter of some sort?If the motors meager output can be multiplied somehow,I think it would have better prospects for more research beyond our stage of engagement.