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Originally posted by Master Wu
One thing is certain: a second war with north korea would not only be the messiest/bloodiest war in human history, it would be the last war in human history. Nuclear weapons if used on the scale necessary (by eather side) to win would cause so much destruction and death, alot of those numbers of military units would become moot points. The insuing chaos would throw military plans (again, by both sides) out the window.
The united states of course, would prevail, but at what cost?
I for one could never again trust my government if they nuked someone without just cause (and no, wmd is not just cause, 911 is not just cause). I would gladly (or sadly) rebel against my government if they started a nuclear war with north korea.
Sadly, these are the kinds of mental excercises that arise when the office of president of the united states is occupied by a serial killer.
Originally posted by The Vagabond
So here's your typical battle between NK and American forces. American tanks bypass Korean infantry positions under cover of darkness, with American artillery providing suppression against any Korean fire called in against the tanks. North Korea moves its tank and mechanized infantry forces into the breach, assuming that the Korean infantry's communications were not being disrupted. American tanks engage and destroy the Korean response and proceed into Korean territory to eliminate a supply depot or artillery battery, then come back through the lines, dealing out a few parting blows the the Korean front line.
Picture this happening countless times every night, and each time NK's ability to fight back decreases.
Originally posted by rogue1
Originally posted by The Vagabond
So here's your typical battle between NK and American forces. American tanks bypass Korean infantry positions under cover of darkness, with American artillery providing suppression against any Korean fire called in against the tanks. North Korea moves its tank and mechanized infantry forces into the breach, assuming that the Korean infantry's communications were not being disrupted. American tanks engage and destroy the Korean response and proceed into Korean territory to eliminate a supply depot or artillery battery, then come back through the lines, dealing out a few parting blows the the Korean front line.
Picture this happening countless times every night, and each time NK's ability to fight back decreases.
LOL, I find this laughable at best. Just how much artillery do you think the US has ? Bugger all compared to NK.
VAgabond, you really overesimate America's ability in Korea. Hell, they can't even control Iraq for gods sake., and half the population want them there. You couldn't imagine what it would be like for US soldiers going into NK. Every citizen with a gun would be out for them.
PLease, your assumptions are completely flawed.
BTW, The NK special forces are highly trained and have been active against SK and oher countries for 50 years. They are neither secand rate or a pushover. Seems like typical american arrogance to me - like I said just look at Iraq and you think you hvae a hope of invading NK LMAO.
Originally posted by rogue1
LOL, I find this laughable at best. Just how much artillery do you think the US has ? Bugger all compared to NK.
VAgabond, you really overesimate America's ability in Korea. Hell, they can't even control Iraq for gods sake., and half the population want them there. You couldn't imagine what it would be like for US soldiers going into NK. Every citizen with a gun would be out for them.
Seems like typical american arrogance to me
Originally posted by ludo182
Dear Vagabond,
let me give you some examples of wars that the US lost or didn't win :
Vietnam and the Korean war ( 1950-1953 )
I have no doubt that the US would win a war against NK but at what price? Is the American public opinion ready to see 30 000, 40000... soldiers die? i don't think so. The thing is that it's only in desperate situations (WW2, or the US mainland being invaded) that the US could afford such losses.
Originally posted by LiquidationOfDiscrepancy
What is China's take on NK? Are they 100% behind NK in time of war?
How is the relationship between NK and China politically and military wise?
Originally posted by The Vagabond
Originally posted by rogue1
LOL, I find this laughable at best. Just how much artillery do you think the US has ? Bugger all compared to NK.
Bugger all, but unlike the North Koreans we'll actually be hitting targets when we fire. Once the lines have moved and their initial recon is no longer of use they will only be able to effectively hit targets when they have spotters calling in fire. Our firefinder radar will make our artillery far more effective in countering theirs.
Originally posted by The Vagabond
That is exactly your problem. You think that all wars are Vietnam or Iraq. Nothing could be further from the truth. What need does America have to "control" the North Korean people? When deprived of fire support and logistics a militia or even a poorly drilled regular military disintegrates into just a bunch of guys with rifles, all dressed up with no place to go.
You fail to realize the tremendous difference between war and counter-insurgency. If you care to learn a thing or two about modern warfare I recommend a study of the Six Day War, The Yom Kippur War, The Battle of Wadi Doum (actually there are several examples of mobility over force throughout the war for the Aozou Strip), and Operation Desert Storm.
Modern wars are fought and won by manuever, not attrition.
Originally posted by Master Wu
Imagine how much worse a nuclear explosion over a US city would be compared to what that hurricane did. Not to mention the multiple logistics cuts, emp pulses etc... The US would fall into instant chaos one way or another, whether it wins or loses.
Originally posted by The Vagabond
I can only post briefly at the moment though more will follow. There is ample evidence from the Korean War that you don't have to be in "good tank country" to use tanks effectively. Refer to Operation Touchdown. There was also a defensive action in which tanks played a vital role but I've forgotten the location.
In short though, you can rest assured that your points about Korean hatred of America will be shown to be moot. We don't have to kill them all. They won't even get a chance to resist, so their ferocity will mean nothing. They'll be without command, transportation, food, or ammo after a short time.
As far as artillery is concerned, you can expect me to argue that the ability of our tanks to penetrate their lines will more than make up for any remaining advantage you might percieve from their numbers versus our fire control.
Originally posted by rogue1
Everything would be pre stockpiled, they don't have to worry about supply, they're fuighting a defensive war. It is the US supply lines which would be extraordinarily vulnerable to attack by NK.
We've seen what happened in Iraq, and most of them don't mind the Americans. Every village would be a hostile place for US soldiers in NK.
Vagabond you seem to be blind to the obvious.
Originally posted by rogue1
As for villages, what do you think the Americans are going to do, completely ignore the raod system and bring their supllies in cross country ?
Also if you'd bothered to read any of the information I posted you'd realise that the NK are using fibre optics more and more in their communications. The US can't jam those
You haven't put forward one logical reason why the US would kick ass so easily. Your argument seems to be ' America is the best, so there ' LOL.
Like I said america has a tough enough time in Iraq against poorly trained insurgents. In NK they would be facing a guerilla war of a scale several orders of magnitude greater. To say guerilla war doesn't come into it, is being gullible in the extreme.